The Kingdom of Gaia [3.5, Invocations]

[AmberVael]

From the humblest mouse to the king of eagles, every creature has its talent. There are those who call on the fell gifts of fiends, the terror of the dead, even the raw power of the elements, but I will tell you this: A man with the might of the beasts at his back is as great as they. What can match the cruel poisons of the vipers? Who will not tremble when faced with the ferocity of a lion? Is there not majesty in the flight of the birds and mystery in the beings that lurk in the depths of the sea?
In the kingdom of Gaia there are a thousand secrets that wait for the wise man to find them.

And so proceeds my slow (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=245205) but (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=244815) continual (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=232064) quest to make more invocations than Wizards of the Coast! Also to give some new and interesting themes and powers to the warlock and other invocation classes. This time, they've got an animal theme. As always, suggestions and comments are encouraged, both for these invocations and new sets.
I'm thinking of making a plant set after this one, we'll see if it works out, or if I make it in anything resembling a timely manner.


Assumption of the Humble Creatures
Lesser; 3rd
By communing with the humblest creatures, you have come to learn their talents and assume them yourself.
You gain the ability to change take the forms of certain creatures for 24 hours. As a standard action, you may take the shape of the following animals: Badger, Bat, Cat, Dog, Donkey, Lizard, Monkey, Owl, Rat, Raven, Small Fish, (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263573) Toad, Trout, (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263573) Viper Snake (tiny or small), and Weasel. You may also use a standard action to change between any of these forms or resume your normal form. While you use this invocation to take a form other than your own, you cannot use other invocations, including eldritch blast.
This works as the Alternate Form special ability, except that you also take on the creature's special qualities.

Cheetah's Sprint
Least; 2nd
You can channel your eldritch power to give yourself a great burst of speed.
Activating this invocation grants you a +30ft enhancement to all movement speeds for 24 hours. By using a swift action, you can increase this bonus to movement speed to +150ft for one round, but after that round, you gain no bonus to movement from this invocation until have had a chance to rest for at least one full minute.
So long as you gain a bonus to movement speed from this invocation, you gain a +4 dodge bonus against attacks of opportunity.
The bonus movement speed from this invocation is not taken into account when determining bonuses or penalties to jump checks.

Eldritch Charge
Greater; 6th; Blast Shape
You unleash the power of a rampaging beast with your magic, and charge headlong into your foes.
By using a full-round action, you transform yourself into a bestial shape of eldritch power and may attack all enemies in a line, which can be any length from 10 feet to 60 feet. You make a melee touch attack against each enemy within the area, and affect each target you hit with your eldritch blast, including any eldritch essence applied to the blast. You reposition yourself in any empty square adjacent to the last square entered by the line and reform there. Anything you carry (up to a maximum of your heavy load) is transported with you.

Facets of Nature
Dark; 8th
You have mastered the shapes of the beasts, and can move from one to the other with but a moment's thought, taking on whatever traits you desire.
After using this invocation, you gain the ability to take on the traits and qualities of animals, mixing and matching them as you desire for the next 24 hours. As a swift action, you may change your form in up to three of the following ways:
Increase or decrease your relative your size by up to two categories, gaining the appropriate size modifiers to attack, armor class, grapple, and hide, as well as the appropriate space and reach. In addition, for every increase in size, you gain a +2 size bonus to strength, and a -2 size penalty to dexterity, while for every decrease in size, you gain a +2 size bonus to dexterity, and a -2 size penalty to strength. Size penalties cannot reduce your ability score below 1.
Add up to four points to your physical ability scores, divided among them as desired. These bonuses stack with all other bonuses.
Add a +4 bonus to your natural armor.
Gain one new mode of movement at a speed of 30ft. You may gain a burrow speed, a fly speed with good maneuverability, or a swim speed as well as the aquatic subtype and the amphibious special quality. Alternately, you may increase the speed of one of your current modes of movement by 30ft, or increase the maneuverability of a fly speed by up to two steps.
Gain natural weapons that you do not already possess. You may gain one primary natural attack (either a bite, slam, tail, or gore attack) that deals 1d8 damage plus your strength bonus, and two secondary natural attacks (two claws, tentacles, slap attacks, or wing attacks) that deals 1d6 damage plus half your strength bonus. If you already have a primary natural attack, you may not gain a second one, but may instead gain a third secondary natural attack. The specified damage assumes medium size, and should be adjusted to reflect current size.
Gain one new sense type. You may gain 60ft darkvision and low light vision (if you possess darkvision, add 60ft to it, if you possess low-light vision, you can now see three times as far as normal in dim light), Scent and Track as a bonus feat (if you already have Scent, double its range), or 20ft Blindsense (if you already possess Blindsense, add 20ft to its range.)
You may only gain one benefit at a time from each of these options, though you may alter previously made choices while changing your form. You may never benefit from more than three of these options at once.

Hawk's Eye
Least; 2nd
You look upon the world with the eyes of the hawk, and not even the finest or most distant details escape your vision.
You gain increased visual acuity for 24 hours. You gain Low Light Vision, a +6 bonus to spot checks. Furthermore, instead of taking a -1 penalty to spot for every 10ft of distance, you take a -1 penalty to spot for every 50ft.

Leaping Hare
Greater; 6th
The bounding hare leaps and jumps to escape its predators- with your power to guide you, you mimic its evasiveness.
This invocation grants you a +6 bonus to jump checks. In addition, for the purposes of jumping, you are always treated as having a running start. These effects last for 24 hours.
This invocation also grants you a number of charges equal to half your caster level. By spending a single charge, you may make a jump check and move that distance as a swift action. By spending four charges, you may make a jump check and move that distance as an immediate action. These charges refresh every time you have a full minute to rest.

