[PF] Android Barbarian?

[Arutema]

The Inner Sea Bestiary statted out Androids as a playable race, here are the specifics:

+2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, –2 Charisma: OK, no bonus to Str or Con, but a penalty to the universal barbarian dump stat.

Darkvision and Low-Light Vision: OK

Emotionless: -4 to Sense Motive checks. What barbarian tries to be good at Sense Motive?

Nanite Surge: A bonus of 3+your character level to one d20 roll per day. Useful.

And then the big complication:
Constructed (Ex): For the purposes of effects targeting creatures by type (such as a ranger’s favored enemy and bane weapons), androids count as both humanoids and constructs.

Androids gain a +4 racial bonus on all saving throws against mind-affecting
effects, paralysis, poison, and stun effects, are not subject to fatigue
or exhaustion, and are immune to disease and sleep effects. Androids can never gain morale bonuses, and are immune to fear effects and all emotion-based effects.

No morale bonuses means we never gain Str, Con or Will save bonuses from rage, but still take the -2 AC penalty. Terrible Barbarians right?

"Androids ... are not subject to fatigue or exhaustion."

Yes, that's right, free rage-cycling, at level 1. Not so handy at level 1, but then at level 2 we start getting rage powers, some of which can only be used once per rage. But you can start and stop your rage as a free action with no downside, so that is no longer a limit.

What rage powers are worth taking to abuse this trait, and can they make up for what the Android lacks in the rage department?

[tzar1990]

-Eater of Magic: Re-roll a saving throw, and gain temporary HP if you succeed the second time.

-Knockdown: Decent control if you can use if once per turn.

-Powerful Blow and Crippling Blow: Free ability damage? Papa likes!

-Spell Sunder: **** you and your buffs, wizard!

-Strength Surge: Use it with Knockdown to pretty much guarantee that their ass hits the floor.

-Unexpected Strike: Free attack of opportunity against anyone who moves through a square you threaten.

Not too much here for a normal barbarian. However, this, combined with your natural immunities to most mind-affecting stuff, makes you rather good as a wizard-****er. Fun fact: Knockdown+Strength Surge+Surge means that anyone you hit will go down - we're talking +21 to your trip attempt - and you can keep AoO'ing them anytime they try to crawl away.


Anyone else have any good ideas?

[Jaxile]

Am Android Barbarian.
Am Kill Without Rage.
Am Speaking In Monotone.

[Raven777]

Hasta la vista, baby. :smallcool:

[Zubrowka74]

I don't know. As a DM I'd probably dissallow rage powers as well. I mean : an android is a product of technology (or magic) and what's the anythesis of technology and magic ? Right.

[TopCheese]

I don't know. As a DM I'd probably dissallow rage powers as well. I mean : an android is a product of technology (or magic) and what's the anythesis of technology and magic ? Right.

..... This is why I don't play under certain DM. Randomly applying logic that isn't logical in a game that is all about fantasy.

Anyways at the OP: Android Barbarian is fantastic, the rage itself is NOT a moral bonus nor is the rage powers (unless they give a bonus say like superstitious). Fantastic, not the most optimized fighter but fantastic none the less.

Maybe somehow make a dervish dancer who uses "come and get me"?

How many levels of Archer Fighter does it take to be able to shoot bows in melee range without an AoO?

I think there might be a way to work all this in... But take the archetype Urban Rager (I think) not because it isn't a moral bonus but because you can use dex and concentration while raging ;)

[Feralventas]

You can stop and start your rage as a free action, but each round you use your rage or rage powers would probably count against your limit of rounds per day (4+con mod+2/barbarian level).

The rest sounds good, but where you were talking about limitless rage this seemed to be an over-looked detail.

[Slipperychicken]

You can stop and start your rage as a free action, but each round you use your rage or rage powers would probably count against your limit of rounds per day (4+con mod+2/barbarian level).

The rest sounds good, but where you were talking about limitless rage this seemed to be an over-looked detail.

If you only rage-cycle once per round, it shouldn't pose an additional cost (do turn, end rage right before your next turn, then restart the rage). Aside from your Con score bouncing around (which isn't a problem for an Android, it seems), which may KO you if you aren't careful. Once you've got rage-rounds to spare you can afford to "nova" more often.

[Zubrowka74]

..... This is why I don't play under certain DM. Randomly applying logic that isn't logical in a game that is all about fantasy.

You're mixing un realism with logic and consistency. Androids, magic and barbarian are not consistent with our reality (well, a case could be made for the barbarian but let's stick with the fantasy barbarian)
but with the fantassy world. And this world does have a logic. Therefor, unless the specific setting calls for magic-loving or tech-loving barbarians, I don't see it consistent with the internal logic of generic D&D.

That does not mean it cannot be played, only that it would take a specific setting of type of game to put in. I personnally define my barbarians as opposed to tech / magic.

[Deepbluediver]

I don't know. As a DM I'd probably dissallow rage powers as well.

I feel sort of the same way, though for different reasons.

The android has a quality of "Emotionless" and last time I checked, Rage was an emotion. But if you want to play an android-barbarian without rage, be my guest.

