-Only one Magic School-

[Bulix]

If you could choose only ONE school for your wizard, what would it be?
Besides transmutation, what else is good?
List the pros and cons of your favorite and/or least favorite.

Thanks :smallbiggrin:

[TypoNinja]

Conjuration.

If I can't cast it I'll damn well Summon something that can.

[Malroth]

with shadow craft mage Illusion.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Conjuration.

If I can't cast it I'll damn well Summon something that can.

QFT.

Conjuration can do most things, and can summon or call critters to do the rest.

Eliminating that and transmutation I'd probably pick abjuration.

What's stronger than magic? Making magic not work.

Though if I could pick two, it'd be a combination of illusion and enchantment. "I reject your reality and substitute my own....... and you do too, whether you like it or not."

[Piggy Knowles]

Illusion - decent mix of defensive buffs, offensive spells and utility, and the Shadow line of spells is a big help as well.

Conjuration is a close second, though - shadow walk can sort of sub in for teleportation but I'd miss the real thing, and I suppose I could always use Conjuration to planar bind an outsider to cast my buffs for me.

[jaybird]

Other then Conjuration and Transmutation? Necromancy or Illusion would be my next up picks. Good mix of offense, defense, and utility.

Worst one IMO is Enchantment - at least Evocation can always do something, even if it isn't much, and you still have Wall of X and some great metamagic seeds.

[BowStreetRunner]

Conjuration.

If I can't cast it I'll damn well Summon something that can.

Pikachu! I choose you! :smallbiggrin:

[Sgt. Cookie]

Actually, I'd personally go for Enchantment.

It gets a bit of a bad rep, simply because Enchantment needs to be played smart to be any good. And playing smart is my cup of tea.

[Flickerdart]

Actually, I'd personally go for Enchantment.

It gets a bit of a bad rep, simply because Enchantment needs to be played smart to be any good. And playing smart is my cup of tea.
Protection from X, Mind Blank and friends, undead, constructs...playing smart is one thing, but Enchantment is one of the easiest schools to just say "no" to.

[dascarletm]

Honestly it's just too campaign specific to say almost. Conjuration is probably the most useful as has been said.

It would be fun to try and go a whole campaign using only Illusion spells or something. (assuming the DM knows this in advance and would limit the Oh you can't do anything moments.

[Eldariel]

Conjuration & Illusion are super-versatile and really strong; my order is probably Conjuration > Transmutation > Illusion. Abjuration is pretty nice too but playing an Abjurer would be kinda dull since your offense is restricted to banishing **** and dispelling magic (which, granted, is useful but not really that versatile).

After that, well, Enchantment is incredibly convenient but weak to counterplay and really restricted in creatures it can affect (natural mind-affecting immunity is annoyingly common) so I have to place it last. Evocation is kinda like Conjuration lite; it doesn't do things as well but it's also quite versatile. Necro has some real good stuff tho; I'd probably put the rest as Abjuration > Necro > Evo > Enchantment.


As for Divination? Really powerful game-shaping school but if I was restricted to just it, I'd have not much to do in combat. I wouldn't play a "Diviner ONLY" outside a campaign where fighting just isn't that common.

[Snowbluff]

with shadow craft mage Illusion.

Cheater! lol :smalltongue:

I like Abjuration. I'm a big buffer, and without Transmutation as an option, this is what I got!

[killianh]

polymorph subschool :smallbiggrin:

but really it depends on the campaign.

Evocation has it's uses, but damage isn't what magic is for when you can do so much more.

Illusions and enchantments have so many ways to counter in mid to late play that being limited exclusively to either one can be bad.

Abjuration is a really good school over all. The only real downside is that being mainly defensive won't accomplish all that much.

Necromancy makes too many enemies to be chosen as the only school, but it can hold it's own against most other schools for summons, debuffs, and BFC

Divination is great for the prep side of the game, but having only divination leaves you lacking when it comes time to actually go and do something.

Conjuration gives you a touch of everything, and all of the fun stuff that sets you aside as a proper caster. Easily the top contender between transmutation for top school. The main difference I find between the two is that conjuration comes with more options that can be interesting to work on, while transmutation is pretty straight forward in how to play one well.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Illusion has the advantage of having Shadow Conjuration/Evocation, so you still get access to spells like Contingency, even WITHOUT Shadowcraft shenanigans. Of course, Shadowcraft does make this a 'do anything you want and get away with it' college.

Transmutation has the Polymorph subschool. If you can get access to their supernatural abilities, this can replace the single-school casting. Alternately, morph into something that is a full caster. Plus a solid lineup of buffs and debuffs.

Conjuration. As was mentioned... lots of 'no save, no SR, just die' and a lot of really nice battlefield control and Save or Lose. Plus, if there's something you want to do that you can't do yourself... Planar Binding solves this.

The rest are either too marginal, or too easy to shut down.

Abjuration has the Exploding Rune Bombs, but that's about their only offensive ability, and not every level has decent spells.

Enchantment is just too easy to shut down. Immune to Mind Affecting makes you immune to this college.

Necromancy is also too easy to shut down, plus Undead, typically a large portion of opponents, not only ignores it, but actively benefits from it. Double fail.