Lord of the Deep
Dark; 9th; Blast Shape
In the darkness of the sea's depths, you have found new ways to manipulate your magic.
You may use this blast shape invocation as a free action reshape your eldritch blast into eight long tentacles until your next turn. By using a full-round action, you may make a 60ft ranged touch attack with each tentacle, though you may not attack a single target more than three tentacles. You cannot use your normal eldritch blast while this invocation is active.

Protective Shell
Lesser; 3rd
A creature that truly needs protection provides its own cover- in observing the tortoise and the crab, you learn to weave your eldritch magics into a layered shell of energy.
You are treated as having cover, granting you a +4 bonus to armor class and a +2 bonus to reflex saves, though you cannot use this benefit to make a Hide check. As a swift action, you can extend this protection to all creatures who are adjacent to you. Reducing its range to personal again is also a swift action.
In addition, any creature that gains the benefits of this invocation may forgo acting on their turn to increase the benefits they receive (but not the benefits any other creature in the area receives) to Improved Cover, granting them a +8 bonus to armor class and +4 to reflex saves, as well as improved evasion to attacks against which the reflex save bonus applies.

Venom Blast
Greater; 6th; Eldritch Essence
From the discipline of the serpent, you learn how to distill your eldritch powers into a potent substance with poison-like properties.
This eldritch essence invocation allows you to change your eldritch blast into a venom blast. Any creature struck by a venom blast must make a Fortitude save. On a failed save, they take 1d6 constitution damage, and must make a second save one round later, or suffer another 1d6 constitution damage.

Wild Summons
Lesser; 4th
You call out for an ally, and the wild answers.
This invocation takes one hour to perform, after which you may call any creature that acts as an animal companion, drawn from the animal companion list. For the purposes of determining what animals you can call and what benefits they receive, your effective druid level is equal to your caster level. Unlike normal animal companions, your Wild Summons does not have the Share Spells feature. You may not have more than one Wild Summons at once, though you may use this invocation again to dismiss your previous Wild Summons and call a new one. A Wild Summons lasts indefinitely or until slain, and its calling is an instantaneous effect, so it cannot be dispelled as a summoned creature might be.

[Erik Vale]

Very good. I can see myself using these in the future.

A question in regards to Lord of the Deep, how does it interact with homebrew warlock classes that grant the ability to make a full round attack action to gain irruptive attacks. The maximum number I know is three, but that blooms into 30 attacks, while other classes can break the game worse, this destroys the direct damage industry.
Especially considering it can happen at will...
I am now so wanting to use this with your eldritch paragon class...

[Cipher Stars]

Assumption of the Humble Creatures
Lesser; 3rd
By communing with the humblest creatures, you have come to learn their talents and assume them yourself.
You gain the ability to change take the forms of certain creatures for 24 hours. As a standard action, you may take the shape of the following animals as the Alternate Form special ability: Bat, Cat, Dog, Donkey, Lizard, Monkey, Owl, Rat, Raven, Small Fish, (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263573) Toad, Trout, (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263573) Viper Snake (tiny or small), and Weasel. You may also use a standard action to change between any of these forms or resume your normal form. While you use this invocation to take a form other than your own, you cannot use other invocations, including eldritch blast.

Lovely~



Lord of the Deep
Dark; 9th; Blast Shape
In the darkness of the sea's depths, you have found new ways to manipulate your magic.
You reshape your eldritch blast into ten long tentacles. By using a full-round action, you may make a 60ft ranged touch attack with each tentacle, though you may not attack a single target more than four tentacles.

~<3




Wild Summons
Lesser; 4th
You call out for an ally, and the wild answers.
This invocation takes one hour to perform, after which you may call any creature that acts as an animal companion, drawn from the animal companion list. For the purposes of determining what animals you can call and what benefits they receive, your effective druid level is equal to your caster level. Unlike normal animal companions, your Wild Summons does not have the Share Spells feature. You may not have more than one Wild Summons at once, though you may use this invocation again to dismiss your previous Wild Summons and call a new one. A Wild Summons lasts indefinitely or until slain, and its calling is an instantaneous effect, so it cannot be dispelled as a summoned creature might be.
Not sure as to the effectiveness and usage of this, but I like it so I wont say anything else but I like it :3

[AmberVael]

A question in regards to Lord of the Deep, how does it interact with homebrew warlock classes that grant the ability to make a full round attack action to gain irruptive attacks. The maximum number I know is three, but that blooms into 30 attacks, while other classes can break the game worse, this destroys the direct damage industry.
Especially considering it can happen at will...

Lord of the Deep was not designed with such features in mind. Kind of like Eldritch Glaive wasn't.

I may add a specific clause to assist with that since it is common (and there is eldritch sculptor and quicken spell-like anyway,) but attempting to keep track of how my homebrew interacts with all other homebrew is really something of a lost cause. I can do my best to keep it in line with all WotC material, but beyond that...

I am now so wanting to use this with your eldritch paragon class...
As a side note, there's a reason that class hasn't made it to my homebrew list or the homebrew forums, for that matter. It was made to fit in with a group of classes that I don't accept as the standard level of balance.

That, and I think it was kind of boring. :smalltongue:


Not sure as to the effectiveness and usage of this, but I like it so I wont say anything else but I like it :3

Glad you like them! My thought is that Wild Summons is pretty handy for having interchangeable, renewable, but relatively effective minions. I can see a fair number of uses for it.
The Dead Walk may be a bit more powerful, though Wild Summons has some advantage in not requiring onyx or corpses. You're rather more free to get exactly what you want when you want it.

