Best Strategy for Combat Against a Wizard?

[DwarvenRanger]

My party is about to set off on a mission to battle a high level wizard. We assume he will be low-epic level, as our average level is around 19.

What are the best spell combinations to use or tactics to use to ensure a victory?

We will have up to 9th level Wizard spells and up to 7th level Cleric Spells at our disposal, besides our 2 fighters and rogue.

[Glimbur]

It would be helpful to have more details on the characters. Does anyone have non-magical flight? What is your gear like, and how feasible is it to get more? What sorts of things are your characters good at, and how good are they? Two archer fighters will use different tactics than a TWF fighter and a sword and board fighter, for example.

[Invader]

Be an even higher level wizard? :smallamused:

Globes of invulnerability are always useful regardless of level. Disjunction, AMF, spell reflecting magics items, energy immunity/resistance, scrying beforehand, mindblank, freedom of movement.

Its really kind of hard to be totally prepared for an epic level caster.

[DwarvenRanger]

It would be helpful to have more details on the characters. Does anyone have non-magical flight? What is your gear like, and how feasible is it to get more? What sorts of things are your characters good at, and how good are they? Two archer fighters will use different tactics than a TWF fighter and a sword and board fighter, for example.

We have no non-magical flight, we have an array of magical weapons & armor up to and including +5, we can get more non-magical gear if we need. We have one TWF, one rogue with sneak attack 10d6, one fighter using a twohanded sword power attack/cleave type fighter, our wizard, and our cleric.

More what I am looking for is if there are typical spell combinations or strategies I don't know about, for example, someone suggested Dimensional Anchor + Force Cage to make sure he can't flee, someone else suggested Power Word Stun + Empowered Touch of Idiocy etc.

[Eldan]

Someone in your group, and preferably at least about 3 of you, have to win initiative over the wizard, or you are probably already dead.

Get as many contingencies as you can, and measures against dispelling and disjunction. As many flat-out immunities as you can, too. Mind Blank, Death Ward, Freedom of Movement. Anklets of Translocations for everyone, too.

[dantiesilva]

Ah besides the better wizard and everything else that was said, summon hell to tear down the wizard. Wish for him to be as strong as he was as a child. Basically make sure you have immunity to everything up to 30, if you can get immune even better. After all a wizard casting an exploding meteor shower can one hit K.O. anything really saying it deals damage, sends you flying into another one, which also deals damage which sends you into another one, so on so forth.

[Mithril Leaf]

Scrounge up as much money as you can and get ready to do some fiendish dealing. Pick up a set of feathered wings for your fastest base speed member, or rogue if everyone is equal. Acquire some sort of anti-magic field to be placed on the rogue, perhaps via UMD if need arises. Have the wizard limited wish a psychic reformation to grab the darkhunter feat for said rogue. Make sure he's got a solid set of non-magical hiding gear. Have him attempt to sneak up on the wizard and activate the anti-magic field. Alternatively, attempt to have the cleric pick up that feat which allows him to cast in his own antimagic field with a limited wish emulating psychic reformation. Have him dimensional anchor the wizard to prevent him from using invoke magic to escape with a teleport. Either way, grab feathered wings for non-magic flight.

[Slipperychicken]

Try to remember how your DM runs caster-bosses, as this can be critical.

If he runs them like idiots (stand around unbuffed and get pommeled while launching Fireballs, cast Transformation at low hp), you don't need much preparation. If he runs them like the forum would run them (play to win, buff massively, pre-summon casting minions, use custom Epic spells, give no openings. Destroy enemy before they're aware of you).. well, you're pretty much screwed.

[killianh]

Immunity to Ability Damage/Drain
Immunity to Daze/Stun
Immunity to Disease
Immunity to Energy Drain
Immunity to Fatigue/Exhaustion
Immunity to Fear
Immunity to Non-Lethal Damage
Immunity to Mind Effects
Immunity to Poison

To start off with. Get the Spell Ray deflection ready on everyone (it deflects all range touch or range targeted) freedom of movement is also a must. Greater blinking to dodge some of those AoE spells is good too. High initiative will be needed as well

[Slipperychicken]

To start off with. Get the Spell Ray deflection ready on everyone (it deflects all range touch or range targeted)

Real men cast Friendly Fire (Exemplars of Evil) and laugh as the enemy pommels himself to death with his own arrows, rays, and orbs.


