Dragonborn VoP Sacred Fist

[Dunkoro]

We are going to start our first campaign, and I wanted a character that would be kickass while healing some damage too. After making Sacred Fist I saw that Vow of Poverty would fit in perfectly, so I changed it a little bit to accomodate it even better (like get flying from Dragonborn to cover the lack of it). Here's What I got to:

Cloistered Cleric 1/Monk 1/Cloistered Cleric 2/Monk 2/Cloistered Cleric 3/Singer of Concordance 1/Child of Bahamut 1(homebrewed, at 1st level gives bonus aspect of Dragonborn)/Sacred Fist 10(ruled full-casting)/Divine Disciple 1/Contemplative 1/Singer of Concordance 2

I'm starting as Dragonborn Lesser Aasimar, with Bahamut as my diety
STR 16
DEX 10
CON 14
WIS 19
CHA 12
(yeah, I got some pretty good rolls)
I'm putting bonus atribute points into WIS, and from VoP into: WIS/STR/CHA/DEX

1 Knowledge Domain=>Knowledge Devotion
Law Domain=>Law Devotion
Dragon Domain(homebrewed to give Dragon Claws)
Light Armor Proficiency=>Dragon Tail (as per Dragonborn feat swap)
Sacred Vow
2 Stunning Fist as (bonus feat)
3 Vow of Poverty
4 Combat Reflexes (bonus feat), Intuitive Attack (VoP)
5
6 Combat Casting (req for Sacred Fist), Touch of Golden Ice (VoP)
7 Wings aspect
8 Sanctify Ki Strike (VoP)
9 Multiattack
10 Sanctify Natural Attack (VoP)
11
12 Snap Kick (considering kicking it, cause I already have a lot of attacks and don't want to not hit with them), Holy Ki Strike (VoP)
13
14 Gift of Discernment (VoP)
15 Superior Unarmed Strike
16 Fist of the Heavens (VoP)
17
18 ?, Servant of Heavens (VoP)
19 Luck Domain
20 Strength Domain

I don't plan to go into the broken zone, only into the slightly better-than-average optimized zone. Note that we play with fractional BAB and saves stacking.
What are your thoughts? Shall I change something in this build? (Acceptable changes are only these that fit ascetic Dragonbon ;) Changing 2nd monk level into smt else is not very convincing, because we play with multiclass penalty, and I want to fulfill Sacred Fist reqs as soon as possible, with Vow of Poverty at 3rd level, and that's only way to do that.

[Toliudar]

This is definitely not into the broken zone. It seems like a flavourful and fun build. You're still going to have a lot of trouble doing meaningful damage at even mid levels.

If I'm understanding your level progression correctly, you've only got three levels of cleric before entering Singer of Concordance. How are you getting the third level spells that are a prerequisite?

If you've gotten Sacred Fist to be houseruled as full-casting, I see no reason not to enter earlier, since you'll be able to qualify by level 7.

Is this the kind of feedback you were after?

[Dunkoro]

Ahh, I forgot of the 3rd level spells req ;/
Then what should I do with the level slot? Upping the cleric by one gives me 20% exp penalty for the rest of the game, so it's a no.
And Sacred Fist is full-casting by RAW, not by houserule, text trumps table =]
And I AM qualifying by level 7 (3 of cleric, 2 of monk, 1 of Singer/smt else, 1 of Child of Bahamut) BAB: 1,5+1,5+1/2+3/4=4 1/4
And yes, that's exactly the kind of insinght I'm looking for, maybe some feats good for the build?

[Toliudar]

Since Child of Bahamut is homebrew regardless, why not take it at level 6 and then head into Sacred Fist at level 7? With three levels of cloistered cleric and two of Monk, there's no XP penalties, and it gives you ten whole levels to explain why you're switching your allegiance from Bahamut to Io later. :smallwink:

This thread might help crystallize your thinking about how to contribute in melee. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127026)

Feat-wise, Touch of Golden Ice has a fixed DC, if I recall correctly, so it becomes less and less useful over time. Take it in your level 4 slot, to get the best use of it. Conversely Intuitive Attack will only become useful as the gap between wis and strength grows, so is never really going to do that much for you.

[animewatcha]

Problem with build. Monk has multiclass penalty in that you can't return to it unless specific rules within other prestige classes, feats, certain monastery, etc. Stupid I know, but it's RAW for ya.

[Dunkoro]

Dragonborn is 3/4 BAB, so I wouldn't meet req for Sacred Fist at lvl 6 (I need BAB 4)
1/2+3/4+1/2+3/4+1/2+3/4=3 3/4
I'll propably just take 2 levels of Child of Bahamut then, unless I'd be also able to convince my GM to change Child to full BAB (but then it propably wouldn't advance casting at 1st level ;/)
And I'm not going to change aliegance. We're playing in homebrewed campaign as well and there are only two draconic dieties (Bahamut and Tiamat).
As for intuitive attack, it's pretty much a free feat from a very limited feat list (there are like 4 good exalted feats), and it gives me as much as 2 to hit at the level I take it, up to + 5 at lv 20, so it's not THAT bad, especially considering I have -4 to hit from Flurry of Blows+Snap Kick, so I'm in need of every hit chance increaser possible to me (Law Devotion and Knowledge Devotion help me too.)

EDIT: I was additionally forced by my GM to take monk levels before cleric levels because of the backstory of my character. So I guess my level progression will now be something along the lines of:

Monk 2/Cloistered Cleric 3/Child of Bahamut 1/Sacred Fist 10/Contemplative 1/Singer of Concordance 2/Divine Disciple 1

If you can think of any better finishing of the build (last four levels) I'm open for suggestions.

[Dunkoro]

Bumpidy Bump

[Answerer]

Point of interest: Vow of Poverty is an absolutely atrocious feat, you are burning two feats for the privilege of wasting enormous amounts of money.

See if your DM will allow a non-VoP way to express the flavor of an ascetic. Even if you have to pay double for everything to get it to count as "slotless," you'll end up well ahead.

[JKTrickster]

Meh for people who don't know how to use equipment, Vow of Poverty isn't half bad. It's not optimized, but meh this should be fine.

On the other hand I disagree with XP penalties. Seriously I don't see the point of them and they just complicate things.

[Dunkoro]

Well then, for what kind of bonuses would I spend my money on? It already gives me armor bonus and attribute bonuses and thats all I really need. I know I'm losing access to Rods and Wands, but I also know my GM a little, and from what I can suspect is that he won't give us the items we want in every town and village, but there will be random items here and there that will be of random usefulness.
And my party is pretty low-powered (we have a Rouge, a Ranger, a Fighter and a Druid (well, that one is maybe not THAT low-powered, but you can grasp what do I mean...).
And I just recently got to learn that Improved Natural Attack may be applied to Unarmed Strikes! Yay for big damage increase.

[Dunkoro]

Bump Bump?

[Talya]

If you've gotten Sacred Fist to be houseruled as full-casting, I see no reason not to enter earlier, since you'll be able to qualify by level 7.


Just to nitpick, Sacred Fist is officially full-casting. "Text trumps table."

It's not so much a houserule as it is ensuring the DM is abiding by the order of precedence.