[Neon Knight]

I really like Protective Shell for using the uncommonly employed cover mechanics.

[Amechra]

You might want to tweak Facets of Nature a tad; as it stands, you can only use any of the options once, ever.

Stupid RAW, I know, but RAW is as RAW does.

[AmberVael]

Ah, good point.

Changed from:

You may only benefit from each of these options once, though you may alter previously made choices while changing your form.
To

You may only gain one benefit at a time from each of these options, though you may alter previously made choices while changing your form.

That work, you think?

[Amechra]

That works.

[Xefas]

Assumption of the Humble Creatures
Lesser; 3rd
By communing with the humblest creatures, you have come to learn their talents and assume them yourself.
You gain the ability to change take the forms of certain creatures for 24 hours. As a standard action, you may take the shape of the following animals as the Alternate Form special ability: Bat, Cat, Dog, Donkey, Lizard, Monkey, Owl, Rat, Raven, Small Fish, (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263573) Toad, Trout, (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263573) Viper Snake (tiny or small), and Weasel. You may also use a standard action to change between any of these forms or resume your normal form. While you use this invocation to take a form other than your own, you cannot use other invocations, including eldritch blast.


Does the 'cannot use other invocations' include the passive effects of long-duration invocations? For instance, if I already have Fell Flight active on me, does it count as "using" the invocation if I fly while in Donkey form?

If no, what about passive invocations that grant an at-will ability that requires an action to perform, such as Call of the Wild?

In any case, I'd personally like to see an exception made to utilizing animal-based invocations while in animal form. I don't see why it should be prohibited to have a Bat-form Warlock using Summon Swarm to summon some more bats, or an Owl to use Call of the Wild to speak with other owls, or a Dog using Wild Summons to call up another dog.

[AmberVael]

Does the 'cannot use other invocations' include the passive effects of long-duration invocations? For instance, if I already have Fell Flight active on me, does it count as "using" the invocation if I fly while in Donkey form?
I think this uncertainty is mostly founded on lack of terminology for the warlock. The intention was that you cannot "cast" invocations while in another form. "Use" is the only equivalent term I could find. In any case, long duration effects still apply, as the effects were in place before you changed form. You can't initiate anything, but you can still benefit from things already there. Think Tenser's Transformation.


If no, what about passive invocations that grant an at-will ability that requires an action to perform, such as Call of the Wild?
Using the above reasoning, yes, you can use it. You're not casting it, so as long as you could perform the appropriate action while in your current form, you can do it.


In any case, I'd personally like to see an exception made to utilizing animal-based invocations while in animal form. I don't see why it should be prohibited to have a Bat-form Warlock using Summon Swarm to summon some more bats, or an Owl to use Call of the Wild to speak with other owls, or a Dog using Wild Summons to call up another dog.
While this would work nicely in a fluff sense, it would be a downright pain to implement mechanically, and I don't particularly think it would be worth it.

[Xefas]

I think this uncertainty is mostly founded on lack of terminology for the warlock. The intention was that you cannot "cast" invocations while in another form. "Use" is the only equivalent term I could find. In any case, long duration effects still apply, as the effects were in place before you changed form. You can't initiate anything, but you can still benefit from things already there.

Yeah, I can see that. "Activate" maybe? Although that's still a bit ambiguous. That's annoying. I'm actually kinda thankful for the Tome of Battle terminology now.


While this would work nicely in a fluff sense, it would be a downright pain to implement mechanically, and I don't particularly think it would be worth it.

"While you use this invocation to take a form other than your own, you cannot use other invocations, including eldritch blast, save for those that specifically and directly summon, call, manipulate, or facilitate communication with creatures of the Animal type."?

[AttilaTheGeek]

Like I said over in the PEACH exchange thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=14464361), I have no experience with Invocations (SLAs, usable at will, only one learned per two levels?), but I'm checking these out anyway to give what feedback I can.


Assumption of the Humble Creatures

I don't really see why this invocation would be used other than to sneak and to hide, which Invisibility already does. Warlocks already know hardly any invocations, so I'm not sure if this can compete with other invocations of its level.


Cheetah's Sprint
This seems like a supercharged Expeditious Retreat, which is both cool and handy. It essentially gives you +30 feet of movement speed all the time, allowing you to outrun anyone you meet, ever. However, thinking of in-combat applications, it doesn't do much. Perhaps it could grant you a bonus to your AC against attacks of opportunity, or give extra attacks, like a lesser version of Haste.


Eldritch Charge
I really like this spell. I love charge mechanics in general, but I like the synergy with Eldritch Blast. I do have to say, though, the fluff seems a little unusual. My thought process as I read it was "It's like Wild Shape for a round, but makes touch attacks, and...runs really fast?" Perhaps it would be simpler just to say "you become a cloud of pure energy" and run with that as the fluff.


Facets of Nature
Reminds me of Shapechange and the polymorph line, but with a whole bunch of restrictions. However, the "Add up to eight points to your physical ability scores" line seems incredibly powerful, so much so that I can see it becoming the main focus of the spell. Is that intentional?


Lord of the Deep
This spell is really cool! Like, incredibly cool. As in "Let me build my entire character around this spell", mind-blowingly awesome.