Get an Antimagic Field on him (Sculpt Spell Antimagic Field? or have the Cleric grow a pair and rush in while AMF'd), and have your fighters ready actions to grapple hug him and wail on him. If you attack into a grapple hug while not grappling giving the hug, you roll randomly to see which one you hit, so dogpile him in the AMF and pommel him to death. Have at least one Fighter Pin the Wizard so his chances of escaping the AMF drop to near zero.

Epic spells can potentially get through the AMF, but I seriously doubt he blew one of his Epic slots on a teleportation spell.

[Randomguy]

Immunity to Ability Damage/Drain
Immunity to Daze/Stun
Immunity to Disease
Immunity to Energy Drain
Immunity to Fatigue/Exhaustion
Immunity to Fear
Immunity to Non-Lethal Damage
Immunity to Mind Effects
Immunity to Poison

To start off with. Get the Spell Ray deflection ready on everyone (it deflects all range touch or range targeted) freedom of movement is also a must. Greater blinking to dodge some of those AoE spells is good too. High initiative will be needed as well

You missed Freedom of Movement. That could be the most important thing to have.

Cast the spell Heroics 1-3 times on your melee characters, to give them the mage slayer line.

Whatever you do, don't teleport in up close. He's probably got wards against that. If you must teleport, teleport a couple hundred feet above him/where he is, and feather fall or fly down.

See if the party wizard can hit him with a Reaving Dispel to steal all his buffs in the first round. Make sure to get a bunch of CL boosters.

A good spell for immunity to mind affecting is Disobedience. It's not as good as mind blank, but it's much lower level.

[killianh]

You missed Freedom of Movement. That could be the most important thing to have.

I listed freedom of movement in the later text, which is also in the text you quoted :smallannoyed:

[Randomguy]

I listed freedom of movement in the later text, which is also in the text you quoted :smallannoyed:

Oops... :smallredface:

I blame fatigue.

[Gnorman]

Use Diplomacy to make him your best friend.

It's probably easier.

[DwarvenRanger]

Thank you everyone for all of the suggestions, they are very helpful. We will work on all of it and do our best.

[hoverfrog]

The best strategy for combat against a wizard is to run away as fast as you can. :smallsmile:

On a more serious note have you tested his abilities? Do you know what spells he typically has learned, what magic items he keeps handy, what contingencies he has against attacks, etc? Use divinations to find out as much as you can about him. Then kidnap his daughter, mother or favourite pet and hold them hostage against your own lives.

Another option is to target his familiar as soon as you see it. Just hope that he's only just gone up a level.

[Telonius]

It's extraordinarily difficult to prepare for combat against "a wizard." "A wizard" can range in power from useless to godlike. Slipperychicken has it right:


Try to remember how your DM runs caster-bosses, as this can be critical.

If he runs them like idiots (stand around unbuffed and get pommeled while launching Fireballs, cast Transformation at low hp), you don't need much preparation. If he runs them like the forum would run them (play to win, buff massively, pre-summon casting minions, use custom Epic spells, give no openings. Destroy enemy before they're aware of you).. well, you're pretty much screwed.

The actual wizard you're going to face will probably be somewhere in between those two extremes. He'll probably be buffed by spells. (Magic Circle Vs. Alignment is a common one; so is mirror image, blur, blink, haste). He'll probably have some minion backup. He may be flying; he'll probably use terrain against you. He'll have Dispel Magic prepared.

I'd suggest you take what you know about the wizard into account when you fight him. Is he a known Necromancer? An Evoker? A Conjurer? Figure out his strategy, and get immune to the things that he's most likely to employ against you. Use some spells that will debuff him, or use his own magic against him. (Reciprocal Gyre is one of my favorites for people who massively buff before fights).

[Mirakk]

I prefer the non-standard approach!

Refuse to go after the wizard immediately, and try to raise an army of volunteers to slay the evil wizard. As many small towns and cities should be assimilated into the great hoarde as possible. This will most likely get the DM to memorize a lot of AoE spells for the day.