Divination is nice... but knowing what is going to happen without being able to do something about it is rather worthless.

[Feralventas]

Divination: The idea of fore-knowledge and preparation has been brought up, but so has combative-ineffectiveness. There are, however, plenty of divination buffs to damage.

Arrow Mind: Threaten nearby squares with a bow and fire without provoking AOO.

Critical Strike: 1 round of +1d6 damage, double threat range, and +4 on Crit confirmation.

Guided Shot: ignore distance co er and concealment for a round.

Sniper's Shot: no range limit on next Sneak Attack.

Targeting Ray: +1 to hit/3 levels on target. Have an archer co-hort or ally and play the spotter.

And let's not forget Truestrike; when you Absolutely Must Hit That Thing.


Looking into Seers as well as Diviners (psionics) a Seer also gets Precognition for Offense and Defense, bonuses to Damage, Hit, AC and Saves all by way of foresight.

[Flickerdart]

Divination: The idea of fore-knowledge and preparation has been brought up, but so has combative-ineffectiveness. There are, however, plenty of divination buffs to damage.

Arrow Mind: Threaten nearby squares with a bow and fire without provoking AOO.

Critical Strike: 1 round of +1d6 damage, double threat range, and +4 on Crit confirmation.

Guided Shot: ignore distance co er and concealment for a round.

Sniper's Shot: no range limit on next Sneak Attack.

Targeting Ray: +1 to hit/3 levels on target. Have an archer co-hort or ally and play the spotter.

And let's not forget Truestrike; when you Absolutely Must Hit That Thing.


Looking into Seers as well as Diviners (psionics) a Seer also gets Precognition for Offense and Defense, bonuses to Damage, Hit, AC and Saves all by way of foresight.
Don't forget Hunter's Eye. A Diviner simply doesn't not go into Unseen Seer.

[Hirax]

Transmutation probably. Tough choice over conjuration, but for every problem, there is a polymorph/shapechange solution.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Oh you, you naive thing, thinking Transmutation is the only all-powerful school...

Conjuration. But if you have a kneejerk and ban that too, Evocation or Illusion. Illusion has the second-best buffs after Transmutation, plus some okay BFC, Evocation has the second-best BFC after Conjuration, plus some good blasting for metamagic abuse.

[Tokuhara]

Screw your schools, little wizards. I'm a Druid!!!

[Piggy Knowles]

OK, flipping through the SRD and looking at spells I would probably prepare on a daily basis, here is what I see:

Abjuration:
1- Two pretty good defensive buffs, one utility spell that's handy in lower levels.
2- Two pretty good defensive buffs, one utility spell that's handy in lower levels. Sound familiar?
3- Three defensive buffs (one is a little situational but the other two are quite good), the super-useful debuff/utility/whatever that is Dispel Magic, and one offensive spell that requires a fair bit of prep to work.
4- Two decent utility spells and two decent defensive buffs.
5- A save-or-lose! Granted, it's situational, but it's nice to see. Plus one good utility spell.
6- Greater Dispel Magic and AMF, plus some situational defensive buffs.
7- Another situational save-or-lose and a solid defensive buff.
8- A REALLY good defensive buff, plus another that's OK. You also get a BFC spell! Hurray, you can sort of fill other roles!
9- Save-or-lose, BFC, utility. If every level looked like this, a single-school Abjurer could be fun.

Conjuration:
1- This is a REALLY good level for Conj. A mini-BFC/save or be inconvenienced targetting Reflex, a quite good defensive buff, some BFC, and a fair bit of utility.
2- An OK blast spell, if that's your thing, an excellent AoE save-or-lose, two decent BFC spells and SMII, which could fall under utility or offense.
3- Two very nice BFC spells, a utility spell that almost crosses over into buff territory, and SMIII, which is probably the best summon monster for its level.
4- Two very nice BFC spells, the first teleportation spell we see, and two good utility spells (one of which is one of the most flexible spells in the game), plus SMIV.
5- Lesser Planar Binding means that, with enough splatbook diving, you can probably find a roundabout way of casting any other spell on this list. There's also Teleport, which is a big game changer. (Seriously, once you get access to Teleport, the entire feel of D&D changes.) Also, Major Creation, plus two of the best BFC spells in Core.
6- Some decent BFC, and your planar binding gets a boost.
7- Your teleporting is now perfect. Enjoy. You also get a combo utility/save-or-lose, and a few good utility spells.
8- An OK BFC spell, plus two save-or-loses and Greater Planar Binding. Oh yeah, and SMVIII is pretty nice, too.
9- Gate. The rest is kind of meh - SMIV isn't actually that much better than SMVIII, especially when Gate is available.

Divination:
1- Several utility spells that are handy, but none that I could see myself building a character around.
2- Three decent utility spells, one of which is pretty essential (See Invisibility - although Conjuration has Glitterdust and summoned critters with scent to work around it).
3- Arcane Sight, Tongues and Clairvoyance.
4- Again, all utility. At this point a straight Diviner could make a decent scout, now that they've got things like Arcane Eye, Scrying and Clairvoyance up their sleeve, but they couldn't do much else in Core.
5- Two very nice scouting spells, plus Contact Other Plane, which is theoretically almost as much of a game changer as Teleport.
6- Analyze Dweomer, Legend Lore and True Seeing. Man, Divination is tiny in Core.
7- Again, just three spells, and they're all just expanded versions of spells you already have. Divination is cool but I'm bored already.
8- Hey, you get a pretty excellent buff at this level! Also, two nice scouting spells.
9- One spell. It's a REALLY good one, an excellent defensive buff, but that's all you get.

