Relationship Woes and Advice 23: Answer Unclear, Try Again

[Morph Bark]

Welcome to the Relationship Woes and Advice thread, home of any questions you may have: romantic or familial or friendship, we'll answer (or try to answer) them all. Five years old and growing. This isn't a trade economy- feel free to ask if you have a question, even if you haven't ever given advice and don't intend to start. We won't stone you or ignore you or anything. All we ask is to know how a situation ends up, either in this thread or through a PM.

Here are the basics.

The biggest bit of advice I've seen bandied around is the truest- no matter what else is true about the situation, always be yourself. It's no good to act like someone else, because eventually the true you will come out and the other person will not be happy you hid that from them.


Rules Of Relationships:
#1- Communicate. If you can't talk with your partner, it's probably not going to work.

#2- Be yourself. Admittedly, if you have some really bad habits you should probably try to change them, but be honest about who you are. No one wants to find out they were loving a lie, and no one likes to live a lie (...well, normally).

#3- Accept your partner. In mine, and other people's, experience you have to be able to accept your partner as they are, because they probably won't be able to change. Also, don't change drastically for someone. I've tried it, my friends have tried it, it doesn't work and it doesn't end pretty.

#4- Hints. Do. Not. Work. Or they might, but the chance of that happening is limited. Some people are like me and just utterly oblivious unless it is blatantly stated, others are (also like me) and don't want to assume, and yet others don't care. You won't know which they belong to unless you actually spell out your intentions and/or feelings. I would consider this a corrolery to Rule #1 except that it comes up so often. Do NOT assume someone should know something from hints. Hints, by nature, are subtle. Clue Bats/Crow Bars/Mack Trucks are not. Try hitting them with one of those. ;) (No, not literally. I mean be upfront if you are trying to get someone to know something.)

#5- Don't be desperate. You don't need to be in a relationship and the healthiest mindset is one where you are happy as you are, even if you do not have a significant other. Don't stay in a relationship that isn't good if you aren't happy, just because you want someone. This is detrimental to both parties in the long (and sometimes short) run.

#6- Be a couple. Set aside some time every week to be together. Just an hour, if nothing else, where it's JUST you two. No computer, no others. Just the couple.

#6.5- Maintain the relationship. Ask your partner every now and then how they are feeling, if they feel like the relationship is still going in a good direction, etc. Also, make sure you don't hide it if you have an issue with your partner or a relationship. The only way it can change is if you talk about it.

#7- Let your boundaries be known. This goes for everything from intimacy to what you consider cheating to any other thing you can think of. Pretty much if it's something that would possibly upset you or your partner, let them know BEFORE a problem arises. An example would be letting your partner know you consider kissing cheating. They very well might think only intercourse is cheating. Having that known before anything potentially happens is a good thing.

#8- Know the signs of an abusive relationship. Both men and women can be abusers, and if you recognize the signs early on you are more likely to be able to get out of a bad situation before it gets out of hand. It's never easy, but if you know the general red flags, it can help you to avoid the situation.

A list (http://helpguide.org/mental/domestic_violence_abuse_types_signs_causes_effects .htm)- courtesy of Pheehelm

RULES. YOU READ THESE.
-Anything of a sexual nature, please PM to either myself or one of the regular advice givers. If you just want general opinions post something like: "I have this problem, but it is not board appropriate. Could one of you guys PM me?" I know from experience that you will in fact get help.

-KEEP IT NICE. Disagreements are bound to happen, but please don't be rude.

-Joking is all fun and games, within reasons. Please do not get derogatory.

-We are not allowed to dispense advice that should be handled by a professional, including psychological or medical advice.

I decided to put this up because, evidently, it was not apparent that these should be followed. I do not want this thread to be scrubbed again, and we were blessed to get it back.

So please - play nice, and if you're not comfortable talking about things over the open board, PM one of the regulars (too many to mention), and I'm sure they'll be willing to lend an ear - or if you're not sure who to PM, post asking for someone to PM you, and you'll soon get a response

-Syka

Previous thread: Relationship Woes and Advice 22: In Which Two Problems Prevent Each Others' Solution (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=239955)

We have a sister thread in Personal Woes and Advice (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=239960), which is suited for any woes you may have with things unrelated to relationships.

[Marillion]

Definitely not a line I would personally choose... depends on the tone you put it in, if it is laid back and casual then maybe with a little bit of charm it would come off as humourous; however, other than that it comes off as not confident which wouldn't help.

Well yeah, I wasn't going to say it all depressed and whiny. :smalltongue: It's just that my sense of humour is rather self-deprecating at times, not because I'm insecure, but I like people to know I can laugh at myself.

[Morph Bark]

In other news, I just realized that my pride is one of my greatest hurdles when it comes to relationships.

[Coidzor]

Quick question:

"Hey, this might be a little awkward, but [friend] over there won't leave me alone until I'm officially shot down. So, would you like to join me for coffee some time?"

Acceptable? Endearing? Pathetic?

Mostly the last one by my understanding. Depends upon whether you know them and what the prior relationship is, though.


In other news, I just realized that my pride is one of my greatest hurdles when it comes to relationships.

In terms of viewing others as not good enough for you or the interpersonal friction that being prideful can bring?

[Serpentine]

Marillion: I don't think it's TOO bad, as long as it's carried on the back of self-effacing confidence. Replacing "am officially shot down" with "at least give it a shot" or something like that is probably safer, unless you think you can pull off reverse psychology... :smalltongue:

[Reluctance]

Quick question:

"Hey, this might be a little awkward, but [friend] over there won't leave me alone until I'm officially shot down. So, would you like to join me for coffee some time?"

Acceptable? Endearing? Pathetic?

Depends entirely on context. I'd drop the opening "this might be a little awkward", as it frames things negatively for you, but it's a low-cost opener.

Also low-return, and I strongly advise against using it more than once around the same people. But if it helps you realize that asking a girl out is NBD than I fully support it as a drive-by move.


In other news, I just realized that my pride is one of my greatest hurdles when it comes to relationships.

Yeeeaaahhh. If you're going for relationships, Lust is a much better sin. More fun, too. (Gluttony can also be fun, but tends to inhibit your ability to find relationships.)

[Triscuitable]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.


I met this girl. She's really nice, and I like her. I'm very certain that because of how she introduced herself to me, that she likes me (especially considering I'm rather quiet in class).
A friend of mine introduced me to this guy. He's really nice, and I like him. He also likes me.
I've been friends with this girl for a while, but only just got to know this guy.
I haven't had a chance to hang out with the girl, but the guy has already asked me if I wanted to.
I've got some rather complicated gender-identity issues, but this girl is straight and the guy is gay.
The girl and I share a lot of hobbies. The guy and I share a few interests, though he leans closer to anime and the like, while I prefer games and comics.
The guy smokes. This is actually a big deal for me, because smoking is generally quite gross for me, and I don't like what it does to people. It also really turns me away from him, despite his much nicer traits.


What in the HELL do I do?

[celtois]

@ Triscuitable: Follow your heart. :smallwink:

All sarcasm aside frankly I don't think any of us can tell you what to decide, you'll have to figure it out for yourself.

I can tell you what I'd suggest you do in your situation. But without being you it might be totally off. I can also tell you what the easy thing to do is, and why is probably isn't the best way to go. But again it's all subjective and what matters most is what would make you happy. (Anyway, if you aren't dissuaded from reading my thoughts after that they are in the spoiler)


What I would suggest, from what is strictly my point of view.
-Hang out with both of them in non-datey settings see who you click with romantically its important.
-The more hobbies you share with someone the more things you can do together, the more things you can do together the more fun life is. That said, its fun to learn new things, maybe try and see if you like some of the stuff the guy is into.
-If smoking is a big turn off for you, don't date a smoker. Because you will have to put up with it, and the taste of cigarettes when you kiss, yuck!
-Once you've got a chance to hang out with them each a bit you'l probably have a better feeling of if you click and who with. A person can be awesome but it really needs that spark.
-Once you know, ask them out, and hey either way you just gained two awesome friends.
-Either way you should hang out with the girl and the guy, and don't wait for either of them to ask (though one of them already has so he's out) ask the girl to hang out sometime in a friendly environment. Maybe invite her to a gathering of friend were you drink tea and play cards or some other low-stress activity that is conducive to talking

My word of caution is don't date someone just because its convenient, I've done it before, someone asked me out I said yes. We didn't click at all. Dating won't necessarily be easy but make sure you are always engaged in your relationship, and not just going through the motions.
-

[arguskos]

Ok, so, I gotta tell you guys, communication? It's pretty rad. Man, I like it when my girl and I talk about our relationship. We've already cut off a few problems at the pass by talking about things. Everyone, talk to your lady/man/space lobster/robot overlord! It's awesome. :smallbiggrin:

EDIT: Triscuitable, I'd suggest going with your gut. If the smoking is a serious issue (though I kinda think it shouldn't be, but that's just me) then don't go with the guy. Seems to make sense to me.

[Morph Bark]

In terms of viewing others as not good enough for you or the interpersonal friction that being prideful can bring?

The latter. Though often it's less interpersonal and more... intrapersonal? Like, in the sense that I end up trying not to act on it, but still end up feeling bad one way or another. The current thing is that I put out an invitation to do something together this week since she's got a week off school, then didn't get a reply until last night while I was packing my things as I'm going away this weekend, even telling me she specially asked for a day off work. Since I still needed to pack some things and would have to leave early in the afternoon, it'd seem logical that I'd have to decline right? Sure, but the first thought I got was "you're only replying to that now? Yeah, no". That kind of pride bulldung. :I

It wasn't until my second thought that I was like "wait, she took that day off work for me? Da wut?" So I made sure I finished up nearly all of my packing before I went to bed. Then for some (unrelated) reason, I end up not sleeping at all all night. Karma?


Yeeeaaahhh. If you're going for relationships, Lust is a much better sin. More fun, too. (Gluttony can also be fun, but tends to inhibit your ability to find relationships.)

When it comes to the seven deadly sins, Lust, Sloth and Gluttony are my big ones. My Pride mainly seems to play up as a kind of defense mechanism, which can be great when someone is trying to embarrass you, but bad when you are in a relationship with someone or want to get to that point. Envy is much, much, much worse though. As is Wrath (especially when directed against that person, obviously).


Ok, so, I gotta tell you guys, communication? It's pretty rad. Man, I like it when my girl and I talk about our relationship. We've already cut off a few problems at the pass by talking about things. Everyone, talk to your lady/man/space lobster/robot overlord! It's awesome. :smallbiggrin:

Drat, I've been found out!

(I do really agree with you though.)

[dehro]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.


I met this girl. She's really nice, and I like her. I'm very certain that because of how she introduced herself to me, that she likes me (especially considering I'm rather quiet in class).
A friend of mine introduced me to this guy. He's really nice, and I like him. He also likes me.
I've been friends with this girl for a while, but only just got to know this guy.
I haven't had a chance to hang out with the girl, but the guy has already asked me if I wanted to.
I've got some rather complicated gender-identity issues, but this girl is straight and the guy is gay.
The girl and I share a lot of hobbies. The guy and I share a few interests, though he leans closer to anime and the like, while I prefer games and comics.
The guy smokes. This is actually a big deal for me, because smoking is generally quite gross for me, and I don't like what it does to people. It also really turns me away from him, despite his much nicer traits.


What in the HELL do I do?
you're allowed to hang out with people irrespective of their intentions (and yours). until it comes to smoochie time, you owe neither of them an explanation.
in fact, hanging out/dating will allow you to both wrap your head around your feelings and get to know both a little better.
depending on how direct and/or intimate they are as friends or as buddies, you may want to clarify your doubts/position. for the moment however, just hang out with them and see what happens. you might get to smoochie time and find that you can't or don't want to ever again..

also, being actively chased by 2 people is a big boost in self esteem.. you don't get those often enough in life..so..don't close the door to them.

[Morph Bark]

To add to the above poster's advice, I'd say hang out with both, and learn if the girl actually likes you (it seeming obvious might not do it). Since I dunno more about your gender identity issues, I can't help with how that figures into this, but if the girl actually does like you for me the choice would be obvious. (That is, if I were bisexual. Since I'm straight the answer is obvious even before I'd know whether a girl likes me or not.)

[Rawhide]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.


I met this girl. She's really nice, and I like her. I'm very certain that because of how she introduced herself to me, that she likes me (especially considering I'm rather quiet in class).
A friend of mine introduced me to this guy. He's really nice, and I like him. He also likes me.
I've been friends with this girl for a while, but only just got to know this guy.
I haven't had a chance to hang out with the girl, but the guy has already asked me if I wanted to.
I've got some rather complicated gender-identity issues, but this girl is straight and the guy is gay.
The girl and I share a lot of hobbies. The guy and I share a few interests, though he leans closer to anime and the like, while I prefer games and comics.
The guy smokes. This is actually a big deal for me, because smoking is generally quite gross for me, and I don't like what it does to people. It also really turns me away from him, despite his much nicer traits.


What in the HELL do I do?

I can't speak for you, but if I was in your position (except, make the guy a woman, as I'm straight), I'd go for option number one (the first girl you mentioned).

[bluewind95]

If smoking is a big deal, then I'd suggest against dating the smoker.

Arguskos:

I don't understand why smoking shouldn't be a big deal. For some of us, it really, really is. I, for one, would never date a smoker, and that is a 100% non-negotiable thing.

[The Succubus]

If smoking is a big deal, then I'd suggest against dating the smoker.

Arguskos:

I don't understand why smoking shouldn't be a big deal. For some of us, it really, really is. I, for one, would never date a smoker, and that is a 100% non-negotiable thing.

Kind of curious from an academic perspective - how would you feel about dating someone that was making a genuine effort to quit smoking?

[bluewind95]

Kind of curious from an academic perspective - how would you feel about dating someone that was making a genuine effort to quit smoking?

Not till they quit.

Edit: And if they started back up on that, well, that'd be my goodbye.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Not till they quit.

Edit: And if they started back up on that, well, that'd be my goodbye.

I'm pretty much like this too. I tried dating a smoker who was trying to quit. Instead she just was hiding it from me, because she knew I didn't like it at all. If a girl is making an effort to quit smoking, I don't want her quiting for someone else other than herself. If she's quitting to have the relationship...it's not for the right reasons. All that does is seed resentment toward the person wanting them to stop. It can be a contributor to stopping, but it can't be the incentive.

Either way, cigarette smells make me ill. Like vomitty. My mom is actually legit allergic to the stuff and I have two 8 year old sisters that don't need that in their lungs, so its pretty much a requirement.

I'm currently dating someone who has smoked in the past but quit. (yes we're now facebook official!)

Also...in regards to last thread, I believe this was mentioned...


I'd say its more of - mutually understood liking with the intention of pursuing a actual relationship.

I like to call it a MULWIPAR.

I think we need to officially add this to the glossary at the start of the thread.


If I make the next thread, I'll be doing just that.
I guess my biggest question is...Where is this "official glossary"?

[dehro]

it's not exactly a dealbreaker for me..but I have been known to pull a bit of a face when smooching a girl that had just had a cigarette..
it's just a very pervasive scent that isn't all to pleasant...
for the record, I have smoked for about a year, back in high-school

[Pheehelm]

We don't really have an RWA official glossary, just the recurring rules OP, and the only other RWA-specific term I know of is "gedonkle" which hasn't been used in forever anyways.

[Heliomance]

:smallsigh: I need to get better at reading people. That's two girls in quick succession I've started chatting with, hit it off with, thought I was reading interest and mild flirtation, added on Facebook and discovered are taken already. Most irritating :smallsigh:

[TheWombatOfDoom]

We don't really have an RWA official glossary, just the recurring rules OP, and the only other RWA-specific term I know of is "gedonkle" which hasn't been used in forever anyways.

Hmm...that's strange for them to say then...aw well.

[arguskos]

If smoking is a big deal, then I'd suggest against dating the smoker.

arguskos:

I don't understand why smoking shouldn't be a big deal. For some of us, it really, really is. I, for one, would never date a smoker, and that is a 100% non-negotiable thing.
For full disclosure, I've got a severe form of cough-variant asthma and if I ever smoked, I likely could suffer some terrible health problems.

I'm dating a smoker. She and I have an agreement of sorts. When we're together, she smokes infrequently and we have little physical contact right after she smokes, but after 30 or so minutes and the smell has dissipated, we're close again.

Just because I hate that she smokes and that it actually can affect my health doesn't mean that I'm willing to throw my hands up and say "this one thing is enough to torpedo any chance of a relationship you and I could ever have". I'm willing to make a compromise on it and so is she.

I'll let you and everyone else make their own decisions, but I have to say, discarding a potentially fantastic relationship because of a single habit they have that you personally don't like seems like a poor decision. Still, it's your call. I just think that you should weigh the situation carefully.

[bluewind95]

I'm more thinking long-term here. Can I live with a smoker? No, I can't. Like you, I have a pretty bad cough-asthma... and also a very severe allergy to cigarette smoke. Mine doesn't only trigger for a bit after the smoking. It can trigger for hours afterwards, usually until the smoker takes a shower or something. I also find the scent abhorrent, and not only the smoke, but the scent that lingers in their skin and the things they touch. The nicotine causes the allergy too, as even an e-cig will leave me coughing for ages (only when nicotine is used in the solution). Having lived with a sibling that smoked (and not even in the house!), I know that even if they don't smoke in my presence, it does impact things very negatively. Smokers stink, and not only when they're smoking. The stench lingers in their skin, in their sweat: I feel like vomiting at the scent of their body odour. The things they touch have to be washed to rub away the stench, too. Their breath makes me want to gag. I can't even get close to the bedsheets or clothes of a smoker as their disgusting body odour is absorbed into them. Heck, I find it hard to even enter their room.

I can't have a relationship with someone who disgusts me so much I can't even get close to them. There is simply no way any such relationship could be "fantastic". It's not "just a habit". It's something that impacts pretty much everything. Some people may be able to stand it. I, personally, can't.

[Reluctance]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.


I met this girl. She's really nice, and I like her. I'm very certain that because of how she introduced herself to me, that she likes me (especially considering I'm rather quiet in class).
A friend of mine introduced me to this guy. He's really nice, and I like him. He also likes me.
I've been friends with this girl for a while, but only just got to know this guy.
I haven't had a chance to hang out with the girl, but the guy has already asked me if I wanted to.
I've got some rather complicated gender-identity issues, but this girl is straight and the guy is gay.
The girl and I share a lot of hobbies. The guy and I share a few interests, though he leans closer to anime and the like, while I prefer games and comics.
The guy smokes. This is actually a big deal for me, because smoking is generally quite gross for me, and I don't like what it does to people. It also really turns me away from him, despite his much nicer traits.


What in the HELL do I do?

The dude.

There's a colloquial expression that's used to mean "you really need to loosen up", and you really do need that to help you loosen up. The person who's making an active effort is the person who's more likely to help you with that.


:smallsigh: I need to get better at reading people. That's two girls in quick succession I've started chatting with, hit it off with, thought I was reading interest and mild flirtation, added on Facebook and discovered are taken already. Most irritating :smallsigh:

FWIW, you're about normal at reading people. Flirting is a way for people to feel wanted and attractive, and those are good things, so people will flirt. Still, since they don't want to jeopardize things with the guys they have properly tied down, they flirt with "safe" guys. Gay, too far, etc. (How far do said gals live from you, BTW?)

I mean, you'll have to learn the difference between flirting With Intent and flirting just for fun, but you shouldn't feel like you're missing basics just because you can't always catch that slippery definition.

[Coidzor]

Smoking is just one of many reasons that I'm annoyed at life for the last two or three admirers it threw my way. I cannot be around people while they smoke except for when hookahs which are more of a steam thing anyway. When I have given into peer pressure and either associated with smokers while they were smoking without standing a fair distance away and upwind or even tried a puff from a cigar I've become ill for days afterwards, often with the sinus infection from hell.

I kind of hate my lungs and sinuses, if you haven't gathered by now.

[noparlpf]

I've never tried smoking myself. (I tried patches once out of curiosity as it's a fairly tame drug, didn't like it.) I also have mild asthma, so there's that. And marijuana fumes give me a headache. (I live right by the fire escape, and that's where all the kids step out to smoke, even though that's against like, three different rules, but who even pays attention to rules. So it's either leave my window open and deal with that, or leave it shut and stifle.) I don't mind the smell of either on their own in small amounts, but the smoke bugs me. I doubt I could live with a smoker.

[Heliomance]

The dude.

There's a colloquial expression that's used to mean "you really need to loosen up", and you really do need that to help you loosen up. The person who's making an active effort is the person who's more likely to help you with that.
IMO, that's frankly terrible advice. No, you don't need to "get laid" in order to loosen up, and if you're after an actual relationship, who has the greater chance of providing immediate sex is definitely not the top priority, and IMO not very high on the list at all.


FWIW, you're about normal at reading people. Flirting is a way for people to feel wanted and attractive, and those are good things, so people will flirt. Still, since they don't want to jeopardize things with the guys they have properly tied down, they flirt with "safe" guys. Gay, too far, etc. (How far do said gals live from you, BTW?)

I mean, you'll have to learn the difference between flirting With Intent and flirting just for fun, but you shouldn't feel like you're missing basics just because you can't always catch that slippery definition.
I'm not gay, and they both go to the same university as me, so neither of your ideas applies.

[Triscuitable]

The dude.

There's a colloquial expression that's used to mean "you really need to loosen up", and you really do need that to help you loosen up. The person who's making an active effort is the person who's more likely to help you with that.


