Super-cheesy trick with homunculus (please, don't throw rocks at me)

[Clistenes]

I've been thinking: It is said that the cost of an item that grants you a feat should be around 10000 gp, plus another 5000 gp per prerrequisite. If the Item doesn't occupy a body slot (and doesn't need to be held, like a rod, sword or staff), it should cost double.

Improved Homunculus has two prerrequisites, so 20.000 gp.
Improved Familiar has one prerrequisite, so 15.000 gp.
An item that grants both and doesn't occupy a body slot should cost 70.000 gp.

So, if a guy crafted and homunculus and added both feats not to himself, but to the homunculus itself...could he make it an improved homunculus familiar for those extra 70.000 gp?

That wouldn't be expensive for a high-level character, and the homunculus would be quite a good scout, spy, watcher and worker (it could use your craft, proffesion and survival skills instead of its own).

As I said, please, don't throw rocks at me!

[Acanous]

I don't see how this is cheesy for 70k.

If you could do it for under 5, then sure. But 70? That's not game-breaking at all.

[Clistenes]

I don't see how this is cheesy for 70k.

If you could do it for under 5, then sure. But 70? That's not game-breaking at all.

Many people thinks that any homebrew magical item that grants the use of feats is cheesy, no matter its price.

[lord_khaine]

No to mention, since there isnt actualy any rules about making item that grants feats, then its up to the GM.

So this isnt cheese, its asking the gm for permission :smallfrown:

edit.


Many people thinks that any homebrew magical item that grants the use of feats is cheesy, no matter its price.

Homebrew isnt Cheese, its homebrew.

[Clistenes]

No to mention, since there isnt actualy any rules about making item that grants feats, then its up to the GM.

So this isnt cheese, its asking the gm for permission :smallfrown:

edit.



Homebrew isnt Cheese, its homebrew.

Arms & Equipment Guide offered some rules for items that grant feats.

And the cheesy part comes from crafting items that grant feats, not from the homebrew part. A high-level or epic character could buy a ring that grants a dozen bonus feats, or even worse, hire a spellcaster with the Inscribe Tattoo and Craft Wondrous Item feats and ask him/her to cover his/her skin with tattoos that grant feats.

[Spuddles]

Improved Homunculus' store infusion is pretty handy. A MM1 homunculus only costs 1k gold, so you can get infusion storage for pretty cheap.

[edit]
Homunculus get more feats when they get more HD, yes?

edit again: looks like it costs 3k gold to get infusion, cause you gotta buy another couple HD.

[Psyren]

Considering that DCFS, Feat Battery and Heroics are all free, this shouldn't be a problem.

[Clistenes]

Homunculus get more feats when they get more HD, yes?


Yes, but I guess you have to pay gold and xp for the extra HD if you want to get the extra feats, skills and Improved Homunculus powers.

[Wookie-ranger]

Considering that DCFS, Feat Battery and Heroics are all free, this shouldn't be a problem.

I am unfamiliar with this. Could you elaborate?

[Clistenes]

I am unfamiliar with this. Could you elaborate?

I think it goes like this:

Mirror Move is a 2º level spell that allows you to copy any feat you have seen in use recently (past 10 rounds). You can copy as many feats as your int bonus plus one, and keep them 1 min / level. Heroics is 2º level too, and if gives you any fighter feat for 10 min/level even if you haven't seen it recently.

Embrace the Dark Chaos from the Fiendish Codex allows you to change a feat you have for a tainted "evil" feat.

Shun the Dark Chaos allows you to lose a tainted feat and get a non-tainted feat whose prerrequisites you fulfill.

The thing is, Embrace the Dark Chaos doesn't mention the feat you replace must be permanent and, on the other hand, the feats that Shun the Dark Chaos grant are explicitly permanent, so you are exchanging temporary feats for permanent feats for free.

A case of RAW taken too far.

[Kelb_Panthera]

I think it goes like this:

Mirror Move is a 2º level spell that allows you to copy any feat you have seen in use recently (past 10 rounds). You can copy as many feats as your int bonus plus one, and keep them 1 min / level. Heroics is 2º level too, and if gives you any fighter feat for 10 min/level even if you haven't seen if recently.

Embrace the Dark Chaos from the Fiendish Codex allows you to change a feat you have for a tainted "evil" feat.

Shun the Dark Chaos allows you to lose a tainted feat and get a non-tainted feat whose prerrequisites you fulfill.

The thing is, Embrace the Dark Chaos doesn't mention the feat you replace must be permanent and, on the other hand, the feats that Shun the Dark Chaos grant are explicitly permanent, so you are exchanging temporary feats for permanent feats for free.

A case of RAW taken too far.

Abyssal heritor feats (what you trade in and out with embrace/shun the dark chaos) are inherently chaotic, not inherently evil.

[Glimbur]

Considering that DCFS, Feat Battery and Heroics are all free, this shouldn't be a problem.

Does't the feat shuffle require XP to cast Embrace/Shun? There are, of course, ways around that, but at the baseline it's not free.

[Clistenes]

Does't the feat shuffle require XP to cast Embrace/Shun? There are, of course, ways around that, but at the baseline it's not free.

250 xp to get the Abyssal Inheritor feat and another 250 xp to get the normal one.

And yes, the Abyssal Inheritor aren't evil, but chaotic. The fact that they twist your appearance confused me.

[Psyren]

Does't the feat shuffle require XP to cast Embrace/Shun? There are, of course, ways around that, but at the baseline it's not free.

Meant gp-wise. But even at the standard exchange rate, 500xp beats the tar out of 70k gold.

[Clistenes]

Meant gp-wise. But even at the standard exchange rate, 500xp beats the tar out of 70k gold.

Yes, but if you want to own the feats permanently, there is a much greater chance that your DM will allow you to craft a magical ring that grants a few feats, or even a magical tattoo, that of allowing you to pull a Dark Chaos Shuffle. Maybe a really generous one could allow to use it if you keep the new feats only for the duration of the original Heroics spell.

[TuggyNE]

Yes, but if you want to own the feats permanently, there is a much greater chance that your DM will allow you to craft a magical ring that grants a few feats, or even a magical tattoo, that of allowing you to pull a Dark Chaos Shuffle.

That's because (wait for it)


... crafting an expensive magic item for a few feats isn't as cheesy. :smallcool:

[Spuddles]

Meant gp-wise. But even at the standard exchange rate, 500xp beats the tar out of 70k gold.

That's a pretty dirty trick, and I'm not sure that should necessarily serve as a baseline cost. Not for most games, anyway. 500xp works out to what, 2500gp?

That's actually surprisingly close to what lame feats cost, actually.