What is the Best Spell to Fell Animate?

[Xoroth]

I'm working on an Uttercold Assault Necromancer based off K's Necromancer guide. While I know he recommends just using Fell Animate as free Animate Dead with cantrips, I want to know if there are any other spells out there that could effective as well.

[Moogleking]

Magic Missile at higher levels can hit 5 separate targets for a negative level each; you can't stack all 5 on one target, though.

[Malroth]

Low level with few tricks, Kelegor's grave mist or power word pain.

With tricks
Snowcasted, Fell frost, Arcane mark heightened to whatever level you can squeeze it into. Permanent 2 cold damage per spell level per round for 1 month with no save which will animate whatever you threw it on. and they thought you were insane for taking arcane thesis for a cantrip.

[KillianHawkeye]

I like to put Fell Animate on a cause light wounds at the end of a battle for anybody who's already at negative hp. It's almost guaranteed to finish them off and trigger the animation effect provided you have a CL of 5.


Magic Missile at higher levels can hit 5 separate targets for a negative level each; you can't stack all 5 on one target, though.

We're discussing Fell Animate, not Fell Drain.

[Piggy Knowles]

I also like Kelgore's Grave Mist.

Something to keep in mind is that the corpsecrafter and destructive retribution line of feats only work on creatures animated with a Necromancy spell, meaning things like Acid Splash and the like won't cut it.

[Silva Stormrage]

Low level with few tricks, Kelegor's grave mist or power word pain.

With tricks
Snowcasted, Fell frost, Arcane mark heightened to whatever level you can squeeze it into. Permanent 2 cold damage per spell level per round for 1 month with no save which will animate whatever you threw it on. and they thought you were insane for taking arcane thesis for a cantrip.

Fell Frost? Do you mean flash frost spell? Flash Frost only works once it doesn't apply every single time you deal damage. Just live fell drain doesn't deal 1 negative level a round for damage over time spells.

[Hecuba]

Fell Frost? Do you mean flash frost spell? Flash Frost only works once it doesn't apply every single time you deal damage. Just live fell drain doesn't deal 1 negative level a round for damage over time spells.

Additionally, Arcane Mark lacks an area entry and thus does not qualify for Flash Frost.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Fell Frost? Do you mean flash frost spell? Flash Frost only works once it doesn't apply every single time you deal damage. Just live fell drain doesn't deal 1 negative level a round for damage over time spells.

Fell Drain deals a negative level whenever the opponent is dealt damage by that spell. It can only apply one negative level per round, but can apply negative levels to persisting effects, provided they continue to deal damage in following rounds.

So yes, Fell Drain + Kelgore's Grave Mist = one negative level per turn, assuming you are damaged by either cold or negative energy.

As far as Fell Animate, combining it with Fell Drain and a low damage wide area effect damaging spell can net you a village full of disposable minions pretty easily, whatever doesn't die from damage dies from the negative level.

At higher levels, it gets more troublesome to apply, unfortunately, as opponent hit points goes up more rapidly than your blastomancy's damage output.

[Heliomance]

Locate City.

*shifty eyes*

[Silva Stormrage]

Fell Drain deals a negative level whenever the opponent is dealt damage by that spell. It can only apply one negative level per round, but can apply negative levels to persisting effects, provided they continue to deal damage in following rounds.

So yes, Fell Drain + Kelgore's Grave Mist = one negative level per turn, assuming you are damaged by either cold or negative energy.

As far as Fell Animate, combining it with Fell Drain and a low damage wide area effect damaging spell can net you a village full of disposable minions pretty easily, whatever doesn't die from damage dies from the negative level.

At higher levels, it gets more troublesome to apply, unfortunately, as opponent hit points goes up more rapidly than your blastomancy's damage output.

http://dndtools.eu/feats/libris-mortis-the-book-of-the-dead--71/fell-drain--1103/

Important Line: You can alter a spell that deals damage to foes so that any living creature that is dealt damage also gains a negative level.

Not every time it is dealt damage. Just any creature that is dealt damage gains a singular negative level. There is nothing in this feat that says it repeats.

And also as a point of curiosity, have you ever seen a DM rule that the enemies take a negative level every round? It seems that any caster could instantly kill any creature not immune to negative levels by simply casting a long duration dot and then fleeing. Apply extend to it and it kills anything not immune to negative levels or who can dispel it.