The problem being I don't like smoking. I've always had issues with drugs, be they legal or not. While I don't mind my friends smoking, I do have an issue with dating someone who does.

That, and I'm not interested in sex. Relationships generally go back to sex. Me? I'm not exactly interested in that sort of thing. That can cause a lot of fissures in a relationship where one person isn't getting what they want out of it, aside from the companionship.

I guess it's just a case of me not wanting to be in a relationship with him. He's a great guy, but the more time I spent with him today, the more I realized he was less of a person I want to date, and more of a person I want to be a really good friend with.

[Serpentine]

I hate to be the one to leap to Reluctance's defence, but...

re. The first bit: I don't think he's talking about sex. At least, he never mentions it. Just "loosening up" and that the person who's taking the initiative might be the better candidate to that end. I have no particular opinion on that matter; I think Trisc should just relax, enjoy the attention and see where it all goes - there's not much reason to leap to make a be-all end-all decision right away.

re. The second bit: except for the "safe" part, I think he's pretty much spot on. Flirting is fun, and even taken girls can do it. Taken people can even be interested in others - it's only until they act upon it (and I wouldn't consider normal flirting to be acting), there's no problem. So yeah, you could be right about the flirting and signs of interest, it's not incompatible with them being taken.

[Heliomance]

He mentions a colloquial expression commonly used to mean "you need to loosen up" - the one that immediately springs to mind is "you need to get laid".

[dehro]

He mentions a colloquial expression commonly used to mean "you need to loosen up" - the one that immediately springs to mind is "you need to get laid".

I didn't get that impression...but then, English isn't my first language

[Coidzor]

He mentions a colloquial expression commonly used to mean "you need to loosen up" - the one that immediately springs to mind is "you need to get laid".

Honestly since we were talking about smoking I was thinking about something else. :smallredface:

[gunnar11]

He mentions a colloquial expression commonly used to mean "you need to loosen up" - the one that immediately springs to mind is "you need to get laid".

I think he means: Just don't be so uptight.
And even though reluctance doesn't really elaborate his point well, I agree with him.
But before that:
1) If you really LOATHE smoking, the choice is easy
2) Get to know them both, who do you like better, why?
3) Go with the guy. Not only will he get you out of your comfort zone, but he might also open your eyes, and define your gender-identity, or let you realise you wanted to be with the girl/ someone else the whole time!

In order.

[Grytorm]

Good morning. I am a college student and I have a question.

If I encounter a girl from my dorm who I find attractive and after I say hello or smile at her and they smile back am I correct in my assumption that they are just being friendly? This has happened with at least two girls if that is relevant.

[Serpentine]

Utterly inconclusive. Could be anything from awkward politeness to intense interest.

[noparlpf]

I assume it's fairly normal to get over someone, and then years later, some random thing reminds you and you get all sad for a bit?

[Coidzor]

Good morning. I am a college student and I have a question.

If I encounter a girl from my dorm who I find attractive and after I say hello or smile at her and they smile back am I correct in my assumption that they are just being friendly? This has happened with at least two girls if that is relevant.

Not enough information. Strike up a proper conversation when the two of you are not in a rush somewhere or engrossed in anything for more to go on.

edit: I mean, I'm a guy and I'm not exactly keen on having sex with dudes, but I'll generally offer some acknowledgement of a friendly greeting and smiling is my defense mechanism against people thinking I'm about to murder them because of my naturally dour face and the fact that my facial hair emphasizes my naturally downturned lips to the point where it looks like I'm frowning unless I'm actively smiling.


I assume it's fairly normal to get over someone, and then years later, some random thing reminds you and you get all sad for a bit?

Well, I've run into that, certainly. Not sure if it's normal though, haha. x.x Only really happens with the one ex who is also the only one I could really honestly say I loved in a meaningful way, and it's only just now getting to be years and I get a fair number of reminders due to seeing our old haunts by passing them because I live in the same area still.

[dehro]

Good morning. I am a college student and I have a question.

If I encounter a girl from my dorm who I find attractive and after I say hello or smile at her and they smile back am I correct in my assumption that they are just being friendly? This has happened with at least two girls if that is relevant.
no offense meant, I swear..but..
I am honestly surprised that this doubt comes to you at college age..unless you're Sheldon Cooper and are actually 12

[prufock]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.
...
What in the HELL do I do?

Hang out witht he guy. Ask the girl to go out on a different day. Figure out which person you have more in common with/more fun with/an easier time talking to, and pursue that one. It's allowed.

[Coidzor]

Hang out witht he guy. Ask the girl to go out on a different day. Figure out which person you have more in common with/more fun with/an easier time talking to, and pursue that one. It's allowed.

Recommended, prior to physical and romantic entanglements, even.

[Sholos]

no offense meant, I swear..but..
I am honestly surprised that this doubt comes to you at college age..unless you're Sheldon Cooper and are actually 12

Hey, be nice. I'm 27 and still can't tell those types of things. :smalltongue: Then again, I'm bad at striking up conversation, too....

[Grytorm]

no offense meant, I swear..but..
I am honestly surprised that this doubt comes to you at college age..unless you're Sheldon Cooper and are actually 12

I am just bad at talking to people to some extent. I have Aspergers and generally try to spend time alone and I don't like to talk to people all that much. Thankfully I am pretty certain that I am likable, mostly because I am at friendly terms with most people I know.

[noparlpf]

Well, I've run into that, certainly. Not sure if it's normal though, haha. x.x Only really happens with the one ex who is also the only one I could really honestly say I loved in a meaningful way, and it's only just now getting to be years and I get a fair number of reminders due to seeing our old haunts by passing them because I live in the same area still.

I had the luck to be forced to move away and then go to college shortly afterwards. But when I visit my dad in my old town I get really uncomfortable. Today was just sucky. First thing I saw when I woke up was a pic of my ex on my news feed. Seems like she took a picture with the creator of a cartoon we both "like" on facebook, and he posted it on his page. Oh, hey emotions. I told you to get out. What are you doing here. Go away. Not a great way to wake up.

[Reluctance]

{Scrubbed}

[Sholos]

Arghh! Why can't I simply tell this girl how I feel and ask if she feels the same way? I'm going to be alone forever... :smallfrown:

[Heliomance]

{Scrubbed}


Not that I'm certain why it's either relevant or any of your business, but yes, I did. But I certainly didn't go into the relationship because I figured she'd be easy smexings, I went into it because we hit it off really well and I fancied her, and I continued in it because I grew to love her. I really don't know what your point is here, though, and I don't consider your question appropriate. :smallannoyed:

And frankly, "we all know" nothing of the sort. I'll admit that from the description Trisc gave, he (sorry if that's not your preferred pronoun) seems to be leaning more towards the girl, but I disagree with your accusation of "public hand-wringing to sell an image", and again think it's not an appropriate accusation to make on no grounds. And frankly, I don't see what's wrong with going for the girl. In fact, that would be my advice. You seem to have more in common with her anyway, and the guy's smoking is a big deal for you. Make a move with the girl.

Nor do I see any evidence of him finding excuses to withdraw from society. Kindly stop hurling baseless accusations around, it's really very annoying.

[dehro]

Not that I'm certain why it's either relevant or any of your business, but yes, I did. But I certainly didn't go into the relationship because I figured she'd be easy smexings, I went into it because we hit it off really well and I fancied her, and I continued in it because I grew to love her. I really don't know what your point is here.

my guess is he doesn't like to be contraddicted.

on an unrelated note..

and people wonder why I'm single (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icgT6tG64-w&NR)

[Astrella]

{Scrubbed})

Do you get a kick out of making unbased assumptions about people? Is it that important to you that everything fits into your cynical word view?

[TheWombatOfDoom]

I assume it's fairly normal to get over someone, and then years later, some random thing reminds you and you get all sad for a bit?

It is indeed. However, is it points when you are alone or is it when you are with someone too? There is a difference.


I had the luck to be forced to move away and then go to college shortly afterwards. But when I visit my dad in my old town I get really uncomfortable. Today was just sucky. First thing I saw when I woke up was a pic of my ex on my news feed. Seems like she took a picture with the creator of a cartoon we both "like" on facebook, and he posted it on his page. Oh, hey emotions. I told you to get out. What are you doing here. Go away. Not a great way to wake up.

If she makes you feel this way, why the heck are you still facebook friends with her?


Arghh! Why can't I simply tell this girl how I feel and ask if she feels the same way? I'm going to be alone forever... :smallfrown:

I here you there. I have a lot of problems with this step. Getting rejected scares me because I often get emotionally invested in a person I like. As in it's not like I can go up and say: "Hey, you're cute. Want to go to a movie? No? Ah well, moving on." I like getting to know people first before I have an opinion on if I want to date them, so I inevitably gather more potent feelings, such as crushes. Still, 2 and a half years being single...I got a bit more confident. I'd not suggest that technique as a method, but I feel ya.

[Thajocoth]

Yes, yes, I know that sex isn't important in a healthy relationship.

Actually, an individual's physical needs are just as important as mental & emotional needs and can be a huge compatibility issue, even if all other aspects of the relationship line up perfectly, in exactly the same way that not meeting each other's emotional or mental needs might. A healthy relationship is well rounded on all fronts.

Physical doesn't always have to mean sex, but for a good majority of people it does. Also, I'm not saying physical needs are the most important thing, but I would highly doubt the long term happiness of any relationship that doesn't consider it to be important at all. It can be a direct relationship conflict just as easily as mismatched personalities can, and the intricacies of the specifics can be just as complex as well.

[Sholos]

I here you there. I have a lot of problems with this step. Getting rejected scares me because I often get emotionally invested in a person I like. As in it's not like I can go up and say: "Hey, you're cute. Want to go to a movie? No? Ah well, moving on." I like getting to know people first before I have an opinion on if I want to date them, so I inevitably gather more potent feelings, such as crushes. Still, 2 and a half years being single...I got a bit more confident. I'd not suggest that technique as a method, but I feel ya.

I'm basically the exact same way. I like to be a little more sure of liking a person before I do anything about it. Except now I'm going on 4+ years of being single (since I started desiring not to be, I've been single my entire life).

As for the needs discussion, do you have to have a romantic partner for those? Though I feel like none of my needs in any of the three areas are currently being met, but still, I'd hope that there's the possibility of meeting them without someone else.

[noparlpf]

It is indeed. However, is it points when you are alone or is it when you are with someone too? There is a difference.

If she makes you feel this way, why the heck are you still facebook friends with her?

I'm not. Like I said, she took a photo with the creator of a show we both "like", and he posted it on that facebook fan page.
Though it's not like that's my normal response. Usually I'm okay. I think it was waking up from a bad night's sleep and having that be the first thing I saw before I was properly awake.

[Thajocoth]

Arghh! Why can't I simply tell this girl how I feel and ask if she feels the same way? I'm going to be alone forever... :smallfrown:

I hope this concept helps:

There are three possible outcomes. #1 - You tell her & she feels the same way. You're both happy. #2 - You tell her & she does not feel the same way. It hurts for a while, but you move on. #3 - You don't tell her & you agonize over the question for a good long time... Years... Maybe even decades (I don't know the specifics in your case, but it's far more difficult to move on without closure.)

The worst case scenario if you talk to her is still better than the only scenario if you don't.

Might I recommend starting with a more familiar topic and changing the topic to how you feel once you start to get a bit comfortable with the conversation flow?


As for the needs discussion, do you have to have a romantic partner for those? Though I feel like none of my needs in any of the three areas are currently being met, but still, I'd hope that there's the possibility of meeting them without someone else.

It's possible to get them all through other social outlets, I suppose... But really, I was referring to the needs of the relationship. If two people are together, but they're each getting all their emotional needs met with friends, their mental needs met at work & their physical needs met with a few really close friends, then how much of a relationship are they even having with one another? How likely are either of them to prefer the company of their friends at that point?

[Morph Bark]

Actually, an individual's physical needs are just as important as mental & emotional needs and can be a huge compatibility issue, even if all other aspects of the relationship line up perfectly, in exactly the same way that not meeting each other's emotional or mental needs might. A healthy relationship is well rounded on all fronts.

Physical doesn't always have to mean sex, but for a good majority of people it does. Also, I'm not saying physical needs are the most important thing, but I would highly doubt the long term happiness of any relationship that doesn't consider it to be important at all. It can be a direct relationship conflict just as easily as mismatched personalities can, and the intricacies of the specifics can be just as complex as well.

I agree with your point here a lot. This is one point where long-distance relationships fail immediately.

[Coidzor]

I agree with your point here a lot. This is one point where long-distance relationships fail immediately.

Heck, that's entirely why I cannot enter into one in good conscience.


Actually, an individual's physical needs are just as important as mental & emotional needs and can be a huge compatibility issue [...-snip-...]

I'd swear that was sarcasm on Reluctance's part, but I didn't see the blue, so I couldn't be sure.

[Seffbasilisk]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.


I met this girl. She's really nice, and I like her. I'm very certain that because of how she introduced herself to me, that she likes me (especially considering I'm rather quiet in class).
A friend of mine introduced me to this guy. He's really nice, and I like him. He also likes me.
I've been friends with this girl for a while, but only just got to know this guy.
I haven't had a chance to hang out with the girl, but the guy has already asked me if I wanted to.
I've got some rather complicated gender-identity issues, but this girl is straight and the guy is gay.
The girl and I share a lot of hobbies. The guy and I share a few interests, though he leans closer to anime and the like, while I prefer games and comics.
The guy smokes. This is actually a big deal for me, because smoking is generally quite gross for me, and I don't like what it does to people. It also really turns me away from him, despite his much nicer traits.


What in the HELL do I do?


Seems to me, just from first impressions, that you like the girl more, but are unwilling to make the first moves there. The guy seems willing to do all the work for you. So you're considering him more due to the path of least resistance.

I'd say to ask the girl to something. Not strictly a date if you're not sure yet, but something to get to know her in an one-on-one situation better. Maybe hang with the guy, but if the smoking's a big thing, it's probably not that shiny a deal anyway.

When you have a decent feel for both of them, try a method I refer to as 'Arguing with a coin'.

To decide which one you want, arbitrarily assign sides. For instance, lets say the girl is heads, the guy is tails. Face-up is the one you date. Flip the coin. Catch it in midair, and slap it down on your arm.

That's the one.

The feeling you get afterwards? That's how you know whether you chose right or not. If you get the sudden urge to flip again, or find some way to invalidate that flip, or try best two out of three or some such nonsense? The one it landed on is not the one you really want.

It's a way of tricking your brain into looking at the decision in hindsight, while still in the decision-making process.

Just my two cents.

[Drascin]

When you have a decent feel for both of them, try a method I refer to as 'Arguing with a coin'.

To decide which one you want, arbitrarily assign sides. For instance, lets say the girl is heads, the guy is tails. Face-up is the one you date. Flip the coin. Catch it in midair, and slap it down on your arm.

That's the one.

The feeling you get afterwards? That's how you know whether you chose right or not. If you get the sudden urge to flip again, or find some way to invalidate that flip, or try best two out of three or some such nonsense? The one it landed on is not the one you really want.

It's a way of tricking your brain into looking at the decision in hindsight, while still in the decision-making process.

Warning: Does not work and in fact can be a real problem if you're the type of person that would feel uncertain with the decision no matter which way the coin falls. Speaking from experience, here.

[arguskos]

Warning: Does not work and in fact can be a real problem if you're the type of person that would feel uncertain with the decision no matter which way the coin falls. Speaking from experience, here.
See, it works perfectly for me at all times. Just a good example of how experiences differ.

It's not a perfect method, but if this style of thing works in general for you, the coin argument trick is a great way to examine your behavior. :smallsmile:

[Sholos]

I hope this concept helps:

There are three possible outcomes. #1 - You tell her & she feels the same way. You're both happy. #2 - You tell her & she does not feel the same way. It hurts for a while, but you move on. #3 - You don't tell her & you agonize over the question for a good long time... Years... Maybe even decades (I don't know the specifics in your case, but it's far more difficult to move on without closure.)

The worst case scenario if you talk to her is still better than the only scenario if you don't.

Might I recommend starting with a more familiar topic and changing the topic to how you feel once you start to get a bit comfortable with the conversation flow?

I'm generally comfortable talking to her about most things. I just don't know how I'd change the topic to that without it being really weird. =/


It's possible to get them all through other social outlets, I suppose... But really, I was referring to the needs of the relationship. If two people are together, but they're each getting all their emotional needs met with friends, their mental needs met at work & their physical needs met with a few really close friends, then how much of a relationship are they even having with one another? How likely are either of them to prefer the company of their friends at that point?

Are the needs that get met in a relationship needs that you only have if you're in a relationship? Or are they needs that single people are just screwed on?

[Thajocoth]

I'm generally comfortable talking to her about most things. I just don't know how I'd change the topic to that without it being really weird. =/

Wait for a pause, smile while looking at her, and then just say what's in your heart. (Not "blood". I mean your metaphorical heart, not the organ.)


Are the needs that get met in a relationship needs that you only have if you're in a relationship? Or are they needs that single people are just screwed on?

A mixture of both I think. A relationship is a bond. Think back to chemistry. A hydrogen bond shares one electron, and is rather weak. Two carbons can share 3 electrons to have a really strong bond. The bond itself needs those electrons, and the atoms aren't quite whole without the bond, but they get by without it if they need to.

So, you can get some of the needs met with friends, but if your electrons are all shared with other hydrogens, how strong is your relationship going to be? They're your needs, but they're also the bond's needs in a way.

My analogy probably isn't perfect... And it's very much an opinion, just like the rest of what I've said on this topic.

[Saposhiente]

Okay, I'm in something of a bind. I'll explain it in bullet points.


I met this girl. She's really nice, and I like her. I'm very certain that because of how she introduced herself to me, that she likes me (especially considering I'm rather quiet in class).
A friend of mine introduced me to this guy. He's really nice, and I like him. He also likes me.
I've been friends with this girl for a while, but only just got to know this guy.
I haven't had a chance to hang out with the girl, but the guy has already asked me if I wanted to.
I've got some rather complicated gender-identity issues, but this girl is straight and the guy is gay.
The girl and I share a lot of hobbies. The guy and I share a few interests, though he leans closer to anime and the like, while I prefer games and comics.
The guy smokes. This is actually a big deal for me, because smoking is generally quite gross for me, and I don't like what it does to people. It also really turns me away from him, despite his much nicer traits.


What in the HELL do I do?
http://i.picresize.com/images/2012/10/21/H8wPz.jpg

Arghh! Why can't I simply tell this girl how I feel and ask if she feels the same way?
Well... why can't you? (On principle. I of course can't give detailed advice nor advice that should be paid great attention to without details.)

I'm generally comfortable talking to her about most things. I just don't know how I'd change the topic to that without it being really weird. =/
What you do is, don't change the topic; create the topic. If for example you want to take her out to a movie, first ask her about the movie and if she hasn't seen it then you can ask her whether she'd like to see it with you.

[Reluctance]

And frankly, "we all know" nothing of the sort. I'll admit that from the description Trisc gave, he (sorry if that's not your preferred pronoun) seems to be leaning more towards the girl, but I disagree with your accusation of "public hand-wringing to sell an image", and again think it's not an appropriate accusation to make on no grounds. And frankly, I don't see what's wrong with going for the girl. In fact, that would be my advice. You seem to have more in common with her anyway, and the guy's smoking is a big deal for you. Make a move with the girl.
{Scrubbed}

Making a move is unlikely to work now - there's that whole "known you forever, don't wanna risk it" thing going against you - but seriously just do it. Remember what I said about social skills being skills with a strong learned component? You'll likely goof on earlier tries, but look at it as leveling your skills up. You'll learn what works and what doesn't, you'll get more confident, and you'll stop stressing.

I'll say this nicely once before going back to the classic Reluctance mode. What are you doing to force yourself out of your shell, to interact with other people, and to make yourself a more active, engaging, and interesting person? All of this "why is everything so danged hard?" just means you're letting your skills fail to advance. Which only means you fall further behind the curve as you (and by extension, your circle of peers) gets older.

(True story. The first time I tried asking a girl out, the hallway suddenly got very crowded and I couldn't get the words out properly. Forcing myself to socialize with bored bystanders (admittedly harder today when everybody has internet-connected devices) and asking for numbers was how I leveled my skills to the "competent" level. The rest is just a natural side-effect of normal social interaction.)

[Astrella]

{Scrubbed}.

Still no reason to make rude assumptions like that. "An air" is not an excuse to be an ass.

And I really hope you're not claiming that Trisc can only be bi if he dates a suitable amount of each gender. :smallannoyed:

[Reluctance]

{Scrubbed}

[Sholos]

Wait for a pause, smile while looking at her, and then just say what's in your heart. (Not "blood". I mean your metaphorical heart, not the organ.)
What's in my heart is that I'm very much starting to like her as a friend and more and I'm scared that she's going to completely cut off from me if I tell her I like her. It's happened before. In fact, the usual pattern of my interaction with women is a sudden cessation of communication on their part. And no one can tell me why, not even my best friends. :smallfrown:


A mixture of both I think. A relationship is a bond. Think back to chemistry. A hydrogen bond shares one electron, and is rather weak. Two carbons can share 3 electrons to have a really strong bond. The bond itself needs those electrons, and the atoms aren't quite whole without the bond, but they get by without it if they need to.

So, you can get some of the needs met with friends, but if your electrons are all shared with other hydrogens, how strong is your relationship going to be? They're your needs, but they're also the bond's needs in a way.