But wait, there's more! It's crazy powerful, too! For just $19.95 one Invocation, I can double your Eldritch Blast! Better yet, I'll double the offer! Still not satisfied? I'll double it again! And just to emphasize how great this deal is, I'll add another two Eldritch Blasts at no additional cost! (Just pay shipping and handling)

Sarcasm aside, this is actually insane. 10d6 on a ranged touch at 20th level isn't all that impressive, but multiplying it by ten makes it borderline absolutely ridiculous. Maybe "ten tentacles that each do half damage" or only five tentacles would make more sense.


Venom Blast
This is just a straight-up damage enhancement. Both solid and flavorful.


Wild Summons
An animal companion is the quintessential mark of a powerful natural spellcaster. Not much to say about it; it's a good ability that everyone knows with both in- and out-of-combat uses.

[Wyntonian]

Gah, you've done it again, Vael. Now I want to play a warlock.

Seriously, my only critique is that the warlock doesn't get enough invocations to use all of these. I suppose a chameleon dip for the floating Extra Invocation would help, but it's no substitute for having all of these and PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWAHH!

Of these, I'd probably take Protective Shell, Lord of the Deep, Facets of Nature (duh) and Wild Summons. They're all fun, really.

Oh, and maybe Lord of the Deep should be 8 tentacles? Just a thought, toning down from 100d6 to 80d6 might help a bit. 350 average damage is kind of a lot, even spread out, but 280 is manageable.

Also, Facets of Nature can give you a total of +8 to your Ranged Touch Attacks, between Dexterity and size decreases, and as a dodge bonus to AC as well. If you start out Small, that goes up to +10 (+4 from the +8 to dexterity, +2 from the +4 to dexterity from size decreases, +4 from being Diminutive). Seems like a lot, and that's just two of its abilities taken in one direction. These could be reeled back a bit, maybe a "pick two" sort of scenario.

[Xallace]

I think my only complaint is that Assumption of the Humble Creatures does not absorb masses of critters into your body and turn you into a horrible amalgamation of human and beast.

Just seems like a warlock thing to do.

[AmberVael]

Thanks to everyone for commenting and offering up their thoughts and suggestions. I really appreciate it. :smallsmile:



"While you use this invocation to take a form other than your own, you cannot use other invocations, including eldritch blast, save for those that specifically and directly summon, call, manipulate, or facilitate communication with creatures of the Animal type."?

Hmm... I see unfortunate potential for conflict and unintended exclusion even with that wording.

I think I'd prefer to make it open to all powers or no powers, anyway. It's just a lot cleaner, and makes a bit more sense in my mind.


I don't really see why this invocation would be used other than to sneak and to hide, which Invisibility already does. Warlocks already know hardly any invocations, so I'm not sure if this can compete with other invocations of its level.
It can let you hide, it can give you a disguise, it can let you change your size, it can increase certain ability scores (good for carrying capacity, in particular), it can let you fly, it can let you swim and breathe underwater. Also, with the viper, you can produce a steady supply of venom, on the off chance that you can find a use for that.

Now, the 'no invocations' clause hurts, but I think it might trump most of the others if it weren't there.
I could probably add in Badger though, which would give burrow, and thus one more thing that it can do.

I'm inclined to think of it as a fairly decent set of utility powers. Does this elaboration on what it can do change your perspective, or were you already considering these things when you made your observation?


This seems like a supercharged Expeditious Retreat, which is both cool and handy. It essentially gives you +30 feet of movement speed all the time, allowing you to outrun anyone you meet, ever. However, thinking of in-combat applications, it doesn't do much. Perhaps it could grant you a bonus to your AC against attacks of opportunity, or give extra attacks, like a lesser version of Haste.
Hmmm. I could see room to give a bonus against attacks of opportunity, or ignoring attacks of opportunity for specific circumstances. It is admittedly pretty limited- I tried erring on the lower end since it is a least invocation. Extra attacks would likely be too much for first level though, at least in any way that would be meaningful to a warlock.



I really like this spell. I love charge mechanics in general, but I like the synergy with Eldritch Blast. I do have to say, though, the fluff seems a little unusual. My thought process as I read it was "It's like Wild Shape for a round, but makes touch attacks, and...runs really fast?" Perhaps it would be simpler just to say "you become a cloud of pure energy" and run with that as the fluff.
The basic idea was a charging animal, like a stag- lowers its horns, rushes through and smacks everyone on the way. It's a touch attack simply because touch attacks are what eldritch blast/warlocks do, whether they're throwing rays of energy, making glaives or gigantic blasts.
Besides, a cloud of pure energy isn't really an animal theme. Gotta stick to my theme, after all! :smalltongue:


Reminds me of Shapechange and the polymorph line, but with a whole bunch of restrictions. However, the "Add up to eight points to your physical ability scores" line seems incredibly powerful, so much so that I can see it becoming the main focus of the spell. Is that intentional?
A more limited shapechange/wildshape was indeed the intention- Warlocks don't really have anything along those lines, unfortunately. I was hoping to rectify that in a way that didn't overpower it.

Ability points probably is one of the main draws, mostly because I was hoping to make the invocation worthwhile to most warlocks, whether they want to be a melee warlock or something else. It seemed enticing enough, but not unreasonable. It could possibly use reducing to 6 or 4 though, especially since there are bonuses for size adjustments too.


This spell is really cool! Like, incredibly cool. As in "Let me build my entire character around this spell", mind-blowingly awesome.