Enchantment:
1- Two very solid save-or-lose spells, including one that has out of combat uses (both Will negates, though).
2- One OK save-or-lose, and a so-so debuff.
3- Three Will-targeting save-or-loses and two solid buffs.
4- Two save-or-loses, and an OK debuff.
5- Two save-or-loses (yawn), and one very nice anti-spellcaster spell.
6- A decent buff and a multi-target save-or-lose with some out of combat usage.
7- One multi-target save-or-lose and one no-save debuff.
8- The big one here is Irresistible Dance. The rest is OK but kind of meh for 8th level.
9- Actually, not too bad. Dominate Monster is pretty useful, as is PWK.

Evocation:
1- Not terribad. Three different styles of blasting (at a level where most enemies have low enough HP to make blasting pretty good) and one decent utility.
2- One of Evocation's better levels. Some pretty solid blasting (and again, blasting is still useful at these levels), plus two of the best utility spells in the game.
3- A couple of OK blasting spells and three pretty good utility spells.
4- One meh defensive buff (if I had access to all schools I doubt I'd ever prepare Fire Shield, but if all I had was Evocation I might), two very nice BFC spells, and some OK blasting.
5- One excellent BFC, and one very nice utility spell.
6- Contingency. Too bad you can only set one, because the rest of this level is boring. One OK blasting spell, except by now blasting is not very useful.
7- Forcecage, which is expensive but very nice. Also gets a decent but semi-unreliable debuff.
8- Man, this level sucks for Evocation. Which is a shame, because it actually was pretty useful up until now.
9- Again, high level Evoker is booooring. Two spells that aren't TERRIBLE, but not particularly interesting.

Illusion:
1- A very good save-or-lose and several utility spells, plus Silent Image, which depending on the DM can be the best 1st-level spell in the game or something that pretty much everyone ignore.
2- Three excellent defensive buffs, one save-or-lose, and three solid utility spells.
3- Two excellent defensive buffs, plus Major Image.
4- A pretty good level for Illusion, with the super-flexible Shadow Conjuration, plus a very good defensive buff, a couple of save-or-loses, and some OK utility.
5- Shadow Evocation. Some decent utility spells, too, but that's the big one.
6- One very nice buff, and one very nice utility spell. Shadow Walk is no Teleport, but if you don't have access to Conjuration, it'll do in a pinch.
7- Greater Shadow Conjuration, Project Image and Simulacrum are all incredibly good.
8- Greater Shadow Evocation plus an OK save-or-lose and a utility spell that's actually pretty handy at this point in the game.
9- Shades. Shades is a very good spell.

Necromancy:
1- A decent save-or-lose with a solid debuff on a successful save, and an excellent debuff.
2- Three decent save-or-loses, including one that doesn't actually require a save against mindless undead, which is most of what you'll face at these levels. One very nice defensive buff, and a couple of decent utility spells.
3- One combo blast/healing spell and one decent debuff.
4- Animate Dead alone makes a single-schooled necromancer decent, assuming clerics and dread necromancers aren't around to laugh at him. But there's also two very good debuffs (Enervation in particular is nice), and the excellent multi-threat Fear.
5- Magic Jar. The rest is barely worth preparing except in very situational circumstances.
6- Two decent save-or-dies and an OK debuff.
7- Save-or-die plus a very nice no save debuff.
8- Clone is pretty useful if clerics don't exist, but not really otherwise. Anyhow, I don't really like Create Undead, but the greater version isn't bad.
9- Hey, Necromancy gets more 9th-level spells than any of the other schools! You have two particularly good ones - Astral Projection and Wail of the Banshee.

Transmutation:
1- The best low-level offensive buff in Core, plus two other decent buffs and two solid utility spells.
2- Yikes, Transmutation has a ton of great stuff this level. One of the most flexible buffs in the game, plus several other great buffs. A ton of excellent utility spells, and one decent multi-threat (BFC/save-or-suck).
3- I count a total of 5 awesome buffs, plus a very good multi-target debuff and a couple of decent utility spells.
4- Polymorph. I'd say you are now a better fighter than the fighter, but that's damning you with faint praise. You're now as good a fighter as the druid. Plus one excellent utility, and one very good party buff.
5- One amazing and one so-so buff, a save-or-lose, and several very nice utility spells. Plus telekinesis, which can potentially be a very good blast spell but has several other uses as well.
6- One blasting spell that is actually powerful enough to work at these levels, plus it has utility uses as well. A couple of solid save-or-loses, a lot of utility, and several party-buffs.
7- A good utility spell, a no-save-just-suck, and a spell with a long casting time that can destroy armies.
8- Polymorph Any Object. Just prepare that for every spell slot. Buff, utility, save-or-lose, you name it.
9- Shapechange. Talk about crazy Gate shenanigans all you want. In actual game terms, this is probably the single most useful 9th-level spell. But just in case that wasn't enough, you also get TIME STOP. Which is nice, because Shapechange's duration is long enough that you'll want something to do with your other spell slots.

