On the terminology of (lesser) globe of invulnerability

[TuggyNE]

So, over at Q&A, mattie_p and I have been having a (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14256535&postcount=124) rather (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14257803&postcount=128) involved (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14257963&postcount=131) discussion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14259494&postcount=135) over a fine point in the wording of lesser globe of invulnerability (and by extension its greater cousin): "Spells of 4th level and higher are not affected by the globe, nor are spells already in effect when the globe is cast" (and "You can leave and return to the globe without penalty") vs. "Note that spell effects are not disrupted unless their effects enter the globe".

Not wanting to disrupt the thread's smooth operation, I decided to take it over here, and see if anyone could shed some light on whether "enter" there refers to spell areas or effects at the time of their casting, or instead (or primarily) refers to spell effects that migrate into the affected area by means of their targeted creature moving into it.

Examples:

Bard casts glibness on self, wizard ally casts lesser globe of invulnerability with area including bard, bard leaves and reenters: does glibness fall off while in the area?
Bard casts eagle's splendor on wizard ally, and then as above.
Wizard casts enlarge person on bard ally, and then as above.


This is primarily a discussion on RAW, although RAI and even RACSD may be of interest as well.

[TypoNinja]

I think there's a typo in the SRD.


Range: 10 ft.
Area: 10-ft.-radius spherical emanation, centered on you

Surely that should be Personal range?

On the other hand, I just opened my PHB to check to see if was an SRD error on the range, PHB shows the same. It also however includes an example not in the SRD that contradicts my first reading.



For example, creatures inside the globe would still see a mirror image created by a caster outsides the globe. If that caster then entered the globe, the images would wink out, to reappear when the caster exited the globe. Likewise a caster standing in the area of a light spell would still receive sufficient illumination for vision, even though that part of the light spell's area that lies within the glove would not be luminous.

So the example seems to contradict my first thoughts on how the spell works. Colour me confused, and unsure.

Hope the example text helps though.

[mattie_p]

I don't think globe should be personal range (that means it affects only the caster). Otherwise the text "You can leave and return to the globe without penalty" would have no meaning. The spell is cast in one of the corners of the caster's square, and remains fixed in that location (not moving with the caster)

Also glibness is a range:personal spell, caster (without shenanigans) puts it on himself. (Same with mirror image, I think you choose poor examples to cast on others)

That aside, in all three cases, the spell fades, as the person leaving and re-entering the globe is not the caster.

OK, example time.


An immobile, faintly shimmering magical sphere surrounds you and excludes all spell effects of 3rd level or lower. The area or effect of any such spells does not include the area of the lesser globe of invulnerability. Such spells fail to affect any target located within the globe. Cleric outside casts zone of truth after the globe is up, the zone does not include the area within the globe. Wizard outside casts magic missile targeting someone inside the globe, does not work.
Excluded effects include spell-like abilities and spells or spell-like effects from items. Wands of the above don't work either. Aasimar uses daylight on a pebble, and throws it into the globe, the daylight is suppressed.
However, any type of spell can be cast through or out of the magical globe.wizard on the inside casts magic missile to one on the outside. OK. Wizard on the outside casts magic missile, targeting someone 50' away. missile travels through the globe. That's ok too.
Spells of 4th level and higher are not affected by the globe, nor are spells already in effect when the globe is cast. Cleric above has an active zone of truth when the globe is cast, zone of truth remains.
The globe can be brought down by a targeted dispel magic spell, but not by an area dispel magic. You can leave and return to the globe without penalty.

Note that spell effects are not disrupted unless their effects enter the globe, and even then they are merely suppressed, not dispelled.

I hope this better explains my position

[TuggyNE]

Surely that should be Personal range?

On the other hand, I just opened my PHB to check to see if was an SRD error on the range, PHB shows the same. It also however includes an example not in the SRD that contradicts my first reading.

No, Range also limits the area available: any area that extends outside the range is wasted. (So, as mattie_p said, it would only affect the caster, and would no longer have an area.)


So the example seems to contradict my first thoughts on how the spell works. Colour me confused, and unsure.

Hope the example text helps though.

It does. It seems that my reading (going only by the SRD) was wrong.


Also glibness is a range:personal spell, caster (without shenanigans) puts it on himself. (Same with mirror image, I think you choose poor examples to cast on others)

I really did. I have no idea what I was thinking. Fixed.


I hope this better explains my position

No, your position was quite clear from your first post; what wasn't clear* was your reasoning for that — i.e., why your reading was the only possible correct one, especially given the apparent oddities. TypoNinja's example, however, provides a decent enough reason to accept it (and seemingly the oddities are intended?).


*and technically still isn't :smalltongue:

[mattie_p]

what wasn't clear* was your reasoning for that —

*and technically still isn't :smalltongue:

Clear as mud where I'm sitting, I don't see your problem :smalltongue:

I'm glad TypoNinja was able to help, at least.