But wait, there's more! It's crazy powerful, too! For just $19.95 one Invocation, I can double your Eldritch Blast! Better yet, I'll double the offer! Still not satisfied? I'll double it again! And just to emphasize how great this deal is, I'll add another two Eldritch Blasts at no additional cost! (Just pay shipping and handling)

Sarcasm aside, this is actually insane. 10d6 on a ranged touch at 20th level isn't all that impressive, but multiplying it by ten makes it borderline absolutely ridiculous. Maybe "ten tentacles that each do half damage" or only five tentacles would make more sense.
Well, for reference, there's a least invocation that lets you make iterative attacks (so three or four attacks), and a lesser invocation that can chain your attacks (up to five targets).

I was attempting to strike a balance with Lord of the Deep- I wanted it useful against multiple and single targets, and I didn't want it to have the horrible flaw of "reflex/half" which far too many blast shapes suffer from. With the inspirational source being a squid, 10 attack rolls seemed to be the way to go- but clearly allowing just 10 attacks would be ridiculous. Which is why it go the "no more than four attacks on a single target" clause.

I don't believe halving damage would do the trick, since much of the power of the eldritch blast comes not from damage, but from their eldritch essences- dealing 15 or so less damage per attack is a minimal loss in comparison to hitting everyone with 2 negative levels, the nauseating condition, or constitution damage, after all.

I'd prefer to keep it at 10 attacks, in order to keep with the inspiration, though I could possibly lower it to 8, for octopus. I'm thinking the way to go might be to lower the number of attacks on a single target a bit more, and possibly to downgrade from ranged touch attack to simply ranged attack.


Gah, you've done it again, Vael. Now I want to play a warlock.

Seriously, my only critique is that the warlock doesn't get enough invocations to use all of these. I suppose a chameleon dip for the floating Extra Invocation would help, but it's no substitute for having all of these and PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWAHH!

Of these, I'd probably take Protective Shell, Lord of the Deep, Facets of Nature (duh) and Wild Summons. They're all fun, really.

Oh, and maybe Lord of the Deep should be 8 tentacles? Just a thought, toning down from 100d6 to 80d6 might help a bit. 350 average damage is kind of a lot, even spread out, but 280 is manageable.

Glad you like it! As for invocation number complaints, I suggest looking at one of the many nifty warlock fixes in the homebrew section, which generally allow for a greater number of invocations.

Alternately, if you're really patient, hopeful, and wish upon a shooting star, you may eventually see my own invocation class (http://www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=287) (spoiler spoiler) come out which is meant to work with all of my invocation sets.


I think my only complaint is that Assumption of the Humble Creatures does not absorb masses of critters into your body and turn you into a horrible amalgamation of human and beast.

Just seems like a warlock thing to do.

Gaia would not be pleased.
*but takes notes for eventual Far Realms themed set*
:smallwink:



Summary of Critiques and Proposed Fixes
Just to get everyone interested in commenting and assisting on the same page, here's everything all nice and neat and orderly.

Assumption of the Humble Creatures
Critiques:
-Should allow for use of appropriate powers
-Doesn't provide enough effects

Potential Fixes:
-Adding new forms with other abilities, like Badger
-Opening up special qualities (might be bad on a normal shapechange ability, but this is a low power controlled list- it would open up things like scent and blindsense, which could extend its utility)
-Allow certain powers to work with it

My thoughts:
I'm inclined to think it is fairly okay as is. I don't think it would be wrong to add a few more forms though, and that would be my preferred method of boosting it if it was generally agreed as necessary, since it was intended as an array of utility effects.


Cheetah's Sprint
Critiques:
-Not many in combat applications

Potential Fixes:
-Add bonuses against attacks of opportunity
-Add extra attacks

My thoughts:
As this is a least invocation, extra attacks is probably a bit much. Bonuses against attacks of opportunity might be useful, though I think I'd be really interested in seeing some extra combat maneuvering ideas for it instead. Perhaps it could lend a bonus to the length of 5ft steps?


Facets of Nature
Critiques:
-Too many ability bonuses
-Perhaps too many abilities at one time.

Potential Fixes:
-Reduce changes made at once
-Reduce ability score bonus.

My thoughts:
On reflection, the bonuses from size and ability points stacked on top of one another may be a bit much. What might be interesting is to remove the ability score adjustments from size, which would tone down the bonuses as well as allow for amusing things like a tiny character with massive strength.
It would also be reasonable to just reduce the floating ability score points from 8 to 4 though.
I think if I were to reduce number of changes at one time, I'd go with three at once, and perhaps separate natural armor bonus to be its own thing at the same time.


Lord of the Deep
Critiques:
-Too many attacks

Potential Fixes:
-Reduce number of attacks
-Reduce number of attacks on a single target
-Change from ranged touch attacks to ranged attacks
-Reduce damage

My thoughts:
If I'm going to reduce attacks, I'd very much like to only reduce it to 8 attacks, so as to keep closer to the theme. I can accept moving from squid to octopus, but moving from squid to half a squid is a bit of a downer. :smalltongue: In addition, if it goes down too far in attack number, then it isn't a large enough boost from Eldritch Glaive and Eldritch Chain.
I'd prefer to keep it with touch attacks if possible, but I could definitely see reducing number of attacks on a single target to 3 or 2 instead of 4.
As one other note, I don't think reducing damage significantly impacts eldritch blast enough for that to be a viable solution.

[Xallace]

So what's the over-arching fluff for this? Like, what would a warlock have to do to get more druid-y powers such as these? Do you make a pact with the planet herself? Nature spirits? Do you need some sorta nature-related ancestor?

I'm interested to know if you had something specific in mind.

[Midwoka]

So what's the over-arching fluff for this? Like, what would a warlock have to do to get more druid-y powers such as these? Do you make a pact with the planet herself? Nature spirits? Do you need some sorta nature-related ancestor?

