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AntiMatter101
2012-12-06, 04:46 PM
I never really liked the way the Fighter was designed; a completely blank slate with which to attempt to build something useful. Plus, the gap in power level between the fighter and the caster always bugged me.

This is an attempt to redesign the fighter concept, and elevate it a tier or two. Personally, I’d like a martial base class that isn’t inferior to casters and does not mimic them in an effort to measure up. This is my attempt at that goal.

I’d appreciate a critique of several things, among them: About what tier would this rate, do you see any exploits I may have missed in the design and how can I fix them, is this realistically playable in a campaign, Is there something you’d add, subtract or change to make this class better suited to its purpose, and do you like the concept in general?

Edit History:Edit 1: I made some changes, reworked the way some abilities like Weapon focus/training and Hardship worked, and added significant bonus feats for more customization.

Edit 2: Cleaned up the table, bonus feat class abilities are now listed only at the level at which they start accruing. Weapons Focus also only listed once. Lowered the level at which some abilities are gained and added Danger Training and Magic Control.

Edit 3: More or less a complete overhaul. Little remains untouched. Removed Arms Mastery, and renamed Weapons Focus to be Arms Mastery. Apprentice is gone. Introduced Magic Suppression and Footwork Mastery. Reduced Training time figures from numbers of weeks to numbers of hours and days. Thanks to PairO'Dice Lost for his valued advice. Work still needs to be done.

Edit 4: Introduction of 5 new class abilities: Impact, Infuriating Agility, Magic Absorption, Finisher, Tactical Assessment. Self-Taught now occurs at every level instead of every other level.

Edit 5: Changes made to 4 of the 5 abilities that were introduced last edit. Thanks again to PairO'Dice Lost for his valued advice. May still require one or two abilities for the last three levels.
Hit die 1d10
Arms Master
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+1|
+2|
+2|
+0|Arms Mastery, Combat Training, Master of the Physical +2, Training, Fighting Styles

2nd|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+0|Armor Focus, Exotic Proficiencies

3rd|
+3|
+3|
+3|
+1| Master of the Physical +3

4th|
+4|
+4|
+4|
+1|Armor Specialization

5th|
+5|
+4|
+4|
+1| Hardship(2), Danger Training

6th|
+6/+1|
+5|
+5|
+2| Magical Compensation (Partial), Improved Armor Specialization

7th|
+7/+2|
+5|
+5|
+2| Master of the Physical +4 Magic Control

8th|
+8/+3|
+6|
+6|
+2|Footwork Mastery

9th|
+9/+4|
+6|
+6|
+3|

10th|
+10/+5|
+7|
+7|
+3|Self-Taught, Hardship(4), Leader of Warriors

11th|
+11/+6/+1|
+7|
+7|
+3|Warrior of Legend, Magic Suppression

12th|
+12/+7/+2|
+8|
+8|
+4|Master of the Physical +5, Impact

13th|
+13/+8/+3|
+8|
+8|
+4|Infuriating Agility

14th|
+14/+9/+4|
+9|
+9|
+4| Tactical Assessment

15th|
+15/+10/+5|
+9|
+9|
+5|Hardship (6)

16th|
+16/+11/+6/+1|
+10|
+10|
+5|Magic Absorption

17th|
+17/+12/+7/+2|
+10|
+10|
+5|

18th|
+18/+13/+8/+3|
+11|
+11|
+6|Finisher

19th|
+19/+14/+9/+4|
+11|
+11|
+6|Master of the Physical +6

20th|
+20/+15/+10/+5|
+12|
+12|
+6|Ultimate Technique, Hardship(8)[/table]

Class Skills: The Arms Master gains (4+Int modifier (X4 at first level)) skill points. The Arms Master’s class skills are as follows: Balance, Climb, Concentration, Craft(any), Heal, Hide, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge(any), Listen, Move Silently, Profession(any), Ride, Spot, Survival, Swim, Tumble, Use Rope.

Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: Arms Masters are proficient in all simple and Martial Weapons, light, medium and heavy armors, and light, medium, and heavy shields, including Tower shields.

Training: In order to train, for any purpose defined by this class, the Arms Master must have rested for at least 8 hours within the last 24 hours. Training always takes at least 4 consecutive hours during the day. On days when he trains, the Arms Master doubles his natural rate of healing for hit points and ability score burn/damage.

Arms Mastery: His study of the broad forms of weaponry means that the Arms Master can wield virtually any weapon you hand him with remarkable skill. Starting at level 1 and every other level thereafter, gain a +1 insight bonus to attack rolls and damage rolls, with a maximum +5 at level 9; double this bonus when making Trip, Disarm, or Sunder Attempts.

At the corresponding levels, gain the appropriate bonus on the following table when attacking with the corresponding damage type:

{table=head]Level|Slashing|Piercing|Bludgeoning

5th|
+4 to Rolls to Confirm Critical Threat, +4 Deflection Bonus|
+2 Critical Threat Range|
+2 Critical Threat Multiplier

7th|
Apply ½ strength modifier as a bleed effect on hit for 1d4 rounds, stacks damage with successive strikes and adds durations together.|
Add additional ½ Strength modifier to Attack Rolls and Damage Rolls |
Apply the Staggered Condition on hit for ½ strength modifier rounds

9th|
+1 to Critical Threat Range, +1 to Critical Threat Multiplier|
+2 to Critical Threat Range, +2 to Critical Threat Multiplier|Upgrade damage dice as if you were 2 size categories larger, +1 to Critical Threat Range

[/table]

At level 9, you gain an additional +3 to Rolls to confirm Critical Threat while using any weapon.