While he's busy blowing up mooks, try to sneak up on him to use the AMF dogpile, and something sharp like a rapier.

[Eldariel]

Things like Shapechange and Gate will probably be key anyways; Shapechange doubles your actions, Gate can get you something like a Gold Great Wyrm. Also, getting few casting minions of your own through Planar Bindings/Planar Allies, Simulacrums and such beforehand might be worth it; even just Great Dispel Magic bots are very useful and e.g. Planetar goes way beyond mere GDM.

Rest depends on the details. When you're ready, use Divinations as you can to find out what you're up against (Contact Other Plane, Commune, etc. are all very useful if you position your questions correctly). You'll want access to Disjunction & Greater Dispels. Anti-Magic Fields, if deployed efficiently, are also fairly useful if you can reach the Wizard with one somehow. What you need to divine are what kinds of defenses he has; can you e.g. use Teleport or is there Anticipate Teleportation in place? Does he have Scrying defenses & Detect Scrying in place? Mind Blank? Delay Death? What kinds of epic spells, if any, he can cast! Make sure you're actually dealing with his real body instead of a Projection of some sort. That sorts of things.


You need ways to penetrate Force walls (Disintegrate is a reasonably reliable means). You need mobility. And as said a dozen times, you need your own defenses. Then you need forms of offense that are not vulnerable to what you've divined. Since you have people with sticks, they'll probably want to do their best to get near the Wizard and use whatever means they have to take down the Wizard's defenses.

I hope they have some magic items for Teleporting, True Seeing and the like; if not, try to acquire. Rod of Cancellation or two wouldn't be amiss either. And they should probably carry Bows even if that's not their primary form of offense; AC is rarely Wizards' strong point and if he has to waste actions to defend from bows you can probably take him down (tho he's probably gonna start with Time Stop anyways).

Oh yeah, and expect him to start with Time Stop and either Gating stuff in or putting you in a swamp of Maws of Chaos in death traps. Maw of Chaos [Spell Compendium] is a very good spell to prepare for since it's normally very hard to resist; Spell Resistance & Spell Immunity are the only two real ways of going about it. Of course, things like Battlemagic Perception and Duelward that allow Immediate Action countermagic should be very valuable. Dimension Lock is a decent tool but Dimensional Anchor I wouldn't expect to land. Dimension Lock is much harder to bypass but on the other hand he can just physically leave it.

[Eldan]

I would also suggest giving at least someone an item of greater dispel magic at the greatest caster level you can afford, and just firing that at the wizard every turn, until he is buff-free.

[frigidmagi1]

These are all good suggestions and I'm gonna go a bit more general here.

You never want to let the wizard(or anyone really) pick the ground of the fight. Nor do you want him to know when you're coming. Not only will you run face first into a myriad of prepared defenses, buffs and summons but at this point a smart enemy will have prepped the ground to be advantageous to him.

This would mean a lack of places for the rogue to hide, no cover from spells and barriers to prevent you from rushing him (low lying brambles for example, or simply a bunch of caltrops).

If possible try to draw the wizard out. Is there something or someone he needs? Steal it. So on and so forth.

Additionally, you do not want the wizard casting spells. That's what he's good at. That's what he does. Counterspelling, Dispells, hell even grappling (if he were lower level I would suggest things like tanglebags, those are unlikely to pin someone at a high level however). Force concentration checks, keep him from teleporting or flying (fight someplace he can't fly, use items or spells to prevent teleports). So that he's never out of range. You want this to turn into a brawl in a place that the wizard is unprepared to brawl in. First off most wizards are bad at brawling, that's for people with alot of HP. Second off wizards work best when they can hold their opponents at arms length.

If you can try to blind him, that removes things like line of sight. Go through everyone's spell list and inventory and see what you can do. Hell, I saw one wizard get rolled because a rogue tied a bag around his head and then the fighter jumped in.

Surprise him, pin him down, remove his eyes, prevent him from casting freely, force him to make alot of checks and defensive rolls. That's how you kill a wizard. It won't be pretty or clean but he'll be down and that's what counts.