My analogy probably isn't perfect... And it's very much an opinion, just like the rest of what I've said on this topic.
Huh.


Well... why can't you? (On principle. I of course can't give detailed advice nor advice that should be paid great attention to without details.)
I'm scared I'm going to lose what friendship I've built and I have no idea (well, not none, but little) idea of what she feels for me. PM me. I don't mind getting detailed, but I'd rather not in public (even anonymously).


What you do is, don't change the topic; create the topic. If for example you want to take her out to a movie, first ask her about the movie and if she hasn't seen it then you can ask her whether she'd like to see it with you.
I actually did exactly that. We went to see Looper. Got dinner beforehand. It was fun. She kept leaning away from me, though, and sitting on the opposite side of her seat from me (though she'd lean back occasionally, I guess). I don't know if that really means anything.


{Scrubbed}
How are tennis balls going to help?


Making a move is unlikely to work now - there's that whole "known you forever, don't wanna risk it" thing going against you - but seriously just do it. Remember what I said about social skills being skills with a strong learned component? You'll likely goof on earlier tries, but look at it as leveling your skills up. You'll learn what works and what doesn't, you'll get more confident, and you'll stop stressing.
I've actually only known her for maybe a year, been interacting with her over the spring semester and now the fall. Which is why I want to ask now, before that happens (except that it's almost happening with me...). The only thing I've learned that doesn't work is getting to know the person much at all before something starts. At least that's the way it feels.


I'll say this nicely once before going back to the classic Reluctance mode. What are you doing to force yourself out of your shell, to interact with other people, and to make yourself a more active, engaging, and interesting person? All of this "why is everything so danged hard?" just means you're letting your skills fail to advance. Which only means you fall further behind the curve as you (and by extension, your circle of peers) gets older.
:smallfrown: Nothing really. I'm attending the same clubs, working at the same place. I made it a point to talk to all the new members that showed up, but the vast majority of them have stopped coming (seriously, the one club I think retained maybe 2 or 3 new members, and the other one I think only 1 or 2 stayed). I tried going to a science fiction book club, but I'm pretty sure I was at least 30 years younger than the next youngest person there. I felt completely out of place. Other than that, my time is chaotic since the work schedule is done weekly and I'm not always working the same nights and I'm frequently working nights at that (the time most socializing is done). I also don't have a car, though that's less of an issue here than other places since everywhere is pretty easy to reach, but still becomes a problem at times.

I have started to force myself to randomly contact people during the day, just sending a "How are you doing?" text or similar. It works sometimes, but a lot of the people I know are students and so their chat time and hang out time is limited, and a lot of the time they'd rather be hanging out with people their age (guess I can't really blame them). Everything I could do to meet people my age costs money that I don't have.

As for making myself a more active, engaging, and interesting person... I'm not even sure what I'm supposed to do. Most of my interests are things no one outside the field cares about or are hard to share with someone who doesn't have the technical knowledge I do. It's hard to talk about the cool new algorithms someone has come up with if the person I'm talking to doesn't even really know what algorithms are in the first place, let alone understand the significance of dropping an n^2 function to an nlog(n) function (something about genetic sequencing).


(True story. The first time I tried asking a girl out, the hallway suddenly got very crowded and I couldn't get the words out properly. Forcing myself to socialize with bored bystanders (admittedly harder today when everybody has internet-connected devices) and asking for numbers was how I leveled my skills to the "competent" level. The rest is just a natural side-effect of normal social interaction.)

My normal social interaction is pretty much limited to the 2 or 3 times a week I see people for a couple hours at a club meeting. There are very few people I see outside of those settings, and I don't even really see them all that much. It was even worse when you start talking about my life 5+ years back. I never did much of anything with anyone outside of very brief interactions in school (the 3 years during high school at least). I don't understand much of anything, and people are far less willing to be patient with a 27-year old who doesn't have social graces than they are with a 12-year old.

I'm also very bad at perceiving how others see me as a person. I'm constantly assuming that everyone thinks neutral thoughts of me at best, if they think of me at all, despite assurances to the contrary. But then I find out about things happening with groups that I think of as friends (from time to time) where it's clear I was never even thought of, or dismissed as a possible participant. I'm rarely if ever invited to random get-togethers and practically no one ever contacts me just to say hi or ask to hang out or anything else. Everyone is busy with everyone besides me (is what it feels like). And maybe they don't invite me because they figure I'll be busy, but I'd still like to be invited even if I have to say no! The old saying, "It's the thought that counts," does in fact have a point. Especially with someone like me.

On an aside and hopefully irrelevant topic, almost every single girl I meet is either in a relationship or actively avoiding them. There don't seem to be any single girls that are open to the idea of a relationship. I don't know if it's where I am or what, but it's been annoying in the past.

[Reluctance]

On an aside and hopefully irrelevant topic, almost every single girl I meet is either in a relationship or actively avoiding them. There don't seem to be any single girls that are open to the idea of a relationship. I don't know if it's where I am or what, but it's been annoying in the past.

Very few girls will admit to looking for a relationship. Partially because it's a lot easier for them to find one if it's really a priority for them, partially because it can be seen as an invitation for all manner of clumsy come-ons. There's a whole social dance of subtext, and right now, learning by practice should be your priority.

-------------
{Scrubbed}
Here's what I want you to do. Assuming you can get a good rate at the campus gym as a perk of being part of the school, start going regularly. Not because you want to become a greek god (although I'd be lying if I said it didn't help with the ladies), but because regular exercise makes you feel better.

You have the internet. By extension, all manner of information. Study up on normal person hobbies. Browse OKC to see what shows are popular with locals and catch up on Hulu. Find out about free cultural events nearby and see what you can attend.

Basically, doing things will give you a wider repertoire of things to talk about. That'll give you more options to talk to the normal people.

[Heliomance]

There's this thing I like to call sour-grapes sexual. People who can't get any playing the whole "I don't see why everybody else is so obsessed with hooking up and feeding their baser natures" sort of thing. Your whole post had that air of "I don't get why you think occasional physical affection is such a big thing". Had the whole sour grapsiness to it.


First, what I said was not "I don't get why you think occasional physical affection is such a big thing". I love physical affection. I'm a very tactile person. What I said was that how easily you think the other person will put out should not be a priority if you're looking for a serious relationship. Because in most cases, a serious relationship will get to that point sooner or later. But physical intimacy is not the thing that makes or breaks a relationship. Mostly, it's about personality. If you get on well with your partner, and you stay in the relationship, sex will be involved at some point down the line. If you don't get on with them, it doesn't matter how good or how early the sex is, the relationship isn't going to work.

All that aside, that STILL doesn't give you the right to ask me "did you get any?"
It's a completely inappropriate question and I am really rather offended. I would appreciate an apology.

[Morph Bark]

A lot of people aren't actively looking for a relationship. This usually means they wouldn't mind starting one if the oppurtunity presents itself with a person they like, but won't get into it very quickly or will seem to "avoid" them, because if they appear to others as if they are active looking, they think they might get into kinds of situations they don't want to get into (such as being hit on or get the "awkward come-ons" spoken of above).

When most people around you are like this, especially people you like and are interested in, your best bet is to just go about being yourself and talking to them as you would to other people so they get to know you. This does not necessarily mean hanging out (especially in groups, because then you give off a vibe that comes across as "let's be friends", rather than what Sholos seems to be looking for here (exceptions are big events and birthdays though)). At some point after a little while, when you've at least talked about some personal things, ask if they'd like to do something with just the two of you. If they agree, the chances they are interested in you are high. It still is not a certainty though (and if they invite other people along it's more likely the opposite and they really do just want to be friends).

[dehro]

Very few girls will admit to looking for a relationship. Partially because it's a lot easier for them to find one if it's really a priority for them, partially because it can be seen as an invitation for all manner of clumsy come-ons. There's a whole social dance of subtext, and right now, learning by practice should be your priority.


either I talk to a different kind of girl than you do..or you're making rather broad generalisations..and those never really help explaining anyone's argument.

[Sholos]

When most people around you are like this, especially people you like and are interested in, your best bet is to just go about being yourself and talking to them as you would to other people so they get to know you. This does not necessarily mean hanging out (especially in groups, because then you give off a vibe that comes across as "let's be friends", rather than what Sholos seems to be looking for here (exceptions are big events and birthdays though)). At some point after a little while, when you've at least talked about some personal things, ask if they'd like to do something with just the two of you. If they agree, the chances they are interested in you are high. It still is not a certainty though (and if they invite other people along it's more likely the opposite and they really do just want to be friends).
Wait, does that mean to hang out in something other than big groups or only big groups? I'm just having a bit of trouble parsing.


either I talk to a different kind of girl than you do..or you're making rather broad generalisations..and those never really help explaining anyone's argument.
I think he's saying that on average, it's a lot easier for a girl to find someone who wants to be with them than the opposite. None of the girls I know that are single are for want of opportunity. They've all chosen to be single. And in at least one case not even that worked. She's getting married in January. I mean, she obviously chose to be with the guy, but before that she had actively been against a relationship of any kind.

[Serpentine]

Last I heard, studies in the area found that while women have better luck than men when it comes to casual sex, men and women are both about the same when it comes to committed relationships. Which kinda makes sense considering, you know, there's usually two people involved in every relationship and most people are heterosexual (and I imagine there's reasonably equivalent numbers of lesbians and gay men), so for every woman who gets in a relationship there is (overall) a man who also gets in a relationship.

[dehro]

I think he's saying that on average, it's a lot easier for a girl to find someone who wants to be with them than the opposite. None of the girls I know that are single are for want of opportunity. They've all chosen to be single. And in at least one case not even that worked. She's getting married in January. I mean, she obviously chose to be with the guy, but before that she had actively been against a relationship of any kind.

I understand his reasoning.. I just disagree with the premise that very few women say it when they want a relationship.
in my experience, women who are after that have very little qualms about saying so.
since my experience is contradicting his sweeping statement, that's why I called it a generalisation.
the very wording of "admitting it" sounds laced with bad memories and stereotypes where the women are all secretly out to lure a male prey, put a ring on it and be free to let themselves finally go.

[Reluctance]

Last I heard, studies in the area found that while women have better luck than men when it comes to casual sex, men and women are both about the same when it comes to committed relationships. Which kinda makes sense considering, you know, there's usually two people involved in every relationship and most people are heterosexual (and I imagine there's reasonably equivalent numbers of lesbians and gay men), so for every woman who gets in a relationship there is (overall) a man who also gets in a relationship.

My point was that by the time a girl is frustrated enough to tell total strangers/casual acquaintances that she's on the prowl, she's probably frustrated enough to drop her standards to the point where somebody becomes available. If you're talking relationship searching in general, some bizarre quirk in the alien female psyche leaves them unenthused about Mr. "meh, he's not much, but at least he'll have me".

That, and a woman who wants to broadcast that she's looking for a relationship is much more likely to play up nonverbal signals (mostly dress and body language) while maintaining plausible deniability with her words. Not playing gender wars here. Just explaining why human women prefer to be a little more subtle than flashing their engorged red buttocks when they're interested.

[Astrella]

My point was that by the time a girl is frustrated enough to tell total strangers/casual acquaintances that she's on the prowl, she's probably frustrated enough to drop her standards to the point where somebody becomes available. If you're talking relationship searching in general, some bizarre quirk in the alien female psyche leaves them unenthused about Mr. "meh, he's not much, but at least he'll have me".

Stuff like that has to do with socialization and societal attitudes, not "some bizarre quirk in the alien female psyche". :smallannoyed:

[bluewind95]

My point was that by the time a girl is frustrated enough to tell total strangers/casual acquaintances that she's on the prowl, she's probably frustrated enough to drop her standards to the point where somebody becomes available. If you're talking relationship searching in general, some bizarre quirk in the alien female psyche leaves them unenthused about Mr. "meh, he's not much, but at least he'll have me".

That, and a woman who wants to broadcast that she's looking for a relationship is much more likely to play up nonverbal signals (mostly dress and body language) while maintaining plausible deniability with her words. Not playing gender wars here. Just explaining why human women prefer to be a little more subtle than flashing their engorged red buttocks when they're interested.

In my experience, women tend to say they are looking for a relationship when they are, and they tend to say they are not when, you know, they aren't. If they do say no when they are looking for one, it tends to mean "I really don't like you that way, but I'm trying to spare your feelings about it, and would rather you leave me alone about this". They also don't use dress to broadcast they're looking for a relationship. Many women just like to feel good about how they look, rather than dress pretty for all them males to know she wants a relationship. Women may also actually not be looking for a relationship and then get into one, not because they lied about their intentions, but because someone really interesting came along and they took that chance.

I'm... not entirely sure you understand women. Certainly not in general.

[Reluctance]

{Scrubbed}

[Serpentine]

What self-deception? People find things they weren't looking for all the time.

[The Succubus]

What self-deception? People find things they weren't looking for all the time.

So if I actively stop looking for my front door keys I might actually be able to find the bloody things in the morning? :smallsigh:

[Morph Bark]

Wait, does that mean to hang out in something other than big groups or only big groups? I'm just having a bit of trouble parsing.

I meant not to hang out in groups, because that gives off a very different vibe from just hanging out with the two of you. The exceptions are big events and birthdays, because it's a very different setting. If you go to events with someone you like, it feels kind of like a date, but it's also in a "safer" environment (at least, with most events this is the case; if you go to an erotica convention this is clearly different). Birthdays are "safe" by default, unless you invite the other person along to a birthday of someone they don't know.

[Coidzor]

either I talk to a different kind of girl than you do..or you're making rather broad generalisations..and those never really help explaining anyone's argument.

Well, by necessity we have to talk in generalities till we get to a specific person and even then, we're still obligated to do so by a lack of intimate details and forum decorum. :smallconfused:

In general, if a woman makes it openly known that she's looking for a beau, she's going to get a lot of unwanted attention and harassment, even and/or especially from her circle of male friends, depending.

In general, with the way it's set up, women have an easier time finding someone, but standards, social taboo, and various other factors I am either not aware of or don't particularly feel like expounding upon at length get in the way of that, like the inherent risks of being a ciswoman culturally and biologically.

And if a man is on the prowl/hunt/wossname and meeting women, the culturally expected reaction is to demur, even if she is currently on the market herself. At least, if I recall demur's usage in language properly, the dictionary is "eh, close enough." Which does seem to tie-in with the initial scenario that started this discussion. Admitting that you're also looking for someone to someone who is looking for someone is a quick way to send signals that one does not necessarily want sent, and certainly not before getting a better feel for the other person.


Stuff like that has to do with socialization and societal attitudes, not "some bizarre quirk in the alien female psyche". :smallannoyed:

:smallconfused: That's not supposed to be taken literally, you might object to the phraseology of the device, but that's not what Reluctance is thinking or espousing, necessarily. Usually it's a bit tough to tell, but this is one of the clearer examples of their use of figurative language as a form of emphasis, as far as I can tell anyway. Sarcasm usually not being one's personal views and all.

[Sholos]

I meant not to hang out in groups, because that gives off a very different vibe from just hanging out with the two of you. The exceptions are big events and birthdays, because it's a very different setting. If you go to events with someone you like, it feels kind of like a date, but it's also in a "safer" environment (at least, with most events this is the case; if you go to an erotica convention this is clearly different). Birthdays are "safe" by default, unless you invite the other person along to a birthday of someone they don't know.

Ah, that's what I thought you were saying. And something I've definitely seen happen for other people. I always seem to run into walls when I do try and it's very discouraging. Walls include people being too busy to hang out with me, our schedules conflicting, or they're busy hanging out with other people. Or, the people that I do manage to hang out one-on-one are non-single or guys. I'm still trying, but it quickly gets frustrating when no one seems to have any time for me personally.

[dehro]

{Scrubbed}

it's a self evident truth.. that anybody who has lived past the age of..12, can vouch for.
I do believe the "much reaction" you get stems from your delivery, rather than from the content.

[Serpentine]

The thing is, this supposed "deception" that's being taken for granted is anything but. The claim that a girl is lying when she says she's not looking for a relationship if some time later she is in one is founded on three assumptions:
1. A girl is only capable of falling for someone if she is actively intending to do so,
2. Girls are incapable of changing their minds or being subject to changing circumstances, and
3. Girls have some sort of mystical power to see the future.

While the insistance that women are superhuman beings incapable of being merely wrong is flattering, it is not very useful in a respectful discussion of human relations.

[Coidzor]

The thing is, this supposed "deception" that's being taken for granted is anything but. The claim that a girl is lying when she says she's not looking for a relationship if some time later she is in one is founded on three assumptions:
1. A girl is only capable of falling for someone if she is actively intending to do so,
2. Girls are incapable of changing their minds or being subject to changing circumstances, and
3. Girls have some sort of mystical power to see the future.

While the insistance that women are superhuman beings incapable of being merely wrong is flattering, it is not very useful in a respectful discussion of human relations.

On the other hand, assuming that it's never a "white" lie also sets up a scenario where women are viewed as inconstant and incapable of knowing their own minds or choosing for themselves, which is what a number of unfortunate things from the past and present are predicated upon.

Carelessness and general humanness is more likely than malice like the old adage I'm forgetting the exact phraseology of, and all, and at the end of the day a no is a no is a no is a no, and getting told that she's not looking for someone is a fairly definitive no, which is the only thing that really matters for the purposes of romance.

[Serpentine]

There's a pretty huge range of possibility between "girls never ever tell lies" and "every single time a girl says something and then later does something that could be seen to contradict what she said before she's a dirty rotten liar" - the latter of which being the only option put forth thus far.
And it's pretty damn straightforward to go with "either way, that's a no" without going into all sorts of baseless and pointless accusations, generalisations and demonisation, and it'd be nice to see that happen more often.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff: Thread locked for review.

[SMEE]

The Rainbow Mod: Thread re-opened for posting.

[Coidzor]

Yeah, I must admit, I've had to rethink the degree of my Devil's Advocacy.

[The Succubus]

In that case, I shall have a rethink on my Demon's Advocacy.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Horray! It's back! So how be the woes and the advisers? Anything good or bad happening?

[Coidzor]

Well, my English Teacher paramour broke things off with me because apparently the guilt was driving her mad.

Would've been nice if it were before she was begging me to come over and then went full cray-cray, but c'est la vie.

[Morph Bark]

In my country we have a saying: "no news is good news."

This does not apply to relationships with people.

Not hearing from someone for two weeks kinda grates me. :|

[Coidzor]

In my country we have a saying: "no news is good news."

This does not apply to relationships with people.

Not hearing from someone for two weeks kinda grates me. :|

Agreed. I ran into something very much like that myself recently.


It is a very curious piece of misapplied feminism that results in the strange belief that the only person whose thoughts, feelings, or schedule matters is the woman and any kind of compromise or discussion is sexist oppression.

C'est la guerre, I suppose, given the number of self-described anti-feminists or completely apathetic women that I've encountered it in.

[Morph Bark]

It is a very curious piece of misapplied feminism that results in the strange belief that the only person whose thoughts, feelings, or schedule matters is the woman and any kind of compromise or discussion is sexist oppression.

If that is supposed to be a thing, I guess it's applicable moreso to your area than in general. My ex wasn't at all like that, for instance. With regards to this girl, I understand that's she's very busy (she's studying to become a dentist), but I like being in contact fairly regularly, however briefly. Texting doesn't seem to cut it for her, as she doesn't keep her phone with her most of the day as to not be disturbed during classes (they might not even be allowed in there, I forgot if she mentioned that).

Anyway, I decided to re-install WhatsApp on my smartphone, since she has her iPod with her more often than her Nokia phone and can apparently use WhatsApp on it. See if she replies to pokes on there.

[Coidzor]

If that is supposed to be a thing, I guess it's applicable moreso to your area than in general. My ex wasn't at all like that, for instance.

Mostly an observation that your plight reminded me of, and as I've encountered it on the West Coast, the South, and online I'm inclined to believe that there's something other than personal hallucination to it.

[Adumbration]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).

[Coidzor]

I seem to recall something about there being some form of etiquette involving questions but I can't recall any details for the life of me.

[noparlpf]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).

I think you're supposed to say more than "Hey :)". Try starting a conversation. Be interesting.

[Coidzor]

Say, what was that term that was developed for the thread as an alternative to partner/lover/boytoy/etc.?

edit: Kerfluffington? Gerrinton? Gerdonkle? Merfonkle? Gedonkle?

[Castaras]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).

- Go for profile pictures of you outside doing something. Pictures taken of people just against the wall of their room or from a webcam look much less attractive and more inherently creepy than pictures of you out there doing something - even if it's just standing by a tree looking sheepish.
- Two-three sentences is good. More than just "hello darling" or "Hey, I have a <genitals> and you have a <genitals>, 'ey? 'ey?". Commenting on something the person mentioned on their profile is good. Don't do too long a reply, however - people will go "TL;DR" and ignore it, sadly, no matter what the content.

[Marillion]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).

This article (http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2011/07/online-dating-first-contact) is a pretty good look at the situation.

[Morph Bark]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).

Starting up talk about something you both find interesting is probably a good start. I have an account there I only used for a month or so, but I got a pretty good reaction after I asked a lady about her Stargate blog.

...if you're talking about sending messages in written form, rather than the kind of "making a first impression".

[TheWombatOfDoom]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).

I can certainly help you there, depending on what you're looking for and how you want to go about it. I just warn you that many girls are absolutely swamped with messages, and many don't take the time to message back to the ones they aren't interested in. Even the most promising could turn out to be a let down. However, I've also had some nice luck on there as well.