From looking at this...

Conjuration is REALLY nice - at pretty much every level, a straight Conjurer would have a plethora of useful things to do. Its only downside is that it doesn't really have any buffs (beyond the super-nice Mage Armor at 1st level). Still, if planar binding is allowed that can be circumvented. Without Planar Binding (including its lesser and greater incarnations, plus Gate), you can make a mage with a lot of utility and offense, but you really can't make an invincible mage. With Planar Binding, you can even make an invincible one, if you're allowed to use it with impunity.

Transmutation on the other hand CAN make you an invincible mage. Your offense will tend to be either of the "make the party fighter turn into an 11-headed hydra and eat my enemies" sort or the "make a save or turn into a toad" sort, which is pretty fun. That said, you get almost zero BFC. Still, I think that this is probably the easiest school to take if you only get access to one.

Illusion I still consider a close third, though. You get some very nice defensive buffs, especially early in the game, and you get the ultra-flexible Shadow line, which helps to break out of the one-school restrictions.

A straight Necromancer gets some very nice debuffing, but unfortunately so does the Transmuter, and the Transmuter also gets a bunch of other spells. You could make a decent single-school Necromancer, but it's not my favorite for this experiment.

Enchanter gets a couple of buffs but for the most part it's "make a Will saving throw" repeated, again and again. I suppose you could get some mileage out of it by charming mooks out of combat and dragging them around with you, but the Necromancer does that better than you with Animate Dead... after all, zombies don't say no!

Abjurer would also be pretty boring. There are some gems in there that make it an excellent supplementary school, but I really couldn't see just playing a straight Abjurer.

Diviner is... well... eh. It's hard for me to say this, because this is my favorite school of magic otherwise. If you want to make a scout, you actually could make a good one. But expect that in combat, you're basically restricted to occasionally nudging the fighter in the shoulder and saying, "that invisible rogue is over THERE, go get him!"

Evocation would actually be decent, especially in the lower levels. It gets a cool mix of blasting, utility and BFC. The main downside is that it's so completely and utterly outclassed by Conjuration.

I guess I would say that, at least based on SRD spells alone, it goes:

Transmutation -> Conjuration --> Illusion -----> Necromancy -> Evocation ----> Abjuration/Divination -> Enchantment

[Rubik]

Hogwarts, because Beauxbatons is too girly and Durmstrang is evil.

See what I did thar?

[Kelb_Panthera]

Screw your schools, little wizards. I'm a Druid!!!

Just throwing this out there. You did know that -all- spells belong to one of the eight schools, right? The wizard's just the only one that has an option that restricts which schools he can access.

[gr8artist]

Evocation. I know the other schools are probably more useful, more powerful, or more well rounded. But I really like the smell of kobolds burning in the morning. Not to mention there's a lot of crowd control in the evocation school as well, and metamagic boosts them really well.

[jaybird]

Just throwing this out there. You did know that -all- spells belong to one of the eight schools, right? The wizard's just the only one that has an option that restricts which schools he can access.

This sort of post is why I wish the forum had a Like feature.

[Eldariel]

Divination: The idea of fore-knowledge and preparation has been brought up, but so has combative-ineffectiveness. There are, however, plenty of divination buffs to damage.

Arrow Mind: Threaten nearby squares with a bow and fire without provoking AOO.

Critical Strike: 1 round of +1d6 damage, double threat range, and +4 on Crit confirmation.

Guided Shot: ignore distance co er and concealment for a round.

Sniper's Shot: no range limit on next Sneak Attack.

Targeting Ray: +1 to hit/3 levels on target. Have an archer co-hort or ally and play the spotter.

And let's not forget Truestrike; when you Absolutely Must Hit That Thing.


Looking into Seers as well as Diviners (psionics) a Seer also gets Precognition for Offense and Defense, bonuses to Damage, Hit, AC and Saves all by way of foresight.

If you dumpsterdive enough you can find some combat magic in divination. The ones you listed tho? Practically useless unless you're a Rogue already. If you have good base Sneak Attack (or gain off-class spell in Hunter's Eye) a Diviner can make for a decent combat character but even then you'll be doing your damage with physical attacks and minor magical enhancement, which isn't really the place to be at with a Wizard.

Unluck is a decent Save-or-Suck and Sure Strike is a decent buff. Insight of Good Fortune has a Material Component but it's useful. Alter Fortune is a great "oh ****"-button and Combat Readiness is more or less a Divination Nerveskitter. But we have what, 1 offensive spell and ~3-4 buffs depending on how you count? Yeah, that's not very far-reaching.


Just throwing this out there. You did know that -all- spells belong to one of the eight schools, right? The wizard's just the only one that has an option that restricts which schools he can access.

Well, technically 9, since Universal Schools exist outside the division. :smalltongue:

[erikun]

Illusion would probably be my first choice, especially with a good DM. The creativity you can have with illusion spells, even when they don't work as intended, is well work playing an illusionist. :smalltongue: There are also the powerful options: Shadowcraft Mage, Illusion Mastery (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#illusionistVariants), and just Greater Invisibility can net you some absurd strong points.