Combat Training: Learning from the wisdom of those who came before, Arms Masters study the art of combat diligently. At level one, level ten, and every level in between, the Arms Master may choose a single bonus feat from among the Fighter Bonus feats, Tactical feats, Combat Form feats, or General feats, he qualifies for.


Exotic Proficiencies: An Arms Master is always willing to learn to wield new weapons. Starting at 2nd level, by training for 4 hours, specifically for this purpose, with an exotic weapon, exotic armor, or exotic shield with which he is not proficient, an Arms Master permanently gains proficiency in that Exotic Weapon Armor, or Shield.

Danger Training: Arms Masters train their minds and bodies to fight a myriad of dangers, from fireballs, to poisons, to charm spells. Starting at level 5, the Arms Master gains Mettle, any effect that gives half damage or partial effect on a successful Will Save or Fortitude Save, instead gives no effect on a successful save. In addition, the Arms Master gains Evasion, even in Heavy Armor, Improved Evasion if wearing Medium Armor or less, and a +4 bonus to reflex saves if wearing Light Armor or less.


Hardship: Learning lessons the hard way is the best teacher; this all Arms Masters know from painful experience. At fifth level, the Arms Master gains Endurance as a Bonus Feat. In addition, the fifth level Arms Master may not receive less than a 2 as a result on any of his Hit Dice for this class. Should any Hit-Dice be less than 2, set them to 2.

At level 10, the Arms Master may not receive less than a 4 as a result on any of his Hit Dice for this class. Should any Hit-Dice be less than 4, set them to 4.

At level 15, the Arms Master may not receive less than a 6 on as a result any of his Hit Dice for this class. Should any Hit-Dice be less than 6, set them to 6.

At level 20, the Arms Master may not receive less than a 8 as a result on any of his Hit Dice for this class. Should any Hit-Dice be less than 8, set them to 8.


Master of the Physical: You are a master of physical weaponry, and have learned the utmost control and precision with regards to your attacks. Magical enhancements and modifications to your armor and weapons throw your senses off. Starting at level 1 the Arms Master receives a +2 bonus to attack rolls made with masterwork weapons instead of the normal +1. This bonus increases to +3 at level three, +4 at level seven, +5 at level twelve, and +6 at level 19. This bonus only applies when wielding weapons with no Enhancement bonus.

In addition you add ½ your Intelligence modifier and ½ your Wisdom modifier as an insight bonus your armor class, minimum +1. You lose this bonus whenever you would lose your dodge bonus to AC. This bonus is not received when using Armor with an Enhancement bonus.

Magical Compensation: Through grudging experience, Arms Masters learn to compensate for magically altered gear. Starting at 4th level, an Arms Master receives the bonus from his Master of the Physical class ability even when using weapons or Armor with an Enhancement bonus. Note that any enhancement bonus to a weapon’s attack roll does not stack with the bonus from Master of the Physical, just like the bonus from masterwork weapons as normal.

Armor Focus: By training intensively with one Armor type, the Arms Master brings a new level of competence to the battlefield. Starting at 2nd level, the Arms Master may choose an Armor Type to focus on by training for 4 hours in armor of that type, specifically for this purpose. This may be retrained as often as one would like, by training for 4 hours again. Depending on the Armor Type chosen, one of the following benefits are granted to the Arms Master so long as he uses that Armor Type.

Heavy Armor: Increase armor bonus by 4. You gain the ability to put on any armor by yourself without aid from anyone else, and without receiving any penalties for doing so.
Medium Armor: Increase your Armor bonus by +2, your Maximum Dexterity bonus by 1, decrease any Armor Check Penalties by 1, and restore any lost movement speed due to wearing Medium rather than Light armor.
Light Armor: The Maximum Dexterity bonus of the Light Armor you wear is increased by 2. The Armor bonus is increased by +1, and you never take an Armor Check penalty from your armor while you use Light Armor.
No Armor: Instead of adding ½ your Intelligence and Wisdom modifiers as an insight bonus to your AC, you add your full Intelligence and Wisdom modifiers as an insight bonus to your AC, minimum +2.

Armor Specialization: By training extensively with the Armor type with which you have Armor Focus, the Arms Master brings a new level of competence to the battlefield. Starting at level 4, the Arms Master may choose an Armor Type to focus on by training for 4 hours in armor of that type, specifically for this purpose. In order to retrain this to a different armor type, Armor Focus must be retrained to that armor type first. Depending on the Armor Type chosen, one of the following benefits is granted to the Arms Master, though only when he uses that Armor Type.

Heavy Armor: Increase your armor bonus further by +3. You gain DR /- equal to ½ the armor bonus from your Armor, and spell resistance equal to ½ your Armor bonus, rounding down, in addition to any spell resistance you have already.
Medium Armor: Gain DR 2/-, increase the armor bonus by +2 and double the armor bonus provided by your armor during any charge action you take.
Light Armor: Increase your armor bonus by +1 Apply your Armor bonus to your touch AC, all tumble checks, and reflex saves.
No Armor: All 5 ft steps you take now can be 10 ft steps. When you take a 5 ft step, gain a +2 dodge bonus to AC until the start of your next turn.


Improved Armor Specialization: The Arms Master’s intuition with regards to battle is born of long, hard experience. Starting at 6th level, the Arms Master adds the corresponding bonus below to the bonuses by his Armor Specialization Class ability. These bonuses only apply when the corresponding bonus from Armor Specialization applies.

