[PF] Emulating the Iron Kingdoms Gun Mage

[Thalnawr]

So... I dearly adore the Gun Mage class, as published in the Iron Kingdoms Character Guide by Privateer Press. I'd love to be able to have it (or something very similar) available for my Pathfinder campaigns. The Myrmidarch (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus/archetypes/paizo---magus-archetypes/myrmidarch) archetype of the Magus comes fairly close, but without spontaneous Charisma-based casting or anything to simulate the bond a gun mage has with their magelock pistol, it just doesn't feel right. It also gets too focused on armor, when the gun mage was only allowed light armor.

Does anybody know of any homebrew that might better emulate the gun mage than this archetype? I attempted to search the Homebrew section, however the search kept erroring out. My google-fu found this partially completed work (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159322), but I don't think it's quite what I'm looking for. The others I found weren't much better.

[Ravenica]

other than the spellslinger archetype for wizard in ultimate combat there isn't anything else that I know of (in paizo material anyway)

[Thalnawr]

other than the spellslinger archetype for wizard in ultimate combat there isn't anything else that I know of (in paizo material anyway)
Spellslinger is nice, but it has the unfortunate problem of being a wizard archetype. I'm not really averse to homebrew material, and have slowly started working on my own take on it. Completely stuck for what to do about a capstone ability, however...

[grarrrg]

So... I dearly adore the Gun Mage class, as published in the Iron Kingdoms Character Guide by Privateer Press. I'd love to be able to have it (or something very similar) available for my Pathfinder campaigns. The http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus/archetypes/paizo---magus-archetypes/myrmidarch (Myrmidarch) archetype of the Magus comes fairly close, but without spontaneous Charisma-based casting or anything to simulate the bond a gun mage has with their magelock pistol, it just doesn't feel right. It also gets too focused on armor, when the gun mage was only allowed light armor.

Well, the Myrmidarch is fully compatible with the Spell Dancer (Elf) (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/core-races/elf/spell-dancer-magus-elf) archetype. The main change is that Arcane Pool grants movement/defensive abilities instead of boosting your Weapon. It also trades away Medium/Heavy armor for a Insight bonuses to AC.

Also, Spellslinger doesn't "specifically" state that it "only" works with Wizard-cast spells. Dip 1 level of Spellslinger and then go with whatever class makes you happy.

[Thalnawr]

Spell Dancer is definately interesting, but not everyone wants to be a poncy little elf. Having to carry a spellbook, rather than having the magic be intuitive through the gun mages innate understanding of his gun is a real drag. Doesn't have a bond with their weapon either. Spellslinger suffers from similar problems. I'm not really sure why there isn't a gun-using archetype that casts arcane spells via charisma in the official material, especially since they went out of their way to make the Mysterious Stranger for the Gunslinger...

[Baroncognito]

Also, Spellslinger doesn't "specifically" state that it "only" works with Wizard-cast spells. Dip 1 level of Spellslinger and then go with whatever class makes you happy.

I was under the impression that it deliberately did not state that you could only use Wizard Spells for it.

Also, there is a third-party Magus archetype that provides spontaneous casting, but I don't know if it's supposed to be charisma based or intelligence based.

[Blisstake]

I'm not really sure why there isn't a gun-using archetype that casts arcane spells via charisma in the official material, especially since they went out of their way to make the Mysterious Stranger for the Gunslinger...

Probably because that's an extremely specific character concept, and there's no real reason to make two spellcasting gunslingers when they already have one.

That said, gunslingers are proficient with all martial weapons. So you can pretty easily go Mysterious Stranger 5/Sorcerer/Eldritch Knight. Just make sure you have at least 5 levels in the gunslinger for the dex to damage.

[Thalnawr]

I was under the impression that it deliberately did not state that you could only use Wizard Spells for it.

Also, there is a third-party Magus archetype that provides spontaneous casting, but I don't know if it's supposed to be charisma based or intelligence based.
The Cabalist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus/archetypes/3rd-party-publishers/super-genius-games---magus-archetypes/cabalist) looks to be what you were talking about, however it is not compatible with Myrmidarch, as both replace the knowledge pool with different things.

[grarrrg]

Probably because that's an extremely specific character concept, and there's no real reason to make two spellcasting gunslingers when they already have one.

That said, gunslingers are proficient with all martial weapons. So you can pretty easily go Mysterious Stranger 5/Sorcerer/Eldritch Knight. Just make sure you have at least 5 levels in the gunslinger for the dex to damage.

Mysterious Stranger does not get DEX to damage. They also do not get Quick Clear deed.
Instead they get CHA to damage (but have to pay Grit) at 1st, and can ignore Misfires starting at level 5.

So only 1 level of Mysterious Stranger would be 'needed'.

But the OP wants to 'shoot spells', so that idea kinda falls apart anyway.


