Excuse to boost stats?

[Reogan]

I'm currently running a 3.5 game in which I have a party that is (for various reasons) mostly considered criminal by the evil society. Thus, they cannot find much in the way of refuge and are constantly besieged by everyone they meet. This has been going well for the first three levels.

Now they are reaching level four, and a terrible problem has come to my attention. The party Paladin has a Strength of 14, a Charisma of 12, and a Wisdom of 10. He has no good scores. Strength is the highest he can manage. I know it's my fault for letting it happen, and I regret I didn't realize before now. At this point, he is clearly too weak to last long.

I want to fix this. I want to find an in-game reason to give him an ample boost to Wis or Cha, but I'm not sure how. Is there a way I could bring in an item (they are about to enter a wizard's dungeon-vault where it could be hidden) without the Bard or Cleric claiming the Wisdom or Dexterity for their own?

Any ideas would help. Thanks for your time.

[NichG]

The Paladin could receive a wish from someone. Its a standard fairytale trope to have some old beggar actually be a powerful supernatural creature in disguise, testing the hospitality/generosity/virtue/whatever of mortals for its own particular purposes. If the Paladin is being Paladiny, he might be more likely to go help someone the other PCs would shrug off. Of course, you have to make it fair if you do something like this, and if another PC passes the test they'd get the wish.

If you really want it to be very specific to the Paladin, have his deity give him a quest. Maybe there's some sacred relic that, when you do the relic quests, grants you stat buffs when it is wielded. If the others don't worship that deity, they can't use it.

[hisnamehere]

Firstly, are you playing a highly optimized game?
If not, why do you feel absolutely, terribly, overwhelmingly compelled to grant this player preference on the subject poor ability score choice? Can't the player learn of his/her mistake on their own? Can't the character be fun/effective without being over-optimized?
If yes, this is not very optimized. Was the player not aware of this? Are they not an optimizer? If not, do they need to be to have fun? Is the player currently enjoying their character?

Secondly, the easiest way to give a paladin-specific item is to make it a 'Holy' item, usable (to full effect) only by paladins. This has traditionally been a 'holy sword', but could conceivably be any item. A holy item granting bonuses to paladin ability scores makes perfect sense.
However, remember that you don't want to make this item look like a gift. The above-mentioned side-quest for the paladin is a good idea. Also, granting the other characters a gift as well will make the paladin's gift more palatable to the other players.

Happy gaming!

[hex0]

Give him the Saint template (BOED)?

[danzibr]

Give him the Saint template (BOED)?
+1
fillerfiller

[Kelb_Panthera]

I'm currently running a 3.5 game in which I have a party that is (for various reasons) mostly considered criminal by the evil society. Thus, they cannot find much in the way of refuge and are constantly besieged by everyone they meet. This has been going well for the first three levels.

Now they are reaching level four, and a terrible problem has come to my attention. The party Paladin has a Strength of 14, a Charisma of 12, and a Wisdom of 10. He has no good scores. Strength is the highest he can manage. I know it's my fault for letting it happen, and I regret I didn't realize before now. At this point, he is clearly too weak to last long.

I want to fix this. I want to find an in-game reason to give him an ample boost to Wis or Cha, but I'm not sure how. Is there a way I could bring in an item (they are about to enter a wizard's dungeon-vault where it could be hidden) without the Bard or Cleric claiming the Wisdom or Dexterity for their own?

Any ideas would help. Thanks for your time.

When you say "He's clearly too weak to last long," are you basing that entirely on those abilities or has he been struggling to survive thus far?

Fact is; except for in fairly high-op settings, the importance of the starting abilities tends to get a bit over-stated around here. Those numbers are certainly nothing to write home about, but they can suffice in a mid or low-op environment. He'll still get his spells if he picks up a wis booster. Cha, while nice to have for saves and smites, is somewhat superfluous unless he was planning on relying heavily on divine feats (nightsticks can pick up the slack if you're okay with them.) Str 14 is the expected +2 for a 3rd level character (going by the expectations that the designers were balancing toward) so he's only behind in str by high-op standards.