Heavy Armor: The DR is now equal to your full Armor bonus. You gain +3 to your armor bonus, you gain Energy Resistance 5 to all energy types.
Medium Armor: Reduce any Armor check penalty by -2, Increase the DR to 4/-, increase the armor bonus by +2, and add ½ your armor bonus to any spell resistance you have, rounding down.
Light Armor: Your Armor bonus is increased by +1, your 5ft steps can now be 10 ft steps.
No Armor: as long as you have taken a 5 ft step this round you cannot be flanked and you gain an additional +2 dodge bonus to AC, until the start of your next turn. Your 5 ft steps can now reach 15 ft.

Self-Taught: Upon achieving a certain level of competence, the Arms Master begins to branch out and decide his own fate, rather than following in the footsteps of another. Starting at level 10, and every level thereafter, the Arms Master gains an additional bonus feat of his choice, from Crafting feats, Racial feats, General feats, Tactical feats, Combat Form feats, Fighter Bonus feats, or Epic feats (should he qualify).

Magic Control: Expanding from his adaptation to magical arms and armor, the Arms Master learns to resist the effects of magic on his person on a grander scale. Starting at level 7 the Arms Master gains Spell Resistance equal to 15 + his Arms Master levels.

Footwork Mastery: At level 8, the Arms Master ignores any penalty imposed by difficult terrain, and moves through it normally. In addition his base move speed increases by 10ft.

Leader of Warriors: Arms Masters gain followings whether they like it or not as their fame spreads, and traveling warriors come to learn at his feet. Starting at Level 10, the Arms Master gains Followers exactly like having the Leadership Feat, and the Epic Leadership Feat except the key stat is Intelligence instead of Charisma, he does not gain a cohort, and never takes penalties to his leadership score if his Followers happen to die when he personally leads them into battle. The maximum level of any of his Followers is his levels in Arms Master minus 4. All the Followers he attracts are martial warriors or soldiers of some sort. This stacks with the Leadership feat.

Warrior of Legend: People respect personal power, if nothing else, and power is something the Arms Master has in abundance. Starting at 11th level, 5/day the Arms Master may substitute a Bluff or Diplomacy check with an Intimidate check, and have it function exactly as if he had used Bluff or Diplomacy normally.

Magic Suppression: The Arms Master’s control over magic that affects him grows to such a level that he can delay the onset of an effect for a time. Starting at level 11, Any magical effect on you that has a duration may be suppressed for a number of rounds equal to 3+your constitution modifier. While suppressed, the effect does not affect you in any way. This does not expend the duration of the effect, and once suppression ends, the duration of the effect begins from that point. Only one effect may be suppressed at a time in this manner. You may only suppress a given effect once. You may suppress harmful or helpful effects in this manner, in an attempt to more efficiently time the influence. Releasing a suppressed spell prematurely is a swift action, releasing it after the maximum number of rounds is a free action.

At level 15 you may suppress up to two effects at a time, in this manner.

Impact: The Arms Master has learned to make good use of his weight on the battlefield and often does so when charging his opponents. Starting at level 12, the Arms Master may make a special charge attack that is both charge attack and Bull Rush. Make a charge attack as normal, except with a +6 bonus to the attack roll and -2 to armor class, triggering whatever attacks of opportunity you normally would. The Arms Master gains a bonus to the damage roll equal to his Strength modifier X 2 + his Constitution modifier X 2
Once this attack is resolved, assuming you hit, you immediately make a Bull Rush attempt, without provoking any attacks of opportunity that your charge did not already provoke. You gain the +2 bonus from the charge, whatever bonuses or penalties due to size categories, and add your Constitution modifier X2 as well.
Success means you move into the square previously occupied by your target and your target is knocked straight back a number of squares equal to your strength modifier.

Creatures who have just been successfully Impacted must make a Fortitude save DC: 15+ Arms Master Level or be unable to use powers, spells, spell or psi -like abilities, or anything requiring a concentration check, for 1d4 rounds.

Infuriating Agility: The Arms Master has learned the value of constant motion on the battlefield and uses it to his advantage. Starting at level 13, on any turn in which the Arms Master moves more than 5 ft, he gains a 50% miss chance against ranged attacks until the start of his next turn. The miss chance is decreased to 25% when wearing Heavy Armor.

Tactical Assessment: The Arms Master needs only a moment to assess a situation and dive in with a plan ready for action. Starting at level 14, the Arms Master receives a +4 bonus to initiative and the following benefits:

When acting in the surprise round, the Arms Master may take a full set of actions.

When the Arms Master rolls for initiative and receives an 18-20 on the die, he may be included in any existing surprise round by taking his action immediately following the first enemy action or acting on his own initiative, whichever is lower.

If there is no surprise round, he gains a surprise round as if he was aware of the enemy beforehand.

If the Arms Master already was included in the surprise round, he goes first.

Magic Absorption: The Arms Master further develops his ability to suppress spells, resulting in the ability to absorb them completely and derive benefits from them. The effort this requires does limit its use, however. Starting at level 16, 2/day the Arms Master may choose to absorb a spell that penetrates his Spell Resistance, rather than let it affect him. Depending on the nature of the spell absorbed he gains varying benefits:

If it had an energy type, he gains resist 25 to that energy type for the duration.
Negative energy spells or spells with the death keyword grant an effect identical to Death Ward for the duration.
Positive energy spells grant Regeneration 5/- for the duration.
Force spells grant a +5 deflection bonus to AC that stacks with any existing deflection bonus for the duration.
Fear spells grant Fear Immunity for the duration.
Sleep spells remove fatigue and exhaustion, while granting immunity to sleep spells for the duration.
Compulsion or Mind-Affecting spells grant an effect identical to Mind Blank for the duration.

