Would this help get rid of MADness?

[Origomar]

For the monk, if i were to put 3 levels into swashbuckler, and take Kung fu Genius at level 4 when i start getting monk levels.

I would suck pretty badly until i got my first monk level if i chose weapon finesse for unarmed attacks, and tried to stack pure Dex and Int.

But once i did do you think it would let me not be quite as MAD as the monk normally is since i basically just need Dex for hit, Int for damage and some constitution for health.


Also, for Insightful strike, do i have to actually be using the weapon finesse feat(dex modifier for hit) or does it still work if im just using a weapon that i got weapon finesse for?

I'm not sure if im missing anything other than the majority of monk feats would still require wisdom which would be kinda lame since there would be less of a point in me having any if i took kung fu genius.

[ahenobarbi]

Monk could still use Wis to get AC bonus. Or it could get mithril breastplate and dump wisdom. So yes, this could help monk MADness a bit.

EDIT: OR does Kung-fu genius add Int to AC? Internets say so but I don't have dragon #319 so I can't check.

[eggs]

I can't remember which of Carmendine Monk or KFG was the one that tied the monk's non-AC features to Intelligence, but if it's not KFG, you might want to check Carmendine out. It' in Champions of Valor.


But addressing the bigger questions, the problem that is understressed when people talk about MAD is that MAD is not so much a problem with abilities being keyed off different stats as it is a problem with a classes' features just not being very good.

Just to break this down, it's burning 4 levels to get one stat to attack, another stat to damage and a high AC. That's less useful than what a high-strength Fighter wearing armor gets out of the can (the Fighter consolidates its offense into one stat which is even multiplied for damage output, and which also applies to its various combat maneuvers).

So the Ability-related problems might be a bit less bad, but they're still there.

Generally, if your problem with a class is that it relies to much on ability scores, the easiest solution is just to get it better class features. Sprinkling in even just a handful of Warblade levels would help tie this together considerably.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Monk could still use Wis to get AC bonus. Or it could get mithril breastplate and dump wisdom. So yes, this could help monk MADness a bit.

...You know what Kung Fu Genius does, right?

Also, if you're wearing armor of any sort, a lot of your class features stop working.

However, unless I missed something and KFG can be taken as a 1st level monk bonus feat, you're waiting until level 6 before you stop being completely terrible. Then you're just mostly bad.

[ahenobarbi]

...You know what Kung Fu Genius does, right?

No I don't, see my EDIT :smalltongue:


And what do you loose?
- Wis to AC - not a problem because you want to dump Wis.
- Faster movement - well that hurts a little.

Something else?

[Origomar]

No I don't, see my EDIT :smalltongue:


And what do you loose?
- Wis to AC - not a problem because you want to dump Wis.
- Faster movement - well that hurts a little.

Something else?

It just changes all monk abilities that would work off of wisdom and make them work off of intelligence.

[TopCheese]

To help from Monk MADness...

Replace your AC bonus from WIS to CON. Also for Quivering Palm DC and any other class feature the Monk gains (ACF;s and stuff).

Then you have a 3 attributes that you are playing with just like most other melee types.

Str/Dex/Con

You will have 3 scores that are more or less dump-ish

Int/Wis/Cha

[gorfnab]

I would suck pretty badly until i got my first monk level if i chose weapon finesse for unarmed attacks, and tried to stack pure Dex and Int.

But once i did do you think it would let me not be quite as MAD as the monk normally is since i basically just need Dex for hit, Int for damage and some constitution for health.


Also, for Insightful strike, do i have to actually be using the weapon finesse feat(dex modifier for hit) or does it still work if im just using a weapon that i got weapon finesse for?

With Weapon Finesse in 3.0 you had to choose which weapon it applied to. In 3.5 Weapon Finesse applies to all light one handed weapons, as well as rapiers, whips, and spiked chains (and a few other exotics from some non-core books).

You can get Int mod to HP from the feat Faerie Mysteries Initiate. See also X stat to Y bonus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125732)