Other than that, I would probably try an Abjurer or Diviner. My biggest concern with Diviner would be affecting enemies, but scouting around with something like Prying Eyes (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/pryingEyes.htm) would be a lot of fun. (Although perhaps boring for others.) Abjuration would be nice for defensive buffs and the NO factor in Dispel Magic, although I'd probably be looking at a gish for that direction. (Paladin / Sorcerer / Cloistered Cleric 1 for Knowledge Devotion?)

[Kelb_Panthera]

@Eldariel:

Dang it. I always forget about limited wish, wish and a handful of other spells being outside the normal structure. They're all wizard spells though, IIRC. :smalltongue:

[Tokuhara]

Just throwing this out there. You did know that -all- spells belong to one of the eight schools, right? The wizard's just the only one that has an option that restricts which schools he can access.

The school that says, "I'm a Druid"

[Kelb_Panthera]

The school that says, "I'm a Druid"

... is composed mostly of transmutations and conjurations, IIRC. There's a bit of at least 7 of the 8 schools, but those two are the bulk of it.

Though at this point, I'm pretty sure you're just making a joke.

I know for a fact that there's at least one uber-newb on the boards today though, so I'm throwing the knowledge out there anyway.

[Tokuhara]

... is composed mostly of transmutations and conjurations, IIRC. There's a bit of at least 7 of the 8 schools, but those two are the bulk of it.

Though at this point, I'm pretty sure you're just making a joke.

I know for a fact that there's at least one uber-newb on the boards today though, so I'm throwing the knowledge out there anyway.

Then I pick PF's Wood School

[Kelb_Panthera]

Then I pick PF's Wood School

I know not of this pathfinder of which you speak. (not a paizo fan, sorry.)

[Tokuhara]

Wood School (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/elemental-arcane-schools/wood)

[Kelb_Panthera]

Wood School (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/elemental-arcane-schools/wood)

:smallamused: Look again friend. The spells that belong to that school still belong to one of the eight schools.

It's just a variant form of specialization. It's no different than being a domain wizard.

[ericgrau]

Protection from X, Mind Blank and friends, undead, constructs...playing smart is one thing, but Enchantment is one of the easiest schools to just say "no" to.

Aww you're immune? Say hello to my dominated friend :smalltongue:.

Yeah in general it's bad. But I can see the other poster's point that it can do well if you play it smart. May also work well for avoiding an encounter in the first place. It's horrible thrown into a random fight with nothing before it, but with some planning you can take it somewhere.

Evocation gets a lot of internet hate and I think it goes too far. I'd put it second to conjuration, and only because conjuration has more options for a school by itself. Some evocations are better. The bottom schools are easily, very easily illusion, necromancy, enchantment, abjuration, divination. Not necessarily in that order, but I think it's roughly correct (best to worst). They have some good spells but by themselves they are way too narrow to get anything done. If I'm limited to one school any of those would be trouble. If I can have multiple schools then things may change a bit. Divination in particular: "I see all but during combat I sit on my hands." Combine it with another and it could get better. Abjuration and up can at least become so-so with a bit of work. Though abjuration requires stoneskin (level 4) for any consistent combat use and repulsion (level 6) for consistent combat use that doesn't cost gp every time. Lower level abjurations sometimes help but most fights are useless.

[Rubik]

Then I pick PF's Wood SchoolThat's what s/he said.

[Fable Wright]

Wood School (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/elemental-arcane-schools/wood)

...Which is not actually one of the schools. Click on one of the spells on that list, there. Any one, I don't care which. Let's go with Entangle for the purpose of example. Look at the name of the spell at the top of the page. Look at the first letter. Keeping your eyes in the same vertical column on the screen and looking about 4 lines downwards, just past that initial blank space under the name of the spell, and you should see the bolded word "School", followed by the hyperlinked word "transmutation." This spell is of the transmutation school of magic. There are 8 of these. Those schools are the schools we're talking about.

If I had to pick one, and only one school for my Wizard? I would pick the school that fits best with my character. If I wanted one that made the best God wizard? Conjuration, hands down. If you need to lock someone down? You have the tools from the start. Grease, Glitterdust, Stinking Cloud, Web, up to Solid Fog, Cloudkill, whatever. If you need to do something you can't? Summon or Planar Bind something that can. Given time to prepare, they can do anything.

If I wanted to make an adventuring mage, who goes out to explore the world and always be useful in a fight? Transmuter. Fits in any party, works with them, and can still be potent in combat by itself via Polymorph if necessary. Someone more impulsive that doesn't have to be tied down to reference guides to what to summon or bind, someone who doesn't have to worry about the angle at which the Stinking Cloud comes down in, whatever.