The Duration is a number of rounds equal to 1+ the spell level of the absorbed spell. The Arms Master may absorb any spell that includes him as a target, but any aspects of the spell that deal with other creatures or objects are unaffected. The Arms Master cannot absorb spells after they are cast. For instance, he cannot absorb a wall of force standing in his path. However should the Arms Master be in the area of affect when a wall of force is being cast, (in addition to the spell failure that normally occurs in such a case) he may absorb the spell then.

During the duration, the absorbed spell takes up a slot from the Magic Suppression class ability. Thus one cannot absorb a spell if both slots for the Magic Suppression ability are already occupied.

Finisher: At level 18, The Arms Master recognizes that each fighting style is like a separate song, with its own rhythms and choruses. However, all songs must end, and so he developed the Finisher. To use this ability the Arms Master must have struck at least one enemy each round while using the same fighting style for at least 5 successive rounds. This ability is a full round action. Select one enemy within reach, and make a full attack, willfully disregarding any extra attacks you might be granted other than those provided by your base attack bonus. Do not calculate damage for these attacks yet, first see how many of them hit.

{table=head]Number of Hits|Damage|Secondary Effect

0 hits|
no damage|
Target is Shaken

1 hit|
Deal damage normally|
Target is Frightened

2 hits|
Deal 1 strike of normal damage and one Auto-Crit|
Target is Panicked

3 hits|
Deal 2 Auto-Crits and one normal strike of damage|
Target is Panicked and Nauseated

4 hits|
All attacks Auto-Crit|
Target makes a Fortitude save DC 15 + Arms Master Level or Dies instantly, Success on the saves grants the same effect as 3 successful hits [/table]

Targets that are Immune to critical hits take normal damage *1.5 instead of *2. Targets that are immune to fear are confused for 1d6 rounds per hit instead. Targets that are immune to death effects instead double the damage they take from this ability at 4+ hits.

After using this ability The Arms Master is no longer using a Fighting Style and may not initiate another one for 1d4 rounds.




Ultimate Technique: At level 20, the Arms Master gains the ability to know one additional Fighting Style. This Special Fighting Style can be used for a maximum of 10 rounds each day, broken up across however many uses you’d like, and must be developed over 3 days by the Arms Master. This Fighting Style may not be taught to another. When developing this Style you gain 20 more points to spend than you would have normally.


Fighting Styles:The Arms Master is not only an avid student of the Martial way of life; he is an inventor in his own right. Starting at first level, The Arms master may develop his own fighting styles over the course of his career, and they serve as his legacy to future generations.
With 2 days of training devoted to this purpose, an Arms Master can develop his own fighting style. With 4 hours of training with another Arms Master, knowledge of a single Fighting style may be transferred from one to another.

A Fighting style is a combination of technique, stance, state of mind, and a collection of specific attacks and defenses. Beginning use of a combat style is a swift action, ending a combat style or switching to another one is a move action.

An Arms Master may only know a number of Fighting Styles equal to (his intelligence modifier + his levels in Arms Master/5, rounding down), minimum 2. You can replace any Fighting Style you know with another Fighting Style by developing your own or training with another Arms Master for 4 hours. You can learn someone else’s Fighting Style of a level higher than your own, but for every level higher than your own that it is, it counts as one more Fighting Style for the purpose of how many you may know at once.

To develop your own Fighting Style do the following:

(Spoilered for length)

First pick what level the Fighting Style you want to create is. A Fighting Style’s level cannot be greater than the number of levels its creator has in Arms Master, though it can be less if one wishes.

You initially have a number of points to spend on a Fighting Style equal to the level of the Style.


Prerequisites: Not all styles demand that the user be wielding certain weapons or armor, but those that are developed around a specific set of gear are often more focused, and more potent.
Main-hand: This hand must be occupied by a weapon or shield type of your choice, or even left completely empty, in order for this Fighting Style to be used. (+3 points to spend)
Off-hand: This hand must be occupied by a weapon or shield type of your choice, or even left completely empty, in order for this Fighting Style to be used. (+2 points to spend)
Armor: A type of Armor, of your choice, must be worn in order to use this Fighting Style, be it heavy, medium, light, or none. Any deviation means that this Fighting Style is unable to be used at that time. (+3 points to spend)

Note that requiring a specific two handed weapon type means both the Main-hand and the Off-hand prerequisites are chosen, and you receive each benefit.

Passive Benefits: These Benefits always apply to the Arms Master so long as he is using this Fighting Style.

