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Jormengand
2012-12-30, 06:35 PM
Yeah, if you're just going to come and tell me this isn't funny, don't. If you don't get the references, it's not funny. If you've seen this kind of thing before, it's not funny. If you only look at the spell selection, it's not funny.

If you actually know the stuff I'm referencing, look at all the special abilities... it might be funny. It might not. So please, if you're here to tell me it's a bad class, it's not balanced/playable etc. just don't. Okay?

Alignment: Any, though they have an alarming tendency to be lawful evil.

Hit die: D%

Class skills: All skills are always class skills for the Dungeon Master.

Skill points: 20+Int (*4 at first level in 3.5 ed.)

Starting gold: 50d%*1000

{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
20/15/10/5|
+10|
+10|
+10| Bonus Feats (Combat), Supremacy +100

2nd|
40/35/30/25|
+15|
+15|
+15| Bonus Feats (Item Creation), Supremacy +200

3rd|
60/55/50/45|
+15|
+15|
+15| Bonus Feats (Metamagic), Supremacy +300

4th|
80/75/70/65|
+20|
+20|
+20| Bonus Feats (All), Supremacy +400

5th|
100/95/90/85|
+20|
+20|
+20| Voice of Command, Supremacy +500

6th|
120/115/110/105|
+25|
+25|
+25|Supremacy +600

7th|
140/135/130/125|
+25|
+25|
+25|Supremacy +700

8th|
160/155/150/145|
+30|
+30|
+30| Write Out, Supremacy +800

9th|
180/175/170/165|
+30|
+30|
+30|Supremacy +900

10th|
200/195/190/185|
+35|
+35|
+35|Supremacy +1000

11th|
220/215/210/205|
+35|
+35|
+35|Supremacy +1100

12th|
240/235/230/225|
+40|
+40|
+40|Write In, Supremacy +1200

13th|
260/255/250/245|
+40|
+40|
+40|Supremacy +1300

14th|
280/275/270/265|
+45|
+45|
+45|Divine Retribution, Supremacy +1400

15th|
300/295/290/285|
+45|
+45|
+45|Supremacy +1500

16th|
320/315/310/305|
+50|
+50|
+50|Supremacy +1600

17th|
340/335/330/325|
+50|
+50|
+50|Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies, Supremacy +1700

18th|
360/355/350/345|
+55|
+55|
+55|Supremacy +1800

19th|
380/375/370/365|
+55|
+55|
+55|Supremacy +1900

20th|
400/395/390/385|
+60|
+60|
+60|The True Master, Supremacy +2000[/table]{table=head]Spells Per Day
{table=head]Level | 0* | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9
1st | 20 | 18 | 16 | 14 | 12 | 10 | 8 | 6 | 4 | 2 |
2nd | 40 | 36 | 32 | 28 | 24 | 20 | 16 | 12 | 4 | 4 |
3rd | 60 | 54 | 48 | 42 | 36 | 30 | 24 | 18 | 8 | 6 |
4th | 80 | 72 | 64 | 56 | 48 | 40 | 32 | 24 | 12 | 8 |
5th | 100 | 90 | 80 | 70 | 60 | 50 | 40 | 30 | 16 | 10 |
6th | 120 | 108 | 96 | 84 | 72 | 60 | 48 | 36 | 20 | 12 |
7th | 140 | 126 | 112 | 98 | 84 | 70 | 56 | 42 | 24 | 14 |
8th | 160 | 144 | 128 | 102 | 96 | 80 | 64 | 48 | 28 | 16 |
9th | 180 | 162 | 144 | 126 | 108 | 90 | 72 | 54 | 32 | 18 |
10th | 200 | 180 | 160 | 140 | 120 | 100 | 80 | 60 | 36 | 20 |
11th | 220 | 198 | 176 | 154 | 132 | 110 | 88 | 66 | 40 | 22 |
12th | 240 | 216 | 192 | 168 | 144 | 120 | 96 | 72 | 44 | 24 |
13th | 260 | 234 | 208 | 182 | 156 | 130 | 104 | 78 | 48 | 26 |
14th | 280 | 252 | 224 | 196 | 168 | 140 | 112 | 84 | 52 | 28 |
15th | 300 | 270 | 240 | 210 | 180 | 150 | 120 | 90 | 56 | 30 |
16th | 320 | 288 | 256 | 224 | 192 | 160 | 128 | 96 | 60 | 32 |
17th | 340 | 306 | 272 | 238 | 204 | 170 | 136 | 102 | 64 | 34 |
18th | 360 | 324 | 288 | 252 | 216 | 180 | 144 | 108 | 68 | 36 |
19th | 380 | 342 | 304 | 266 | 228 | 190 | 152 | 114 | 72 | 38 |
20th | 400 | 360 | 320 | 280 | 240 | 200 | 160 | 120 | 76 | 40 |
[/table][/table]