Assuming you/your DM are OK with Spellslinger working with Not-Wizard spells, then something like Wizard 1/Mysterious Stranger 1/Sorcerer X would work fairly well, getting CHA for Grit and Casting.
Or Wizard 1/Gunslinger 1/Sorcerer (Empyreal) X could work too, Empyreal is a Wild Bloodline that lets you use WIS for Casting, that way you still get WIS to Grit and Casting.

[Thalnawr]

Mysterious Stranger does not get DEX to damage.
Assuming you/your DM are OK with Spellslinger working with Not-Wizard spells, then something like Wizard 1/Mysterious Stranger 1/Sorcerer X would work fairly well, getting CHA for Grit and Casting.
Or Wizard 1/Gunslinger 1/Sorcerer (Empyreal) X could work too, Empyreal is a Wild Bloodline that lets you use WIS for Casting, that way you still get WIS to Grit and Casting.
Hmmm... I suppose the first could work, using the Arcane bloodline to get a bonded pistol. The second wouldn't exactly do it, without using the Crossblooded (Arcane/Empyreal) archetype. The GM I play with probably wouldn't let the Wizard/Sorc thing fly, however, due to some funky house rules he has. At the best, I'd be spending 2 Sorc spell slots to cast any of the spells in the 4 opposition schools Spellslinger has to take.

[KoopaTrooper#12]

I was just working on this for our group here I have a bunch of options.
There is a book called Might of the Magus for Pathfinder and inside is a feat
Ranged Spellstrike
You can use spellstrike with ranged weapons.
Prerequisite: Spellstrike, Point-Blank Shot
Benefit: You can use spellstrike with a ranged weapon
that is ready to fire rather than a melee weapon. Ready to
fire means it is either thrown, already loaded, or requires
only a free action to load.

So you need that for any magus build but that and being proficient in a gun should be enough.

Gunslinger/Magus again you can go 5 gunslinger for dex to dmg (a good idea) or just take one level in it for the extra grit and prof in the gun.

Magus with this option you would pick up the amateur gunslinger feat to gain 1 point of grit and the prof you need and just go up as a Magus to spell strike your heart out with out loosing out/slowing down gaining any of those cool abilities.

Gunslinger/Alchemist (Grenadier archetype) http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/grenadier You can once more go 1 or 5 for Gunslinger depending if you just want the prof with a deed and grit or want the dex to dmg. But the Grenadier gains the ability to infuse bullets/weapon with an alchemical item such as alch fire. Now that only effects one target but how cool would it be to say shoot someone with a bullet that had abolyth mucus on it lol. The archetype also gives some nice options for the alchemists bombs. Also an alternate option with this one would be to go 2 into Alchemist (Grenadier) just to get the infuse option and go up the rest of the as gun smith.

Cavalier (Musketeer)/Wizard(SpellSlinger) or Magus this is a heavier investment for Cavalier as it takes 8 lvls to get good.. gives you improved crit in the gun and prof in it but the normal cavalier abilties are cool.. the gun replaces the horse and it talks about how they cannot sell the gun as it is a symbol and a focus for his talent abilities and he counts a a fighter for qualifying for feats. The wizard magus is just to get the casting in there.. but it still sounds pretty cool.

Also if you pick up the Bladebound archetype for Magus your gun cannot gain the broken condition.. so misfiring doesn't ever hurt your weapon.

[Larpus]

Checking the archetype, it doesn't seem too terribly hard to adapt it to a Sorcerer: Gunsmith replaces Eschew Materials, Mage Bullets work as is, and Arcane Gun and School of the Gun replace couple bloodline powers or lower your effective level when determining bloodline powers/spells; or in the case of School of the Gun, might even make the Sorcerer pick couple opposition schools and make him unable to learn spells from those schools.

It's homebrew, but eh...it's a very specific concept that's only explored once in the official rules, so I'd say it's a good candidate.

[Thalnawr]

I was just working on this for our group here I have a bunch of options.
There is a book called Might of the Magus for Pathfinder and inside is a feat
Ranged Spellstrike
You can use spellstrike with ranged weapons.
Prerequisite: Spellstrike, Point-Blank Shot
Benefit: You can use spellstrike with a ranged weapon
that is ready to fire rather than a melee weapon. Ready to
fire means it is either thrown, already loaded, or requires
only a free action to load.
What book is this feat in since it's not on the SRD? I have to own the book or have access to it online in order to use specific material. The Myrmidarch already does this for ranged touch spells, at the very least.



Also if you pick up the Bladebound archetype for Magus your gun cannot gain the broken condition.. so misfiring doesn't ever hurt your weapon.
And there's the bond with a weapon I was looking for, IF my GM allows me to have a Black Gun instead of a Black Blade...

[KoopaTrooper#12]

the book is Advanced Feats - Might of the Magus, here is the link.
http://paizo.com/products/btpy8lgs?Advanced-Feats-Might-of-the-Magus
Tons of good stuff in the book for a magus, if your DM wont let you use Bladebound you could go for item familiar.

[Blyte]

Have you considered simply porting the spellslinger over to a sorcerer archetype, to elevate the burden of taking the 1 wiz dips grarrrg was suggesting?