Intimidating Style: (Cost = 3) Add half of your highest base attack bonus to your intimidate checks.
Size Tailored Style: (Cost = 3) Pick a size category, gain a competence bonus to your attack and damage rolls when attacking creatures in that size category. The bonus is equal to your dexterity modifier or your strength modifier, whichever is higher. You can take this benefit more than once, each time it applies to a different size category.
Immovable: (Cost = 3) gain a determination bonus on any opposed roll or any saving throw to avoid being moved or knocked over, equal to your Constitution bonus.
Deeper Strikes: (Cost = 2) your blows have more strength behind them. Add 1 to your damage rolls. Can be purchased multiple times, it stacks.
Accurate Strikes: (Cost = 2) Your blows tend to hit their mark. Add 1 to your attack rolls. Can be purchased multiple times, it stacks.
Poised: (Cost = 6) gain 2 additional attacks of opportunity in a round, also, you have a 50% chance of being able to make attacks of opportunity against someone casting defensively adjacent to you.
Dancing Combat: (Cost = 8) whenever you land a melee attack and deal damage you may immediately take a 5ft step.
Defensive Style: (Cost = 2) you increase your deflection bonus by 1.Can be purchased multiple times, it stacks.
Charge Foiler: (Cost = 4) gain an opportunity attack against those who charge you. Should you do damage to them, they must make a concentration check, DC 10+ damage dealt or fall prone and not get to complete the charge.
Fury: (Cost = 4) While in this stance you are considered Raging with regards to any effects that pertain to characters who are Raging. You do not gain the normal penalties and benefits of a barbarian rage. Instead, each time you purchase this Benefit, your Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution Scores increase by 1 while in this stance. The Boost to Constitution grants hit points that function exactly like those gained from barbarian rage.
Confidence: (Cost 1) When you first begin using this Style, and at the start of any turn of which you were not attacked and took no damage in the last round, you gain 2 temporary hit points. These temporary hit points do not stack. This Benefit may be taken multiple times, each time you purchase it, the number of temporary hit points gained increases by 2.



Active Benefits: These benefits define special actions that an Arms Master using this Fighting Style can make.

Flurry of Strikes: (Cost = 3) once an encounter, add another attack to your full attack action at your highest base attack bonus. Can be purchased multiple times, each additional purchase increases the number of uses per encounter by 1. One CAN use multiple uses of this ability in one full attack action.
Rend: (Cost = 1) You can forfeit your lowest attack in a Full attack action in order to apply a bleed to every target you strike this round equal to 1 damage per round, until someone heals the target. Striking the same target twice stacks the bleed to 2 damage per round. The bleed effect stacks from successive strikes, from round to round. The bleed effect ends if the target is treated by a heal check or magically cured of even 1 hit point.
The Old One-Two: (Cost = 4)You can make an attack with your offhand weapon at a -5 penalty in addition to your normal attack whenever you strike someone using only an opportunity action or a standard action, like at the end of a charge, for instance.
Serene Headshot: (Cost = 8) By forfeiting all attacks but one in a full round action, you may make a single ranged attack at a +5 bonus. The critical threat range for this single attack is doubled, and should you make a critical hit, the critical multiplier is increased by one. On top of all that, targets struck by this shot are staggered for 3 turns.
Tactical Step: (Cost = 3) as a swift action you may make a 5ft step.
Pause in the Rhythm: (Cost = 3) should you need it, you may take a full round action that provokes an attack of opportunity to collect yourself. This removes the Stunned, Staggered, Dazed, Dazzled, Sickened, and shaken conditions from the Arms Master. It also temporarily suppresses the fatigue, exhaustion, frightened effects as well as grant a +4 bonus to will saves, these temporary effects last for 1d4 rounds. Purchasing this benefit twice makes it so that using this ability does not provoke an attack of opportunity.



Drawbacks: Arms Masters of level 7 or below who create a Fighting Style must have at least one drawback chosen from this list, with no benefit. Arms Masters of level 8 or above may, at their option, take drawbacks for a gain of +2 more points to spend elsewhere for each drawback taken.

Distracted Mind: -4 to Will Saves.
Lethargic Stance: -4 to Reflex Saves.
Reckless Abandon: -4 to Fortitude Saves.
Slowed Advancement: Reduce move speed by 20ft/round (minimum 5ft/round)
Dull to the Warning Signs: Loose the bonus granted to your AC by your Wisdom and Intelligence scores.
Unreactive: Reduces number of Opportunity attacks made per round to 1 (if at 1 already, reduce to 0, if at 0 already, take a -5 penalty to Reflex saves.)
Predictable: Creatures with an intelligence greater than 7 gain a dodge bonus vs. your attacks equal to their intelligence modifier, minimum 1.
Wild strikes: take a -6 penalty to attack rolls.
Weak strikes: take a -4 penalty to damage rolls.

It is permitted for players to invent their own active benefits and passive benefits, but the GM should have the final say on how much any given player-created benefit costs to purchase.

AntiMatter101
2012-12-09, 11:43 PM
*Bump*

Had some ideas, made some edits...

Without feedback, i'm just stabbing in the dark here. >.>

nonsi
2012-12-10, 05:51 AM
I don't think you've figured the tier system correctly. (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1002.0)

To my better understanding, this remake is tier 4 at best.

AntiMatter101
2012-12-10, 03:05 PM
That... may be so.

Even after reading on how Tiers work, I still have trouble applying it to class design.

so. small steps. How would you suggest I go about improving this class to tier 3, even when un-optimized?

Jormengand
2012-12-10, 03:12 PM
That... may be so.

Even after reading on how Tiers work, I still have trouble applying it to class design.

so. small steps. How would you suggest I go about improving this class to tier 3, even when un-optimized?

Something to stop people holding person and laughing?

PairO'Dice Lost
2012-12-10, 04:14 PM
That... may be so.

Even after reading on how Tiers work, I still have trouble applying it to class design.

so. small steps. How would you suggest I go about improving this class to tier 3, even when un-optimized?