[Arcanist]

Locate City.

*shifty eyes*

Correction: Locate City, with a caster level so high that it touches every section of the planet :smallamused:

[Heliomance]

Correction: Locate City, with a caster level so high that it touches every section of the planet :smallamused:

Assuming a spherical planet, the definition of "circle" starts to get a little problematic once it becomes non-trivial w.r.t. the circumference of the planet. And even more so once it becomes greater than the circumference of the planet/

[TuggyNE]

And also as a point of curiosity, have you ever seen a DM rule that the enemies take a negative level every round? It seems that any caster could instantly kill any creature not immune to negative levels by simply casting a long duration dot and then fleeing. Apply extend to it and it kills anything not immune to negative levels or who can dispel it.

... That's not precisely what I'd call "instant". :smallconfused: Also, good luck running from e.g. a fiend with greater teleport, a dragon with 240' flight, or some kind of ranged enemy. If you get off a nice long-duration near-certain kill, cool, but it takes so long to trash things you might be dead first.

Of course, you might be right about RAW, although the usual interpretation I've seen is somewhere between that and the silliness of allowing negative levels to stack multiple times/round.

[Silva Stormrage]

... That's not precisely what I'd call "instant". :smallconfused: Also, good luck running from e.g. a fiend with greater teleport, a dragon with 240' flight, or some kind of ranged enemy. If you get off a nice long-duration near-certain kill, cool, but it takes so long to trash things you might be dead first.

Of course, you might be right about RAW, although the usual interpretation I've seen is somewhere between that and the silliness of allowing negative levels to stack multiple times/round.

Sorry by "Instantly" I meant "With no challenge". And its very easy to flee, Dimensional door or teleport, invisibility, resilient sphere.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Sorry by "Instantly" I meant "With no challenge". And its very easy to flee, Dimensional door or teleport, invisibility, resilient sphere.

Or you could simple one-round kill it and not bother in the first place.

Really, D&D doesn't lend itself to DoT tactics, because it just gives opponents time to do something to you. You've easily got the potential to wipe them out with your first attack, why bother pussyfooting around with waiting thirty something rounds for your target to die off?

By mid-levels, expect Invisibility to no longer be effective. Too many things start getting stuff like Scent, Lifesense, Blindsense, Blindsight, Tremorsense...

By higher levels, expect opponents to be able to easily keep up with you. Even if you start porting around, there's always things like Anticipate Teleport to keep things interesting.

[lord_khaine]

To get back on track, since people are now disgussing the wrong metamagic feat, then the best spell i have found for this is Blade of Pain and Fear (or whatever its called), its a relatively lowlevel spell, but by subduing your target with other spells then you can Coup the grace them with the blade, creating several large and nasty zombies though a singel casting.

[Mystral]

There's a spell in libris mortis that kills anything with 9 or less hitpoints and gives you a boost to your strength and caster level.

That spell can be made persistent with divine metamagic.

Just cast it on yourself, presistent and with fell animate. Then, turn invisible and start flying over the local hospital, kindergarden and park. Watch the zombie apocalypse unfold and get demigodlike powers to fight of those pesky heroes that are bound to show up.

I always wanted to do that with my velsharoon cleric in one evil campaign. Sadly, we never got that far.

[kardar233]

There's a spell in libris mortis that kills anything with 9 or less hitpoints and gives you a boost to your strength and caster level.

That spell can be made persistent with divine metamagic.

Just cast it on yourself, presistent and with fell animate. Then, turn invisible and start flying over the local hospital, kindergarden and park. Watch the zombie apocalypse unfold and get demigodlike powers to fight of those pesky heroes that are bound to show up.

I always wanted to do that with my velsharoon cleric in one evil campaign. Sadly, we never got that far.

That's Greater Consumptive Field, and it was reprinted in SpC.

I once had a character who, as part of their buff routine, would gate in a gaggle of lemures and Consume them with Comsumptive Field to bring his CL up to ~70.

[Mystral]

Sadly, that's not possible, as the caster level bonus caps out at 50% of your original CL. So, at Level 16, you could have a maximum caster level of 24.

The temporary hitpoints and strength bonus don't cap out, though. How about a strength of 200?

[2xMachina]

You could recast for a recursive 50% boost to CL

Cast 1: 24cl
Cast 2: 36cl
...
Profit!