If you'd like to be more specific, or message me, I can cater to your specific needs.


Say, what was that term that was developed for the thread as an alternative to partner/lover/boytoy/etc.?

edit: Kerfluffington? Gerrinton? Gerdonkle? Merfonkle? Gedonkle?

I'm assuming you don't mean MULWIPAR....so how about PILTFER - Person I Love To Fondle - Exnay Relationship

[Serpentine]

As a general question - I just made a profile on OKCupid, and I was wondering what's a good first message to send to someone? Is there an etiquette of any kind? Apart from A) Be attractive, B) Don't be unattractive and C) Don't be a creepy bastard (my personal addition).Everyone's pretty much said it, so I'll basically reiterate: pick up on something in their profile, and start a conversation on that. Ask one or two questions that invite an answer, and that can further contribute to conversation. Avoid commenting on physical stuff, I think, unless there's something particularly distinctive (e.g. funky hair colour, weird bit of clothing).
On the other hand, I recently started an ongoing conversation by just saying "Nothing much to say, but I like your style".

[Faulty]

So: cute girl in a class. I managed to get her out to coffee with me by saying I'd like to hear about the thesis to her research paper (I actually do want to hear it). How do I move from that -> friendship -> romance? Tipz plox.

[Zrak]

I feel like the intentional move from friendship to romance will always appear artificial. Just be her friend and wait and see if something develops; if nothing does, it's not as though a dozen roses would've changed things, you know? There's nothing wrong with making it clear you like her after you've gotten to know her, or even asking her out, I just mean trying to move the relationship in a more romantic direction before doing that often seems artificial and forced.
As for going from acquaintances to friends, just make it clear that you like hanging out with her and enjoy her contributions to topics of mutual interest. The thesis is a great way to do this, since it gives a lot more indication of what somebody's like than the usual small-talk, but there's not too much added pressure.


Mostly an observation that your plight reminded me of, and as I've encountered it on the West Coast, the South, and online I'm inclined to believe that there's something other than personal hallucination to it.

I don't think it's so much personal hallucination, but I also don't think it has much of anything to do with women or feminism. Typically, people believe (regardless of their sex) that the only thoughts, feelings, and schedule that matters is their own, even if they don't think so consciously or openly. Whenever someone is called out on this, it is obviously not his or her fault and is instead a result of him or her being oppressed, bullied, or what-have-you by whoever had the audacity to suggest they were being anything less than reasonably. The important thing to remember about most people of either sex is that they are convinced they are always right and they/their priorities are the most important, provided anyone else matters at all.

[Serpentine]

Random but tangentially related: My sister's recently joined OKCupid and is enjoying enormous success with it. I'm somewhat jealous, but on the other hand the sort of interactions she's having aren't really the sort of interactions I particularly want, so oh well I guess...

[Coidzor]

I don't think it's so much personal hallucination, but I also don't think it has much of anything to do with women or feminism. Typically, people believe (regardless of their sex) that the only thoughts, feelings, and schedule that matters is their own, even if they don't think so consciously or openly. Whenever someone is called out on this, it is obviously not his or her fault and is instead a result of him or her being oppressed, bullied, or what-have-you by whoever had the audacity to suggest they were being anything less than reasonably. The important thing to remember about most people of either sex is that they are convinced they are always right and they/their priorities are the most important, provided anyone else matters at all.

I don't think it was the casual sociopathy or solipsism of selfishness alone when I've encountered it. Certainly it's a component, but you usually don't get the fires of dogma with solipsism and all.


So: cute girl in a class. I managed to get her out to coffee with me by saying I'd like to hear about the thesis to her research paper (I actually do want to hear it). How do I move from that -> friendship -> romance? Tipz plox.

Well, there's the old conventional standby of outmoded gender roles for comparison. Be attractive. Don't be unattractive. Show charisma/personability/non-creepiness.

Put your best foot forward, show interest in her, flirt as best you're able and as the situation allows.

You really don't need to establish a formalized friendship before your first date, after all, considering you're already interested in pursuing her. So... pursue her. :smallconfused: It's not like pursuing her is mutually exclusive with having an interest in her or her thoughts.

[Serpentine]

There are no "fires of dogma" here. Your angle is irrelevant to this thread. Shall we move on?

[Coidzor]

There are no "fires of dogma" here. Your angle is irrelevant to this thread. Shall we move on?

There was no angle in the first place, nor was I suggesting such, so, yes, by all means. :smalltongue:

I'd hardly say a memory of past relationship woes was completely irrelevant to the thread, given the title if nothing else though. :smalltongue:

[Heliomance]

Sigh. I miss having a girlfriend.

[Adumbration]

Well, this is awkward. In an attempt to follow the advice here, I sent multiple messages to various people. Just got a response - I asked (after seeing a lot of classical literature): "Have you read Dostojevski's Idiot? I can recommend that."

Honestly I wasn't expecting anything back, but just got. ".... jeah I have". And I'm a bit lost now. :smalltongue:

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Well...at least they responded, so that's something. I had a few people like that as well...I generally would try once more to strike up a conversation, ask more questions, ask them open ended questions like what is your favorite thing to do, so on, so they invest time in a response instead of a yes or no.

[Faulty]

I feel like the intentional move from friendship to romance will always appear artificial. Just be her friend and wait and see if something develops; if nothing does, it's not as though a dozen roses would've changed things, you know? There's nothing wrong with making it clear you like her after you've gotten to know her, or even asking her out, I just mean trying to move the relationship in a more romantic direction before doing that often seems artificial and forced.
As for going from acquaintances to friends, just make it clear that you like hanging out with her and enjoy her contributions to topics of mutual interest. The thesis is a great way to do this, since it gives a lot more indication of what somebody's like than the usual small-talk, but there's not too much added pressure.

Thank you for the advice. :smallsmile:


Well, there's the old conventional standby of outmoded gender roles for comparison. Be attractive. Don't be unattractive. Show charisma/personability/non-creepiness.

Put your best foot forward, show interest in her, flirt as best you're able and as the situation allows.

You really don't need to establish a formalized friendship before your first date, after all, considering you're already interested in pursuing her. So... pursue her. :smallconfused: It's not like pursuing her is mutually exclusive with having an interest in her or her thoughts.

We're both femme so I don't know how I could use stereotypical gender role scripts effectively here. :smalltongue: The problem is I don't know how to effectively flirt/pursue people. Zrak's advice sounds like it'll do me well.

[Asta Kask]

Well, this is awkward. In an attempt to follow the advice here, I sent multiple messages to various people. Just got a response - I asked (after seeing a lot of classical literature): "Have you read Dostojevski's Idiot? I can recommend that."

Honestly I wasn't expecting anything back, but just got. ".... jeah I have". And I'm a bit lost now. :smalltongue:

If you have, you can now ask what ze thought. And then conversation can follow.

[Chen]

So: cute girl in a class. I managed to get her out to coffee with me by saying I'd like to hear about the thesis to her research paper (I actually do want to hear it). How do I move from that -> friendship -> romance? Tipz plox.

So do you actually want to be her friend? Or are you only interested romantically? Trying to be friends just to become romantic later is a bad plan. Just directly ask her out if you're interested.

[Faulty]

So do you actually want to be her friend? Or are you only interested romantically? Trying to be friends just to become romantic later is a bad plan. Just directly ask her out if you're interested.

I am romantically interested. She seems like a shy person so I don't want to just be like HEY LETS GO OUT after our first time spending time together... Maybe I'm wrong?

[Fragenstein]

I am romantically interested. She seems like a shy person so I don't want to just be like HEY LETS GO OUT after our first time spending time together... Maybe I'm wrong?

Find common interests and invite her to things not involving thesis papers. Compliment her in unexpected ways. Initiate some subtle touches to the shoulder/arm/hand region if she seems open enough.

If her friendliness increases, ask her out. If that fails, go for the old stand-by...

"Wow. I love your skirt. It'd look great dangling from the ceiling fan in my bedroom."

That line's always worked on me, after all.

[Faulty]

Thank you for the advice. My problem is I normally just go to coffee with people so my only idea of what else we could do would come off date like (movies, etc.). I guess that's my one hole right now. :smallsigh: The rest of the suggestions I can manage.

[Morph Bark]

I am romantically interested. She seems like a shy person so I don't want to just be like HEY LETS GO OUT after our first time spending time together... Maybe I'm wrong?

My investigation as to this subject is still ongoing. I'll let you know when I publish my results.


That line's always worked on me, after all.

How often have you actually used it?


...oh ON you, not FOR you. Nevermind! :smalltongue:


EDIT:

Thank you for the advice. My problem is I normally just go to coffee with people so my only idea of what else we could do would come off date like (movies, etc.). I guess that's my one hole right now. :smallsigh: The rest of the suggestions I can manage.

Watch a movie together at home, or a series you both like? Done that a few times. Then stayed up late just talking. Eventually we didn't even see the anime episodes anymore.

Walking through parks or such is generally also pretty okay, only semi-date like (especially if you asked about seemingly as more of a spur-of-the-moment thing, unless it is a REALLY cool and/or pretty park), healthy (SNIFF THAT NATURE AIR) and free.

[Faulty]

Watch a movie together at home, or a series you both like? Done that a few times. Then stayed up late just talking. Eventually we didn't even see the anime episodes anymore.

Walking through parks or such is generally also pretty okay, only semi-date like (especially if you asked about seemingly as more of a spur-of-the-moment thing, unless it is a REALLY cool and/or pretty park), healthy (SNIFF THAT NATURE AIR) and free.

Okay, cool. Thank you for the advice guys.

[Adumbration]

Second response that I've gotten today, and this time fairly positive - perhaps I am doing something correctly with this OKCupid thing. The thing is, I don't really want you guys to coach me in my answers/responses - but I could use a general idea on what to expect. Is it supposed to be like a facebook chat? Or more like email? Short responses or long (of course this depends on topic etc., but in general)? Does response time matter?

[The Succubus]

Enjoy the conversation and let the response times take care of themselves. If it's a big question, such as thoughts and feelings towards each other, chew it over for a little bit so that you're clear in your head and heart about what you want.

[Adumbration]

I don't know, I wouldn't do that. People talk, and they also talk about who showed interest in them, and with facebook and the like you can't rely on the ZIP code rule to avoid looking bad.

I don't know, I wouldn't do that. People talk, and they also talk about who showed interest in them, and with facebook you can't rely on the ZIP code rule to avoid looking bad. Did you just out of the blue send that question, or is it part of a conversation? Do you know the person? How do you know about their interest in classic literature? It sounds like what you're saying is you just texted someone and suggested a book to them. Please correct me if that's not the case, I'm not trying to be presumptuous and I could easily have misunderstood, but if you were making suggestions a propos de nothing, that can make you come off as smug when you're really not.

Talking about literature with a lit nerd is a good call, but I would suggest you ask for a suggestion rather than suggesting. That's far more open ended and allows more than just a one or two word response. Still, of all the books to suggest to a romantic interest and you suggest a book about a guy falls in love with a mean girl and strings along a girl who really does like him and then finally can't choose between them? Oh yeah and then the girl who loves Lev runs back to the guy who beats her. And then he kills her. Not exactly a good sort of "I think you're really interesting and would like to get to know you" suggestion :smalleek:

This was in OkCupid, not facebook. Umm. If your advice still applies, I have absolutely no idea what the concept of "dating site" means. O.o

Also thanks for spoiling the book. I was about halfway through it.

[Coidzor]

Watch a movie together at home, or a series you both like? Done that a few times. Then stayed up late just talking. Eventually we didn't even see the anime episodes anymore.

Walking through parks or such is generally also pretty okay, only semi-date like (especially if you asked about seemingly as more of a spur-of-the-moment thing, unless it is a REALLY cool and/or pretty park), healthy (SNIFF THAT NATURE AIR) and free.

Plus, things being a little date-like without being too openly intimidating seems to me to be the kind of thing you want here given your intentions and interest, Faulty.

[Faulty]

Plus, things being a little date-like without being too openly intimidating seems to me to be the kind of thing you want here given your intentions and interest, Faulty.

Why did you bold my name? D:

[Rawhide]

Thank you for the advice. My problem is I normally just go to coffee with people

This is one of the best first date ideas. It's a relatively neutral and non-threatening environment where people can talk and get to know each other. Plus, there's plausable deniability if it doesn't go so well.


so my only idea of what else we could do would come off date like (movies, etc.). I guess that's my one hole right now. :smallsigh: The rest of the suggestions I can manage.

What's wrong with something more date like? Though I don't suggest a movie as a first date. You want something where you can actually talk.


Why did you bold my name? D:

My guess? Because he quoted Morph Bark, but was addressing you and wanted to make sure you read it.

[Coidzor]

Why did you bold my name? D:

Because I wasn't quoting you and wanted to make sure that the fact that I was addressing you was clear.

It's not that uncommon to do on the boards here. :smallconfused:

[Faulty]

I dunno. Seemed odd to me, haha.

ANYWAY, it went pretty well though she was really talkative on an I-didn't-get-to-talk-much level, but I want to spend more time with her and see where it goes.

[Morph Bark]

It's not that uncommon to do on the boards here. :smallconfused:

First time I've seen it in my four years.


ANYWAY, it went pretty well though she was really talkative on an I-didn't-get-to-talk-much level, but I want to spend more time with her and see where it goes.

Is being very talkative her usual MO? If not, go get 'r. :smalltongue:

[Faulty]

I have 0 clues. Like, none of them. I'm hoping she was nervous or trying to impress or something, so was unusually chatty.

[Morph Bark]

Whelp, after yesterday I sent a Whatsapp message to the girl of my affections asking if she felt like watching March of the Penguins (random idea, since it's on today), I got a reply today telling me she wants some space since she just doesn't know anymore.

This is neither really here nor there. I've had positive and negative results from such messages before, but if I had to judge from her prior behaviour towards me, I'm guessing this should be good.

Unless I somehow have a negative influence on her study results, then I'm ****ed.

[Rawhide]

Whelp, after yesterday I sent a Whatsapp message to the girl of my affections asking if she felt like watching March of the Penguins (random idea, since it's on today), I got a reply today telling me she wants some space since she just doesn't know anymore.

This is neither really here nor there. I've had positive and negative results from such messages before, but if I had to judge from her prior behaviour towards me, I'm guessing this should be good.

Unless I somehow have a negative influence on her study results, then I'm ****ed.

Yeah, no. That's pretty much a negative, especially in light of what you've said previously.

Give her that space, and assume she won't be coming back. She may decide to, but don't hold your breath.

[Morph Bark]

Yeah, no. That's pretty much a negative, especially in light of what you've said previously.

Give her that space, and assume she won't be coming back. She may decide to, but don't hold your breath.

What exactly did I previously say that you're referring to? :smallconfused:

Either way, I told her I'd give her the space she needs and if she wants to talk, she could reach me and I hope that for the rest she's alright.


EDIT: I'm just gonna go ahead and stay positive. Not because I'm sure her answer will be positive, but because giving her space will prettymuch mean the same thing as doing what I've done the past two weeks with regards to her, since I knew she'd be unavailable last week, plus right now I could handle a slow termination much better than a quick one. Frankly, I really need at least something to be positive about, after losing my education, my job and more, but that would be more something for the other Woe thread. Which, to be honest, I'd hate to go into.

This isn't so much about this thing as about the whole puzzle, which is a lot more complicated and weighing on me than I'm willing to share.

[Rawhide]

What exactly did I previously say that you're referring to? :smallconfused:

About how she has been avoiding contact for several weeks, how you kept trying to make contact in different ways, and how she now wants space because she "just doesn't know anymore".

[Morph Bark]

Erm, if so, could you point out where I said that? Because that's not true. O.o

[Rawhide]

Erm, if so, could you point out where I said that? Because that's not true. O.o

Here:

In my country we have a saying: "no news is good news."

This does not apply to relationships with people.

Not hearing from someone for two weeks kinda grates me. :|

And here:

If that is supposed to be a thing, I guess it's applicable moreso to your area than in general. My ex wasn't at all like that, for instance. With regards to this girl, I understand that's she's very busy (she's studying to become a dentist), but I like being in contact fairly regularly, however briefly. Texting doesn't seem to cut it for her, as she doesn't keep her phone with her most of the day as to not be disturbed during classes (they might not even be allowed in there, I forgot if she mentioned that).

Anyway, I decided to re-install WhatsApp on my smartphone, since she has her iPod with her more often than her Nokia phone and can apparently use WhatsApp on it. See if she replies to pokes on there.

Then here:


Whelp, after yesterday I sent a Whatsapp message to the girl of my affections asking if she felt like watching March of the Penguins (random idea, since it's on today), I got a reply today telling me she wants some space since she just doesn't know anymore.

This is neither really here nor there. I've had positive and negative results from such messages before, but if I had to judge from her prior behaviour towards me, I'm guessing this should be good.

Unless I somehow have a negative influence on her study results, then I'm ****ed.

[Morph Bark]

*shrug* To be fair, I didn't text her during those two weeks either. It's more like she's been very hard to reach ever since her school started again. If that was instead her avoiding me, we wouldn't have gone out several times since then.

[Coidzor]

I have 0 clues. Like, none of them. I'm hoping she was nervous or trying to impress or something, so was unusually chatty.

What'd she talk about? That can clue you in to what it was in a fair amount of cases.

[dehro]

asking if she felt like watching March of the Penguins (random idea, since it's on today), I got a reply today telling me she wants some space since she just doesn't know anymore.
I didn't know penguins could affect a person like that :smallbiggrin:

on a more serious note.. it doesn't sound good. I share Rawhide's view..I've never heard a girl say she needs time/space apart and it turn out good for the guy/them as a couple.

[Faulty]

What'd she talk about? That can clue you in to what it was in a fair amount of cases.

Her family, school, Shakespeare, our mutual trans*-ness and various other things. Nothing I didn't also talk about, though I didn't have as much space in the conversation.

[Mauve Shirt]

Go to Mod party. Stay out til 3 AM.
Mom: "Were there any single young men at this party?"
Me: "No Mom, there were not."
Mom "Then I can not condone it as an activity that keeps you out until 3 AM."

Trust me Mom, been there done that.

[dehro]

Go to Mod party. Stay out til 3 AM.
Mom: "Were there any single young men at this party?"
Me: "No Mom, there were not."
Mom "Then I can not condone it as an activity that keeps you out until 3 AM."

Trust me Mom, been there done that.

this is funny when you've just watched an episode of The Nanny

[Coidzor]

Her family, school, Shakespeare, our mutual trans*-ness and various other things. Nothing I didn't also talk about, though I didn't have as much space in the conversation.

Well, I hope she managed to work her way in there aside from her trans status. Not the best judge, personally, of whether that meant she was sticking to "safe" topics or not given my lack of context for your previous interaction and the culture of the area you're in and the place that you were for this discussion.


Go to Mod party. Stay out til 3 AM.
Mom: "Were there any single young men at this party?"
Me: "No Mom, there were not."
Mom "Then I can not condone it as an activity that keeps you out until 3 AM."

Trust me Mom, been there done that.

I second this motion, though I must admit, I'd somehow gotten the incorrect notion that you were engaged. :smalleek:

[Sholos]

Go to Mod party. Stay out til 3 AM.
Mom: "Were there any single young men at this party?"
Me: "No Mom, there were not."
Mom "Then I can not condone it as an activity that keeps you out until 3 AM."

Trust me Mom, been there done that.

I've lost track on the number of times I've been out late to parties with no single/interested girls in sight.

[Jack Squat]

Alright, I'm looking for a bit of advice.

My girlfriend has been really stressed these past couple weeks because of her job (she's always on call). I do what I can to help relieve it outside of work (cook meals, try to plan fun things, etc.) but for the past bit, she's been entirely zapped of energy and all that fun stuff that comes with stress and working oodles of overtime. As a result, I think we're growing apart a bit (or at the least, she's a fair bit less passionate - which is understandable because of the whole no energy thing)

What can I do, outside of suggesting a career change, that can help this? I guess I'm looking for good stress relief techniques as well as things that can "rekindle" a relationship, if you will.

[Aedilred]

What can I do, outside of suggesting a career change, that can help this? I guess I'm looking for good stress relief techniques as well as things that can "rekindle" a relationship, if you will.
A holiday? I think that's pretty much the best thing for her sake, as well as for the relationship.

[Mauve Shirt]

Only over the past couple weeks? Don't worry about it, she's just stressed and worn out. The best advice would be to not plan activities until you're sure she doesn't just want to fall asleep on the couch. Be affectionate and she will appreciate it.

[Jack Squat]

A holiday? I think that's pretty much the best thing for her sake, as well as for the relationship.

There's a 5 day trip planned in January. She can't get off work before then - short staffed as it is. Honestly, I think that if she was actually off call on the days that she's supposed to be, it'd help a lot.


Only over the past couple weeks? Don't worry about it, she's just stressed and worn out. The best advice would be to not plan activities until you're sure she doesn't just want to fall asleep on the couch. Be affectionate and she will appreciate it.

Well, about 6, but yeah. Noted on the planning, we're just generally both fairly active people, so it seemed like a good idea to go to the mountains, a bar, or game to "get away" from work life for a bit.

[Faulty]

Well, I hope she managed to work her way in there aside from her trans status. Not the best judge, personally, of whether that meant she was sticking to "safe" topics or not given my lack of context for your previous interaction and the culture of the area you're in and the place that you were for this discussion.

I really dunno how I'd read that situation other than she talked a lot, and there may have been a reason for it? Hopefully. I like her.