The difference between Tier 5 (has one thing, sucks at it) and Tier 4 (has one thing, doesn't suck at it) is numbers, which this class has in spades. The difference between Tier 4 and Tier 3 (does one thing well, has other things it doesn't suck at) is options and new abilities, which this class has very few of (and weak ones to boot). Let's take a look at the class features. This is going to sound harsh, and I apologize in advance, but I'm trying to make things very clear.

Spoilered because it's pretty long:
Arms Master
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+1|
+2|
+2|
+0|Weapons Focus, Combat Training, Master of the Physical +2, Training

2nd|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+0|Armor Focus, Exotic Proficiencies

3rd|
+3|
+3|
+3|
+1| Master of the Physical +3

4th|
+4|
+4|
+4|
+1|Danger Training

5th|
+5|
+4|
+4|
+1| Fighting Styles, Hardship(2)

6th|
+6/+1|
+5|
+5|
+2| Magical Compensation (Partial)

7th|
+7/+2|
+5|
+5|
+2| Armor Specialization, Master of the Physical +4

8th|
+8/+3|
+6|
+6|
+2|

9th|
+9/+4|
+6|
+6|
+3| Arms Master(Weapon Focus)

10th|
+10/+5|
+7|
+7|
+3|Self-Taught, Hardship(4)

11th|
+11/+6/+1|
+7|
+7|
+3| Warrior of Legend, Magical Compensation (Full)

12th|
+12/+7/+2|
+8|
+8|
+4|Arms Master(Weapon Specialization), Master of the Physical +5

13th|
+13/+8/+3|
+8|
+8|
+4|Improved Armor Specialization, Magic Control

14th|
+14/+9/+4|
+9|
+9|
+4|This is My Weapon

15th|
+15/+10/+5|
+9|
+9|
+5| Hardship (6)

16th|
+16/+11/+6/+1|
+10|
+10|
+5|

17th|
+17/+12/+7/+2|
+10|
+10|
+5| Leader of Warriors

18th|
+18/+13/+8/+3|
+11|
+11|
+6|

19th|
+19/+14/+9/+4|
+11|
+11|
+6| Apprentice, Master of the Physical +6

20th|
+20/+15/+10/+5|
+12|
+12|
+6|Ultimate Technique, Hardship(8)[/table]

Better Ref save. Numbers: 1; Actual class features: 0.

[quote]Class Skills: The Arms Master gains (4+Int modifier (X4 at first level)) skill points. The Arms Master’s class skills are as follows: Balance, Climb, Concentration, Craft(any), Heal, Hide, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge(any), Listen, Move Silently, Profession(any), Ride, Spot, Survival, Swim, Tumble, Use Rope.

More skills, more skill points. Numbers: 1; Actual class features: 1.


Weapons Focus:

Attack, damage, crit range, and crit multiplier bonuses. Numbers: 2; Actual class features: 1.


Combat Training: Learning from the wisdom of those who came before, Arms Masters study the art of combat diligently. At level one, level ten, and every level in between, the Arms Master may choose a single bonus feat from among the fighter bonus feats.

Fighter bonus feats. Not just numbers, but nothing the fighter didn't have already. Numbers: 2; Actual class features: 1.


Exotic Proficiencies:

Free exotic weapon proficiencies. Most exotic weapons aren't worth the feat, and for those that are this just removes the -4 nonproficiency penalties...so more numbers, though we don't really care about them. Numbers: 3; Actual class features: 1.


Danger Training:

Mettle and Evasion. Numbers: 3; Actual class features: 2.


Hardship:

Bonus HP, bonuses to Con checks. Numbers: 4; Actual class features: 2.


Master of the Physical:

More attack/damage/AC numbers...some of which are negative. There are better ways to incentivize using nonmagical gear. Numbers: 5; Actual class features: 2.


Armor Focus:

More numbers (removing penalties), and benefits that could be gained with mithral. Numbers: 6; Actual class features: 2.


Armor Specialization:

Now you're talking. DR, touch AC, and 10-foot steps are nice...though a few levels later than they should be. Numbers: 6; Actual class features: 3.


Improved Armor Specialization:

Just improves Armor Spec with increased numbers. Numbers: 7; Actual class features: 3.


Self-Taught:

The good epic feats are ones he wouldn't be able to qualify for, and he can't really use crafting feats, but we'll give him the General feats. Numbers: 7; Actual class features: 4.


Magical Compensation:

Removed penalties, and self-imposed ones at that. Numbers: 8; Actual class features: 4.


Warrior of Legend:

Numbers, essentially; the skill substitutions are really just a big bonus to those checks, since he doesn't have anything that synergizes with the replaced or replacing skills. Numbers: 9; Actual class features: 4.


Arms Mastery:

Numbers: 10; Actual class features: 4.


This Is My Weapon:

"This weapon can be used in a grapple and counts as a monk weapon" is useful only for monks, people who expect to lose grapples, and people who are amazing at grapples, and without grapple-based class features this guy is none of those. Numbers: 11; Actual class features: 4.


Magic Control:

SR = level means equal-level casters cannot fail to penetrate it, so it's not even a Numbers feature. Numbers: 11; Actual class features: 4.


Leader of Warriors:

This is essentially a bunch more low-level followers, which is the same as a big boost to your Leadership score. Numbers: 12; Actual class features: 5.


Apprentice:

A level 9 cohort? At level 19? Of a specific class, with no wealth? Too little, too late; it's basically +1 Follower. Numbers: 13; Actual class features: 5.