Unless he has an abysmal (read; 11 or less) con score, he'll be fine unless you're running a fairly high-op game.

Evidence speaks louder than conjecture though, so I ask again; has he been struggling so far?

[MarsRendac]

The Paladin could receive a wish from someone. Its a standard fairytale trope to have some old beggar actually be a powerful supernatural creature in disguise, testing the hospitality/generosity/virtue/whatever of mortals for its own particular purposes. If the Paladin is being Paladiny, he might be more likely to go help someone the other PCs would shrug off. Of course, you have to make it fair if you do something like this, and if another PC passes the test they'd get the wish.

A noble djinni could do this, assuming he has Change Shape like an efreeti. Perhaps have him test the Paladin's commitment to law by acting CG to ambiguously CN until the Paladin has no choice but to subdue him and put him in chains. Surprise! You passed the test, and you have also captured a noble djinni.

Kelb is on the right track anyway, though. If he's not struggling and it's low-mid op, he'll be fine when he picks up a few magic items.

[Kelb_Panthera]

It occurs to me that there is one really ham-fisted way to do this.

Technically, you could place one of the tome or manual of +X <ability> items that's specific to paladins in his path. As in a manual of gainful excersize +2, but only usable by a paladin. The item creation guidlines in the DMG -do- cover the possible creation of such an item, but like I said, it's ham-fisted as all get-out.

Just tell the players flat, "I don't want him to have to roll a new character this early in the game, and I think his stats are going to get him killed entirely too soon, so I've laid this in your path to fix something that's broken, not to give him any sort of favoritism or unfair advantage. I'd do the same for any of you if your stats were so cripplingly low." It'll ring hollow if you used a point buy, but for rolled stats it -might- just fly.

[Jane_Smith]

Or you can just have a sit down with him, and say I know your struggling, and just give him the bonus points he needs to be average/superior, and act like nothing changed at all in game and he was just having a run of bad luck. Or food poisoning.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Or you can just have a sit down with him, and say I know your struggling, and just give him the bonus points he needs to be average/superior, and act like nothing changed at all in game and he was just having a run of bad luck. Or food poisoning.

^ also a good suggestion.

[Xefas]

Or you can just have a sit down with him, and say I know your struggling, and just give him the bonus points he needs to be average/superior, and act like nothing changed at all in game and he was just having a run of bad luck. Or food poisoning.

The party wakes up one morning.

"Good news, guys! The gout's gone!"

The paladin shoves his fist through a nearby brick wall and strangles a warlock to death on the other side, before grabbing his sword and doing a backflip out the front door.

[Slipperychicken]

Just get him to sink his 4th level ability point into Wisdom. Mention that he can't cast his spells otherwise. No shenanigans, ham-fisted items, or rule-breaking required. Putting his bonus ability score points into Wisdom every four levels will get him his spellcasting on time.

[Reogan]

Those who say I probably don't need to: I do. He's the weakest in the party, a victim of bad rolls. I fixed everyone else up so they could do well in the very dangerous world I made, but I missed him. They were all first time players, and he could not have known better, and even if he had, his scores are where they are most useful.

You all make very good points. I worry about handing him a magic item because I don't want to make a world where those are so easily gained, even if it is just once. Fixing him quietly by just raising the scores wouldn't be "real". I like the idea of the god blessing him, as the world is such that Vecna has seized power, so Heironeous' last hope might be our Lawful Stupid friend. I also like the idea of his ailment leaving him overnight making him better.

What if I were to have his god call on him in a dream as last of the Paladins (a conceivable thing) and charge him to right the world (already the party's overarching goal)? He could use divine mumbo-jumbo to age him. You see, our Paladin is sixteen. His low scores could be because he is young and foolish. By advancing him in age, we could add a prefrontal cortex and a bit of testosterone to fix everything. Yes?