The Dungeon Master is proficient with all weapons, all armour and all shields including tower shields.

The Dungeon Master knows all spells from all spell lists. He need not prepare spells in advance, nor carry a spellbook. Regardless of the spell list used, the DM does not suffer arcane spell failure.

*In Pathfinder, ignore this column entirely. Like other spellcasters, the Dungeon Master's level 0 spells can be cast indefinitely.

Bonus Feats (Ex)

The Dungeon master gains all feats from the given category at the given level (see table). In 3.5, combat feats are all the feats which a fighter can take as bonus feats.

Supremacy(Ex)

At first level, and every level thereafter, the Dungeon Master's ability scores are all increased by 100 points.

Voice of Command (Ex)

At 5th level, the DM is so powerful that he can make a creature follow his commands. At will, and as an immediate action, the DM can command a creature to perform a single action, which it must obey as soon as possible, even if it cannot understand the Dungeon Master's commands. No saves are allowed against the Voice of Command.

Write Out (Su)

From eighth level onwards, the Dungeon Master may attempt to write any character out of existence as a standard action at will. The Dungeon Master aquires the script, which must be held along with some form of writing implement to complete the action, which involves drawing a single line on the script. The target must succeed on a will save with a DC equal to 10 + the Dungeon Master's intelligence modifier + the Dungeon Master's wisdom modifier or be obliterated from the plot.

Any who are written out are treated as having died from old age and being in a dead-magic, dimensionally locked plane which cannot be accessed by any means until such a time as they are written back in. This means that not even a wish or true resurrection spell can return them.

Write In (Su)

From twelfth level onwards and as a full-round action, the Dungeon Master can write any creature into existence at will. The creature can be anything of the Dungeon Master's description, or it can be a creature that was written out previously. He may also choose to write any creature, including himself, into a different location. If the target exists already, it gets a will save, of the same DC as Write Out, if it wishes.

Otherwise, the target appears in a location of the Dungeon Master's choosing. Note that the Dungeon Master does not have control of the target.

Divine retribution (Su)

From fourteenth level onwards, the Dungeon Master can call down a bolt of lightning on a creature at will as a standard action. The lightning bolt deals 10d6 points of untyped damage per level, and ignores all damage reduction. The Dungeon Master may choose to deal non-lethal damage instead.

Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies (Su)

From seventeenth level onwards, the Dungeon master may call down a storm of rocks as a standard action. He may do this at will. The storm of rocks affects an area of the Dungeon Master's choosing. Every creature and object in the area takes 20d6 points of damage per level, and must take a Fortitude save with the same DC as Write Out or be slain (for creatures) or destroyed (for objects) immediately.

The True Master (Ex)

At twentieth level, the Dungeon Master can do whatever he likes as a free action.

AuraTwilight
2012-12-30, 08:19 PM
This doesn't even work as a joke. It seems you just threw in some completely arbitrary numbers.

Maybe if the class was theoretically playable but still overpowered it'd be funny, like if they got Wish as an At-Will Spell-Like Ability at a capstone.

kinem
2012-12-30, 09:19 PM
This has been done before. Kind of funny but too much numerical detail.

Aura, look again at the name of the class. It's meant for one player in a group, and not his character :)

That said it needs more meta- stuff, like:

If you give the DM munchies, you can make a Diplomacy check (DC = DM's Wisdom score). If you succeed, he will grant you a limited wish.

AuraTwilight
2012-12-30, 09:49 PM
Aura, look again at the name of the class. It's meant for one player in a group, and not his character :)

I'm aware. It's also completely irrelevant to my complaint. My complaint is that it's not even remotely like a legible character. Anyone can throw around ridiculously large numbers around. That doesn't make good satirical homebrew.

kinem
2012-12-30, 10:05 PM
OK, I see what you're saying, but I still think it works better the less sense it makes, since DMs can (at least within the joke) do as they please.