[Feytalist]

I really dunno how I'd read that situation other than she talked a lot, and there may have been a reason for it? Hopefully. I like her.

Talking a lot is a good sign, I'd think. It means that she wanted to talk with you (or at you, but that's also okay, probably).

I actually like it when the other person does all the talking. You can then do the listening intelligently thing and not have to worry about what to say other than "still interested" noises. And when you look interested, the other person feels interesting. And that's good in a budding relationship. But I'm a quiet sort of guy, maybe that's just me.

[Imbasel]

So I have had recent and not so recent girl troubles. This past summer I broke up with my girlfriend that I had been dating for a year and a half. She had moved to another state over 500 miles away and she was still in high school whereas I am in college.

Over time the distance proved to be difficult and she had thought about breaking up with me a couple of times when things got tough. Eventually I broke up with her because the financial constraints grew too much for me to bear. I was the only one flying and until she finishes high school it will continue to be that way, until perhaps this summer upcoming her mom might let her come out. Her parents did give me some money to help but for me it was just too much. However, I still care about her love her even and I don't care about the distance I just want to be with her breaking up with her was a mistake I feel. We haven't talked since we broke up but I'm wondering should I break the silence and tell her how I feel? We broke up in July for reference.

The second girl is the one that I'm dating. I told her from the start I was getting over a relationship. We dated since near the end of August She had sex with me fairly early on and we were both virgins. However, she has since micro-planned our life out and wants us to go to the same college or ones that are close together besides other things. I do love her and care about her, but its creepy and I feel like I don't have a choice. I've talked to her about it and how I don't like it and she still does.

So what should I do should I tell the first girl how I feel? When I was with the first girl I felt far happier and when I was with her nothing could ever get me down.

[Thajocoth]

So I have had recent and not so recent girl troubles. This past summer I broke up with my girlfriend that I had been dating for a year and a half. She had moved to another state over 500 miles away and she was still in high school whereas I am in college.

Over time the distance proved to be difficult and she had thought about breaking up with me a couple of times when things got tough. Eventually I broke up with her because the financial constraints grew too much for me to bear. I was the only one flying and until she finishes high school it will continue to be that way, until perhaps this summer upcoming her mom might let her come out. Her parents did give me some money to help but for me it was just too much. However, I still care about her love her even and I don't care about the distance I just want to be with her breaking up with her was a mistake I feel. We haven't talked since we broke up but I'm wondering should I break the silence and tell her how I feel? We broke up in July for reference.

The second girl is the one that I'm dating. I told her from the start I was getting over a relationship. We dated since near the end of August She had sex with me fairly early on and we were both virgins. However, she has since micro-planned our life out and wants us to go to the same college or ones that are close together besides other things. I do love her and care about her, but its creepy and I feel like I don't have a choice. I've talked to her about it and how I don't like it and she still does.

So what should I do should I tell the first girl how I feel? When I was with the first girl I felt far happier and when I was with her nothing could ever get me down.

With the first girl: LDRs are very difficult. They usually don't work out... But they can. She made you happier. That's a good thing. Financial constraints can be difficult, certainly. Skype can help a lot.

Second girl: When people lose their V, things will often change a bit. It is not uncommon for this to result in an over-attachment or planning too far into the future. Your description of this relationship makes me want to link a picture of "Overly Attached Girlfriend".

At the same time, going to colleges near one another would help prevent the problems you had with the first girl.

The important thing is though, she isn't making you happy. That's important. If you stick with her, you are likely to resent her later. Your negative feelings towards her won't be her fault, she means well, but you'll keep thinking back to the first girl. The one that makes you happy.

Cheesy romantic movie line: "Follow your heart."

[dehro]

some people like to be micromanaged..everything you say, and what little I know about you, makes me think you don't. you told this new girl that you don't care for it..
she didn't/doesn't listen.
that's a serious thing.
if she doesn't listen this early on in your relationship and insists on behaviour that you don't care for..who's to tell what she will make you swallow later on?
so..the second girl..either you find a way to change her attitude and teach her to listen, or you should seriously reconsider making long term plans with her. also, it seems to me you are at an age when long term plans should only be undertaken about things and with people you're 100% certain about.. the fact that she seems to be planning your entire life already either tells me she's inexperienced relationship-wise and thinks that's how you're supposed to behave, or that she's in a different place in the relationship than you are.
either way.. this deserves serious consideration, serious talks and may be an indication that no matter how much fun/how comfortable she may be to be with..maybe you're not right for one another.

as for the previous girl.. I remember you writing about it back when the long distance thing first became an issue.. if you're still thinking about her even throughout dating with the new girl.. maybe it means something.
then again..maybe not.
long distance is difficult always, despite skype...especially when you're both at an age where you can't throw a stone without hitting an alternative

[Faulty]

Talking a lot is a good sign, I'd think. It means that she wanted to talk with you (or at you, but that's also okay, probably).

I actually like it when the other person does all the talking. You can then do the listening intelligently thing and not have to worry about what to say other than "still interested" noises. And when you look interested, the other person feels interesting. And that's good in a budding relationship. But I'm a quiet sort of guy, maybe that's just me.

Yeah. She certainly seemed to enjoy talking to me. Haha. So hopefully it goes well in the future.

[Sholos]

Yeah. She certainly seemed to enjoy talking to me. Haha. So hopefully it goes well in the future.

Though talking a lot could just mean she sees you as a friend. That's what seems to keep happening to me, anyways.

[Heliomance]

Though talking a lot could just mean she sees you as a friend. That's what seems to keep happening to me, anyways.

Bah. All of the relationships that I've been in that I would be willing to go back into if the opportunity arose, started with several hours of solid chatting.

[Chen]

Though talking a lot could just mean she sees you as a friend. That's what seems to keep happening to me, anyways.

And this is why I said earlier to make your intentions clear. And this involves being honest with yourself. Do you really want this person as a friend? Or do you want a romantic relationship. Looking back, there were times where I had certainly done the whole "become friends with intentions of it becoming something more" when in reality I didn't want the "just friends" part. In which case you're just causing yourself problems by confounding friendship with a romantic relationship.

This is not to say romance cannot come from a friendship first. It can. But if the intent is romantic FIRST you want to make sure the friendship part isn't just a means to an end. If it is, you are FAR better off just stating your romantic intentions to begin with and let things fall as they may.

[DJ Yung Crunk]

Moved this from the LGBT thread. I would have posted it here but I honestly didn't even notice you guys. Mea culpa, indeed. Anyway.


Hey guys, would it be totally weird of me to take out the son of an ex? I'll probably just do it anyway regardless of the response but I want to get a consensus on this so I know whether or not to grandstand and feel persecuted.

and...


So what's the protocol here? Just stay away from family gatherings or what? I was gonna wing it but I figure I'm this far, a second opinion can't hurt.

[Serpentine]

Crossing my response over, too:
Like I said, it depends on a lot of details. For starters, how was and is your relationship with your ex? How and why did it end? Are you on good terms? How long did the relationship last, and how long ago did it end? What sort of relationship does the son have with them? etc etc etc...

[DJ Yung Crunk]

Crossing my response over, too:
Like I said, it depends on a lot of details. For starters, how was and is your relationship with your ex? How and why did it end? Are you on good terms? How long did the relationship last, and how long ago did it end? What sort of relationship does the son have with them? etc etc etc...

In order: Decent at the start, I suppose. I don't have a whole lot to compare it to. It was one of my longer relationships, if not the longest. It ended because we realized that (towards the end at least) we didn't like each other as much as we thought and we were staying together out of habit. The nail in the coffin, though, was when he threw a ceramic rooster at me during a fight. He apologized for that but it's still not cool. This month is November? I'd say it ended a good six months ago. It was definitely before my birthday which is in June so there's that. Honestly I have no idea what their relationship is like. I only saw the son in passing while I was going out with his dad, mostly small talk. Didn't have enough time to get a handle on their relationship.

[Serpentine]

For completeness' sake, how long did it last, approximately?

[DJ Yung Crunk]

For completeness' sake, how long did it last, approximately?

I am totally winging it here. Just under a year. Between a year and nine months. If it was a year or more I will be gobsmacked.

EDIT: Holy crap! I do say "totally" a lot!

[Serpentine]

Totes :smallwink:

Hm... It's hard to say whether 6 months is enough at the best of times. I'm not going to discourage you from going ahead with it, but I urge a great deal of tact and sensitivity. Unless you receive very strong indications that your ex really is fine with it, I'd keep it out of their view as much as possible. If you do receive those indications, still be tactful, and be conscious of the possibility that their okayness may change.

[DJ Yung Crunk]

Totes :smallwink:

Hm... It's hard to say whether 6 months is enough at the best of times. I'm not going to discourage you from going ahead with it, but I urge a great deal of tact and sensitivity. Unless you receive very strong indications that your ex really is fine with it, I'd keep it out of their view as much as possible. If you do receive those indications, still be tactful, and be conscious of the possibility that their okayness may change.

That was possibly the best answer I could have hoped for. I may use you for future relationship woes.

Imagine my luck, though. Two generations playing the same team?

[Serpentine]

Should probably check my personal experience before taking me on full-time :smallwink:

And for heterosexuality at least, it's a pretty common occurrence :smalltongue:

[DJ Yung Crunk]

Should probably check my personal experience before taking me on full-time :smallwink:

And for heterosexuality at least, it's a pretty common occurrence :smalltongue:

That sounds an awful lot like work. Can't you just praise yourself, put it in quotes and claim it's from the New York Times?

Oh I bet you think you're pretty clever. Even so, both on this particular side, I can't overstate how awesome that is. I don't know what I did to deserve such tremendous luck. I'm a pretty terrible person. But I'll take it where I can get it. Thank you, distributors of luck!

[Serpentine]

"She's bangin' at bangin'."

- J. Depp

[DJ Yung Crunk]

"She's bangin' at bangin'."

- J. Depp

Yeah, I got nothing. I usually don't when people quote Johnny Depp at me. It's my Achilles heel. Also saying "totally" a lot.

[Morph Bark]

"She's bangin' at bangin'."

- J. Depp

I'm laughing so hard at this.

Wish I could set the thread to be a humourous-response magnet. :smallbiggrin:

[Serpentine]

Speaking of which, I just got my first-ever OKCupid ask-out :smallredface:
...two days before I leave the area :smallsigh:

[Morph Bark]

Do you got time? Are they cute? If so, no harm in having a good time until you leave the area, right? :smalltongue:

[rogueboy]

Speaking of which, I just got my first-ever OKCupid ask-out :smallredface:
...two days before I leave the area :smallsigh:

Yay/boo! That actually sounds really similar to the only useful exchange I've had on OKC - asked her out, then ran into one of us being out of town more than half of the next month, while she was looking for a job, until she actually got a job a few hours away before we actually managed to go out. :smallsigh:

And now, I've gotten 0 'hits' from OKC in the last month or more... and can't decide if that's a good thing, considering I'm trying to finish up my MS in the next 6 months before moving across the country (to an area whose population isn't >50% college students like it is here). Free time isn't exactly a common occurrence for me right now...

[Serpentine]

Do you got time? Are they cute? If so, no harm in having a good time until you leave the area, right? :smalltongue:I did, barely, but apparently he has night shifts and it makes him poor company during the day or something. Looks like it ain't happening.
I can't decide whether he's cute... I don't think he's bad looking by anyone's standards, but I can'd decide whether he's cute by my standards - I generally likes 'em prettier :smallwink: But eh, he's not bad, and if I started fancying him he'd become more attractive to me.
I would but, alas, 'tain't to be.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

If you don't have free time and you're moving soon, I'd say it's a good thing. Wouldn't it be terrible if you found the love of your life and then moved across the country a few weeks later?

The only relationship I managed to forge through OKC end after a few dates because she moved about 3 hours away and went to seminary, so got insanely busy. That ended up working out for me because I'm now in a VERY good relationship with a girl I met IRL instead of on a dating website...and she likes me BECAUSE of my nerdliness.

She's a legend of zelda fangirl for crying out loud. I have me a keeper. :3

[Serpentine]

And at the other end of the spectrum...

"wanna mak lov to u.."

That's hot, thanks 9.9

[TheWombatOfDoom]

And at the other end of the spectrum...

"wanna mak lov to u.."

That's hot, thanks 9.9

O.o ? :smallconfused:

[The Succubus]

And at the other end of the spectrum...

"wanna mak lov to u.."

That's hot, thanks 9.9

It's as if Shakespeare himself arose from the grave....and had left his brain six feet under. :smallyuk:

[LordShotGun]

Help me random people of the internet! I don't know how vague I have to be on here so it is spoilered and possibly removed later. According to the rules perhaps I should ask for PMs?

Keep going! Not yet! Almost there!I am 22 and something of a sexual nature between myself and my 44 year old roommate occurred last night. Alcohol was involved.

Problem is her "boyfriend" (26 years old and she only keeps him for "relief") walked in on us and broke up with her. Now I don't know what to do. I don't really want to be in a relationship with her but I feel bad for sabotaging her purely sexual relationship. Another problem is we both work at the same place (which is how we became roommates) and she doesn't want anyone to know what happened last night. Word will probably get out anyway since her former boytoy knows other people at our workplace although he doesn't work there.

[The Succubus]

Not going to lie, you've got some pretty choppy water ahead of you. That said, it's easier to deal with this sort of stuff if you break it down into bits:

1) Your female room-mate. What were your feelings towards her a month ago and what were your feelings about her last night?

2) Do you want to be in a relationship with her? I'm guessing "no" from what you've said. If you talk completely and openly with her about this (and this might be easier than you think because I'm certain she wants to talk to you about what happened) then the rest of this becomes a lot easier to deal with.

3) Be direct about this. Seriously. If you talk to her with allusions it's going to make things even more awkward and complicated. Something along the lines of "While I like you as a friend, last night was a mistake and I do not want to repeat it, given how awkward it has made things for all of us. I hope you understand."

4) Once you've smoothed things over with your room-mate (and the sooner you do this the easier it will be), you need to ask her about her "friend with benefits" (I dislike the term "boytoy" immensly). Again, this is just a guess but give her a chance to speak with him first before you do because he's going to be very annoyed with you. I would say avoid him for the moment if possible, at least until your lady friend has done this.

5) The only thing scientifically proven to travel faster than light is workplace gossip, especially if it involves a love triangle. If your colleagues don't know now, within the next day or two they probably will. It all depends on the 26-year old. If he's feeling angry, he's probably let the cat out of the bag.

6) It will be a lot easier to deal with your workmates if you've spoken to your room-mate and cleared things up between you. Once you're clear about what's going to happen between you two, you can just repeat that until your colleagues get bored. If they keep poking your for sordid details, do your best to ignore them or tell them to get lost.

7) The key thing to remember is this: what happened was between you and your room-mate. That's the relationship you need to fix right now. Work on that.

[LordShotGun]

Not going to lie, you've got some pretty choppy water ahead of you. That said, it's easier to deal with this sort of stuff if you break it down into bits:

1) Your female room-mate. What were your feelings towards her a month ago and what were your feelings about her last night?

No different. I don't think any differently about her

2) Do you want to be in a relationship with her? I'm guessing "no" from what you've said. If you talk completely and openly with her about this (and this might be easier than you think because I'm certain she wants to talk to you about what happened) then the rest of this becomes a lot easier to deal with.

I believe I did say something like this last night (that it was a one time thing) but it could always use repeating

3) Be direct about this. Seriously. If you talk to her with allusions it's going to make things even more awkward and complicated. Something along the lines of "While I like you as a friend, last night was a mistake and I do not want to repeat it, given how awkward it has made things for all of us. I hope you understand."

She is still sleeping off the booze so I guess im waiting now

4) Once you've smoothed things over with your room-mate (and the sooner you do this the easier it will be), you need to ask her about her "friend with benefits" (I dislike the term "boytoy" immensly). Again, this is just a guess but give her a chance to speak with him first before you do because he's going to be very annoyed with you. I would say avoid him for the moment if possible, at least until your lady friend has done this.

They already did and the broke up. Although she was considering doing that anyway but she still took it really hard

5) The only thing scientifically proven to travel faster than light is workplace gossip, especially if it involves a love triangle. If your colleagues don't know now, within the next day or two they probably will. It all depends on the 26-year old. If he's feeling angry, he's probably let the cat out of the bag.

Really I am not too worried about workplace gossip about me. But I know it would make her uncomfortable. Don't know what I can do about this if anything.

6) It will be a lot easier to deal with your workmates if you've spoken to your room-mate and cleared things up between you. Once you're clear about what's going to happen between you two, you can just repeat that until your colleagues get bored. If they keep poking your for sordid details, do your best to ignore them or tell them to get lost.

I suppose I will have to wait and see how she wants to deal with this but sound advice none the less.

7) The key thing to remember is this: what happened was between you and your room-mate. That's the relationship you need to fix right now. Work on that.

That's the problem. I don't know how things are between us now. Personally I am fine with calling it a mistake and moving on (I think I am a bit of a sociopath since I don't seem to be affected by negative emotions that much or perhaps I just have good emotional heath (according to this artical I just googled http://www.helpguide.org/mental/mental_emotional_health.htm. I mean I feel a little bad right now and obviously I feel I need to talk about it but more so that I feel bad that I may have hurt her not so much that I have hurt myself. I KNOW I will be fine, I can't say the same for her.



Sound advice and my responses in bold.

Perhaps a little background info could help? I am a 22 year old male, 6'1, 230 pounds, heavily muscled (I lost about 60 pounds of fat and gain lots of muscle over a year thanks to a very physical job I have). I am just about to graduate college with 3 two year degrees (Associates in arts, computer networking, and computer programming). I work as a cart pusher at walmart. Not a glamorous job but I get to talk to tons of interesting people (one 92 year old man who was a medic in the D-Day invasion) and it pays my bills with a few hundred left over each month.

I was kicked out of the house twice, once by my mother when she remarried, and again by my dad when he remarried. So I meet my now roommate who is a customer service manager at walmart and she mentioned she had a spare bedroom. So now I pay the electric and cable bill and she takes care of everything else (the house is paid for so no rent). Everything was going fine for about 3 months and now this happens.

[dehro]

I suggest you wait and see what happens. she might shrug it off, she might have forgotten all about it, she might have been looking for a pretext to break up with her boytoy, she might blame you and it may or may not have any consequence on your living arrangements.
you'll have to be patient and wait to see how and if she reacts at all.. if nothing at all happens and it is all brushed under the carpet.. make of it what you will...you could just learn the lesson and move on..
at worst it will become an issue and there will be consequences, but until she's made up her mind on how to proceed from there, there's little you can do to "make it better".
you both blundered, she more so than you.. but she's holding the best cards in her hand, on account of you depending on her for a place to stay... this levels the field..or tilts it in her favour. but until she speaks her mind, you shouldn't beat yourself over the head over this.

[The Succubus]

Have a think on this for a while. As you said, things were going pretty well for the two of you for three months. It's a pretty long time and if there were going to be any personality clashes between the two of you they'd have flared up by now, especially if its just the two of you living alone. She also offered the spare room to you, which means that she likes you in some form or another and that's the bit we need to be clear on.

Think back over these past three months. Has she done anything flirty with you at all, or given you any reason to suspect she might like you as more than a friend? The next time the two of you have one beer too many, do you think this will happen again?

It sounds like you might not need to talk to her but instead listen to what she has to say and really chew it over. Don't be in a rush to do this bit though. Although your conscience is screaming at you to do this the nano-second she's capable of speaking, it'll be far more productive if you do it tomorrow evening. Maybe sit down on the sofa together with a cup of coffee each as it'll help with the awkward pauses (of which there may be one or two).

Good luck Shotty.

[LordShotGun]

Have a think on this for a while. As you said, things were going pretty well for the two of you for three months. It's a pretty long time and if there were going to be any personality clashes between the two of you they'd have flared up by now, especially if its just the two of you living alone. She also offered the spare room to you, which means that she likes you in some form or another and that's the bit we need to be clear on.

Think back over these past three months. Has she done anything flirty with you at all, or given you any reason to suspect she might like you as more than a friend? The next time the two of you have one beer too many, do you think this will happen again?

It sounds like you might not need to talk to her but instead listen to what she has to say and really chew it over. Don't be in a rush to do this bit though. Although your conscience is screaming at you to do this the nano-second she's capable of speaking, it'll be far more productive if you do it tomorrow evening. Maybe sit down on the sofa together with a cup of coffee each as it'll help with the awkward pauses (of which there may be one or two).

Good luck Shotty.

Sad thing is my conscience is NOT screaming at me and that makes me sad. I expected to be feeling...something. Not just apathy. I am not worried about my living situation, as I am her only access to a vehicle and she was having cash problems that I managed to stabilize for her. She doesn't have any kids, thankfully, so no problems there.

As for the past three months...yeah she has been really flirty. I didn't think much of it, but considering just the SHEAR AMOUNT OF CRAP (I mean, the dang house was falling apart) I have fixed for her, perhaps she was feeling thankful? I guess the whole waking up to her sleeping naked on the couch would have been a good hint. Also, I guess I am the first person in years that can keep up with her mentally. She was so used to talking with stupid/ignorant/uneducated (take your pick) people that when I came along, she always wants to talk to me.

[The Succubus]

Some final words and a general bit of advice.

One of my favourite TV shows is Babylon 5. There's a character in it by the name of Mr Morden and he works for some extremely powerful people. In his debut appearence, he walks around the station chatting to the various ambassadors but in the end his questions and goals boil down to one simple phrase:

"What do you want?"

