First timer Gestalt and Binder Advice

[Postmodernist]

So I'm making a character for a new 8th level gestalt Eberron campaign taking place in Xendrik. The character will be drow, though it'll just be a standard elf refluffed. DM has allowed Lolth-Touched (also refluffed as Vulkoor-Touched and the STR/CON bonuses are only +4 instead of +6), and he's also allowing PrCs on both sides of the gestalt. Stat rolls (pre-racial modifications and stat bumps) are nice: 17, 16, 15, 14, 13, and 11. This character will likely be primary melee.

Tentative plan is: LE Paladin (Tyranny) 4/Crusader 1/RKV 3//Lolth-touched LA+1/Binder 4/Knight of the Sacred Seal 3. Not completely certain about feats, since the only one I'll need is (sadly) Weapon Focus. Binder 4 isn't necessary, but it grants a bonus feat.

Emphasize Charisma a little, go melee front liner, shoot for lots of versatility with binder. It'll be mostly dungeon crawl, and trips to the magic mart will be strictly limited. Thematic focus will be on Xendrik Drow themed stuff, employing things like Choculops (refluffed as a drow scorpion spirit or something) for combat bonuses. Mostly, he's a mean drow bastard on a mission from the scorpion god.

Is KotSS worth it, considering that gestalt covers a lot of angles, especially melee? Should I just focus on Binder instead? Other suggestions or comments? Thanks in advance for your help, Playgrounders.

[Postmodernist]

Shameless bump. I've glanced over most of the appropriate handbooks, just looking for input.

[Bloodgruve]

KotSS isn't bad at all. If you can do some homebrew there is a prc that I've been dieing to play, Midnight Occultist (http://forum.faxcelestis.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=22). Incarnum and Binder mix, crazy versatility and a lot of very fun combinations. You could play a new build every session for quite a while ;)

GL
Blood~

[God Imperror]

So I'm making a character for a new 8th level gestalt Eberron campaign taking place in Xendrik. The character will be drow, though it'll just be a standard elf refluffed. DM has allowed Lolth-Touched (also refluffed as Vulkoor-Touched and the STR/CON bonuses are only +4 instead of +6), and he's also allowing PrCs on both sides of the gestalt. Stat rolls (pre-racial modifications and stat bumps) are nice: 17, 16, 15, 14, 13, and 11. This character will likely be primary melee.

Tentative plan is: LE Paladin (Tyranny) 4/Crusader 1/RKV 3//Lolth-touched LA+1/Binder 4/Knight of the Sacred Seal 3. Not completely certain about feats, since the only one I'll need is (sadly) Weapon Focus. Binder 4 isn't necessary, but it grants a bonus feat.

Emphasize Charisma a little, go melee front liner, shoot for lots of versatility with binder. It'll be mostly dungeon crawl, and trips to the magic mart will be strictly limited. Thematic focus will be on Xendrik Drow themed stuff, employing things like Choculops (refluffed as a drow scorpion spirit or something) for combat bonuses. Mostly, he's a mean drow bastard on a mission from the scorpion god.

Is KotSS worth it, considering that gestalt covers a lot of angles, especially melee? Should I just focus on Binder instead? Other suggestions or comments? Thanks in advance for your help, Playgrounders.

KotSS is great (specially due to the increase in BAB) but since you are gestalting with full bab on the other side you ain't as pressed to take it.

The biggest problem with KotSS is the patron vestige it has to be something that you have bound before, so (in your case a vestige of no more than 3rd level, if you took improved binding, hint: you should).

If you are going to be front lining and you are going to have a nice cha Dahlver Nar is awesome giving you natural armor and shield self. Focalor is also a good candidate as its aura of sadness can be good in combination with your paladin's aura. Savnok is not bad either and pretty straight forward.

When playing a binder in gestalt with the other side a paladin (as you are) I love tenebrous. Tenebrous grants turn undead once every 5 rounds, ask your DM if you can use it to power feats or class features.

[Postmodernist]

Cool, so it looks like I'll just go straight binder in the meantime. Any other cool suggestions?

[God Imperror]

Get battle blessing to make your paladin spells swift action castings that way you can get more spells on the table, at later level if you combine tenebrous turning with divine impetus that's a lot of spells without heavy investment.

Also take a look at divine feats with good durations such as divine shield or divine vigor (from complete warrior). Similarly domain feats are also a good way to expend tenebrous turning attempts such as strength devotion (making your attacks count as adamantine).

Acererak is also a great guy to bind it allows you to heal on negative energy (and positive) so your inflict spells can heal you, and in a couple of levels you are probably going to appreciate it.

