Bows Akimbo build?

[ben-zayb]

Just wanted to ask what are the, if there are any, competently viable (i.e. ~T3) builds that utilize dual-wielding ranged weapons (not thrown). Bonus points for being able to be used on bows instead of just crossbows.

As for restrictions:
1. It would be great if the character only has two hands mechanically and aesthetically.
2. Should be online asap, level 12 at latest.
3. Stat priorities can be anything except that it doesn't need STR.

Anybody can help me guys?

[Malroth]

In a game that uses both 3.5 and pathfinder material both the Alchemist class and the Summoner (synthesist variant) can both get the multiple arms needed to Duel Wield bows fairly easily. Alchemist gets better self buffs, can get sneak attack like a Rogue and is easier to keep healed, but Synthesist Summoner can get more than 4 arms, Innate flight and much better Base physical stats.

Elf Vivisectionist Alchemist can gain the Vestigal Arm Discoveries at lvs 2 and 4 Taking point blank shot at lv 1 and two weapon fighting at lv 3 giving you 2 bow attacks that will become 3 if you take rapid shot at lv 5-6 and leaving the rest of the build open to whatever ranged build of your choice. Just make sure your after equipment INT is 14+ so you can take advantage of your Alchemist class features.

Elf Synthesist Summoner With a Bipedal Edilion can Grab the Extra Arms and Improved Natural Armour Evolutions giving him the ability to wield multiple bows from LV 1, however since the Edilon's Physical stats override the wielders an archer build would be better served by Using the Serpentine form for higher DEX and putting off getting your second pair of arms untill LV 3. A Synthesist Summoner Archer is probably better off staying in his base class to become a massive multiarmed monstrosity rather than branching off into traditional archer classes.

[eggs]

Be an outsider, cast polymorph (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20040815b&page=4).

[Keld Denar]

Thri-Kreen? Polymorph into an Arrow Demon?

That's about all I got.

[Tvtyrant]

First: Take 12 levels of Artificer. Now you have the capacity to play an Archerficer by firing fully upgraded arrows (splitting, flaming, shocking, etc) out of a fully upgraded (whatever else in the same vein) bow, which you then cast Greater Magic Weapon on to get it fully upgraded on to hit. Make two large bows.

Then you make a Wand of Polymorph, and become an Arrow Demon from the Monster Manual III. This gets you the ability to use bows 1 size larger than it (so if you go for Giant's Size you can get colossal+ arrows), you aren't threatened by melee opponents when shooting arrows, and the ability to shoot 8 arrows on a round of Manyshot (two arrows everytime you can fire one). This goes up to 16 arrows with splitting property, all of which have enough damaging properties to crush everything in your path.


Otherwise I assume none-psionic Thrikreen is your best shot, possibly also Artificer. Not quite as good, but less cheesy.

I got ninjaed so hard...

[some guy]

Dual wield footbows while lying prone?

[alanek2002]

It depend on how lenient your DM is, but Soulbow is worded such that it isn't directly against the rules to use the two weapon fighting tree as you need a free hand to create an arrow. you can find it in complete psionic.

[ThiagoMartell]

In 3.5, there are plenty of feats to get dual-wielding crossbows to be effective.
In Pathfinder, dual wielding guns is easy once you get weapon cords.

[kitcik]

Dual wield footbows while lying prone?

On a carpet of flying...

[2xMachina]

I propose soulbow.

They fire arrows from their hands without need of a bow. TWF that, and tada, Arrow akimbo.

Not exactly bows.... but same effect.

edit: oops, didn' see alanek. +1 to him/her then

[Slipperychicken]

Dual wield footbows while lying prone?

While flying. You can't fire bows while prone.

[Psyren]

Soulbow will indeed do the trick. But I'll one-up the others by linking to it since it's online. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060403a&page=2)

[Prime32]

Would a prehensile tail be okay, or a bow held between your teeth?

[Roderick_BR]

You could dual wield your dual wield bows!
http://8bittheater.wikia.com/wiki/Episode_1087:_Exalted_Feat
Warning: It can hurt your neck.

[Jeff the Green]

Girallon's blessing.

[ben-zayb]

First: Take 12 levels of Artificer. Now you have the capacity to play an Archerficer by firing fully upgraded arrows (splitting, flaming, shocking, etc) out of a fully upgraded (whatever else in the same vein) bow, which you then cast Greater Magic Weapon on to get it fully upgraded on to hit. Make two large bows.

Then you make a Wand of Polymorph, and become an Arrow Demon from the Monster Manual III. This gets you the ability to use bows 1 size larger than it (so if you go for Giant's Size you can get colossal+ arrows), you aren't threatened by melee opponents when shooting arrows, and the ability to shoot 8 arrows on a round of Manyshot (two arrows everytime you can fire one). This goes up to 16 arrows with splitting property, all of which have enough damaging properties to crush everything in your path.

I'm visualizing a steampunk-ish bowslinger doing just that! Unfortunately, the only Eberron I have is RoE. Very awesome theme to have, though.

The problem I have with Arrow Demon is that it's from MM3. Aside from not having the material, I heard that a lot of creatures are designed poorly in other MMs aside from the original, and I only ever see Arrow Demon in C.O. and T.O. discussions--Polymorphing into it reeks of cheese somehow.

But flavorwise? Of course I could roll with that, it looks pretty dang boss!


Dual wield footbows while lying prone?

On a carpet of flying...

While flying. You can't fire bows while prone.
Another cool suggestion. I was actually planning to make a flying/floating/levitating archer who rains hell on his enemies, so this could good. Although I suppose it would look better aesthetically on races who don't use footwear normally, though.

It depend on how lenient your DM is, but Soulbow is worded such that it isn't directly against the rules to use the two weapon fighting tree as you need a free hand to create an arrow. you can find it in complete psionic.