I would normally say that both fun and mechanics trump logic, but in this case it seems to be less about ignoring logic and more about spitting in logic's face while you steal his lunch and flirt with his girlfriend.

[Feralventas]

If you only rage-cycle once per round, it shouldn't pose an additional cost (do turn, end rage right before your next turn, then restart the rage). Aside from your Con score bouncing around (which isn't a problem for an Android, it seems), which may KO you if you aren't careful. Once you've got rage-rounds to spare you can afford to "nova" more often.

Even if there is nothing preventing this in the rage description itself, this is blatant and clear violation of the purpose of there Being a limit on rage rounds per day. I'd advise against this unless the DM is already allowing similarly ridiculous things such as Bag of Holding+Portable Hole Arrows and Iron Heart Surge to mitigate Gravity or Mortality.

[Raven777]

Put my foot in my mouth, can't delete own posts, moving on.

[tadkins]

Is that you, General Grievous?

[CTrees]

On the "would you allow it," compared to a normal barbarian you get to use rage powers with less lag time in exchange for not gaining the stat bonuses of raging. You're also still saddled with the -2 AC, and don't get any extra uses per day. Mechanically, this does not seem overpowered.

Flavor-wise, the first issue is that fluff is mutable. If the default doesn't work, come up with something different. Even keeping the default fluff, I can see it working:

*Darby the android barbarian strolls into a bar*
Drunkard: "Look at this guy, with his stupid face. Hey, screw you, guy!"
*Drunkard takes a swing at Darby*
Darby: "Activating 'Rage' subroutine..."
*Darby's face snaps into the image of a snarl, no less fixed and artificial than his normal blank expression*
Darby: "'Strength Surge' initiated. Performing 'Knockdown' maneuver."
*Darby slams the bumbling drunkard to the floor with superhuman strength, but the energy to power that attack drained from his defensive systems, leaving him open to a second drunkard smashing a bottle into his head*

Etc.

[doko239]

I suggest the Urban Barbarian archetype for this trick, since you don't care about the stat boosts anyways.

[Slipperychicken]

Even if there is nothing preventing this in the rage description itself, this is blatant and clear violation of the purpose of there Being a limit on rage rounds per day. I'd advise against this unless the DM is already allowing similarly ridiculous things such as Bag of Holding+Portable Hole Arrows and Iron Heart Surge to mitigate Gravity or Mortality.

It's not giving the character more rage rounds per day than normal, just allowing him to use the 1/rage powers more often. He'll still exhaust them at the normal rate, or even faster if he wants to use 1/rage powers more than once per round. It seems pretty reasonable to me, since most of those powers just aren't worth it at 1/encounter.



Flavor-wise, the first issue is that fluff is mutable. If the default doesn't work, come up with something different.

Several possible explanations:

"COMBAT SEQUENCE ENGAGED"

It's a program which removes the normal limits on activity, which boosts reflexes and coordination, but also would fry his circuits if continued for too long. His system automatically kicks back into normal mode before it becomes unsafe.

He's powered much like a magic item is. Many magic items run on charges per day, some of which allow them to exceed normal usage if multiples are used at once or in rapid succession. Each charge boosts his abilities, in a similar fashion to Rage, for one round. He can spend multiple charges in one round to use special maneuvers very quickly, although this depletes his reserves much faster.

[TopCheese]

I now have the idea that the robots from "I Robot" riding on a mount and the mount is raging..

The mount of course looks like this (before raging)...

http://i45.tinypic.com/v5lv8l.png

Now to find someone to put a robot on the back of that thing...

[Endarire]

This is similar to 3.5's Warforged Barbarians.

[Blisstake]

Anyways at the OP: Android Barbarian is fantastic, the rage itself is NOT a moral bonus nor is the rage powers (unless they give a bonus say like superstitious). Fantastic, not the most optimized fighter but fantastic none the less.

Not true. Rage explicitly gives a morale bonus to Strength, Constitution, and Will saves.

[Ashram]

The standard fluff even specifically states that as a robot, you have a hard time processing emotions. This should quite honestly be disallowed, or at the very least you would be a featureless fighter.

Warforged are created through complex magical rituals and have emotions and thought processes that are on par with a flesh and blood creature. As an android, you're early Data from Star Trek: The Next Generation.

[Feralventas]

Not true. Rage explicitly gives a morale bonus to Strength, Constitution, and Will saves.

Meaning one wouldn't gain the bonuses, but not that one could not go into a Rage, as that is simply an Ex:traordinary ability granted by class levels.

[OracleofWuffing]

Warforged are created through complex magical rituals and have emotions and thought processes that are on par with a flesh and blood creature. As an android, you're early Data from Star Trek: The Next Generation.
How about I just overclock my positronic brain to make my cyberneurons synapse faster?

[Tanuki Tales]

How about I just overclock my positronic brain to make my cyberneurons synapse faster?

Seconding this.

Character classes and mechanics are abstracts for the most part; so any imaginative waving of the re-fluff wand fixes any perceived problems ~7/10.

[Blisstake]

Meaning one wouldn't gain the bonuses, but not that one could not go into a Rage, as that is simply an Ex:traordinary ability granted by class levels.

Oh, I see. I misread his post, I thought he was saying the bonuses it gave weren't morale.