My advice is to play straight binder a little until you realize that you really like a certain ability, then go and get knight of the sacred seal with the vestige that gives it as your patron vestige.

[Postmodernist]

Any ideas on Devotion feats from CC? I was thinking maybe Animal (lots of utility, RP-wise refluffed as maybe Insect Devotion) or Death. I'm sure they aren't optimal, but they look potentially fun. Anyone have any experience with them?

[God Imperror]

Animal devotion is an awesome feat it grants flight or a big bonus to STR those are good options. I haven't ever tried death devotion but it is probably good too negative levels can be a pain.

[Postmodernist]

The ability to use Tenebrous to power divine feats seems pretty awesome. I'll have to check that out.

[Dusk Eclipse]

I am fan of Law Devotion, the bonus isn't bad and you can switch it depending on what you need; but I do agree that Animal Devotion has a lot more utility.

[Postmodernist]

I'm thinking Power Attack, Improved Binding, and Battle Blessing for feats now. Anything else that would be worth dropping a Flaw (or two) for?

What's a distinctively cool weapon this character should wield? Any cool equipment ideas, for that matter? I know Xendrik Drow have a propensity for the long knife, scorpion chain, and Xendrik boomerang, though using those would cost me the Drow Skirmisher feat. Any other suggestions would be welcome.

[Postmodernist]

Minor bump: Anyone have any experience using Karsus and his UMD ability for buffs? Regularly binding him and carrying around wand chambers with assorted buffs on them might be good.

[silverwolfer]

so my mind isn't bleeding to much, can you sperate each of your gesalts line?

[Postmodernist]

Side 1: Paladin 4/Crusader 1/RKV 3
Side 2: LA +1/Binder 7

DM is allowing PrCs on both sides of the gestalt.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Save a very few buff spells (wraithstrike for example), most of them rely on CL for their effects and/or durations, which make wand costs prohibitble high, if you are going to bind Karsus for UMD I suggest to get hold of utility spells, swift fly, swift haste, serpent's swiftness, etc. to use in combat.

As for weapons, getting reach is one of the best options for a melee character so grab a Guisarme for tripping goodness or a Glaive for slightly more damage and go to town.

[TekHed]

Any room in that game for a Gestalt Warforged Master of Many Forms??? :smallbiggrin:

[silverwolfer]

If phenominal raw power is what we want, mystic paliden varient + anima mage?

[Postmodernist]

Save a very few buff spells (wraithstrike for example), most of them rely on CL for their effects and/or durations, which make wand costs prohibitble high, if you are going to bind Karsus for UMD I suggest to get hold of utility spells, swift fly, swift haste, serpent's swiftness, etc. to use in combat.

As for weapons, getting reach is one of the best options for a melee character so grab a Guisarme for tripping goodness or a Glaive for slightly more damage and go to town.

This is in keeping with my expectations. I was contemplating taking Animal Devotion for some of the abilities (speed and flight), but wands of wraithstrike, enlarge person, and other utility buffs seemed appropriate. Any other suggestions?


Any room in that game for a Gestalt Warforged Master of Many Forms??? :smallbiggrin:

I can ask the DM, but I think we might be full. I'll toss a link your way once the IC thread goes up, if you're interested in following along.


If phenominal raw power is what we want, mystic paliden varient + anima mage?

I'm not too concerned about raw power, otherwise I might have gone Binder/Dread Necromancer/Anima Mage on one side of the gestalt. I'm more concerned about the character's intended design and goals being thematically appropriate while still being pretty optimal for his role. Technically, RAW battle blessing and the mystic fire knight paladin don't work (something about "paladin spell list," IIRC) together, though that's often a DM call. Besides, given that this game will be in the tier 2-3 area, I think my build fills that slot nicely. Still, it's a cool suggestion.

[StreamOfTheSky]

I suggest either doing cleric/RKV, or if sticking to the above, put the LA +1 on the paladin side. You want the nasty LA stuff as far from your "more caster-like" side as possible, the level delay hurts more there. And...I consider a Binder more like a "caster" than a paladin/RKV...

[Postmodernist]

Actually, that's not a bad idea. With Improved Binding, I'll have 5th level vestiges and be able to bind 2 at once. It costs me a BAB which is more than made up for with the +STR from Lolth-Touched.

[Postmodernist]

Anyone have any experience using Dantalion in conjunction with Crusader stuff? It seems like the Awe of Dantalion ability, coupled with a ton of lockdown build stuff would basically prevent enemies from doing much of anything at all, yeah?