I propose soulbow.

They fire arrows from their hands without need of a bow. TWF that, and tada, Arrow akimbo.

Not exactly bows.... but same effect.

edit: oops, didn' see alanek. +1 to him/her then

Soulbow will indeed do the trick. But I'll one-up the others by linking to it since it's online. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060403a&page=2)
Soulbows are probably the closest that would fit my request, since it doesn't require any other appendage aside from the two hands. Hmm... I suppose it's just needs a slight refluff that he's actually wielding ectoplasmis psionic guns and firing from it.


Would a prehensile tail be okay, or a bow held between your teeth?
A tail for loading looks okay, but the character I'm building is a trash talker, so teeth are no-go.

You could dual wield your dual wield bows!
http://8bittheater.wikia.com/wiki/Episode_1087:_Exalted_Feat
Warning: It can hurt your neck.
Trust me. If I could, I definitely would! Screw the neck!


@To all who contributed You guys are awesome! Thanks for the wealth of input! I'd definitely like to try all of those diverse themes. Now to the recruitment thread! :smallbiggrin:

[Prime32]

A tail for loading looks okay, but the character I'm building is a trash talker, so teeth are no-go.Draconic Tail feat (Races of the Dragon) grants a tail slap. Prehensile Tail feat (Savage Species) lets you use a tail slap as an extra hand.

[Arcanist]

Draconic Tail feat (Races of the Dragon) grants a tail slap. Prehensile Tail feat (Savage Species) lets you use a tail slap as an extra hand.

Using a tail to shoot a bow...
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/225/600/1325200574513.gif

[Ashtagon]

While flying. You can't fire bows while prone.

http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/6267/Allens-Foot-bow#.UHArfVH5Oi1
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2151/1779803741_c77a8de6b5.jpg

Of course not.

[ThiagoMartell]

Because as we all know, pictures change RAW.

[Slipperychicken]

http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/6267/Allens-Foot-bow#.UHArfVH5Oi1
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2151/1779803741_c77a8de6b5.jpg

Of course not.

That looks like a crossbow, which would be RAW.

[Novawurmson]

All this talk of footbows and nobody's linked the Raptoran (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20050106b&page=1)? For shame, Playground.

[Tvtyrant]

Another option would be to play a Persist Chameleon. (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=np1nhdv34bt4hvjrnhl8nc6g40&topic=7547.0) Place it on a Thri-Kreen or get Girallon's Blessing and you can dual-wield bows while using persisted archery buffs.

[ben-zayb]

All this talk of footbows and nobody's linked the Raptoran (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20050106b&page=1)? For shame, Playground.

Probably because the only contribution they give is martial proficiency of footbow. Its flight only goes online at a level where flying becomes common anyway. Granted, it's the first image I thought of when they suggested using Footbow.

[eggs]

Another option would be to play a Persist Chameleon. (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=np1nhdv34bt4hvjrnhl8nc6g40&topic=7547.0) Place it on a Thri-Kreen or get Girallon's Blessing and you can dual-wield bows while using persisted archery buffs.
Is there a trick for getting Thri-Kreen into Chameleon?

[Tvtyrant]

Is there a trick for getting Thri-Kreen into Chameleon?

Not that I know, it is just that the Chameleon stops after 10 levels so as long as you get those ten it doesn't matter if you lose the last couple. Basically it inverts the "Don't lose CLs" because you already stall out on them.

[toapat]

well it is possible, and quite cool, the most effective Hand/Bow ratio is to have as many Heavy repeaters as you have main hands, and Hand crossbows as you have offhands, most of the rest has to be homebrewed to get a reasonable ratio.

Heavy Repeaters do not specify that they absolutely require two hands

[eggs]

Not that I know, it is just that the Chameleon stops after 10 levels so as long as you get those ten it doesn't matter if you lose the last couple. Basically it inverts the "Don't lose CLs" because you already stall out on them.
I mean getting Able Learner on a Thri-Kreen - is that an oversight, or is there a trick to meet the racial requirement?

[ThiagoMartell]

Another option would be to play a Persist Chameleon. (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=np1nhdv34bt4hvjrnhl8nc6g40&topic=7547.0)
That is just... beautiful.

[Azoth]

Hell even just a non-psionic thrikreen hd2/soulknife2/ranger2/soulbowx/xxxy with the multiweapon fighting line and zen archery is nasty. Either suffer kensai 3 or get (modified) mindblade gauntlets with splitting on them. Hello atleast 12 attacks a round...which get doubled...so 24 attacks a round. Couple it with you mind arrow augment being lucky and the woodland archer feat. Now you re-roll every missed shot...and if you still miss, well your next shot gets IIRC +4 or +6 to hit.

Your only fear is DR.

[Malroth]

of course if your're the thy-kreen mentioned above and you're worried about DR why not use leadership to grab yourself a broze-dragon heritaged, DFI bard as a cohort?

[Duboris]

You know, I didn't exactly read the first page of this, but aren't you fully capable, as a Synthesist, of getting... oh... I don't know, like 10 arms?

Multi-weapon fighting makes one weapon a primary shot, while all your other arms are offhand. I don't see why you wouldn't just make yourself a large creature and just shoot 5 bows at a time.

Or Hell, make yourself capable of flying, get 10 arms, multi-weapon fighting, and put a Keen Adamantium Rapier in every hand. Then throw on Every critical feat you can think of and chain stagger fools.

[Malroth]

You could give yourself 10 arms if you're willing to devote 15 entire levels worth of evolutions to nothing but more arms.

WBL is the biggest limitation to this, you can wind up with an absurd number of attacks but if the are all with normal non-enchanted longsords you're probably going to be behind the damage curve against most CR appropiate monsters.