If I want a character out for power, I turn to a Necromancer. Yeah, yeah, Conjuration can get everything everywhere, for a price. The Conjurer has to pay gold for Planar Bindings, time for Summons, and dependency on others for the ability to finish combat. The Necromancer makes for a very good rogue character. Conjuration is a swiss army knife, with tons of fiddly bits for every situation, but it takes time to get the right one out. Necromancy is a butcher's cleaver. It has one use, but it's very good at that- chopping stuff up. It cleaves strength from bone, spells from minds, souls from bodies. It also has another use- sharpening whatever's around to use as a weapon. Zombies and skeletons are clubs- blunt whacking instruments to thrust on others. Wights and Shadows are sharp rocks- you can grind them against other rocks to get more, and you can use them to cripple your enemy, if not necessarily finish them off. They can cut through a surprising number of defenses. Against mobs of foes? They bring their own mobs. Against single opponents? Their opponent has plans or guards? Chopped to bits through blunt force. They wreck combat plans with raising the dead, they have the force to hammer through plans and defenses, and are very good at being a maverick with save or dies, massive damage, and occasionally being sly with Magic Jar and Gently Reposed undead. Plus, it is very hard to arrange for their permanent demise. If they get Magic Jar as an SLA (Through Spellstitched or Archmage), they can body-hop nonstop. If they feel paranoid, they go for a clone. If they still don't want to risk it, they Astral Project from their stronghold which is on the other side of the multiverse from their Clone.

And of course, for NPCs, my favorite is Divination. A good diviner knows who you are, who you are with, what motivates you, and how to use you to solve their problems. In a way, they're more insidious than Enchanters. Enchanters have people following them and hanging on their every word, and Illusionists can get you to follow their path in their reality. Only Diviners can really push your buttons, though. They know what makes you tick, and can change your destination, your goals, and how you will respond to their prompting. They know what you need to serve their goals, where to find it, and basically can plan out your quest years before you start it to achieve their goal. If an Enchanter takes an interest in you, you'll temporarily fall under their spell (or maybe permanently), but you can break free. With a diviner? You will never break free. When you try to escape their machinations, they get second hand information, or information from outsiders who can get past your countermeasures. They use your plans, even if the plan is to kill you, and can use it to their end. They're fun characters to play around with as the DM, and I just love the concept of someone who, rather than tamper with the people around them to progress their stories, tampers with fate itself to write their own happy endings.

[Kelb_Panthera]

While divination and abjuration don't do a whole lot on their own, both make for a nasty suprise on a character with a high-BAB.

Even just a simple eldritch knight could do pretty okay with just divination.

Abjuration means abjurant champion. 'Nuff said.

[Wise Green Bean]

Enchantment has the same sort of strength conjuration or shadowcraft illusion has. In conjuration, if you can't do it, summon something that can. In shadowcraft illusion, you probably can do it yourself, plain and simple. And in enchantment, if you play smart and maybe a tiny bit evil, you dominate/charm/mind rape some sucker who can do what you want. So even if mindblank is a real b***h for enchantment, you can still have your small army of thralls take care of it. Rather like conjuration, really, just a bit more work.

[Wise Green Bean]

The worst would probably be a pure abjurer. Yeah, it has some must-have spells, but overall...they are tolerable buffers in a party, and are literally worthless alone. They sit on their butts and cry until their defenses run out. Any other school can defend itself somehow if they play smart, even enchanters and diviners(dominate and I-know-exactly-who-you-are-and-how-to-manipulate-or-avoid-you). Explosive ruins is not enough, especially without stuff from other schools to support.

[Tokuhara]

...Which is not actually one of the schools. Click on one of the spells on that list, there. Any one, I don't care which. Let's go with Entangle for the purpose of example. Look at the name of the spell at the top of the page. Look at the first letter. Keeping your eyes in the same vertical column on the screen and looking about 4 lines downwards, just past that initial blank space under the name of the spell, and you should see the bolded word "School", followed by the hyperlinked word "transmutation." This spell is of the transmutation school of magic. There are 8 of these. Those schools are the schools we're talking about.


Must you kill my buzz? I like the Elemental Schools because they are better options for a Wizard than the boring cliches of Evokers/Conjurers/Candlestick Makers. This is precisely why Universalist and Elemental Schools exist.

And Rubik, I have a hammer, not a hole.

[Rubik]

And Rubik, I have a hammer, not a hole.It's hard to peg people properly over the internet.

[Fable Wright]

Must you kill my buzz? I like the Elemental Schools because they are better options for a Wizard than the boring cliches of Evokers/Conjurers/Candlestick Makers. This is precisely why Universalist and Elemental Schools exist.
Yes, I suppose I do. Partially because it's difficult to distinguish whether or not you were actually misinterpreting the meaning of schools, and partially because I get a small thrill when I shoot down a tangential train of whimsy.:smalltongue:

[Tokuhara]

Yes, I suppose I do. Partially because it's difficult to distinguish whether or not you were actually misinterpreting the meaning of schools, and partially because I get a small thrill when I shoot down a tangential train of whimsy.:smalltongue:

So there is my real answer. Given the choice of any Wizard Specialist School, I'd Pick Elementalist (Wood) because I like the spells and I adore the specialist abilities (floating +1-5 to one or two ability scores, a summonable spear of bleed damage, and making my friends healthy). Again, lots of good with little that makes me sad.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Aww you're immune? Say hello to my dominated friend :smalltongue:.Yea... you see, that's the problem. You can have a dominated friend. Fine. Conjuration has the Planar Binding and Summon Monster series of spells, so his minions are almost invariably more powerful than what you can dominate.

Likewise with Necromancy, he's got you beat on the pet thing, particularly when he gets access to things like Animate Dread Warrior or Skeletal Champion.


