View Full Version : If Belkar joined team evil.
JennTora
2012-11-27, 09:13 PM
Thinking about this is kind of fun. I'm wondering how everyone thinks it would go if Belkar were a minion of Xykon. Would they get along well, or would belkar end up pissing him off at some point and become a Zombelk? Or maybe Xykon kills Mr. Scruffy and Belkar goes all broken sword on his ass.
Winter
2012-11-28, 06:22 AM
They'd get along very well and had a lot of fun. I think Xykon would enjoy a horrible bastard as Belkar very much (he'd consider him to be some sort of toy he can throw at living beings).
Xykon would probably enjoy breaking Belkar by doing something bad to Mr. Scruffy as well. From that point on, they'd not like each other very much but they'd still form a formidable Team of Evil.
Chloe Seven
2012-12-04, 11:04 AM
I can't imagine them ever working together. Neither is the type to accept orders, and both are very arrogant and like being in charge. They'd come to blows in a single conversation.
Gorfnod
2012-12-04, 11:13 AM
THIS
They'd get along very well and had a lot of fun. I think Xykon would enjoy a horrible bastard as Belkar very much (he'd consider him to be some sort of toy he can throw at living beings).
UNTIL THIS
Xykon would probably enjoy breaking Belkar by doing something bad to Mr. Scruffy as well. From that point on, they'd not like each other very much but they'd still form a formidable Team of Evil.
THEN THIS
I can't imagine them ever working together. Neither is the type to accept orders, and both are very arrogant and like being in charge. They'd come to blows in a single conversation.
King of Nowhere
2012-12-04, 02:19 PM
Yes, I agree too. At first they'll get along very well, but at some point they would break up because both want to be in charge. once this happens belkar's life expectation can be measured in seconds.
Winter
2012-12-05, 03:09 AM
I can't imagine them ever working together. Neither is the type to accept orders, and both are very arrogant and like being in charge. They'd come to blows in a single conversation.
Belkar works with Roy, who is also a control freak, lawful on top of that and good on top of that and on top of that, Roy forbids Belkar from doing all the fun things he want to do. And Roy is arrogant as well.
When Belkar can work with Roy I really see now issue at all of him working with another control freak but who is much less controllish than Roy.
Nephrahim
2012-12-05, 05:01 AM
I can't help but think they'd get along fine. Belkar has shown he's more then willing to take orders if it gets him what he wants, and under Xykon he would be free to do anything other then cross him.
I don't see why he would hurt the cat. It's not like it's just a random animal, it's a class feature. I don't think Xkyon ever went around torturing Tusiko's ghasts.
Winter
2012-12-05, 07:36 AM
If you think there is anything Xykon would not do out of cruelty or to break someone... you really need to read Start of Darkness.
Xykon did not have to break Tsukiko because she already was as loyal as it gets towards him.
King of Nowhere
2012-12-05, 04:11 PM
belkar works under roy, true, but he's hard to control anyway. roy has developed a sort of "soft control" that consist mostly in letting belkar do what he wants whenever it don't go much against team's objective, and reining him with treaths otherwise. Xykon would not be that patient. they would get along fine as long as xykon never ask belkar to do something he really don't want to. that may take weeks, years, or never, but once it happens, belkar is going to refuse and xykon would smoke him or break him.
Maybe that changed after his character's growth (I can't believe it's been already four years in real world time!) but still he's used to the good guys being much more permissive with him. Xykon would be eveno more permissive in some ways, but much more restrictive in others.
rewinn
2012-12-05, 05:52 PM
Xykon's major joy in life is killing things.
Belkar's major you in life is killing things (...except, now, maybe enjoying the company of Mr. Scruffy...)
They really don't have any conflict. Belkar's willing to play along with a party leader, so long as he gets to kill things. It doesn't seem likely that Xykon would stop Belkar from killing anything except possibly Redcloak, and even there Xykon would enjoy watching them duke it out (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0369.html).
Chloe Seven
2012-12-06, 10:58 AM
Belkar works with Roy, who is also a control freak, lawful on top of that and good on top of that and on top of that, Roy forbids Belkar from doing all the fun things he want to do. And Roy is arrogant as well.
When Belkar can work with Roy I really see now issue at all of him working with another control freak but who is much less controllish than Roy.Roy treats his "underlings" very differently than Xykon does. Belkar might chafe under Roy's restrictions, but he goes along with them. The first time Xykon made an arrogant or disparaging comment toward Belkar (probably about height) he'd either go immediately berserk, or start plotting against him.
King of Nowhere
2012-12-06, 02:28 PM
Xykon's major joy in life is killing things.
Belkar's major you in life is killing things (...except, now, maybe enjoying the company of Mr. Scruffy...)
They really don't have any conflict
Roy's main concern is protecting the weak and fighting evil.
Miko's main concern is protecting the weak and fighting evil.
The two shouldn't have had any conflict if we follow this reasoning...
