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Asta Kask
2012-11-20, 11:26 AM
Revenge? You? I am SMAUG! I kill when I wish! I am strong, strong, STRONG! My armor is like tenfold shields! My teeth like swords! My claws, spears! The shock of my tail, a thunderbolt! My wings, a hurricane! And my breath, death!

So, stat challenge. 3.5 edition. Any ideas?

ETA: Ooops, wrong forum. Can a friendly moderator move it?
supermonkeyjoe
2012-11-20, 12:30 PM
Am I missing something here or are the stats for Smaug not just, well, a Dragon? (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/dragonTrue.htm)


Revenge? You? I am SMAUG! I kill when I wish because I am chaotic evil! I am strong, strong, STRONG MY STRENGTH IS 45! My armor is like tenfold shields AC41! My teeth like swords 4d8 worth of Swords! My claws, 2x 4d6 spears! The shock of my tail, a 4d6 thunderbolt ! My wings, a hurricane of 2d8s! And my breath, death, so long as you don't make a reflex save and have evasion!
Asta Kask
2012-11-20, 12:40 PM
That's no fun. Anyway, he probably has levels in some obscure prestige class (is there a Dwarfkiller prestige class?).
Boci
2012-11-20, 12:40 PM
Am I missing something here or are the stats for Smaug not just, well, a Dragon? (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/dragonTrue.htm)

Unlikely. He cannot cast spells and we never saw him use SLA, he has aledgedly impenetrable hide, yet was brought down by a single arrow once it was bypassed.
Ulm11
2012-11-20, 12:46 PM
The single lucky arrow could represent a house rule where rolling three 20's in a row instantly kills anything, which incidentally explains what happens to Sauron. The lack of actual magic could just be because of Smaug being so arrogant that he does not believe that anything can challenge him enough to get him to cart casting spells.
Asta Kask
2012-11-20, 12:54 PM
IIRC, Smaug tries to cast some kind of hypnotizing spell on Bilbo, but fails because Bilbo never looks into his eyes.

Glaurung could certainly cast spells, but he was the first of his kind.
Urpriest
2012-11-20, 12:56 PM
Unlikely. He cannot cast spells and we never saw him use SLA, he has aledgedly impenetrable hide, yet was brought down by a single arrow once it was bypassed.

Actually, the SLAs for Red Dragons are pretty much explicitly based on things Smaug does in the book. And there are plenty of ways to take away a Dragon's casting.
Eurus
2012-11-20, 12:57 PM
Aren't there some dragon template things that lose spellcasting? Besides Xorvintaal, anyway.
Grimsage Matt
2012-11-20, 12:57 PM
About ze Smaug... DR50/ Dwarfcursed Weapon? Basicly, as a dwarven king dies, the weapons his people made know what killed them, and they thrist for vengence. When used against the killer of their makers, they gain the Doom Epic Property and the Greater Slaying property. Avilable only by DM plot.

DR wise, dat could explain both the arrow, and the one hit kill.
Urpriest
2012-11-20, 01:06 PM
About ze Smaug... DR50/ Dwarfcursed Weapon? Basicly, as a dwarven king dies, the weapons his people made know what killed them, and they thrist for vengence. When used against the killer of their makers, they gain the Doom Epic Property and the Greater Slaying property. Avilable only by DM plot.

DR wise, dat could explain both the arrow, and the one hit kill.

Most things in LotR die to one-hit kills, Boromir exempted. It's just part of the system the setting operates under, not a feature of any particular creature.
Grimsage Matt
2012-11-20, 01:12 PM
Ya, I know, but why not tweak a Red Dragon, give it a special form of DR, and give it a rage abillity, plus some addtions to the whole messing with your head thing?

SPLA and spellwise, might Dragonfire adept be a better choice then sorcerer?
hymer
2012-11-20, 05:14 PM
@ Asta Kask: Where did you find that quote you open the thread with? Is it from the new movie, trailer or something?
On a cursory reading, I find no indication that Bilbo looking Smaug in the eyes would have made the dragon's speech any more powerful. Though certainly Glaurung's most potent mind-affecting abilities use eye contact, if we accept those sources.

@ Boci: Depends what you consider SLA. He shakes Bilbo's faith in the Dwarves when they talk, he is alert even in sleep when he wants to be, and he does something to the treasure he lies on so that it does something bad to Thorin once he reclaims it. Things like that could be called SLAs.

@ Ulm11: What happened to Sauron that the 3 x nat20 you mention would explain?

@ Grimsage Matt: About the Black Arrow. Pertinent, if perhaps a tad far fetched. :) But I agree with the 'only available by DM fiat' thing. That thing is clearly more of a story device than a piece of equipment.
Ulm11
2012-11-21, 02:09 AM
@ Ulm11: What happened to Sauron that the 3 x nat20 you mention would explain?

The fact that Isildur hit the one part of Sauron that could not only hurt him, but kill him whilst lashing out blindly.
hymer
2012-11-21, 06:54 AM
Ah, the movie. I see, thanks.
hamishspence
2012-11-21, 07:17 AM
@ Asta Kask: Where did you find that quote you open the thread with? Is it from the new movie, trailer or something.

It appears to be a shortened version of Smaug's speech from the book.
hymer
2012-11-21, 08:30 AM
@ hamishspence: Tolkien writing a word in all capitals? I hardly think so. :) I'm thinking it's maybe a comic or a movie or some such, based on the book.
Well, or it's not a quote at all.
Alejandro
2012-11-21, 09:34 AM
Smaug is a dragon, a great wyrm red one. Doesn't really need any kind of anti-dwarf powers...he's a great wyrm.

The arrow is an arrow of dragonslaying, or a legacy weapon with powers unique against Smaug.

That quote is what Smaug says to Bilbo in The Hobbit (the book) when Bilbo says they did not come just for treasure, but for revenge (against Smaug.) The capitalized words are not from the text, though.
hymer
2012-11-21, 11:30 AM
We don't seem to have the same text, Alejandro. Here is what it says in my copy:


'Revenge!' he snorted, and the light of his eyes lit the hall from floor to ceiling like scarlet lightning. 'Revenge! The King under the Mountain is dead and where are his kin that dare seek revenge? Girion Lord of Dale is dead, and I have eaten his people like a wolf among sheep, and where are his sons' sons that dare approach me? I kill where I wish and none dare resist. I laid low the warriors of old and their like is not in the world today. Then I was but young and tender. Now I am old and strong, strong, strong, Thief in the Shadows!' he gloated. 'My armour is like tenfold shields, my teeth are swords, my claws spears, the shock of my tail a thunderbolt, my wings a hurricane, and my breath death!'
Jeraa
2012-11-21, 12:02 PM
We don't seem to have the same text, Alejandro. Here is what it says in my copy:

Its not from the book, but from the animated movie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or8G_jDcLNo&feature=related).
hymer
2012-11-21, 12:03 PM
Thank you!
LibraryOgre
2012-11-21, 07:11 PM
ETA: Ooops, wrong forum. Can a friendly moderator move it?

The Mod Wonder: No, but an unfriendly one, can.
LordofBones
2012-11-22, 07:11 AM
The single lucky arrow could represent a house rule where rolling three 20's in a row instantly kills anything, which incidentally explains what happens to Sauron. The lack of actual magic could just be because of Smaug being so arrogant that he does not believe that anything can challenge him enough to get him to cart casting spells.

Isildur cut the Ring from Sauron's prone body, not with a lucky strike.

As for Smaug, I'd go ahead and advance him by an age category or two above the standard great wyrm. He's supposedly almost as fearsome as Ancalagon.