Yeah in general it's bad. But I can see the other poster's point that it can do well if you play it smart. May also work well for avoiding an encounter in the first place. It's horrible thrown into a random fight with nothing before it, but with some planning you can take it somewhere.It also depends heavily on GM Fiat as to how well your enchantment shtick works and how much impunity you have when using it. Granted, Illusion has a lot of this same problem as well, as does the Planar Binding line of Conjuration, but here the thing...

If the GM comes down hard on 'consequences of your actions' and Planar Binding/Charming always bites you on the rear, Conjuration still has some of the best Battlefield Control and Blastomancy in the game.

If the GM comes down hard on 'everything facing illusions gets a Disbelieve as soon as he sees it, because NO ONE can make anything that looks perfect', then Illusion still has the Shadow line as well as superior defenses like Mirror Image (and greater), Invisibility (and Greater and Superior), and other 'get out of trouble free' cards.

Enchantment... doesn't. If an opponent is Immune to Mind Affecting... you're pretty much screwed.


Evocation gets a lot of internet hate and I think it goes too far. I'd put it second to conjuration, and only because conjuration has more options for a school by itself. Some evocations are better. The bottom schools are easily, very easily illusion, necromancy, enchantment, abjuration, divination. Not necessarily in that order, but I think it's roughly correct (best to worst). They have some good spells but by themselves they are way too narrow to get anything done. If I'm limited to one school any of those would be trouble. If I can have multiple schools then things may change a bit. Divination in particular: "I see all but during combat I sit on my hands." Combine it with another and it could get better. Abjuration and up can at least become so-so with a bit of work. Though abjuration requires stoneskin (level 4) for any consistent combat use and repulsion (level 6) for consistent combat use that doesn't cost gp every time. Lower level abjurations sometimes help but most fights are useless.

I would respectfully disagree. Evocation has nothing going for it but Forcecage, Force Wall and Contingency. However, it has nothing worthwhile TO contingent, so it's pretty much a wash.

Illusion, however, has all that through Shadow Evocation and Greater version therein.

Repeat after me "Blastomancy doesn't work because melee does it better, easier, and without consuming resources".

Illusion is probably # 3, behind Conjuration and Transmutation, both of which have access to everything by virtue of either 'I summon/Planar Binding something to do it for me', or 'I turn into something to do it for me'. If Shadowcrafting is allowed, it bumps up to #1, because you have effectively removed school limitations.

Evocation is down at the bottom of the pile, with very little to contribute to a party.

[Piggy Knowles]

I would respectfully disagree. Evocation has nothing going for it but Forcecage, Force Wall and Contingency. However, it has nothing worthwhile TO contingent, so it's pretty much a wash.

Eh, I disagree with your disagreement. Evocation has quite a lot of useful spells. It's main problem isn't so much that it is BAD as much as it is that Conjuration is BETTER. It also peters out in the higher levels.

Just from the SRD alone, Evocation has...

1- Floating Disk, Magic Missile
2- Darkness, Gust of Wind, Scorching Ray, Shatter
3- Daylight, Tiny Hut, Wind Wall
4- Ice Storm, Resilient Sphere, Wall of Fire, Wall of Ice
5- Sending, Wall of Force, Interposing Hand
6- Contingency, Forceful Hand
7- Forcecage, Grasping Hand
8- OK, by now Evocation has started to suck. Sunburst and Telekinetic Sphere, I guess?
9- .......eh

I included Magic Missile and Scorching Ray because Magic Missile actually IS decent at low levels - decent range, no attack roll required, and the damage is respectable below fifth level. Scorching Ray similarly is actually pretty good at the level you get it, even if it starts losing its handiness at low levels.

And that's just SRD spells. Outside of Core, you've got things like Great Thunderclap, Sonorous Hum, Greater Floating Disk and Howling Chain to make it even better. (Of course other spells get better, too, but my point is that Evocation is decent.)

But yeah, I understand that other schools do it better. Who needs Tiny Hut, for example, when you've got Rope Trick a level earlier? But that doesn't make Evocation bad, it just speaks to how good other schools are.

I think that there's a big backlash against Evocation because one of the first things you learn when you start to pick up the facets of CharOp is how non-optimal the stereotypical blaster wizard is. But sometimes I think that backlash goes too far.....

[Psyren]

^ The other problem with evocation is SR/immunity; Conjuration can blast around both, but Evocation has comparatively fewer spells that bypass them. A single golem can shut down an Evoker but is cake for a Conjurer.


Then I pick PF's Wood School


That's what s/he said.

One of the best uses of that I've seen :smallbiggrin:


The worst would probably be a pure abjurer. Yeah, it has some must-have spells, but overall...they are tolerable buffers in a party, and are literally worthless alone. They sit on their butts and cry until their defenses run out. Any other school can defend itself somehow if they play smart, even enchanters and diviners(dominate and I-know-exactly-who-you-are-and-how-to-manipulate-or-avoid-you). Explosive ruins is not enough, especially without stuff from other schools to support.

An abjuration-only wizard is far from worthless; he merely has to know how to fight. If I only had access to one school of magic (that didn't focus on summoning or blasting things for me) I'd probably pick up some martial training too.