[Randomguy]

Oh, I just remembered something: Antimagic field + grapple shuts down most wizards, except Initiates of Mystra. The hard part is getting the person with AMF up close to the wizard.

[asuev]

Antimagic Ray (SpC 7th level spell) + fighter grapple. Then have your rogue walk up and give his kidneys "speed holes". Just reassure the wizard that he'll move faster after and that it's all for his own good.

Also ready actions to attack when he's casting. DC 10 + damage dealt to keep the spell is pretty hard to make. Especially if your fighter is a 2 handed power attacker.

[Roguenewb]

Mage Slaying is an honorable professon. And a very hard one. Watch out for the fact that you could end up against like 7 18 HD outsiders or elementals. Like a half dozen planetars....that's game over. Make sure you have dismissal or banishment so you can deal with planar binding creatures. Also look out for swarms of conjured beasties.

The single nastiest thing I know of is rod of maximize Time Stop, swift Arcane Spellsurge, then an extended forcecage for each of you, and a dimensional lock on the area, then 1-4 Maw of Chaos (2 of which would be maximized). If you can't win initiative, I know of no way to stop that. And god forbid he has real cheese like a Genesis Demiplane working at 8,000,000,000,000,000,000,000:1 time advantage.

You can employ the similar tactics, which I recommend, at least the time stop-forcecage-dimensional lock-maw of chaos progression.

[Mithril Leaf]

Polymorph one of your characters into a dire tortoise. Have them have access to some form of AMF. As a dire tortoise they automatically get to act in the surprise round, so they get to take the wizard's magic down.

[Ravens_cry]

Diplomacy check. Massive, massive, diplomacy check.

[ahenobarbi]

Diplomancy would be fun but DM probably won't allow it.

Why no one mentioned contingent spells?

If the wizard doesn't have teleportation protections you could.
Polymorph one of your fighters into dire tortoise (as Mithril Leaf suggested).
Put contingent AMF on the character (activated after completion of swift action teleportation).
Pump initiative of the character (Sign, Nerve skitter, Improved Initiative (via psychic reformation if necessary), Dex buffs, ...).
The character should act before wizard. It teleports to the wizard, AMF activates, character grapples wizard, everybody joins the hug.

[Eldariel]

Antimagic Ray (SpC 7th level spell) + fighter grapple. Then have your rogue walk up and give his kidneys "speed holes". Just reassure the wizard that he'll move faster after and that it's all for his own good.

Also ready actions to attack when he's casting. DC 10 + damage dealt to keep the spell is pretty hard to make. Especially if your fighter is a 2 handed power attacker.

Thanks to Ray Deflection, Contingency, Touch AC & Will-save, this is FAR from reliable. In fact, it's just about the most unreliable thing you could try. Don't bother.

[Sturmcrow]

Getting flashbacks to the lich fight in baldurs gate.

Expect a Time Stop followed by everyone in the party dying unless you have enough spell immunities/elemental immunities/active AMF.

Summon 4 Vrocks, have them do their dance within range of the wizard while some other minions keep him distracted. Boom. Try to figure out what contingencies he has and prepare for those going off.

Lots of Reaving Dispels on him.

[pyromanser244]

this may be a newbish idea, but when I've played fighter even melee fighter I like to have a composite longbow as a back up. it won't be optimized like your regular style but it still does damage like a longsword at long range and if the wizard knows you don't use something then there should be a hole in his defenses.

you may even get away with barbing the arrowheads and casting AMF on the arrows.:smallwink:

[Sturmcrow]

I just had a thought, maybe you are approaching this wrong. Instead of asking what combat strategy you should use, ask this knowledgebase what they would have an epic Wizard do with the assumption that the DM wants you to fight him and then try to find holes in the ideas presented.

:smallcool:

[Mithril Leaf]

I just had a thought, maybe you are approaching this wrong. Instead of asking what combat strategy you should use, ask this knowledgebase what they would have an epic Wizard do with the assumption that the DM wants you to fight him and then try to find holes in the ideas presented.

:smallcool:

Small problem, we wouldn't lose if we were the epic wizard. It'd basically consist of contingencies on contingencies on epic spellcasting on infinite to one genesis planes. Unless purposely crippled, epic wizard almost cannot lose.