Can Thri-Kreen be a balanced PC race?

[zzuxon]

So, I'm making a campaign setting for 3.5. I want to make Thri-Kreen a PC race. In their natural form, are they balanced, or do I need to modify them?

[RFLS]

So, I'm making a campaign setting for 3.5. I want to make Thri-Kreen a PC race. In their natural form, are they balanced, or do I need to modify them?

They're balanced if you respect their LA and the rules surrounding more than 2 arms.

[Urpriest]

Their high LA and RHD makes them a bit weaker than a standard PC race, but their good racial features mean they aren't very disadvantaged.

[Snowbluff]

They are balanced in my book. Multiweapon Fighting is Straight up better than TWF, and is broken with things like Duskblade, though.

[docnessuno]

They are balanced in my book. Multiweapon Fighting is Straight up better than TWF, and is broken with things like Duskblade, though.

Whoo hoo, i'm a duskbade 13 with 2 RHD and 2 LA! I can channel touch spells with 4-armed multiweapon fighting!
Wait, did the same-ECL human mage next to me just cast a 9th level spell?

[hex0]

With LA Buyoff they are pretty viable. Their racial poison is a bit of joke though. I'm not a fan of their racial hit die at all. I'd let someone wave it if they are starting with enough class levels to equal the RHD.

[Snowbluff]

Whoo hoo, i'm a duskbade 13 with 2 RHD and 1 LA! I can channel touch spells with 4-armed multiweapon fighting!
Wait, did the same-ECL human mage next to me just cast a 9th level spell?

He casts Energy Drain!

It's a good thing I didn't bring Fell Drain, or I would be doing a 9th level spell's work!

EDIT: Fixed something for you. Why would someone be a psionic thri-kreen caster? That's just silly.

[Deth Muncher]

Big question here: Are you using Psionic or Nonpsionic? Psionic Thri-Keen are, of course, in the XPH, but people seem to forget a lot that Nonpsionic Thri-keen are in the Forgotten Realms (I forget exactly which book, I'm pretty sure it's the Campaign Setting though).

[Greenish]

Big question here: Are you using Psionic or Nonpsionic? Psionic Thri-Keen are, of course, in the XPH, but people seem to forget a lot that Nonpsionic Thri-keen are in the Forgotten Realms (I forget exactly which book, I'm pretty sure it's the Campaign Setting though).Shining South, for 3.5.

[zzuxon]

Big question here: Are you using Psionic or Nonpsionic? Psionic Thri-Keen are, of course, in the XPH, but people seem to forget a lot that Nonpsionic Thri-keen are in the Forgotten Realms (I forget exactly which book, I'm pretty sure it's the Campaign Setting though).
I'm not sure what the difference is, but the Psion class will definitely be available.
Also, let me make sure I get this. LA and RHD says what the minimum level your charcater needs to be to compete with 1st level regular races? So, since Thri-Kreen have 2rhd and +2 LA, they'd have to be 4th level to compete with a 1st level human?




With LA Buyoff they are pretty viable. Their racial poison is a bit of joke though. I'm not a fan of their racial hit die at all. I'd let someone wave it if they are starting with enough class levels to equal the RHD.

I'm not sure what you mean.

[docnessuno]

I'm not sure what the difference is, but the Psion class will definitely be available.
Also, let me make sure I get this. LA and RHD says what the minimum level your charcater needs to be to compete with 1st level regular races? So, since Thri-Kreen have 2rhd and +2 LA, they'd have to be 4th level to compete with a 1st level human?

It means exactly the opposite, that a human would have to be level 4 to be on par with a 2 RHD 2 LA Thri-Kreen.

[Flickerdart]

I'm not sure what the difference is, but the Psion class will definitely be available.
Psionic Thri-Kreen have some psi-like abilities that non-psionic Thri-Kreen don't have. They're also at a higher ECL because of it, which is generally not worth it.




I'm not sure what you mean.
LA Buyoff is an optional rule in Unearthed Arcana (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/reducingLevelAdjustments.htm).

[Urpriest]

I'm not sure what the difference is, but the Psion class will definitely be available.
Also, let me make sure I get this. LA and RHD says what the minimum level your charcater needs to be to compete with 1st level regular races? So, since Thri-Kreen have 2rhd and +2 LA, they'd have to be 4th level to compete with a 1st level human?


Nope! You really really need to read my Monster Handbook, link in sig.