It's a question that more folks should ask themselves and know the answer to. Once you know what you want in your heart of hearts, you can become a force to be reckoned with when you go after it.

[LordShotGun]

Some final words and a general bit of advice.

One of my favourite TV shows is Babylon 5. There's a character in it by the name of Mr Morden and he works for some extremely powerful people. In his debut appearence, he walks around the station chatting to the various ambassadors but in the end his questions and goals boil down to one simple phrase:

"What do you want?"

It's a question that more folks should ask themselves and know the answer to. Once you know what you want in your heart of hearts, you can become a force to be reckoned with when you go after it.

Unimportant blathering.

Easy enough. I came to terms with my lack of ambition long ago. I want a physically active job (since I am a lazy man that needs forced activity or I will get fat again) that may or may not be a full 40 hour work week that allows me to have enough money to save some to travel occasionally.

I don't want to cure cancer, or discover a new metal, or solve the energy crisis. I just want a normal boring life in which there is always internet access.

Thus my focus is to go work for comcast/xfinity/whatevercablecompany as an installation tech. It will keep me active, allow me to work with electronics and people, and give me free high speed internet.

As for what I want with her...I really did enjoy myself last night and she is an intelligent women but the age gap will be hard to bridge and I may not even want to bridge it. I suppose we shall see.

[Heliomance]

I've stalled out on OKC. I've hit the problem that every girl it reckons would be a reasonable match with me I've already either messaged already or looked at and decided I'm not interested.

[LordShotGun]

Just in case anyone cares, I took all your advice and just talked with my roommate and everything is now fine.

[Lord Loss]

I always find that, as a rule, the people I'm attracted to are invariably the ones who don't like me. Plenty of people like me, it's just never the ones that I'm into. Anyone else feel like that?

@Heliomance Consider switching to a different online dating site? I've never had any experience with them (I'm a minor), so I couldn't tell you which ones are any good, but there are plenty lots of other decent ones out there.

@LordShotgun Good to see you worked things out.

[Marillion]

So I just found out my ex sent a facebook message a month ago to S, the girl I've had a longstanding crush on, trying to get her to go out with me. And I wondered why she hadn't been talking to me as much lately. :smallfurious:

And in other news, I managed to properly introduce myself and ask to coffee a girl I'd been looking at for a couple weeks. She had to decline, as she's stage manager of a play the university is doing currently and it was a big night for them. I don't know if she's saying "I'd like to but can't" or if she's saying "I'm politely rejecting your advance", but either way, I'm glad I did it. Turns out, it's not so hard. :smallcool:

[Verte]

So, I've never posted in these threads before, I usually only post sporadically, and I don't really have any woes at the moment, but I still feel I could use some advice, or at least a chance to get some minor stuff off my chest. Also, spoilered for length and rambling.

There have been a few issues that have been on my mind lately. First of all, a few months ago I stopped seeing a guy who I had been practically dating on and off for about a year or so. That has left me left me feeling like I'm not ready for a proper relationship right now or until I suss out other personal issues, but I'm not sure - I mean, if someone great comes along, maybe I should give it a go. Second of all, I also feel like I don't have any friends. I have a good relationship with my family, fortunately, but I don't feel like I have anyone who I can get in touch with to talk or hang out with or whatever where there isn't that odd family dynamic. Third, I think I'm kind of bad at reading what people think of me unless they actually tell me straight out.

Anyway, there are a couple of guys in this class I'm taking, who I'll call A and B. I've talked to A a few times outside of class, and well, he seems like someone who I would like to be friends with. Problem is, the semester's ending soon, and I have no way to stay in touch with A at this point. Would it seem weird to just say that I'd like to stay in touch and exchange contact info?

With B, I have a hard time reading what he thinks of me - it seems like he's flirtatious with me some of the time, but we've only had one real conversation outside of class. Sure, we seem to get along well enough in class, but I feel like if he were actually interested in me, he would try to talk to me when he has the chance. We sit close together in class - he actually moved from across the room to a chair a few feet over from mine - but, he doesn't make an effort to talk to me during class breaks (this class is several hours long). The thing is, is that I do like him and I think he's attractive, but there are some things about him that rub me the wrong way. I'm also concerned that maybe I'm looking for interest when it isn't there just to feel better about myself. I don't have any of B's contact info, so I would actually have to talk about staying in touch in order to do so, which I'm worried might be taken in a weird way. Also, I think that I'd want to be friends with B, too, but I'm not sure about any dating for a few more months. However, I'm also worried that I'll regret not doing something, since I can't count on being in another class with this guy, and since I've regretted not taking action with people I like in the past.

[Serpentine]

Alright, first of all, how old are you, and are you in high school/your country's equivalent? (I just need the context)

Secondly, asking someone for some means of contacting them is totally fine. You can also offer them yours so it's their decision, but that's really six to one half dozen to the other; the ideal would probably be both. Nowadays the easiest way is just to look them up on Facebook if you have one.

Thirdly, the impression I get is that you're not actually really all that into B. Enjoying some flirting and attention is fine; you don't need to intend to get into a relationship in order to enjoy it. I'd personally go with looking at developing a friendship with both these guys before considering dating, and working out how you actually feel about them. Remember, you don't need to be dating; you only do it if you want to. And sometimes a friendship just requires one of you to step up and make it happen. You might like to consider inviting both of them to some sort of outing or activity, as friends.

[Coidzor]

Some final words and a general bit of advice.

One of my favourite TV shows is Babylon 5. There's a character in it by the name of Mr Morden and he works for some extremely powerful people. In his debut appearence, he walks around the station chatting to the various ambassadors but in the end his questions and goals boil down to one simple phrase:

"What do you want?"

It's a question that more folks should ask themselves and know the answer to. Once you know what you want in your heart of hearts, you can become a force to be reckoned with when you go after it.

It's sad, but I swore to myself that I'd never be the stupid besotted fool who lets himself become the captive of one woman.

And yet here I am.

My roommates even brought up that I'd started saying her name in my bloody sleep again.

FML. So hard. So very, very hard. :smallamused:

Edit: I mean, it wouldn't be so bad, but I just found out I'm seriously got a problem with sleeptalking. Sleep talking. :smallsigh: Next thing I know I'll start sleep walking.

And to think, I'd thought I'd moved on. But no, just moved to sleep-talking about it. Blargh!

[Sholos]

I learned something about myself recently. I apparently am completely incapable of interacting with single girls without them thinking I'm flirting with them, or hitting on them, or some sort of reaction like that. Also, none of them like it. Also, I am completely incapable of continuing contact with a single girl for more than a little bit before she (apparently) decides I'm not worth the time and will stop talking to me. The best part is that I don't know how to fix it because as far as I'm concerned I'm being friendly the entire time. Apparently I am very, very bad at being a friend and very good at being the creepy guy. :smallsigh::smallfrown:

[dehro]

It's sad, but I swore to myself that I'd never be the stupid besotted fool who lets himself become the captive of one woman.

And yet here I am.

My roommates even brought up that I'd started saying her name in my bloody sleep again.

FML. So hard. So very, very hard. :smallamused:

Edit: I mean, it wouldn't be so bad, but I just found out I'm seriously got a problem with sleeptalking. Sleep talking. :smallsigh: Next thing I know I'll start sleep walking.

And to think, I'd thought I'd moved on. But no, just moved to sleep-talking about it. Blargh!
my sister sleep-talks occasionally. as a kid she once started to get dressed at 3 am, telling us she had to go buy salami.
we had a right laugh about that..
also, for a while, every couple of days we'd make up stuff she'd been alledgedly talking about.
we stopped that little game when she started to get just a little freaked out..

[The Succubus]

It's sad, but I swore to myself that I'd never be the stupid besotted fool who lets himself become the captive of one woman.

And yet here I am.

My roommates even brought up that I'd started saying her name in my bloody sleep again.

FML. So hard. So very, very hard. :smallamused:

Edit: I mean, it wouldn't be so bad, but I just found out I'm seriously got a problem with sleeptalking. Sleep talking. :smallsigh: Next thing I know I'll start sleep walking.

And to think, I'd thought I'd moved on. But no, just moved to sleep-talking about it. Blargh!

Bleh, I hear you Coid. My ex has been running through my mind lately as well. Part of me wants to get in touch with her again and try and rekindle a friendship. The smarter part of me knows that it'd be incredibly awkward and I'd only feel bad every time she mentions her new lover. Oy. =/

On the plus side, at least you're not sleep-humping, because that would be really bad.

[snoopy13a]

I learned something about myself recently. I apparently am completely incapable of interacting with single girls without them thinking I'm flirting with them, or hitting on them, or some sort of reaction like that. Also, none of them like it. Also, I am completely incapable of continuing contact with a single girl for more than a little bit before she (apparently) decides I'm not worth the time and will stop talking to me. The best part is that I don't know how to fix it because as far as I'm concerned I'm being friendly the entire time. Apparently I am very, very bad at being a friend and very good at being the creepy guy. :smallsigh::smallfrown:

You're probably coming on too strong. Plus, they probably think you're trying to date them. Especially if you're asking them to coffee, a dinner, or a movie because those are the same strategies that people use who are trying to date people. When I ask someone out, I ask her if she wants to get coffee or go to dinner. I don't mention that I see her as a potential romantic partner because that's implied.

Why do you want to go out of your way to make platonic female friends anyway? I've found that one makes platonic female friends with people that you share interests and activities with and these friendships grow organically over time. They aren't really something that you set goals for nor expand extraordinary effort for. Rather, they simply evolve by being yourself and interacting with people that you see on a regular basis.

[Coidzor]

Bleh, I hear you Coid. My ex has been running through my mind lately as well. Part of me wants to get in touch with her again and try and rekindle a friendship. The smarter part of me knows that it'd be incredibly awkward and I'd only feel bad every time she mentions her new lover. Oy. =/

It's a friend of mine and we talk maybe once every two months beyond a short snippet of text messaging now and then. Hardly thought that I dwelled upon her except when I was given actual cause to be reminded of her like anyone else that I know. My friends are rather given to hyperbole when it comes to the torch I've been trying to get rid of, but I wasn't really paying them much mind until they brought up how I'd been moaning her name in my sleep. One of them even had somehow gotten the idea that I'd never met her in person just because we moved away from one another. :smallconfused: The way they tell it I'm wasting away pining after a girl who is on the other side of the country and engaged to another woman who I'm actually rather fond of despite the fact that I've actually been working on my love-life despite the way I was raised assuming a certain level of ...affluence on the part of the male that I simply could not sustain at present.

Was rather helpful in getting me past my ex-fiance though, I must admit, so part of that lingering niggling might have just transferred over to her as a side effect of that switch of gears, I suppose. I'm of two minds about that potential plot point.


On the plus side, at least you're not sleep-humping, because that would be really bad.

Well, I don't share a bed with anyone at the moment, so it'd be a bit irrelevant anyway.

Also, apparently sleep-talking about Queen Elizabeth. :smallconfused: So maybe I'm overreacting and I should be in personal woes and advice bemoaning the fact that I sleep-talk and have that terrible, terrible vulnerability to exploitation that such entails. Really rather uncomfortable with that. I suppose I should be googling how to kick the habit rather than bellyaching about it here though.


Speaking of bellyaching... Two more of those while I've on a computer and the inclination to air my embarrassment to you all. So, you may recall that I had something end rather poorly in the not too distant past! The one woman I had a paramour thing going on with and who then flipped out on me started texting me again late at night. :smallsigh:

Thankfully she seems to have scarpered after I called her on the 180 from saying that sleeping with me again would make her a slut to saying she loves me.

I'm not adverse to a purely physical relationship even if it's not really what I want out of life, but disrespect and mood swings are not a good way to keep physical attraction going.

In other news, I started talking to an old high school friend again and then flirting with her a little bit after we seemed to be hitting it off rather well. Asked her to a game night with some of my other friends to introduce her to this great game called Cards Against Humanity and the first time everyone bailed and she allegedly got press-ganged into christmas tree shopping with her family and forgot her phone in her bedroom so that she couldn't even inform me of such.

I was a bit skeptical but I figured, eh, benefit of the doubt, since she'd never really been the type to beat around the bush and I really honestly believed from our previous history that if she wasn't comfortable or didn't want to then she simply wouldn't have agreed and made plans in the first place.

So then I asked her if she was still interested and invited her along to the rescheduled get together and she said that the day in question was fine for her. Day rolls around, have a little bit of phone trouble but I manage to get the directions to her and it's on the west end of town and she lives on the north end and she says that she has to cancel because the traffic would delay her to the point that she'd only be able to stay for an hour before having to leave at 7 for some other plans of hers. When the plans I invited her to were from about 4:30 to 8 or 9.

Whee.

[noparlpf]

It's a friend of mine and we talk maybe once every two months beyond a short snippet of text messaging now and then. Hardly thought that I dwelled upon her except when I was given actual cause to be reminded of her like anyone else that I know. My friends are rather given to hyperbole when it comes to the torch I've been trying to get rid of, but I wasn't really paying them much mind until they brought up how I'd been moaning her name in my sleep. One of them even had somehow gotten the idea that I'd never met her in person just because we moved away from one another. :smallconfused: The way they tell it I'm wasting away pining after a girl who is on the other side of the country and engaged to another woman who I'm actually rather fond of despite the fact that I've actually been working on my love-life despite the way I was raised assuming a certain level of ...affluence on the part of the male that I simply could not sustain at present.

Was rather helpful in getting me past my ex-fiance though, I must admit, so part of that lingering niggling might have just transferred over to her as a side effect of that switch of gears, I suppose. I'm of two minds about that potential plot point.



Well, I don't share a bed with anyone at the moment, so it'd be a bit irrelevant anyway.

Also, apparently sleep-talking about Queen Elizabeth. :smallconfused: So maybe I'm overreacting and I should be in personal woes and advice bemoaning the fact that I sleep-talk and have that terrible, terrible vulnerability to exploitation that such entails. Really rather uncomfortable with that. I suppose I should be googling how to kick the habit rather than bellyaching about it here though.

I dunno man maybe you're secretly in love with Queen Elizabeth and pining for her across the ocean and the age gap. (Unless it's the First anyway.)
More likely you were just having a random confused dream, as most are, and were mumbling incoherently about it. When I remember my weirder dreams I usually spend a while trying to "figure them out" but that doesn't really work, so try not to worry about what your dreams and sleeptalking "mean". Mostly it's just your unconscious brain throwing random stuff together and spitting it out.

My old roommate talks in his sleep sometimes (once in French, and he hadn't taken more than a year of French several years earlier; and a few times he sang) and I can tell you it was pretty tempting to make stuff up to tell him. But I didn't because I think that's rude.


EDIT: This one is actually related to the thread. What's the general consensus on confessing to a same-sex person who is known to be straight? The confessing party is also severely depressed and sometimes self-injurious, and seems to be in the worst throes of early puppy-love.
EDIT: Add in other friend who's driving herself to distraction worrying that she's "not good enough"/"doesn't matter enough" to "save" her friends from their unhappiness. Help?

[Heliomance]

Asked her to a game night with some of my other friends to introduce her to this great game called Cards Against Humanity

You misspelt terrible. Cards Against Humanity is a terrible game for terrible people. And I'm terrible because I think it's fun.

[Sholos]

You're probably coming on too strong. Plus, they probably think you're trying to date them. Especially if you're asking them to coffee, a dinner, or a movie because those are the same strategies that people use who are trying to date people. When I ask someone out, I ask her if she wants to get coffee or go to dinner. I don't mention that I see her as a potential romantic partner because that's implied.

Why do you want to go out of your way to make platonic female friends anyway? I've found that one makes platonic female friends with people that you share interests and activities with and these friendships grow organically over time. They aren't really something that you set goals for nor expand extraordinary effort for. Rather, they simply evolve by being yourself and interacting with people that you see on a regular basis.
Because I'm very, very bad at naturally interacting with people, and if left to my normal behaviors I'd be completely without friends (female or male) in a matter of months. The only reason I have what very few friends I have (and I can't even call most of them friends, really) is because I went against my normal behavior patterns. I am just plain terrible at hanging out with people or seeing them regularly. I've been around the same people for about 4 years now, and I barely known any of them all that well. Certainly don't hang out with them much more than once every couple of months. So, yeah.


You misspelt terrible. Cards Against Humanity is a terrible game for terrible people. And I'm terrible because I think it's fun.

No, no, no. It's a wonderful game for terrible people. *Is also a terrible person.

[Imbasel]

So I have a bit of an odd situation. Recently, a girl started talking to me on facebook. She is a couple of years younger than me I'm a sophomore in college she is a senior who lives in a high school a few hours away. We went to the same middle school together and were friends, but when she moved we lost contact. She added me last year and recently we started chatting again.

We've talked for a couple of days and she is very attractive and funny and so on and says how she enjoys talking to me and that she likes me. We haven't talked about seeing each other too much yet in person but its definitely doable because of trains.

So yesterday I shoot her a message round 8 30 saying whats up to which she responds that she isn't ignoring me but she is busy doing schoolwork and would talk if she could. She didn't so that's cool and makes sense. I message her tonight at 9 30 and get nothing but I know she checked fb because she was online although it was for less than 5 minutes.

So should I worry and get my panties in a bunch or not? Should I play it cool and just wait for her to make contact. My friends said that I should have messaged her tonight and that she does want to talk to me. Do you think its more of a case of I'm worrying and that she really is busy and what not?

[Verte]

Alright, first of all, how old are you, and are you in high school/your country's equivalent? (I just need the context)

Oh, I'm 21 and go to a community college in the US. But, most of the friends I've had I've met through gaming, so I guess I feel insecure about getting to know people in other ways, which is probably why I'm overthinking things.

I'm not on Facebook, and not looking to join anytime soon, so I think I'll try email or cell numbers.

One thing that concerns me in general is that I live with my parents, don't have a driver's license, and live out of the way in a small town. I guess I'm just worried that I might not be able to go out and do things as much anyway, so why bother if I'm just going to end up disappointing others? Which I know is not a good way to look at things.

And yeah, at this point I think would really prefer to get to know them better before deciding to see either of them in that way. I mean, nothing A's done or said really indicates that he would be interested in me in that way, so I don't know about him. I do like B - he seems smart and funny and insightful, but I've noticed certain things he's done that were annoying and things he's said - related to politics so not forum-safe - that I disagreed with. And yeah, I don't really feel all that into him on an emotional level. With the guys I've dated before, early on I would feel like just talking to them for a few minutes would make my day. I think the main reason why I've even been considering this now is because he pretty much fits my mental and physical "type".


So should I worry and get my panties in a bunch or not? Should I play it cool and just wait for her to make contact. My friends said that I should have messaged her tonight and that she does want to talk to me. Do you think its more of a case of I'm worrying and that she really is busy and what not?

Personally, at this point, and based on what you said, I don't think there's much cause to worry. I would take what she said about being busy studying at face value - I mean, every time I've said that it's been true, and it sounds like it's only happened once, so there's no weird pattern here. As far as making contact again, I would probably wait a day or a few and then see how she's doing and if she's still really busy.

[dehro]

So I have a bit of an odd situation. Recently, a girl started talking to me on facebook. She is a couple of years younger than me I'm a sophomore in college she is a senior who lives in a high school a few hours away. We went to the same middle school together and were friends, but when she moved we lost contact. She added me last year and recently we started chatting again.

We've talked for a couple of days and she is very attractive and funny and so on and says how she enjoys talking to me and that she likes me. We haven't talked about seeing each other too much yet in person but its definitely doable because of trains.

So yesterday I shoot her a message round 8 30 saying whats up to which she responds that she isn't ignoring me but she is busy doing schoolwork and would talk if she could. She didn't so that's cool and makes sense. I message her tonight at 9 30 and get nothing but I know she checked fb because she was online although it was for less than 5 minutes.

So should I worry and get my panties in a bunch or not? Should I play it cool and just wait for her to make contact. My friends said that I should have messaged her tonight and that she does want to talk to me. Do you think its more of a case of I'm worrying and that she really is busy and what not?

if she couldn't yesterday because of homework or other commitments, it's not out of the realm of the possible to think that today (well..yesterday I supppose) isn't working for her either.
a bit soon to start panicking.

[Morph Bark]

So I have a bit of an odd situation. Recently, a girl started talking to me on facebook. She is a couple of years younger than me I'm a sophomore in college she is a senior who lives in a high school a few hours away. We went to the same middle school together and were friends, but when she moved we lost contact. She added me last year and recently we started chatting again.

We've talked for a couple of days and she is very attractive and funny and so on and says how she enjoys talking to me and that she likes me. We haven't talked about seeing each other too much yet in person but its definitely doable because of trains.

So yesterday I shoot her a message round 8 30 saying whats up to which she responds that she isn't ignoring me but she is busy doing schoolwork and would talk if she could. She didn't so that's cool and makes sense. I message her tonight at 9 30 and get nothing but I know she checked fb because she was online although it was for less than 5 minutes.

So should I worry and get my panties in a bunch or not? Should I play it cool and just wait for her to make contact. My friends said that I should have messaged her tonight and that she does want to talk to me. Do you think its more of a case of I'm worrying and that she really is busy and what not?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_N0TSGcQUzgU/SZMFf4gwoAI/AAAAAAAAArI/5bLq1eTZrzM/s640/4c225ec4fbab7f4cbb8409616565dc3b-orig.jpg

[noparlpf]

So I have a bit of an odd situation. Recently, a girl started talking to me on facebook. She is a couple of years younger than me I'm a sophomore in college she is a senior who lives in a high school a few hours away. We went to the same middle school together and were friends, but when she moved we lost contact. She added me last year and recently we started chatting again.