Ultimate Technique:

Numbers: 14; Actual class features: 5.


Fighting Styles:

Some non-numerical features, but not amazing ones. They can all be duplicated with bonus feats, and though these would stack with said feats it's still just +1 AoO, +5 this, +3 that. Numbers: 15; Actual class features: 5.



So, the actual class features this class has are Mettle, Evasion, DR, extra attacks, broader feats, and better skills. That's actually a fairly good framework for a slightly improved monk (take monk, add Mettle and DR, give one General bonus feat per level, let the monk use any stances from the Fighting Styles spoiler instead of Flurry of Blows, add [level*1.5] as an insight bonus to all rolls)...for the first five levels or so. After that, you need class features that do things, not just add to other things, to compete. Now, giving the fighter more numbers can help in that having bigger numbers by default means you can spend more gold on getting items that do stuff instead of paying to boost your numbers, but lots of fiddly little bonuses that add up aren't the way to go, making the fighter more reliant on gear doesn't help anything, and the fighter has to have something else as well.

So. I hope that helped, and I'd be happy to go into more detail if necessary, but the bottom line is that you'd probably want to start from scratch on this one. If you do want to take what you have and change it, here's what I'd do:
Move all of the Danger Training abilities to level 5 and ditch the numbers that go with them.
Move Armor Focus, Armor Specialization, and Improved Armor Specialization to 2nd, 4th, and 6th.
Change Magic Control to give SR = 15+level, and move it down to 7th or so.
Remove all of the training time requirements; three weeks for any of those isn't worth it. Instead, say that he needs to spend, say, 4 hours for each benefit requiring training; he can do one or two of those after a day of adventuring when he finds equipment he wants to train with, and he can "training montage" a lot of gear at once.
Change Weapon Focus to just give something like a +1 enhancement bonus to all of the things mentioned (attack, damage, crit range, crit multiplier, etc.) at each odd level, to a maximum of 5. That's a lot cleaner, and it makes +X weapons unnecessary without imposing penalties.
Allow the armsman to use any fighting style with a point cost up to his level, starting at 1st, with one drawback and no ability to gain bonus points from more drawbacks. Remove the requirement for drawbacks (but allow adding them for +2 effective level) starting at 7th or 8th level.
Give Leader of Warriors at level 10, and just make it replace Cha with Int for your leadership score and then double it, with a level-4 cap on followers. Again, much cleaner and simpler, and you get closer to level-appropriate minions.
Give a bonus Fighter, Tactical, Combat Form, or General feat at each level. That should help with giving him some more options at those levels.
Above level 10, you'll need to come up with new and different abilities. Take a look at Tome of Battle classes, high-level and epic barbarian/rogue/fighter PrCs, and similar to see what kinds of things would be appropriate.

AntiMatter101
2012-12-10, 05:41 PM
Awesome. Just the sort of feedback I'm looking for.

I'm working on making changes. For the moment I have a few clarifying questions.

I can't exactly tell, With Weapon Focus, are you suggesting I also remove the distinctions drawn between the types of damage, or just normalize the benefits gained by advancing in one of them?

Danger Training, so All benefits are recieved at 5th level; I'm thinking:

Mettle + "The Arms Master gains Evasion, even in Heavy Armor, Improved Evasion if wearing Medium Armor or less, and a +4 bonus to reflex saves if wearing Light Armor or less." Is that what you meant?

Why cap the Followers at level 4? Should the cap stay there even as level increases?

PairO'Dice Lost
2012-12-10, 06:01 PM
Awesome. Just the sort of feedback I'm looking for.

I'm working on making changes. For the moment I have a few clarifying questions.

I can't exactly tell, With Weapon Focus, are you suggesting I also remove the distinctions drawn between the types of damage, or just normalize the benefits gained by advancing in one of them?

I'm saying normalize the bonuses. So by level 9 when it caps out, you get +5 attack, damage, confirmation rolls, and combat maneuver rolls, and then you can add +X deflection and bleed damage to Slashing, +X threat range and +Y crit multiplier to Piercing, and extra dice and stagger to Bludgeoning.


Danger Training, so All benefits are recieved at 5th level; I'm thinking:

Mettle + "The Arms Master gains Evasion, even in Heavy Armor, Improved Evasion if wearing Medium Armor or less, and a +4 bonus to reflex saves if wearing Light Armor or less." Is that what you meant?

Yep.


Why cap the Followers at level 4? Should the cap stay there even as level increases?

That's a level minus 4 cap, the same way a Leadership cohort is capped at [level-2].

nonsi
2012-12-10, 06:02 PM
That... may be so.

Even after reading on how Tiers work, I still have trouble applying it to class design.

so. small steps. How would you suggest I go about improving this class to tier 3, even when un-optimized?

Honestly, I wouldn't know where to begin with an existing class.
I sincerely believe that a decent out-of-the-box tier-3 Fighter fix is the single most difficult D&D challenge ever.
After dozens of failed attempts that, btw, heavily involved plagiarism from hundreds of sources, I finally came up with the only Fighter remake I was wholly content with (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=242257). Ever.

AntiMatter101
2012-12-10, 07:54 PM
Thanks for the clarification.


Honestly, I wouldn't know where to begin with an existing class.
I sincerely believe that a decent out-of-the-box tier-3 Fighter fix is the single most difficult D&D challenge ever.
After dozens of failed attempts that, btw, heavily involved plagiarism from hundreds of sources, I finally came up with the only Fighter remake I was wholly content with (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=242257). Ever.

