City size by population.

[Thewaitingman]

I've searched everywhere for this but I can't seem to find the actual size (in square kms or acres) of a city relative to its population. So if we suppose a city/town/village/hamlet is perfectly round or square how long would its radius or side be? I'm trying to figure out the size of tilverton and since its almost a circle it would be helpful.

[Yora]

It depends on the availability of space and distances between homes and work places. If you have a flat open plain and good city planning, a city can cover a huge area with large gardens for almost every house.
If the city is located on a river island, than everything has to be crammed on that island, regardless of how many people live there.

In my home city, the population was relatively stable at 20.000 people, who all lived on a single square kilometer because the river and the walls made expansions impossible. Today, the same area is home to just half that number, now that military defense is no longer a concern and all the surrounding land is available. You can still see how tightly packed it is today. (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=l%C3%BCbeck&hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=53.86627,10.69489&spn=0.017436,0.036693&safe=off&hnear=L%C3%BCbeck,+Schleswig-Holstein,+Germany&t=h&z=15) This is how the average street looks like from the ground. (http://images.traum-ferienwohnungen.de/45179/509560/19/Die%2520Hundestrasse%2520in%2520der%2520L%25C3%25B Cbecker%2520Altstadt.jpg)
Given that the size didn't change for centuries, that's probably as dense as it can possibly get. According to wikipedia, there are currently only 36 cities in thee world that reach a higher population density and most are in India and the Philipines.

[the_david]

This site holds all the answers:
http://www222.pair.com/sjohn/blueroom/demog.htm

And this one makes it easy for you:
http://www.rpglibrary.org/utils/meddemog/

[jseah]

Psh, that's nothing, you can cram more people in if you use high rise buildings. Last I saw, Singapore where I grew up is now putting people in 30 storey high apartment blocks (and this is government subsidized housing, which is all over the place; the city cannot afford to have slums and aggressively prevents illegal construction and habitation).

...
Oh wow, we have 7.3 thousand people per sq km and are third in the world. Hrm. That must be why everywhere else feels so flat. =(

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If you have a fantasy world, magic will likely let you build as high as you want. Dimensional magic might let you build houses on top of each other or have 4000 sq ft fit into 400.

Stuff gets a whole lot more complicated when you can do weird things like that. And the center of a city, where all the money is, is where such magic is most likely to be applied (since it won't make economic sense to use it anywhere else)

[Thewaitingman]

Thanks for your answers! Really useful links the_david:smallsmile:

What about dwarven cities? Do dwarves cram in their caves or is that a missconception?

[the_david]

It depends on the setting.

Norse mythology has dwarves turning into stone in direct sunlight, so they live underground and only come out at night.

The dwarves from Snowwhite live aboveground, but they do have a mine.

The Pathfinder setting teaches us that dwarves tunneled their way to the surface of Golarion, in a attempt to escape the orcs.


You can have your dwarves living in underground cities, or you can let them carve cities out of mountains. Underground communities would have a higher population density.

[sktarq]

Well think about this. Every cubic cm of space in a dwarven city, be it a business, home, public street, alley, sewer, church, drill hall, storage silo for food, mines, workshops, smelting furnaces, water course, plus many of their farms fields, etc had to be created from solid rock. That rock had to be beeten out of place by tough little men with long beards, then carted away to abysses, voids, or the surface to be dispossed of-a trip that may be many miles. Those people had to be fed and watered during that time and compensated for their time. That is allot of expense. Thus it follows that volume of space is very costly in a dwarven stronghold thus living quarters for a dwarf would be much smaller that an equally prosperous human. This would be especially true of area that few which to claim and take advantage of such a public streets. It is so much more work to carve a street 5 yards further (with its height and width) just to provide space between family houses that unless a statement is trying to be made it is not worth it. Above ground it means walking wee bit farther or paving just the ground at the most. Thus it makes allot more sense to pack 'em in than in above ground settlements.
So yes dwarven settelments are very likely to be sardine like in their lack of privacy.....some exception will occur when they can.