The Warlock's original description said that they could draw their powers from the fey, as one possibility. But the writers apparently forgot about it immediately afterward... I think it's nice to have more invocations that reflect Warlock powers not granted by demons and hellfire and hellevildemonfire =)


I really like Leaping Hare ('cause I love bunnies), but one little thing: a hare doesn't generally "escape its prey", it escapes its predators.

[AmberVael]

Okay! I've been distracted by other things for a bit, but I've finally got some time to come back to this invocation set and make a few changes.

-I've added Badger to the forms you can take with Assumption of the Humble Creatures.
-I've added a notable bonus against attacks of opportunity into cheetah sprint, which should hopefully make it more appealing.
-I've downsized Lord of the Deep from 10 to 8 tentacles, and made it so you can't attack a single target with more than three.

I still need to decide exactly what I'm going to do with Facets of Nature, admittedly, and Assumption could probably use a few more decent forms.


So what's the over-arching fluff for this? Like, what would a warlock have to do to get more druid-y powers such as these? Do you make a pact with the planet herself? Nature spirits? Do you need some sorta nature-related ancestor?

I'm interested to know if you had something specific in mind.

Well, Fey are tied to nature, and that was already mentioned as a possibility for Warlocks. So perhaps they have a fey in their history, or have made a pact with one. They could also have similar ties with other nature spirits.

Or perhaps they were raised by bears.

Or perhaps they went mad, ran into a forest, lived among and learned from all the animals, then came back out with new powers and abilities.

Perhaps they were bit by a radioactive zoo. :smalltongue:

Sometimes I give specific examples of how a warlock could gain such powers in my fluff descriptions, but I never mean to confine people to such an option. In this case, I did not have anything particular in mind, though I think there are plenty of explanations to be used.


The Warlock's original description said that they could draw their powers from the fey, as one possibility. But the writers apparently forgot about it immediately afterward... I think it's nice to have more invocations that reflect Warlock powers not granted by demons and hellfire and hellevildemonfire =)


I really like Leaping Hare ('cause I love bunnies), but one little thing: a hare doesn't generally "escape its prey", it escapes its predators.

I'm glad you agree with my attempt to add variety!

Also, Leaping Hare derp is fixed. I dunno what I was thinking.

[Deepbluediver]

Dropping in here from the PEACH exchange. If you feel my comments where helpful, I'd love some feedback on these combat-style feats (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=267778) in return.

Meant to get to this last night, but I stopped to look up a few quick things and got distracted by the shiny (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=265455).



From the humblest mouse to the king of eagles, every creature has its talent. There are those who call on the fell gifts of fiends, the terror of the dead, even the raw power of the elements, but I will tell you this: A man with the might of the beasts at his back is as great as they. What can match the cruel poisons of the vipers? Who will not tremble when faced with the ferocity of a lion? Is there not majesty in the flight of the birds and mystery in the beings that lurk in the depths of the sea?
In the kingdom of Gaia there are a thousand secrets that wait for the wise man to find them.
Personally, I'm not a huge fan of fey-based warlocks, but maybe that's just because they don't have enough support. More nature-y invocations would certainly help with that issue though.


Assumption of the Humble Creatures
Lesser; 3rd
By communing with the humblest creatures, you have come to learn their talents and assume them yourself.

Since you can't use your other invocations, this basically limits you to running around as a small, non magical critter. It grants several kinds of movement, but the most useful, flight, can be obtaind via Fel Flight which comes online at this same time and doesn't have the restrictions. The only situation I can imagine this being objectively similar is if you are trying to run some sort of underground obstacle course, and need to travers land, see, and air all in quick succession.

Honestly, I think it might do better as a Least Invocation.



Cheetah's Sprint
Least; 2nd
You can channel your eldritch power to give yourself a great burst of speed.

The speed boost and the sprint are both nice, and we all love dodge bonuses to AC; the whole thing though just feels a little static. Personally, I like thing that scale. I'll make a suggestion for tweaking the power based on warlock level, and you can think about if it gets too complicated or not.

{table]W. Level|Speed Enhancement|Sprint|AC Bonus
1-4|10|50|+2
5-8|15|75|+3
9-12|20|100|+4
13-16|30|150|+5
17-20|40|200|+6[/table]



Eldritch Charge
Greater; 6th; Blast Shape
You unleash the power of a rampaging beast with your magic, and charge headlong into your foes.

The movement is a nice addition, but how often do enemies convientenly all line up nice and neatly for you? Seems sort of situational unless you know you are going are going to be fighting in a gnome-sized maze.
I assume that all the normal rules limiting a charge (terrain type and whatnot) also still apply?

I'll make another suggestion, albiet a somewhat unorthodox one. How about if the charge allows your eldritch blast to trigger once for each occupied square? That way it's usable against larger enemies as well, since something occupying a 10x10 foot area could get hit at least twice, and anything larger might take 4 or 5 hits if you position yourself correctly.


Facets of Nature
Dark; 8th
You have mastered the shapes of the beasts, and can move from one to the other with but a moment's thought, taking on whatever traits you desire.

Precisely what action is "a moment's thought"? Can it be done with immediate actions or are you limited to free actions on your turn.

Certainly plenty of options for melee combat here, and it doesn't restrict your invocations. I'd probably rate the straight up combat ability at high tier 4 alone, and pushing the tier 2/3 border when combined with other warlock traits. You might want to think about some way to limit how much you can pump any one ability, or even just limit it to Str, Dex, and Con. As is, there doesn't seem to be any reason to NOT take this and use it to boost your Charisma to make your save DCs that much harder all the time.