We've talked for a couple of days and she is very attractive and funny and so on and says how she enjoys talking to me and that she likes me. We haven't talked about seeing each other too much yet in person but its definitely doable because of trains.

So yesterday I shoot her a message round 8 30 saying whats up to which she responds that she isn't ignoring me but she is busy doing schoolwork and would talk if she could. She didn't so that's cool and makes sense. I message her tonight at 9 30 and get nothing but I know she checked fb because she was online although it was for less than 5 minutes.

So should I worry and get my panties in a bunch or not? Should I play it cool and just wait for her to make contact. My friends said that I should have messaged her tonight and that she does want to talk to me. Do you think its more of a case of I'm worrying and that she really is busy and what not?

It's near the end of the semester. She's probably stressing over exams or something. (Do people do that in high school?)

[Arranis Thelmos]

It's near the end of the semester. She's probably stressing over exams or something. (Do people do that in high school?)

Yup. Still do. Desperately cramming for one in AP Microeconomics.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Yup. Still do. Desperately cramming for one in AP Microeconomics.

For a second there, I read AP Minecraftnomics.

Boy would that be fun.

[noparlpf]

Yup. Still do. Desperately cramming for one in AP Microeconomics.

Well then that's probably what's happening.
(I wasn't sure because I never studied in high school and even as a junior I still hardly study. I'm a little out of touch with real life.)

[Heliomance]

Four and a half months after our break-up, I can finally read my ex's Facebook statuses without more than a mild pang.

Ye gods, but that took a while. And even now, if getting back with her was an option, I would take it in a heartbeat.

[Thufir]

Four and a half months after our break-up, I can finally read my ex's Facebook statuses without more than a mild pang.

Ye gods, but that took a while. And even now, if getting back with her was an option, I would take it in a heartbeat.

I can offer only hugs and an assurance that it gets better.

[Arranis Thelmos]

That's why I stopped using Facebook, actually. I felt a whole lot better after deleting it.

[dehro]

I can offer only hugs and an assurance that it gets better.

also smacks on the back of your head for thinking about getting back together

[Heliomance]

also smacks on the back of your head for thinking about getting back together

:smallannoyed:

Because that's helpful, or appropriate when you know nothing of the circumstances involved.

I am, I think, mostly over her. She has a boyfriend and I'm okay with this. I could find someone myself and not be comparing it to what I had with her. I'm okay with not going out with her again.

But what we had together was amazing, and there seems little point in denying that. I still think on it fondly, and if I was offered the chance to have it again I would take it without hesitation.

[The Succubus]

I don't know if I'd be so quick to reconnect with my ex. I have extremely fond recollections of our time together and for a time I thought she might actually be The One. I tried to find work in Denmark and even did two years of learning Danish before she brought our relationship to a very abrupt halt. Then to rub salt in a very tender wound she told me she'd started going out with a workmate she introduced me to.

It's highly aggrivating. I still find myself occasionally doing things we used to do as a couple and even thinking in Danish from time to time. Stuff like that really sours the positive memories I have of our time together. :smallannoyed:

I'm glad you've had a little more success moving on, Helio. You'll make someone a wonderful girlfriend one day.

[Serpentine]

Going through my music today I discovered that the cover art for one of my Led Zeppelin albums (my Big Ex's favourite band) is the picture he commissioned from someone on this forum of the D&D character I played alongside and DMed for for years, and had a small pang or two. So, you know, you're not alone/it's okay if it doesn't completely go away for a while :smalltongue:
(...although it did have me wondering, which do I miss more: him, or his character? <.<)

Random aside: got to listen to my housemates shagging today. Suddenly (well, not that suddenly...) a bit lonely and... shall we say, craving physical contact. Alas!
...eh, I'll live. Issues of various kinds mean I'm not interested in rushing into a relationship, hesitant about having anything physical with a just-a-friend (and have a notable lack of candidates in the area anyway), and I think a one night stand would be awkward as hell, so meh.

[bindin garoth]

Well, this is my first post hear, so if I'm forgetting anything, let me know.

My wife of 2 years just asked for a divorce today, while I'm across country for work. She's not been happy with our relationship for a while now, and feels that it'd be best to separate. She's not spiteful or angry or anything of the like, she just wants out.

Best way to handle my emotions?

Quick details:
-I'm 22, she's 21
-We've not fought a lot recently. We did when we first got married...... I'm starting to wonder if we ever did really recover from it. The last few months have had no fighting whatsoever.
-......... I can't think of anything else at the moment.

[Thajocoth]

My girl is Jewish and as such celebrates Hanukkah.

She arrived Tuesday night. Before she arrived, I found her menorah, then went out & bought her the candles she needed. She had been driving the previous nights, so the 4th night of Hanukkah was the first she could celebrate.

My gift to her doesn't arrive until the 19th, so it will be late. (I ordered it on the 9th on Amazon. I didn't expect that it would take an entire 10 days to receive it.) Her family isn't getting her anything because she lives in another state now (wtf?). She's sad about not receiving any Hanukkah gifts during Hanukkah.

Meanwhile, there's a growing pile of gifts from my family. Ordered online & shipped directly to me, to open on webcam Christmas morning with my family. (I've been asked to wrap them myself. I can't see what they are as they're in opaque boxes.) These gifts are mostly, if not all, actually to both of us.

I honestly don't care when things get opened, but I want my girl to be happy, and I want my family to be happy.

Drama:
My girl & my mom unfortunately don't seem to get along well. Primarily, my girl wishes to avoid contact with my mom. My mom is more open to getting to know my girl & possibly liking her, but my girl had a bad experience when they first met for unrelated reasons and took the interpretations given to her by one who is too self-centered to give sensible advice. With enough arguing, she'll sometimes temporarily realize this, but forget again within a couple days. Her mind is, unfortunately, more rooted in emotion than logic. (She is aware of this.)

So, in the current plan, she will not open any gifts until the 19th. The last night of Hanukkah ends on the 16th. Do you see any way for me to fix this for her?

A thought I had: She missed the first 3 nights, so I might ask if she'd like to celebrate those three nights late, which would put my gift's arrival only 1 day late of her celebration.

Another thought: I could wrap a pic of her gift... So she'll know what she's getting before it arrives, but will have "unwrapped" it on time.

Edit: I've also thought about pointing out buying her dinner at a restaurant last night or a movie ticket for tonight, which are within the time, but the dinner was meant to be spontaneous romantic & the movie is with 10+ other people that I know most of & she hasn't met yet.

[Lord Loss]

Surprise her with a few inexpensive, but thoughtful gifts. Just little things that she likes. Don't tell her about them beforehand, just go get them and wrap them up and give them to her. It's not quite as good as a full on gift, but it shows you care.

[Coidzor]

My girl is Jewish and as such celebrates Hanukkah.

She arrived Tuesday night. Before she arrived, I found her menorah, then went out & bought her the candles she needed. She had been driving the previous nights, so the 4th night of Hanukkah was the first she could celebrate.

My gift to her doesn't arrive until the 19th, so it will be late. (I ordered it on the 9th on Amazon. I didn't expect that it would take an entire 10 days to receive it.) Her family isn't getting her anything because she lives in another state now (wtf?). She's sad about not receiving any Hanukkah gifts during Hanukkah.

I seem to recall that the theme before commercial and consumptive competition set in was one of a myriad of little gifts. That may provide a stopgap angle.

Some cute handicrafts generally go over well with the ladies and would be thematic from what I recall. You may not want to go full south park unless she's likely to get the reference and enjoy it.



My girl & my mom unfortunately don't seem to get along well. Primarily, my girl wishes to avoid contact with my mom. My mom is more open to getting to know my girl & possibly liking her, but my girl had a bad experience when they first met for unrelated reasons and took the interpretations given to her by one who is too self-centered to give sensible advice. With enough arguing, she'll sometimes temporarily realize this, but forget again within a couple days. Her mind is, unfortunately, more rooted in emotion than logic. (She is aware of this.)

Why and how did she get involved with that webcam plan if she doesn't like your mother and beyond that wants to actively avoid her? :smallconfused:

Considering the tone of apparent bitterness you have, at least as far as who your gedonkle trusts to give good judgment, might want to consider some mediation there.

You might negotiate to get blessing as to which of the gifts for the webcamming are more minor since it sounds like there's some number greater than 2 so that such could be opened earlier. Might play it up as a feather-smoothing, goodwill-gesturey thing, and since it'd be something other than the pièce de résistance, there'd be less vehement objection and less repercussions if you just went ahead and did it anyway.

[Thajocoth]

Why and how did she get involved with that webcam plan if she doesn't like your mother and beyond that wants to actively avoid her? :smallconfused:

She didn't. I don't think my girl actually knows of this plan. Christmas morning, my family wants me to webcam with them & open gifts together, despite being on opposite coasts. My girl lives with me & is likely invited to this as well, but I doubt she wants to be involved. I'll bring it up tonight. I received the largest of these packages today. (They've all been shipped to where I work.) I have no way of knowing what's what or from which member of my family.

Mediation of what?

I cannot make anything without her knowledge unless I do it at work, and in either case it would take away time together. We're pretty much spending as much time glued together as humanly possible right now. She's been away for 7 months.

The event was a year & a half ago. She needed food. Reactive hypoglycemia set in. She had products containing white flour & white sugar, which made it worse. She had high anxiety. (It was before she went on Saphris for anxiety and she was meeting my family for the first time, halfway across the country.) It was really all just a problem waiting to happen. It's my fault for rushing their meeting. They happened to be in the same state & I figured that made it a good idea. Oh well. It was the end of August 2011. I had known my girl for about a month and a half at the time.

She took the interpretations given to her by the "friend" she was visiting that incorrectly labeled everyone that wasn't her as being somehow rude. (In reality, it was her & her friend who were rude, but my girl was not rude on purpose.) Supposedly her best friend, but makes no effort & constantly turns anything to be as about her as she can. When her friend was in the area we were in a year ago, she saw her be unappreciative about something pretty big she did for her, blow off the ceremony we had, etc... and had realized temporarily what she's like. Now she's intending to fly over for her friend's wedding and everything.

At the same time, she doesn't have any friends in this area yet. There are only a few people she has much contact with right now, so I understand clinging to what she's got.

[Arranis Thelmos]

Well, this is my first post hear, so if I'm forgetting anything, let me know.

My wife of 2 years just asked for a divorce today, while I'm across country for work. She's not been happy with our relationship for a while now, and feels that it'd be best to separate. She's not spiteful or angry or anything of the like, she just wants out.

Best way to handle my emotions?

Quick details:
-I'm 22, she's 21
-We've not fought a lot recently. We did when we first got married...... I'm starting to wonder if we ever did really recover from it. The last few months have had no fighting whatsoever.
-......... I can't think of anything else at the moment.

Is anyone going to try and handle this one? I'm only in high school (and never been kissed. Darn gaming stereotypes hold true. :smallfrown:), and wouldn't know how to take it.

[noparlpf]

Surprise her with a few inexpensive, but thoughtful gifts. Just little things that she likes. Don't tell her about them beforehand, just go get them and wrap them up and give them to her. It's not quite as good as a full on gift, but it shows you care.

This, do this. Chanukah was a pretty minor holiday with small gifts each day before it was conflated with the consumerism of modern Christmas. Plus regardless of that it shows that you care and are taking an interest in her holiday and trying to make her happy.

[Coidzor]

She didn't. I don't think my girl actually knows of this plan. Christmas morning, my family wants me to webcam with them & open gifts together, despite being on opposite coasts. My girl lives with me & is likely invited to this as well, but I doubt she wants to be involved. I'll bring it up tonight. I received the largest of these packages today. (They've all been shipped to where I work.) I have no way of knowing what's what or from which member of my family.

Oh. I misread you then as I had thought that she had been drawn into the gift opening cam show with you.


Mediation of what?

The bad blood. Though from what you've said hopefully it'll just get sorted out when she inevitably ceases to have anything to do with this other woman after seeing her bridezilla it up.


I cannot make anything without her knowledge unless I do it at work, and in either case it would take away time together. We're pretty much spending as much time glued together as humanly possible right now. She's been away for 7 months.

Something small on your way home from work then? If you manage to wake up before her or stay up after she goes to bed that might give a window for some kind of surprise?


She took the interpretations given to her by the "friend" she was visiting that incorrectly labeled everyone that wasn't her as being somehow rude. (In reality, it was her & her friend who were rude, but my girl was not rude on purpose.) Supposedly her best friend, but makes no effort & constantly turns anything to be as about her as she can. When her friend was in the area we were in a year ago, she saw her be unappreciative about something pretty big she did for her, blow off the ceremony we had, etc... and had realized temporarily what she's like. Now she's intending to fly over for her friend's wedding and everything.

At the same time, she doesn't have any friends in this area yet. There are only a few people she has much contact with right now, so I understand clinging to what she's got.

Wuff. Good luck with that, woman sounds like a relationship killer if ever there was one. I can't imagine how that type would manage to get hitched. :smalleek:


Well, this is my first post hear, so if I'm forgetting anything, let me know.

My wife of 2 years just asked for a divorce today, while I'm across country for work. She's not been happy with our relationship for a while now, and feels that it'd be best to separate. She's not spiteful or angry or anything of the like, she just wants out.

Best way to handle my emotions?

Quick details:
-I'm 22, she's 21
-We've not fought a lot recently. We did when we first got married...... I'm starting to wonder if we ever did really recover from it. The last few months have had no fighting whatsoever.
-......... I can't think of anything else at the moment.


Is anyone going to try and handle this one? I'm only in high school (and never been kissed. Darn gaming stereotypes hold true. :smallfrown:), and wouldn't know how to take it.

I've been trying to think of something useful and not vapid-seeming to say.

Unfortunately I'm 24 and I'm not really sure what I would have to contribute that's useful or helpful. :/

I think even when it's a mutual, amicable separation and not a last ditch effort to salvage things that some level of counseling and mediation is recommended before actively starting the divorce process, but it isn't really an area that I've thought much about or paid much attention to.

[Thajocoth]

This, do this. Chanukah was a pretty minor holiday with small gifts each day before it was conflated with the consumerism of modern Christmas. Plus regardless of that it shows that you care and are taking an interest in her holiday and trying to make her happy.

That makes sense. We happened to look through a few stores last night & there wasn't anything she seemed to want, but as is usual for her she did pick up & look at everything in these stores that was purple or had Hello Kitty's face on it. She took enjoyment from just looking at all these things, but didn't seem to want to keep any. I know she likes art supplies. Most of the small gifts & prizes I've gotten for her to win have been a combination of purple, Hello Kitty, craft supplies & plush, each item being something she likes.

There is one exception to not finding anything she wants: There's a set of purple Hello Kitty earbuds at Target that look jeweled. $9, which isn't much. She quickly rationalized it away because she already has Hello Kitty earbuds I bought her in June. Those don't sit as well in her ears as these would though, and are pink rather than purple. They also don't have the jeweling or volume control that the ones at Target have. I guess they're different enough... But it still feels a little repetitive.

I've been looking for small prizes to get her for other reasons and that's been the only possibility so far, as well as I could tell. (The prizes help motivate her. This increases willpower.)

After this is done, I need to figure out what to do for the anniversary of that ceremony I mentioned (Dec 22nd) & her birthday (Jan 23rd). I also didn't really do anything for her graduation (Dec 7th). There's just so much at once & it's overwhelming.


Wuff. Good luck with that, woman sounds like a relationship killer if ever there was one. I can't imagine how that type would manage to get hitched. :smalleek:

Her fiance is a criminal. I have more respect for her than for him. My girl does not approve of him. That should pretty much explain how she managed to find a permanent partner.

[Pyromancer999]

Is anyone going to try and handle this one? I'm only in high school (and never been kissed. Darn gaming stereotypes hold true. :smallfrown:), and wouldn't know how to take it.

In college and never been kissed. Don't worry about it. It seems like a big deal to a lot of people until it happens, apparently. If you plan to go to college, odds are you can get someone to kiss you(yes, ironic coming from me, but it's true). One of my friends got his first kiss in college at a party by literally walking up to a girl, introducing himself, letting her introduce herself, then asking if she wanted to make out. And it worked, and she was apparently not drunk to boot. Not saying you should, but the point is that it's not a big deal. Just chillax, and if you happen to come across a girl you want to kiss and don't think they'd mind, just kiss her. Simple as that, or so my friends reassure me.

Tl;dr: Chill out, nothing to worry about.

[noparlpf]

Chocolate beats kissing anyway, plus it's less addictive than romantic love. Science says eat chocolate.

[Arranis Thelmos]

In college and never been kissed. Don't worry about it. It seems like a big deal to a lot of people until it happens, apparently. If you plan to go to college, odds are you can get someone to kiss you(yes, ironic coming from me, but it's true). One of my friends got his first kiss in college at a party by literally walking up to a girl, introducing himself, letting her introduce herself, then asking if she wanted to make out. And it worked, and she was apparently not drunk to boot. Not saying you should, but the point is that it's not a big deal. Just chillax, and if you happen to come across a girl you want to kiss and don't think they'd mind, just kiss her. Simple as that, or so my friends reassure me.

Tl;dr: Chill out, nothing to worry about.

That's good to know, and thanks for that. I still got hope then. :smallsmile: However, I meant bindin garoth's post. His problem is quite a bit more serious than my lack of a love life.

[bindin garoth]

That's good to know, and thanks for that. I still got hope then. :smallsmile: However, I meant bindin garoth's post. His problem is quite a bit more serious than my lack of a love life.

Actually, college is where I got my first kiss too.........

We gamers are a lot alike, aren't we?

But yes, if anyone has insights to the above post, I'd greatly appreciate it.

[noparlpf]

First kiss I was a month past fifteen. I win? I dunno, doesn't feel like much of a success.

[Sholos]

First kiss of mine was during college. Still waiting on a first girlfriend, though. I'm 27 and out of college. So, no, don't worry at all about that sort of thing in high school.

On the divorce thing, I also recommend at least some counseling if it's really out of the blue.

[Thajocoth]

My issue has been resolved. My mom said that 3 of the gifts are for Hannukah. We opened 2 (& haven't received the 3rd yet). Of these two, we intend to return one for the 13 bucks to spend on something else (We already have so many kitchen towels), and the other is a really nice ice cream scoop (her diet allows sugar free ice cream). My girl is happy & there's still plenty to open on Christmas on webcam.

-----

"Suddenly divorce" is a jarring situation. It's good that they're still friendly. It will make things easier going forward. It's also good that it's ending now instead of later. Clearly there's a core compatibility issue. That really sucks though & I hope you manage to find someone more compatible with you.

I don't have experience here. I've only dated 3 girls & my current girl is only the second. I've been with her a year and a half, and we had a commitment ceremony (marriage equivalent) only a year ago. Anniversary is in just over a week.)

My parents, however... Were together 20 years. My mom talked to me about it as her emotions went through all the stages of breaking up with him. It took years. She tried to fix things so many times & so many ways. When she finally broke up with my dad, her mind had already fully processed it. His did not. It was sudden & jarring. As a more black & white thinker, he assumed she must hate him. She didn't... Until he did things she hated, like talking to her through their kids, which he did in reaction to thinking she hated her. (Self fulfilling prophecy.)

They were initially quite compatible, but she grew & he did not. She leveled up, became a stronger thinker, even started her own business. He needed to have someone to take care of. He started being more depressed, less able to do his job (eventually not working for long periods of time)... He wasn't getting his needs met because my mom was no longer a weaker person that needed someone stronger to take care of her. He was still great if she got sick, but that never lasted long.

People can change. They ceased to be compatible. It happens. The moral here is that it's great to be with someone you're compatible with, but if you're not, it's good that it ends sooner. It doesn't matter how much has been invested in the relationship. If compatibility isn't there, you can both try all you want, but it just won't work out long term, or you'll both be miserable.

It's very sad, but at least it's ending now, not after another decade of unhappiness.

Does that help?

-----

My first kiss was half a year after I graduated college, with a girl I met on AdultFriendFinder. She was my first gf, for about 6 weeks.

[dehro]

Is anyone going to try and handle this one?
I was gonna..had written a nice long boring post.. then I re-read it and realised it was 90% rant.
I don't quite know how to relate or how to give advice to someone who gets married straight out of highschool. I'm afraid I'm too jaded and "rational" to be of any use.

[The Succubus]

I was gonna..had written a nice long boring post.. then I re-read it and realised it was 90% rant.
I don't quite know how to relate or how to give advice to someone who gets married straight out of highschool. I'm afraid I'm too jaded and "rational" to be of any use.

:smallconfused: - is there something wrong with getting married shortly after college? If two people love each other and want to get married what exactly does age have to do with it?

Sometimes it doesn't work out though, as it hasn't for Bindin. I'm going to trot out my favourite question here for you to think about Bindin:

"What do you want?"

Unfortunately, in this case it's not very straightforward. Does your partner mean the world to you and more? Do you want to fight tooth and nail to win her back? Can you win her back?

Have a think about where you are at the moment. You're across country on work-related stuff. Is this something that happens often? Do you both feel lonely when you're apart? While long distance relationships (LDRs) can work for a while, there will be a time when one of you won't be there when the other needs you and it will be hard. Very hard.

Have a think about the sort of things you've been arguing about. Are they trivial things or are they things that are a part of who you are? Even if you could change them, would you *want* to change them?