The Abjurant Champion embodies this philosophy expertly.

[ericgrau]

Resilient sphere or wall of force handle a golem, and do it better. The lowest level core golem I noticed in 1/2 second of skimming was CR 7. But basically who ever said evocation was only for blasting?

Though the ability to contribute damage, especially area damage, is handy when you're stuck with limited spells. I'm surprised fireball isn't on that list above. The damage against 2 or more targets is amazing, much more than anything else magical or not. Especially at low levels, but even at high levels obstacles are limited and there are workarounds when you do hit them.

Tiny hut is actually more handy as a source of whole party total concealment even if you're not camping for the night. Almost an area displacement at the same spell level. And it lets you keep watch at night if you are camping. Then you get total concealment when the fight starts at no action cost. Rope trick can be foiled with a cantrip (or tracking or etc.) and an ambush waiting for morning. There are counters to that and counters to counters but point is nothing is the end all be all. Multi-purpose spells are nice for their alternative uses, especially when options are limited.

[Psyren]

Resilient sphere or wall of force handle a golem, and do it better.

Not necessarily. If he's blocking the door you need to get through, walling him in there doesn't help you at all.


Rope trick can be foiled with a cantrip

Which one?

[Axier]

MAGIC!?!

Clarsentience FTW. Psionics!

Seriously, though. I would go pure Diviner so I could tell the rest of the party when they are going to fail, and how to avoid it. Besides, less work for me if all I have are spells that let me view the area, scope out enemies, and glimps into the future. I only have to worry about diseminating the information, and research. I will never outshine anyone but the bard, and they are plot tools anyway.

[Piggy Knowles]

Though the ability to contribute damage, especially area damage, is handy when you're stuck with limited spells. I'm surprised fireball isn't on that list above. The damage against 2 or more targets is amazing, much more than anything else magical or not. Especially at low levels, but even at high levels obstacles are limited and there are workarounds when you do hit them.

Eh, while I agree that Fireball often gets hated on more than it maybe deserves, since it is a decent way of dealing damage to bunched targets, it's still a single-use spell that peters out fairly quickly, especially when resistance to fire becomes more common.

If I was a core-only Evoker that need to do damage in an area, I might consider Ice Storm instead, since it deals comparable damage (slightly less to start, but with no Reflex save to cut damage in half it averages out slightly ahead at the level you get it) but also has a nice movement debuff attached.

[ILM]

Protection from X, Mind Blank and friends, undead, constructs...playing smart is one thing, but Enchantment is one of the easiest schools to just say "no" to.
Then again, this is more related to the ubiquity of means to defeat Enchantment, the brunt of which can be attributed to Mind Blank, a spell that no sane wizard would ever not have on constantly. On the other hand, if you're playing in a game where you only get access to one school, how many Diviners are you going to encounter? Sure, maybe those are your kryptonite, but by and large that setting should boost the viability of Enchanters by a significant margin.

[Malroth]

Protection from Evil, 1st lv spell gives immunity to enchantment effects for 1hr per caster lv, so no enchantment is never useful

[Axier]

Protection from Evil, 1st lv spell gives immunity to enchantment effects for 1hr per caster lv, so no enchantment is never useful

It's only effective at 12th level to keep on all the time, and even then there are more important things you could end up needing your spells for...

As far as NPCs go, a majority of what your going to find in the game usually aren't warded clerics, and enchantment spells can make a lot of interesting things happen that can leave the DM with some fairly entertaining improv to come up with. You can avert most things with enchantment combined with illusion.

Either that, or he gets lazy, ignores the spell through fiat to keep the story in his domain, and gives you the right to call railroading...

A fistfight ensues, and the party rogue takes advantage to snag last slice of pizzia, while the DM's significant other trys to break up the fight. Someone notices the rogue, and starts complaining about the number of slices that have gone around. Arguments left and right break out like a bad rash. Next thing you know, the campagin is over, friends have now become enemies because the DM couldn't handle the unexpected, and you get angry about it.

Oh god, the MADNESS!

[Psyren]

Protection from Evil, 1st lv spell gives immunity to enchantment effects for 1hr per caster lv, so no enchantment is never useful

It only suppresses charms and compulsions that "grant ongoing control." So while it can shut down a Dominate Person, it arguaby can't stop something like Confusion.

Also, you're not exactly immune - the compulsion is still on you, but the enemy caster just can't use it to control you. If the Pro:Evil falls off during the compulsion's duration (very easy when you're considering a days/level spell) you become vulnerable again instantly.

[Piggy Knowles]

Protection from Evil, 1st lv spell gives immunity to enchantment effects for 1hr per caster lv, so no enchantment is never useful

Protection from Evil lasts one minute per level, not one hour. Slight difference.

Magic Circle is 10 minutes per level, though, and that's usually sufficient to cover most of the adventuring day with two Extended castings.

[nedz]

Illusions.
At low level you can trash most melle with Colour Spray/Silent Image/etc.
At mid-level you can dish out the battle-field control with Shadow-Conjuration.
At high-level you can get borked with monsters which are immune to half your spells, or more, but that can happen to anyone.

It has solid defensive buffs and some utilities.

It has the most flexibility, and lends itself to imaginative play.