People will not get along just because they have a big passion in common. I've seen many couples of people who had much in common break over some of the things they hadn't. And other with little in common get along exactly because they had no point of conflict. I found out that among my best friends I have much in common with some, and almost nothing with others. I tried several time to figure out what is that I look for in other people, and could never understand. What makes people get on well together is really one of the most unpredictable forces in the universe.
With that argument I should say that we can't know if belkar and xykon would be fine with each other because of the unpredictability of said forces. But I still think it would not work, because Xykon don't really "get along" with anyone. he has no friends, he only bosses people around. Sometimes he's amused by them, but that's it. Xykon don't care what you do as long as you obey his orders and don't interfere with his plans. And that is something completely different from accepting roy's orders.
But who knows, maybe belkar would have enough survival instinct to obey xykon even the times it smarts and so the two of them could be fine. But I doubt he would like that more than adventuring with roy.
JennTora
2012-12-10, 12:03 PM
Roy treats his "underlings" very differently than Xykon does. Belkar might chafe under Roy's restrictions, but he goes along with them. The first time Xykon made an arrogant or disparaging comment toward Belkar (probably about height) he'd either go immediately berserk, or start plotting against him.
Belkar can plot?
rewinn
2012-12-10, 06:47 PM
Miko's main concern is protecting the weak and fighting evil.
...
Eh, not really.
Miko was most concerned about being right. Rather than pause and assess a situation and consider the possibilities, she always or nearly always assumed that her snap judgment was correct and launched an attack. That's o.k. when she was fighting ogres or the OOTS itself, because she had the ability to win straight-up battles, but when the stuff started getting real, it got her smacked down out of paladinhood (robbing Azure City of the leader it needed to defend itself against Xykon) and then, due to her stubborn refusal to learn her lesson, it got her killed (allowing Xykon/Red Cloak to escape and then occupy Azure city).
Xykon and Belkar are both chaotic evil stone cold killers. If the opportunity arose, they'd enjoy killing each other as much as anyone else, but otherwise they could actually form as real a friendship as either is capable of.
Starbuck_II
2012-12-10, 07:31 PM
Thinking about this is kind of fun. I'm wondering how everyone thinks it would go if Belkar were a minion of Xykon. Would they get along well, or would belkar end up pissing him off at some point and become a Zombelk? Or maybe Xykon kills Mr. Scruffy and Belkar goes all broken sword on his ass.
I'd perfer to see Belkar with a Helm of opposite Alignment work with team evil: after all he is currently evil working with team good.
Carry2
2012-12-11, 04:12 PM
Miko was most concerned about being right. Rather than pause and assess a situation and consider the possibilities, she always or nearly always assumed that her snap judgment was correct and launched an attack...
While that's a fair assessment of one of Miko's principle faults during the later stages of her *ahem* character arc, she seemed remarkably willing to consider the possibility of, e.g, the OOTS actually having a troupe of evil twins.
I'm also not sure it's fair to say that 'being right' was always her dominant motive. There are much safer ways to insert yourself in a position of authority and piss all over the little people than going out into the field to risk injury and death for the sake of The Right Thing. (It's a little like saying that rich people's philanthropy is mostly about improving their image, given that there must be cheaper ways to fund a PR campaign.)
With that argument I should say that we can't know if belkar and xykon would be fine with each other because of the unpredictability of said forces. But I still think it would not work, because Xykon don't really "get along" with anyone. he has no friends, he only bosses people around. Sometimes he's amused by them, but that's it. Xykon don't care what you do as long as you obey his orders and don't interfere with his plans. And that is something completely different from accepting roy's orders.
But who knows, maybe belkar would have enough survival instinct to obey xykon even the times it smarts and so the two of them could be fine. But I doubt he would like that more than adventuring with roy.
This, I agree with.
Whatever else Belkar is, he's a PC. An adventurer. He's not going to settle for being someone else's henchman, even if that "someone else" is practically a god. He goes along with Roy because Roy gives him plenty of opportunities for violence (without nasty consequences), and satisfies his wanderlust - gives him an acceptable level of excitement, change and challenge to keep him interested.
From Xykon's side, what he needs is dedicated, methodical, knowledgeable lieutenants like Redcloak and 'Suki. He doesn't need a dangerous loose cannon with no attention span. (He's already got the MitD, who more than fills that niche in his team.)
Winter
2012-12-12, 02:54 AM
He goes along with Roy because Roy gives him plenty of opportunities for violence (without nasty consequences), and satisfies his wanderlust - gives him an acceptable level of excitement, change and challenge to keep him interested.
No, he goes along with Roy because he does not think about it. He slipped somehow into that group and his personal horizon has never wandered beyond the group.
He lived with the solutions Roy came up with because he never seriously thought about leaving but just stumbled on through his life.
He did not even think about it (only afterwards) when Tsukiko bluntly made a job offer.
Belkar is still following Roy because he is too stupid and too lazy to see that Roy isn't the relationship he wants to be in.
mrzomby
2012-12-19, 08:30 AM
Belkar can plot?
He's not good at it, but he can plot to get miko fallen, or get street cred for being arrested by a paladin.
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