Blindsense is kinda weak, IMO. This invocation already has so much potential that making it blindsight instead wouldn't (IMO) be the determining factor on wether it's broken or not.



Hawk's Eye
Least; 2nd
You look upon the world with the eyes of the hawk, and not even the finest or most distant details escape your vision.

When I evaluate something, I try to look at both power and versatility. This seems decently powered, for it's level, but it's kinda bland. Also, invocations are a warlocks most limited resource; is this invocation worth giving up others that you now can't take in it's place?

It's not bad, but I'd look for ways to improve the number of situations it can contribute to. Maybe rename it Eyes of the Raptor and give it seperate bonuses for day (Hawk) and night (owl).



Leaping Hare
Greater; 6th
The bounding hare leaps and jumps to escape its predators- with your power to guide you, you mimic its evasiveness.

The problem with ubiquitous all-purpose flight is that it eclipses so many other things.

All this really seems to give you is a once-per-encounter jump check to get away from danger or get into the fray. Is that good? Yes. Is it good enough to warrant sacrifcing a Greater invocation slot? Not IMO.



Lord of the Deep
Dark; 9th; Blast Shape
In the darkness of the sea's depths, you have found new ways to manipulate your magic.

Most spells like this have the caveat of "no two target can be more than 30 feat apart. As written, you could target two people, each one 50 ft to either side of you. Was that intentional?

Also, pardon my warlock inexperience, but what exactly is the purpose of this Invocation? Theres no rules for grappling or tripping with it, and it doesn't seem to boost damage against single-target boss types. At first glance, it's only real benefit seems to be to allow you to damage multiple enemies as a single action.

And why is a tentacle a "touch" attack as compared to a normal attack with a physical object?

It looks fun and flavorful, but it seems to raise an awful lot of questions; and I need to figure out exactly what I'm using it for. Again, since the nastiest creatures in D&D tend to NOT come in hordes and swarms, maybe add the following: for each size category above medium, you can hit a single creature with an additional tentacle. (so large=4, huge=5, etc)



Protective Shell
Lesser; 3rd
A creature that truly needs protection provides its own cover- in observing the tortoise and the crab, you learn to weave your eldritch magics into a layered shell of energy.

This seems just fine, to me. Having it boost your defense via psuedo-cover makes for an interesting touch, and it goes a long way towards protecting the blastlock from enemy archers. (or a glaivelock from enemy combatants, even)



Venom Blast
Greater; 6th; Eldritch Essence
From the discipline of the serpent, you learn how to distill your eldritch powers into a potent substance with poison-like properties.

The only downside to this is that it doesn't really scale. That being said, it's plenty nasty all on it's own, because it's Con damage, so each save they fail makes it harder to save the next one. One round ramp-up, and then your target is taking 2d6 Con damage per round.

IMO, a more interesting (though perhaps less powerful ability) would let it deal any ability damage OTHER THAN Constitution, so you could paralyze or stupify your enemies without killing them. Maybe let it add 1d3 or 1d4 Con damage only on a failed save.



Wild Summons
Lesser; 4th
You call out for an ally, and the wild answers.

You've got a full-strength animal companion, except its sort of even better, because you don't care if your animal-buddy dies; you can just summon up a new one!

The one-hour casting time is the only thing that stops me from declaring this totally broken.



Anywho, to conclude, I hope this is helpful, and doesn't come across as overly negative. There are some interesting ideas here, and the flavor certainly fits the theme, but the power levels just seem a little schizophrenic.

[AmberVael]

Thanks for the commentary! I'll try and look at it a bit more in depth, but here are very quick responses I think I can make:


Precisely what action is "a moment's thought"? Can it be done with immediate actions or are you limited to free actions on your turn.
Typically, my flavor text is separate from mechanics. In the mechanics, you find your answer here:
"As a swift action, you may change your form in one or more of the following ways."

Also, I will note that Facets of Nature is one of the invocations that is definitely on my "needs some fixing" list. Check up towards the spoiler a few posts above- I'd appreciate thoughts on any of the specific ideas listed there.


The problem with ubiquitous all-purpose flight is that it eclipses so many other things.

All this really seems to give you is a once-per-encounter jump check to get away from danger or get into the fray. Is that good? Yes. Is it good enough to warrant sacrificing a Greater invocation slot? Not IMO.
This invocation has been something of a source of uncertainty for me. It's part of my attempts to give the Warlock invocations with more diverse action types. Mostly, this was meant to be a defensive invocation- the immediate action jump was the first part to it.
I added the swift action move to give it at least a little more usability, but I was highly uncertain as to how exactly to handle the immediate defense- being able to move as an immediate action is very useful, after all, and a good defense. And then, once I made the charges scaling...

In theory, the deal might be sweetened by lowering the cost of immediate action use, but I wonder if I should abandon the charge mechanic, and perhaps even scaling- I'm not sure scaling is entirely appropriate for this kind of ability. It seems to too easily swing between too much and too little.

Thoughts?


Most spells like this have the caveat of "no two target can be more than 30 feat apart. As written, you could target two people, each one 50 ft to either side of you. Was that intentional?
Yes.


Also, pardon my warlock inexperience, but what exactly is the purpose of this Invocation?
Warlocks honestly have a lot of bad blast shapes. They have area effects, but almost none are considered worthwhile, and for good reason. And they really only have one that allows multiple single target attacks.