Yea, it's not exactly a simple task, I'll give you that.

I have confidence that I'll end up with something passable given time and effort though.


Another round of edits made, I'm especially interested in thoughts on the two new abilities.

PairO'Dice Lost
2012-12-10, 10:07 PM
Another round of edits made, I'm especially interested in thoughts on the two new abilities.

Much better, and much cleaner. Magic Suppression will help with the fighter's Achilles heel, and thank you for not falling into the common trap of giving the Footwork Mastery speed boost a type so it doesn't stack with anything. :smallwink:

And now to start filling in the dead levels. First off, you can probably make Self-Taught give a feat every level instead of every other level; a feat and a class feature each level isn't going to break anything. As for what to fill those levels with, like I said you can draw inspiration from PrCs and such--this is your class, and while we can help you clean things up and tweak power levels, it should be your decision on what to add, though I can try to come up with some suggestions if you'd like them.

AntiMatter101
2012-12-11, 03:27 PM
I came up with some new ones, got a couple questions:

With Magic Absorption, did I miss any spell types, or is what I have pretty all encompasing?

Is Finisher strong enough to do what's intended or are builds that pretty much negate it overly common?

Tactical Assessment, it's mostly numbers, but does it seem useful or superfluous?

Impact, unorthadox, as far as I'm aware. Is it too easily broken?

Just so it doesn't feel left out: Infurating Agility, how easily is miss-chance negated exactly?

PairO'Dice Lost
2012-12-11, 05:26 PM
I came up with some new ones, got a couple questions:

With Magic Absorption, did I miss any spell types, or is what I have pretty all encompasing?

Looks good overall, though I'd suggest re-wording the Force benefit to "grants a +5 deflection bonus to AC or increases any existing deflection bonus by +5" to make it unambiguous that it stacks. You might want to increase the energy resistance to 20 or 30 to keep up with buffs at that level.


Is Finisher strong enough to do what's intended or are builds that pretty much negate it overly common?

There are few builds that are immune to crits and fear and death effects; those creatures that are immune to all three are generally undead or constructs, who have no Con bonuses and so are proportionally more affected by the extra damage, so you should be fine here.

The 4+ hits secondary effect is a bit wonky, though, unless I'm misunderstanding it. You only get 4 attacks from BAB, so this doesn't trigger unless you're either counting TWF and such as part of BAB, or if you're counting all the attacks from preceding rounds; you need to clarify the language so it's clear what attacks count. Once that's done, it's unclear what happens with 5+ attacks. It looks like you're saying that if the armsmaster hits with, say, 7 attacks, the target has to make a save against 7 attacks, then if it succeeds make a save against 6 attacks, then if it succeeds make a save against 5 attacks, then if it succeeds make a save against 4 attacks, then if it succeeds take the penalty for 3 attacks. That's a lot of rolls, so you should either come up with a "shortcut" so it doesn't chain or come up with a different secondary effect.


Tactical Assessment, it's mostly numbers, but does it seem useful or superfluous?

It's probably more fiddly than it's worth; a variable-duration bonus against a certain subset of enemies is annoying to keep track of in play. Something simpler that happens just at the start of the encounter (like giving him a full round of actions in the surprise round, giving him extra attacks or bonuses against a surprised enemy, etc.) would be cleaner.


Impact, unorthadox, as far as I'm aware. Is it too easily broken?

Too fiddly for groups that gloss over encumbrance, extremely abusable for armsmasters larger than Medium. A simple enlarge person or expansion will take a 120-pound human and multiply his weight by 8 to 960, for a +24 bonus. I would change it to be a simple charge+bull rush where you increase the distance they're moved by some factor (+Str, x2, whatever).


Just so it doesn't feel left out: Infurating Agility, how easily is miss-chance negated exactly?

It's easy to negate concealment-based miss chance, but not generic miss chances, so this should be fine.

AntiMatter101
2012-12-11, 06:22 PM
There are few builds that are immune to crits and fear and death effects; those creatures that are immune to all three are generally undead or constructs, who have no Con bonuses and so are proportionally more affected by the extra damage, so you should be fine here.

The 4+ hits secondary effect is a bit wonky, though, unless I'm misunderstanding it. You only get 4 attacks from BAB, so this doesn't trigger unless you're either counting TWF and such as part of BAB, or if you're counting all the attacks from preceding rounds; you need to clarify the language so it's clear what attacks count.

I was working under the assumption that if one continued to level in the class past lvl 20, the BAB would continue to grow and spin off another +1 attack every five levels. Yet upon further investigation this does not appear to be the case. (can you tell I've never played an Epic level character >.> )



Once that's done, it's unclear what happens with 5+ attacks. It looks like you're saying that if the armsmaster hits with, say, 7 attacks, the target has to make a save against 7 attacks, then if it succeeds make a save against 6 attacks, then if it succeeds make a save against 5 attacks, then if it succeeds make a save against 4 attacks, then if it succeeds take the penalty for 3 attacks. That's a lot of rolls, so you should either come up with a "shortcut" so it doesn't chain or come up with a different secondary effect.


That indeed was the way it was intended to work, but you do have a point about it being alot of rolls. However, in light of the previous revelation, the 4+ section won't exist anymore anyway.


I'm drawing a blank for abilities for the last three levels. If anyone has suggestions, I'm open to them.

Until such a time as I come up with more abilities, The Arms Master may be considered complete.