[MarsRendac]

What if I were to have his god call on him in a dream as last of the Paladins (a conceivable thing) and charge him to right the world (already the party's overarching goal)? He could use divine mumbo-jumbo to age him. You see, our Paladin is sixteen. His low scores could be because he is young and foolish. By advancing him in age, we could add a prefrontal cortex and a bit of testosterone to fix everything. Yes?

Excellent idea.

[Sugashane]

I like the divine option listed above. Really seems perfect. Another is to work it around as this:

The young Paladin and his party enter the city, road-weary and ready for a hot meal. As they are passing the temple of Heironeous, a cleric runs to the Paladin. The cleric excitedly tells the party that Heironeous has told him to keep an eye wary for the Paladin, as Heironeous has work for him. To show his faith to Heironeous, the Paladin must take part in a ritual, one in which he will be blessed by his deity through the high priest. The ritual will bind the Paladin to Heironeous, thus giving him the strength needed to carry out his crusade.

Through a ritual of blood and magic, the Paladin is changed. The party waits outside the sanctuary, until they see the new Paladin emerge. The Paladin, standing 8 inches taller, and even much more broad, walks toward them shakily, the only sound his tentative footsteps and rapid tapping of sweat hitting the marble floor. The transformation was exhausting, causing not only drastic physical changes, but also of the mind and spirit. No longer was there doubt and indecision. No longer did he question his true purpose, know seeing his cause in perfect clarity.

As the Paladin sits at the bench, the rest of the party notices just how drastic the changes are. His hair is now long, chin and jaw are broad, and but most of all, his eyes are intense. Where there was a curiosity and a caring demeanor, now replaced with eyes of silver, cold as steel and just as sharp. The party realizes, one by one, the Paladin now bears an eerie resemblance to the 20 foot statue he now rested before.


This will allow for the ability changes you wanted and some additional flavor.
The size and muscularity changes could add 4 to his strength, and 8 to charisma/wisdom (NOT each, but to be split upon the two as you see fit).

The other way of doing it is adding the 4 to strength and a 2 to charisma, and then acting as if he had taken the Vow of Poverty feat at first level. Taking out the AC bonus (or cutting in half), this allows for fairly rapid progression of abilities by late levels (+8/+6/+4/+2 AND the strength, though strength should not be the first ability he is able to modify). There are several ways you can do it, but in my opinion, he should not just get them free, he should have to accept a deal, such as a crusade or task to take as soon as Heironeous calls for him, lest he lose all his abilities and the bond with his deity be broken forever.

[Jane_Smith]

^ And maybe a little bit (+2ish) to constitution as well, just as a little gift or challenge achievement for living this long.

[Pilo]

You should first ask him if he feels weak relatively to other players.

If he does not, you should not do anything to his character.

You can also make him have a pact with a lawful good outsider, when he will die, if his time has come, he should join the eternal battle against evil (war between good and evil in heaven and hell). If he accepts, he will merge with the remain of the soul of a dead angel which will improved him a little.

[prufock]

What if I were to have his god call on him in a dream as last of the Paladins (a conceivable thing) and charge him to right the world (already the party's overarching goal)? He could use divine mumbo-jumbo to age him. You see, our Paladin is sixteen. His low scores could be because he is young and foolish. By advancing him in age, we could add a prefrontal cortex and a bit of testosterone to fix everything. Yes?

Sounds good to me, if the player is on board with it for roleplaying.

And next time... use point buy ;)

[Reogan]

Sounds good to me, if the player is on board with it for roleplaying.

And next time... use point buy ;)

Yeah, I think that will be best.

Thanks all!

[Alaris]

Yeah, I think that will be best.

Thanks all!

That, or set a minimum total stats. That's what my DM, and I do. It makes sure everyone is AT LEAST moderately powerful. They are afterall supposed to be the heroes, right?