PEACH
2012-12-30, 10:10 PM
Why put PEACH on a joke?

You don't want us to PEACH the thing. You don't want me in this thread.

AuraTwilight
2012-12-30, 10:17 PM
Homebrew should be usable. If the DM can just "do whatever he wants", then why bother writing stats out for what is effectively "Can do absolutely anything arbitrarily"? It's a waste of time to write it up and it's a waste of time to read and review.

Even humorous content should be playable, like the recently posted Booze domain or the Commoner flaws from Dragon magazine.

bobthe6th
2012-12-30, 11:42 PM
Well... chiken infested is known for being abuseable, at I don't really see *dead* as a good feat as it is basically a -2 con and a lot of gold for a feat...

But yes, you could just make every statistic line in this "DM fiat" and have the same effect... and a lot shorter of a read.

Jormengand
2012-12-31, 09:23 AM
Removed the PEACH sign, since that seems to be giving people aggro. And the point is, IT'S NOT MEANT TO BE BALANCED! It's meant to be a reference to a lot of stuff; DON'T JUST LOOK AT THE SPELL LIST, BAB AND SAVES.

If you're not a troper, you won't get half of it. If you're not internet-savvy, you won't get the other half. It's like saying that OOTS sucks if you've never picked up a D20. You need to get the jokes for it to be funny.

kinem
2012-12-31, 09:53 AM
This would work a lot better as a template than as a class; that way the stuff we're not supposed to look at much wouldn't take up much space.

Midwoka
2012-12-31, 09:57 AM
I pity the Dungeon Master who uses Write Out to store someone safely out of the way, then finds that Write In won't bring them back because it's Supernatural and the stored character is all dead-magic'd. =P



If you're not a troper, you won't get half of it. If you're not internet-savvy, you won't get the other half. It's like saying that OOTS sucks if you've never picked up a D20. You need to get the jokes for it to be funny.

I may not get every joke in it, but I get alot of them (I'm kinda surprised their lightning bolt isn't mentioned as being blue...); I still don't find it that funny. Sorry. Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies and their HD size amused me a bit, though.

Jormengand
2012-12-31, 11:26 AM
I pity the Dungeon Master who uses Write Out to store someone safely out of the way, then finds that Write In won't bring them back because it's Supernatural and the stored character is all dead-magic'd. =P

It states "Until such a time as they are written back in."


I may not get every joke in it, but I get alot of them (I'm kinda surprised their lightning bolt isn't mentioned as being blue...); I still don't find it that funny. Sorry. Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies and their HD size amused me a bit, though.

It's not meant to be absolutely hilarious, it's just something I did because I felt like it.

Meh-heh-heh.

AuraTwilight
2012-12-31, 06:23 PM
Removed the PEACH sign, since that seems to be giving people aggro. And the point is, IT'S NOT MEANT TO BE BALANCED! It's meant to be a reference to a lot of stuff; DON'T JUST LOOK AT THE SPELL LIST, BAB AND SAVES.

If you're not a troper, you won't get half of it. If you're not internet-savvy, you won't get the other half. It's like saying that OOTS sucks if you've never picked up a D20. You need to get the jokes for it to be funny.

*facepalm* Balance isn't the problem. And I get the jokes, and I'm a troper, and that doesn't change that this isn't funny. My complaint is that this isn't meaningful homebrew. It doesn't really do anything. All it effectively means is "This character is arbitrarily omnipotent by DM fiat".

But thanks for indirectly insulting my intelligence and internet-savviness. That was cool.


This would work a lot better as a template than as a class; that way the stuff we're not supposed to look at much wouldn't take up much space.

Agreed.



It states "Until such a time as they are written back in."


But Jormen, you put wrote them out into a Dead-Magic plane, and Write-In is a Supernatural ability, so it can't function in a Dead-Magic area, so you can't actually write people back in!


It's not meant to be absolutely hilarious, it's just something I did because I felt like it.

Jormengand, stop it. You said it was meant to be funny in one post and now you're saying it wasn't meant to be totally hilarious. If you don't want people to review and criticize your work, don't post it.