[hex0]

Is the extra LA really worthy comparing the psionic to the regular version?

[zzuxon]

Well. I read your guide Urpriest.
That's not something I'm willing to deal with soI'm redesigning the Thri-Kreen as a PC race.

[Arcanist]

Well. I read your guide Urpriest.
That's not something I'm willing to deal with soI'm redesigning the Thri-Kreen as a PC race.

I'm sure everyone can agree with me on this, but Ur-Priest comments and handbooks effectively function like Tomes of Clear Thought. They take you 2 days to really understand, but when you're done you just feel like you've just become a little smarter :smallsmile:

The Thri-Keen is a PC race, however it's annoying that it has a RHD and a LA, but balancing it out so that it no longer has these, you would be better off playing as a Human or other race with no RHD of LA :smallsigh:

[LTwerewolf]

Slightly off topic but kind of not: the rules on multiweapon fighting vs. two weapon fighting. Where can I read up on these? I have a player about to make a four armed race and want to make sure I'm completely up to date with all the rules involved with it.


I'm sure everyone can agree with me on this, but Ur-Priest comments and handbooks effectively function like Tomes of Clear Thought. They take you 2 days to really understand, but when you're done you just feel like you've just become a little smarter :smallsmile::

Yep, pretty much.

[Fouredged Sword]

If you wanted to balance them to no RHD or LA do this.

Four arms, but two arms are unsuited to any combat use and cannot even hold items.

Add +4 to jump checks

-2 str, +2 dex, +2 wis, -2 cha, they are quick, but their face is hard to read and their limbs are week. They have a natural connection to psionics that shows as a knack for psionic warriors.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

For a +0 LA, no racial HD version of Thri-Kreen, I'd make the following changes:

-Stat bonuses changed to +2 Dex, -2 Int, +2 Wis, -2 Cha.
-No natural armor bonus, but access to a new exclusive feat that grants +2 natural armor, it should require a +3 base Fort save and is only available to a Thri-Kreen.
-No natural weapons, no poison.
-They still have four arms, but two are unusable for anything at all until the character hits 6th level (similar to +0 LA races with wings granting flight at 6th level).
-The racial bonus on Jump checks is reduced to +4. Don't forget, their natural 40 ft. land speed automatically gives them another +4.
-Not naturally psionic, no psi-like abilities.
-Deflect Arrows is gained as a bonus feat at 6th level, when their other two arms become usable.
-No racial hit dice, no level adjustment.

[Snowbluff]

Slightly off topic but kind of not: the rules on multiweapon fighting vs. two weapon fighting. Where can I read up on these? I have a player about to make a four armed race and want to make sure I'm completely up to date with all the rules involved with it.


The feats for Multiweapon Fighting are inthe Monster Manual, IIRC. Essentially, you get one main hand, and everything else is an offhand. MWF counts as TWF, it just works with more arms.

[LTwerewolf]

The multiweapon fighting feat essentially puts all attacks at -4. Is it the same where if the "offhands" are light then it goes down to -2?

[Arcanist]

For a +0 LA, no racial HD version of Thri-Kreen, I'd make the following changes:

-Stat bonuses changed to +2 Dex, -2 Int, +2 Wis, -2 Cha.
-No natural armor bonus, but access to a new exclusive feat that grants +2 natural armor, it should require a +3 base Fort save and is only available to a Thri-Kreen.
-No natural weapons, no poison.
-They still have four arms, but two are unusable for anything at all until the character hits 6th level (similar to +0 LA races with wings granting flight at 6th level).
-The racial bonus on Jump checks is reduced to +4. Don't forget, their natural 40 ft. land speed automatically gives them another +4.
-Not naturally psionic, no psi-like abilities.
-Deflect Arrows is gained as a bonus feat at 6th level, when their other two arms become usable.
-No racial hit dice, no level adjustment.

Are you using the guidelines as shown in Savage Species? :smallconfused:

[Lyndworm]

I doubt it; his race looks balanced. *ba-dum pish* (http://instantrimshot.com/classic/?sound=rimshot)

[kitcik]

I am playing a 14th level non-psionic thri kreen monk / warblade.

1 LA (bought off) - it's 2 LA for psionic
changed 2 racial HD to 1, losing poison and the "only 2 arms are useful for combat" thing (I guess more people have thought of that than I would have expected).

I feel racially balanced, although my monk levels put me at a disadvantage class wise :-)