The intention was to make a shape that was a little more worthwhile, and not so horribly situational. It's not flat out bad against single targets, as it can direct more attacks at them, but it also has its use against multiple weaker enemies. It was an attempt to find some kind of halfway point.


And why is a tentacle a "touch" attack as compared to a normal attack with a physical object?

Touch attacks are just kind of what Warlocks do. :smalltongue:
In all seriousness, it's how their power works- and Lord of the Deep isn't so much making actual, physical tentacles so much as reshaping your eldritch magic (which works on touch attacks) into a somewhat different style.

Think less shapeshifting, more waterbending. (http://images.wikia.com/avatar/images/f/fc/Octopus_form.png)

So, it's a touch attack because Eldritch Blast is a touch attack, much like Eldritch Glaive.


Anywho, to conclude, I hope this is helpful, and doesn't come across as overly negative. There are some interesting ideas here, and the flavor certainly fits the theme, but the power levels just seem a little schizophrenic.
I think you hit on both cause and effect here. :smallwink:

I could quite easily just make some invocations that work off of safe, known effects, toss them up, and achieve balance with little fuss. However, my interest is in really expanding and exploring new avenues for invocations and how they might work- and making them is a rather more complicated process. I won't claim that all my invocations are new and inventive, but I definitely try for that- and so the results are a little... mixed.

[Deepbluediver]

Didn't really read through the whole thread the first time; just now found the spoilered update with proposed changes. My bad.


Typically, my flavor text is separate from mechanics. In the mechanics, you find your answer here: "As a swift action, you may change your form in one or more of the following ways."

Ah, ok. It was late at night and I missed that bit.



Also, I will note that Facets of Nature is one of the invocations that is definitely on my "needs some fixing" list. Check up towards the spoiler a few posts above- I'd appreciate thoughts on any of the specific ideas listed there.

Hmm....

What about this:

You assume the form and appearence of any one creature of the animal type, and the charateristics of many others. When using this invocation, you MUST assume the form of some animal, although the shape change alone does not alter your abilities in any way.

To assume the characteristics of other animals you must expend points, and you have a number of points to spend equal to 3+1/2 HD.

Change Size: Any category between Tiny and Gargantuan, costs 1 point per category of difference from your normal form.
Spend 1 point to gain the primary natural attacks of 1 animal (Damage equal to your eldritch blast damage). Spend a second point to gain the secondary attacks of that animal or another animal.
Gain the racial skill bonuses of any 1 animal, 1 point.
Gain the special qualities of any 1 animal, 1 point.
Gain an extradordinary ability of any animal, 1 point each.
Gain the ability to breathe underwater, 1 point.
Gain a swim or burrow speed of 20 ft.; each additional point spent increases the speed by 10 ft.
Gain flight at clumsy manueverability and 30 ft.; each additional point increases the speed by 10 ft. and the manueverability by 1 category
Improve your Str, Dex, or Con by 1, 1 point each.
Improve your AC by 2, 1 point each.


You cannot assume characteristics of any animal whose HD (as given in the MM) exceeds your own HD.



This invocation has been something of a source of uncertainty for me. It's part of my attempts to give the Warlock invocations with more diverse action types.

My opinion of the Leaping Hare is altering, slowly, the more I think about it. I'm still uncertain about how it stacks up against other invocations in terms of pure power, but after reading the rest of the thread I can see better now where it would be useful.

How about, rather than forcing you to rest for 1 minute, during any round in which you don't make a Jump check you regain 1 charge?



Yes.
My knee-jerk reaction is to suggest that it be limited in the area it can target, but I must admit that standing in a group of enemies and lashing out all around you is kinda cool.
Maybe compromise by saying that all targets need to be within a circle with 30 ft. radius.



Touch attacks are just kind of what Warlocks do. :smalltongue:
In all seriousness, it's how their power works- and Lord of the Deep isn't so much making actual, physical tentacles so much as reshaping your eldritch magic (which works on touch attacks) into a somewhat different style.

Think less shapeshifting, more waterbending. (http://images.wikia.com/avatar/images/f/fc/Octopus_form.png)

So, it's a touch attack because Eldritch Blast is a touch attack, much like Eldritch Glaive.

Ooooookay....I guess that kinda makes sense. :smallconfused:



Warlocks honestly have a lot of bad blast shapes. They have area effects, but almost none are considered worthwhile, and for good reason. And they really only have one that allows multiple single target attacks.

The intention was to make a shape that was a little more worthwhile, and not so horribly situational. It's not flat out bad against single targets, as it can direct more attacks at them, but it also has its use against multiple weaker enemies. It was an attempt to find some kind of halfway point.

Reading through the thread, the biggest complaint seems to be that each tentacle gets your full eldritch blast damage. When combined with the fact that you can spam this all day and night, even the cost of a full-round action isn't enough of a balance.

There are a couple of things you could probably do to fix this, here's my first suggestion:

By using a full-round action, you may form your eldritch blast into tentacles that make ranged touch attacks (60 ft. range). The maximum number of tentacles you can form may not exceed your caster level.
You have a pool of d6 to distribute amongst the tentacles equal to twice the normal value for your eldritch blast. No one tentacle can have more than your normal eldtrich blast attack damage.
These tentacles can reach around corners and through gaps, meaning you do not need to have line of sight to hit your target and can ignore cover (though you still have a 50% miss chance for any target you cannot see).



Sorry if that's a little more complicated than your version, but I think it gets at most what you wanted in your initial attempt without going overboard. Plus, being able to bend your attacks makes them feel a little more "tentacle-y", I think.
If you don't like it let me know and I'll head back to the drawing board.