A large part of what is running through your brain right now is fear. Fear of what life will be like if you do decide to separate. Will you find someone else? What will you do with the extra free time that you used to spend with her? The other thing you'll be afraid of is the hurt that comes from no longer loving someone and have them love you in return. This is the bit that's really going to suck I'm afraid. Little reminders of stuff you had and did together. When I split up from my gf, I chucked 99% of the various things we had and did together - my Magic cards, my Danish lesson books, certain clothes - it all went in a charity box. I kept only two pieces that were truly unique - a small piece of crystal we found on a trip to Norway with her family and a small origami butterfly she made into a fridge magnet. And I find that's enough.

If you do decide to go your separate ways, you'll be focusing a lot on the break up itself. Force yourself to remember the good times and in particular how you first met. The latter will help you get into the right frame of mind when you're ready to move on.

Good luck. *hug*

[dehro]

:smallconfused: - is there something wrong with getting married shortly after college? If two people love each other and want to get married what exactly does age have to do with it?


no, there isn't.. which is why I decided not to get involved in this particular case (by which I mean of course trying to give advice that ultimately might not be all too objective, thereby denouncing me for the moron I can sometimes be).

Since apparently I have gotten involved after all, I shall do the grumpy old man thing and spout my 2 cents of nonsense despite most likely not knowing what I'm talking about.

They've been married for 2 years, meaning she was 19 and he was 20. Assuming they didn't meet up a week prior to that, I take it they must have been together for.. months? a couple of years? since puberty?
.. it's probably accurate to say that either they got together fairly young and married at the first chance they got, or that they had a whirlwind romance and decided to marry without really knowing each other all that well. (as I write I realise that there's possibly a child involved, although I suppose he'd have mentioned it, if that was the case)..
We also know that they've been arguing since day one and only had a few months of "no arguing" since then.
I can't help it but to think that maybe they've rushed things a bit and one or both of them wasn't ready for such a big commitment... but the truth is I don't have enough elements to be sure that that is the case.
Either way, I don't quite know anything helpful to say to that assessment of the situation, should it prove accurate.
Was it a mistake? are they going to solve their problems? I don't know. My grandparents got married soon after the war and had a number of squabbles.. my mother tells me that for years my granny had her bags packed and ready to go back to her family.. but they stuck it out and have been married for the last 63 years, happily.
My mother has had 2 important men in her life and 2 children by each, without ever tying the knot with either of the men. She's single and not happy.
I myself am 34 and getting a bit tired of being single after having moved on from one shortlived impossible relationship to the next.
My dad on the other hand remarried with a woman 20 years younger, has had 2 more kids and seems to be quite happy, all considered.
So things really can go either way
As I said, I am probably jaded, entirely too "rational" in my approach, and possibly a bit jealous..
not the right person to be giving advice.

but no..there's nothing wrong "per sé"with marrying as soon as you feel like it, whatever age you're at.

[Aiani]

Well, this is my first post hear, so if I'm forgetting anything, let me know.

My wife of 2 years just asked for a divorce today, while I'm across country for work. She's not been happy with our relationship for a while now, and feels that it'd be best to separate. She's not spiteful or angry or anything of the like, she just wants out.

Best way to handle my emotions?

Quick details:
-I'm 22, she's 21
-We've not fought a lot recently. We did when we first got married...... I'm starting to wonder if we ever did really recover from it. The last few months have had no fighting whatsoever.
-......... I can't think of anything else at the moment.

I feel nervous about giving advice but I'll give it a try. You specifically asked about ways to handle your emotions so I'll stick to that. First I would say give yourself permission to be sad and angry and whatever else you're feeling. Too often people beat themselves up because they can't immediately feel better after something sad happens. It's okay and very human to feel bad so please don't beat yourself up if you can't feel cool with this right away.
Next I would say talk to some close friends about this especially a best friend, someone who will just listen to you rant or whatever you need. Also maybe you could see a therapist just to help you process your feelings. It might help you to go out with friends for a distraction as well.
You could try writing in a journal just to get all your feelings out of your head.

Last bit of advice doesn't have anything to do with feelings and is more practical but you should probably contact a lawyer who can help you with all the legal issues surrounding a divorce. I hope at least some of this is helpful to you. Internet hugs if you want them.

[bindin garoth]

First off: Thanks for all of the inputs, everyone! It helps :smallsmile:

Thajocoth


My issue has been resolved. My mom said that 3 of the gifts are for Hannukah. We opened 2 (& haven't received the 3rd yet). Of these two, we intend to return one for the 13 bucks to spend on something else (We already have so many kitchen towels), and the other is a really nice ice cream scoop (her diet allows sugar free ice cream). My girl is happy & there's still plenty to open on Christmas on webcam.


Glad to see it worked out!



"Suddenly divorce" is a jarring situation. It's good that they're still friendly. It will make things easier going forward. It's also good that it's ending now instead of later. Clearly there's a core compatibility issue. That really sucks though & I hope you manage to find someone more compatible with you.

I don't have experience here. I've only dated 3 girls & my current girl is only the second. I've been with her a year and a half, and we had a commitment ceremony (marriage equivalent) only a year ago. Anniversary is in just over a week.)

My parents, however... Were together 20 years. My mom talked to me about it as her emotions went through all the stages of breaking up with him. It took years. She tried to fix things so many times & so many ways. When she finally broke up with my dad, her mind had already fully processed it. His did not. It was sudden & jarring. As a more black & white thinker, he assumed she must hate him. She didn't... Until he did things she hated, like talking to her through their kids, which he did in reaction to thinking she hated her. (Self fulfilling prophecy.)

They were initially quite compatible, but she grew & he did not. She leveled up, became a stronger thinker, even started her own business. He needed to have someone to take care of. He started being more depressed, less able to do his job (eventually not working for long periods of time)... He wasn't getting his needs met because my mom was no longer a weaker person that needed someone stronger to take care of her. He was still great if she got sick, but that never lasted long.

People can change. They ceased to be compatible. It happens. The moral here is that it's great to be with someone you're compatible with, but if you're not, it's good that it ends sooner. It doesn't matter how much has been invested in the relationship. If compatibility isn't there, you can both try all you want, but it just won't work out long term, or you'll both be miserable.

It's very sad, but at least it's ending now, not after another decade of unhappiness.

Does that help?
Sorry to hear about your parents divorced (coming from someone who's parents divorced too).

It's definitely possible that's we've become incompatible. And if that's what truly has happened here, your right. It's sad, but better now than later.

And yes, it does help!


The Seccubus


:smallconfused: - is there something wrong with getting married shortly after college? If two people love each other and want to get married what exactly does age have to do with it?

Sometimes it doesn't work out though, as it hasn't for Bindin. I'm going to trot out my favourite question here for you to think about Bindin:

"What do you want?"

Unfortunately, in this case it's not very straightforward. Does your partner mean the world to you and more? Do you want to fight tooth and nail to win her back? Can you win her back?

Have a think about where you are at the moment. You're across country on work-related stuff. Is this something that happens often? Do you both feel lonely when you're apart? While long distance relationships (LDRs) can work for a while, there will be a time when one of you won't be there when the other needs you and it will be hard. Very hard.

Have a think about the sort of things you've been arguing about. Are they trivial things or are they things that are a part of who you are? Even if you could change them, would you *want* to change them?

A large part of what is running through your brain right now is fear. Fear of what life will be like if you do decide to separate. Will you find someone else? What will you do with the extra free time that you used to spend with her? The other thing you'll be afraid of is the hurt that comes from no longer loving someone and have them love you in return. This is the bit that's really going to suck I'm afraid. Little reminders of stuff you had and did together. When I split up from my gf, I chucked 99% of the various things we had and did together - my Magic cards, my Danish lesson books, certain clothes - it all went in a charity box. I kept only two pieces that were truly unique - a small piece of crystal we found on a trip to Norway with her family and a small origami butterfly she made into a fridge magnet. And I find that's enough.

If you do decide to go your separate ways, you'll be focusing a lot on the break up itself. Force yourself to remember the good times and in particular how you first met. The latter will help you get into the right frame of mind when you're ready to move on.

Good luck. *hug*

Thanks! That the question I'm taking the time to find the answer to right now.

The travelling started in September, where I was gone for three weeks. As of currently, I've been gone for almost a month (second time out).

As for tossing stuff out, I'll do what I can, but I'm not tossing the cats! I love em too much (currently have 5) :smallsmile:

I'll most likely be keeping the cats, since she'll be living with her sister, where she couldn't keep them (her sister already has 2 older cats, it wouldn't be good to introduce them to new cats).


Dehro



no, there isn't.. which is why I decided not to get involved in this particular case (by which I mean of course trying to give advice that ultimately might not be all too objective, thereby denouncing me for the moron I can sometimes be).

Since apparently I have gotten involved after all, I shall do the grumpy old man thing and spout my 2 cents of nonsense despite most likely not knowing what I'm talking about.

They've been married for 2 years, meaning she was 19 and he was 20. Assuming they didn't meet up a week prior to that, I take it they must have been together for.. months? a couple of years? since puberty?
.. it's probably accurate to say that either they got together fairly young and married at the first chance they got, or that they had a whirlwind romance and decided to marry without really knowing each other all that well. (as I write I realise that there's possibly a child involved, although I suppose he'd have mentioned it, if that was the case)..
We also know that they've been arguing since day one and only had a few months of "no arguing" since then.
I can't help it but to think that maybe they've rushed things a bit and one or both of them wasn't ready for such a big commitment... but the truth is I don't have enough elements to be sure that that is the case.
Either way, I don't quite know anything helpful to say to that assessment of the situation, should it prove accurate.
Was it a mistake? are they going to solve their problems? I don't know. My grandparents got married soon after the war and had a number of squabbles.. my mother tells me that for years my granny had her bags packed and ready to go back to her family.. but they stuck it out and have been married for the last 63 years, happily.
My mother has had 2 important men in her life and 2 children by each, without ever tying the knot with either of the men. She's single and not happy.
I myself am 34 and getting a bit tired of being single after having moved on from one shortlived impossible relationship to the next.
My dad on the other hand remarried with a woman 20 years younger, has had 2 more kids and seems to be quite happy, all considered.
So things really can go either way
As I said, I am probably jaded, entirely too "rational" in my approach, and possibly a bit jealous..
not the right person to be giving advice.

but no..there's nothing wrong "per sé"with marrying as soon as you feel like it, whatever age you're at.

I should of clarified a little bit. The biggest arguing was at the first......... 6-8 months of the marriage? Around that. Afterwards, the arguing lessened, but as I said, I think there may of been some rifts caused by that which we never recovered from.

Perhaps we did get married too fast......... See below.


Aiani



I feel nervous about giving advice but I'll give it a try. You specifically asked about ways to handle your emotions so I'll stick to that. First I would say give yourself permission to be sad and angry and whatever else you're feeling. Too often people beat themselves up because they can't immediately feel better after something sad happens. It's okay and very human to feel bad so please don't beat yourself up if you can't feel cool with this right away.
Next I would say talk to some close friends about this especially a best friend, someone who will just listen to you rant or whatever you need. Also maybe you could see a therapist just to help you process your feelings. It might help you to go out with friends for a distraction as well.
You could try writing in a journal just to get all your feelings out of your head.

Last bit of advice doesn't have anything to do with feelings and is more practical but you should probably contact a lawyer who can help you with all the legal issues surrounding a divorce. I hope at least some of this is helpful to you. Internet hugs if you want them.

That's something I definitely need to work on. I have a bad habit of withdrawing rather than expressing my feelings (I've gotten better over the years but the habits still there).

We actually did see a therapist at one point. It didn't help much.


To All

-Again, thank you for the help!
-Specifics on when we got first married: We got married when I was 20 and she was 19. We got married right before moving a good 3 hours away (to Baltimore). We had move up here for a great job (which ironically laid me off this January). It is possible that some of the arguments was frustration/anger about the move and making adjustments, but not all of them.
-Over the last few months: As said above, laid off in January. Had to make big budget cutbacks, due to previous making a huge amount of OT at my previous job.
-She was going to school, but ultimately had to quit due to us not having enough money.
-This is actually 2 weeks after starting a new job.

[AtlanteanTroll]

*sigh*

That is all. Missed you RWA.

Not.

:smallsigh:

[ShadowFireLance]

Not sure if this is teh right place, but what the heck, you guys seem nice enough...:smallwink:

so I am in a condrum, In my Collage/Lifestyle, Their is this amazing girl, Who I really, Really like, And have made that Well known, about three month's ago.
Fast forward a few weeks:
A Camping trip, On which I learned that one of my best friends likes her the same, And has done the same as me, And has shown it.
Now, We get back, Life goes back to normal, I find out that a nother one of my friends likes her...Which is becoming slightly annoying.
Now, I was talking to her 'Best Girlfriend' And, Well...Bad news, She has this biiig crush on one of my friends, Who is the Brother of the one who likes her...
He just got out of a Relationship , And is not intrested in her (Methinks that he is slightly scared, After all, me and Friend 1 Got into a fist fight)
And..Well, that shocked me really, Really badly.

So I am seeing her tomorrow, and the question is such:
Should i ask her if She *likes* me whatsoever, Or am I just wasteing my time, and if I do that, HOW
Or should I just say something along the lines of "I no longer have any romantic Feelings towords you, Sorry for bothering you" ?

please, Oh please help.

Other info:
She does like me, Because I was over at her house once, And Her cousin was as well, And she (Cousin) Gave me a note, Saying "She likes you"
Needless to say, I was reading it, And She did her best to get it away from me..So...I assume that means what I think it means, but....Whatever, I am male, And have no clue on girls, Whatsoever.

[Pyromancer999]

Not sure if this is teh right place, but what the heck, you guys seem nice enough...:smallwink:

so I am in a condrum, In my Collage/Lifestyle, Their is this amazing girl, Who I really, Really like, And have made that Well known, about three month's ago.
Fast forward a few weeks:
A Camping trip, On which I learned that one of my best friends likes her the same, And has done the same as me, And has shown it.
Now, We get back, Life goes back to normal, I find out that a nother one of my friends likes her...Which is becoming slightly annoying.
Now, I was talking to her 'Best Girlfriend' And, Well...Bad news, She has this biiig crush on one of my friends, Who is the Brother of the one who likes her...
He just got out of a Relationship , And is not intrested in her (Methinks that he is slightly scared, After all, me and Friend 1 Got into a fist fight)
And..Well, that shocked me really, Really badly.

So I am seeing her tomorrow, and the question is such:
Should i ask her if She *likes* me whatsoever, Or am I just wasteing my time, and if I do that, HOW
Or should I just say something along the lines of "I no longer have any romantic Feelings towords you, Sorry for bothering you" ?

please, Oh please help.

Other info:
She does like me, Because I was over at her house once, And Her cousin was as well, And she (Cousin) Gave me a note, Saying "She likes you"
Needless to say, I was reading it, And She did her best to get it away from me..So...I assume that means what I think it means, but....Whatever, I am male, And have no clue on girls, Whatsoever.

Hmmmm.... a complicated situation indeed. I don't think that fighting over a girl physically is really appropriate, but it seems you do feel strongly for this girl, despite the rest of this confusing situation. I think as soon as you can do so in person, you should tell her how you feel about her. As in, just say it to her. Try to do it when you two are alone together, though, as otherwise you're sort of just putting her on the spot. Worst case, she rejects you and you get a chance to move on. Best case, she likes you, and you two start going out.

As for the cousin thing, the cousin may have just been playing with you. Even if she wasn't and she did like you, no guarantee she still does. Don't trust anything about whether or not a girl likes you unless it comes from the girl herself.

In any case, it seems to me the best course of action would be to tell the girl how you feel about her, and if you choose to go and do just that, I wish you the best of luck doing so.



*sigh*

That is all. Missed you RWA.

Not.

:smallsigh:

Did something bad happen? Need help?

[ShadowFireLance]

Alrighty then, thanks, now I just need to find myself a potion of Courage...:smallcool:
actually just realized I am seeing her Tomorrow...
*Begins to Physc self*

[ShadowFireLance]

Speaking from a Male point of view, I am scared, For reasons beyond my mind, I have actually had a fight with a rabid dog (No joke), and that did not scare me as much as talking to her...So, How does one summon up teh Courage?

[Wyntonian]

Well, something like 85% of my friends are girls, but I still find it terrifying to speak to someone I don't know at all without some justification. I can't just go up and say "You! Hot one! Let us date!" or whatever it is you're supposed to :smalltongue:, but then, I've only really ever found myself attracted to people I already know as friends.



So... alcohol?

[SiuiS]

Move fast enough that your mind can't process and stop you? Like when people say "I'm going to jump in the count of three..." and start counting. I find it's easier to actually jump before 3 because you don't have time to reconsider.

So if you can start talking to her, before your brain freaks out, you should be able to get enough data to realize she is as easy to talk to as anyone else, which will calm down the fear response before it really takes hold. But that's all I've got. "Who Dares Wins".

[ShadowFireLance]

Problem is, I have about 16 Hours to stew on this...:smalleek:

Thing is, I can talk to her, But..Well, i suppose it is the hoping for not the 'heartbreak' that is so common, (Which, If you ask me, Is a lot scarier then Physical pain.) I suppose it is a 'fear of rejection'...UGH...

[Cosmic Traveler]

"Here be dragons"
- every hermit to explorers in all realities at some point in time.

Ok, now for serious business. Talking to a girl is touchy IMO. At work, as a lowly wrapper in a grocery store, I get to talk with girls on a regular basis because cashiers are all girls and woman (age difference to be noted). From what little experience I got so far, don't try to force a conversation because it will lead to the dreaded awkward silence. You want to avoid it like a giant spider.
Best situation is to let the girl strike the conversation, that is gold.

If you are in a school environment, then try to talk about recent happening in the day. Lots of girls seem to like gossip, but not all. One thing I ask myself, but that's because it's me (because I'm a generally insecure person) is if I'm boring her to tears and to be honest about her answer. In case I am, I'll ask her to talk about her day and herself (but that's because I'm a good listener).


One thing I can guarantee you is this: if she asks you if you are into video games, it's not a shame to say you are, most won't mind if you don't start talking about it like no tomorrow. Don't talk video games unless she seems genuine about it.

Another thing I got to talk about was LARPing.
They might get confused about it but you can tell her that its basically like a big theater play, outside, everyone's an actor, everyone has its time to shine.
That's how I passed it as and you can agree with me that my own definition is correct if we look at the French-style LARPing (dialogue and roleplay oriented)

[Aedilred]

but no..there's nothing wrong "per sé"with marrying as soon as you feel like it, whatever age you're at.

etc.
I'm pretty old-fashioned about this sort of thing, but I take the view that if marriage is to have any real significance it shouldn't be a decision taken lightly, and in turn shouldn't be that easy to just run away from when it gets a bit difficult. That's basically the point, to my mind. You're making a commitment to stay with that person for life, rather than "until I don't feel like it any more".

Now, obviously, there are circumstances where people can, and must, be allowed to leave a marriage, but these should be relatively exceptional. I'm thinking specifically abuse, adultery on the part of the other party, excessive irresponsibility with the family future, and a few others that should hopefully come up much more rarely. To my mind, if these circumstances don't apply, then the party being asked for a divorce is morally entitled to put the brakes on, and request, if not demand, that at least a concerted and directed effort is made to fix the problem. If the worst comes to the worst, accepting a separation but refusing a divorce and requiring litigation is an option, but that's not really worth pursuing most of the time.

This is the problem with getting married young, I think - you're not necessarily emotionally and rationally equipped to make the commitment to the above sensibly and/or in full knowledge of what you're committing to. That people from older generations got married younger and stayed married is more, I think, because of the social unacceptability of divorce. In the last fifty years or so, there's been a kind of negative feedback effect which has increased the availability of divorce, which has made marriage less of a commitment, which means people take it less seriously, which pushes up the divorce rate.

Ultimately, though, like any relationship, there aren't any rules about it: if it works for you then it's the right thing to do. However, when it comes to marrying young, I tend to feel that the younger it happens, the less good an idea it tends to be. Some people make it work; some people don't, but I think you tend to be taking a bigger risk the younger you are.

@bindin garoth directly
Now, obviously I don't know the full history of your relationship, but I would say that if you don't want a divorce then saying "no" at this stage should be an option, and insisting that you both put some more work in to save the marriage. It doesn't mean a divorce isn't inevitable and, if your wife is sure about it, you can't and probably shouldn't stop it from happening, but I don't see any reason why you should just have to lie down and accept it out of, effectively, politeness. On the other hand, if you just want out, that's alright too. It's your decision either way. In any case, you have my utmost sympathies over the situation, it must be a horrible time for you, especially coming on top of a recent relocation.

[noparlpf]

You know what's stupid? Besides still being awake at this hour despite having to get up at eight and then probably being up late tomorrow night despite my final Tuesday evening? Finding old pictures while backing up an old computer. >.<

[dehro]

written "she likes you" notes ? how old is this cousin of hers? :smallconfused:

[Jay R]

So, How does one summon up teh Courage?

I recommend you consider two thoughts:

1. The first time you rode a bike, you fell. The first time you tried to throw a ball, you missed. Maybe you won't do well this time. But then you will have a little experience for the next time.

I can promise you that sometimes you will do well, sometimes you will do poorly, and that it will get easier if you try. (I can also promise that it will not get easier if you don't try.)

2. Consider what the risks are.

If you don't talk to her, you never get to talk to her.

If you do talk to her, there are several possible outcomes, the worst of which is that you will never get to talk to her again.

The worst possible result of talking to her matches what you get by not trying.

So you can just take a critical fumble by not talking to her, or you can roll the dice by talking to her.