Into Mystic theurge the Earliest

[Cranthis]

I want to get into Mystic theurge (Or arcane hierophant) as early as possible. Is there any way to do this before level 7?

[Arcanist]

So many ways to do this (Earliest that is possible is at 3rd level). Sanctum Spell. It solves ALL of your problems! :smallbiggrin:

[Cranthis]

Please explain why and how that would work. Also. You didn't get in on today's Versus, I was disappointed haha.

[Rejakor]

Versus?

Mystic Theurge can be entered at level 4 if you have 2nd level divine spells and 2nd level arcane spells.

You can get this via Divine Metamagic: Heighten, or by Sanctum spell (sanctum spells count as one level higher in your sanctum).

Another common entry is divine casting class 3/arcane casting class 1(Precocious Apprentice)/Mystic Theurge X

[Arcanist]

Please explain why and how that would work. Also. You didn't get in on today's Versus, I was disappointed haha.

While in your sanctum your spells are treated as if they're 1 level higher without increasing your spell slot meaning your 1st level Divine Spells and Arcane Spells are treated as if they're 2nd level spells.

Seriously, it is one of my favorite feats :smalltongue:

On that note: I was at my girlfriends place and then we went over to go play some Werewolf (first time playing on my part). So when I got home I was to tired to go on these forums :smallfrown:

EDIT: you can also take Precocious Apprentice, Southern Magician, Divine Metamagic: Heighten (Not sure if that works for since it only affects your Divine Casting).

[Hirax]

So many ways to do this (Earliest that is possible is at 3rd level). Sanctum Spell. It solves ALL of your problems! :smallbiggrin:

How are you getting 6 ranks in knowledge arcana and religion at level 2 to be able to make theurge your third class level?

[Kelb_Panthera]

How are you getting 6 ranks in knowledge arcana and religion at level 2 to be able to make theurge your third class level?

At maximum cheese you can do it at level 2.

1 level of your divine casting class of choice, plus magical training and precocious apprentice, and a flaw to get sanctum spell.

Then you politely ask a bard to inspire greatness in you giving you 2 extra HD. Politely ask a capable psion to hit you with psychic reformation, allowing you to rearange your skill points, while you're still affected by inspire greatness, to the new 6 rank cap. When inspire greatness goes away so do those bonus HD, but skill ranks don't get affected retroactively because they're the result of skillpoints that were spent legally. You now have the ability to cast 2nd level divine and arcane spells and the requisite 6 ranks in the appropriate skills, at level one.

Try this and you'll find yourself on the wrong end of a DMG with a ballistic trajectory.

There's not much point though. Theurge will only advance your divine casting since your arcane casting doesn't come from a class, but rather a feat; arcane heirophant still gives some juicy class features that wouldn't hurt on a straight divine caster, you'll have to play a bamboo spirit folk as your race though. You could use this to get into the otherwise sub-par geomancer PrC.

Alternately, skip magical training, grab a level each of divine and arcane casting, and otherwise follow the above for genuine theurgy starting on level 3.

[Axier]

I perfer just Theurging an Ur-Priest, less chance of dodging books.

[Snowbluff]

Versatile Spellcaster. Beguiler/Cleric. You only need 5 in the skills, right?

[Arcanist]

How are you getting 6 ranks in knowledge arcana and religion at level 2 to be able to make theurge your third class level?

I said the earliest way to get in was at level 3 (meaning your 4th level will be as a Theurge)... Where in the hell are you getting level 2? :smallconfused:

Clearly Kelb disagrees, but personally, I have a "misguided" belief that if you can't do something yourself then you shouldn't be able to do it at all... Whatever though...

[Kelb_Panthera]

I said the earliest way to get in was at level 3 (meaning your 4th level will be as a Theurge)... Where in the hell are you getting level 2? :smallconfused:

Clearly Kelb disagrees, but personally, I have a "misguided" belief that if you can't do something yourself then you shouldn't be able to do it at all... Whatever though...

I did qualify that whole bit with "at maximum cheese" I tend to agree that for actuall play that sort of thing is simply not to be done, RAW legal or not.

[Gavinfoxx]

I think you can make your 3rd level Theurge and have it advance your class spells... right?

[Kelb_Panthera]

I think you can make your 3rd level Theurge and have it advance your class spells... right?

Under the thing I described?

In that setup you can enter theurge (or one of those other classes) on your second character level, but you'll only be advancing as a divine caster. You'd have to wait till third if you wanted to advance both, and 4th is the earliest you can get in without having other characters aid you.

edit: oh, forgot to mention a necessary adjustment for getting into arcane heirophant. You need the trackless step feature which is available either at Druid 4 or if you play a bamboo spirit folk.

[Hirax]

I said the earliest way to get in was at level 3 (meaning your 4th level will be as a Theurge)... Where in the hell are you getting level 2? :smallconfused:

Clearly Kelb disagrees, but personally, I have a "misguided" belief that if you can't do something yourself then you shouldn't be able to do it at all... Whatever though...

Calm down, why the snarkiness? I reread your post, and maybe I'm alone, but the way it's worded to me implies that level 3 would be theurge.



edit: oh, forgot to mention a necessary adjustment for getting into arcane heirophant. You need the trackless step feature which is available either at Druid 4 or if you play a bamboo spirit folk.

1 level in wildrunner (RotW) gets you trackless step. Not necessarily a fun detour, but there you go.