Jormengand
2013-01-01, 10:44 AM
*facepalm* Balance isn't the problem. And I get the jokes, and I'm a troper, and that doesn't change that this isn't funny. My complaint is that this isn't meaningful homebrew. It doesn't really do anything. All it effectively means is "This character is arbitrarily omnipotent by DM fiat".

It's not meant to be meaningful.

But thanks for indirectly insulting my intelligence and internet-savviness. That was cool.

Thanks for directly insulting my everything. And, you know, actually doing it deliberately. And assuming I was trying to insult you. That was just lovely.

Agreed.

*Shrug*

But Jormen, you put wrote them out into a Dead-Magic plane, and Write-In is a Supernatural ability, so it can't function in a Dead-Magic area, so you can't actually write people back in!

Yes you can. As soon as you use the write in ability - which you can so long as the DM is not in a dead magic area - they stop being in a dead magic area.

Jormengand, stop it. You said it was meant to be funny in one post and now you're saying it wasn't meant to be totally hilarious. If you don't want people to review and criticize your work, don't post it.

It's meant to be mildly amusing. Is that not "funny, and yet not totally hilarious"?

If you've just come to insult me, leave. No-one's forcing you to be vile to me.

Cipher Stars
2013-01-01, 01:27 PM
*Laughs at class moments before actually considering taking it*



*Reads posts*


*sighs*


*Hugs Jormengand*

Jormengand
2013-01-01, 02:33 PM
*Laughs at class moments before actually considering taking it*



*Reads posts*


*sighs*


*Hugs Jormengand*

*Hugs*

Glad someone likes it.

T.G. Oskar
2013-01-01, 04:34 PM
YOU! YES, YOU WHO HAS COME TO TELL ME I'M BEING STUPID!

Yeah, if you're just going to come and tell me this isn't funny, don't. If you don't get the references, it's not funny. If you've seen this kind of thing before, it's not funny. If you only look at the spell selection, it's not funny.

If you actually know the stuff I'm referencing, look at all the special abilities... it might be funny. It might not. So please, if you're here to tell me it's a bad class, it's not balanced/playable etc. just don't. Okay?

Erm...the first thing I looked when I got here was watching this. What kind of a welcome is that one?

Reading the rest, and realizing it's a reaction to the responses received, on the other hand, pretty much forces me to make you this question.

What exactly IS the joke here, in any case?

From what I can gather, it's meant to be a joke, but not exactly a joke, that requires an arbitrary knowledge of tropes and metagame knowledge to apparently understand. Perhaps it's not meant to be a joke per se, but rather something not to be taken serious.

Whatever the case it may be, it seems the attempt has fallen flat real quick. Nobody seems to get the joke, and even if other posters know by fact it shouldn't be serious (if only because of the title, as "Dungeon Master" pretty much assumes by necessity it can't be serious), they can't seem to relax around it.

It's not meant to be PEACHed, as you've removed the tag, and you're insisting that no one dare to question its balance, as you've stated beforehand that there is no balance to this.

The majority of the posters so far probably must be questioning the same thing; I can't speak for anyone, so I'll leave the others to respond in kind. That said, if that WERE to be the case, everybody's just asking "where is the joke so I may laugh/understand?", or some variation thereof. You've spent some time making the table, placing arbitrary numbers and class features meant to surpass even what's on the Immortals Handbook 3rd party splat if everything in there had 20 divine ranks, so there MUST be a purpose. There's no reference to the MST3K Mantra or Bellisario's Maxim in any place, so that probably discards the "don't take it seriously" bit. Thus, with what's presented, all I (and I'm not sure if the rest share this position) can gather is that this is an attempt to make a joke class, but one that falls flat from expectations, which are basically to provide a good laugh. Unless the purpose is NOT to provide a good laugh, in which case I must declare myself dumbfounded.

However, and the point I wish to specify, is that, for something that's not meant to be taken seriously, you're taking the critique (if any) WAY too seriously, to the extent that you're pretty much imagining people are calling you "stupid", when I'm sure that's the opposite (not on the intellectual axis, but on the condescension axis; thus, nobody is calling you "stupid", but while nobody would call you "smart" for this action alone, nobody is trying to insult you either). For something that's meant to be taken as a joke, you're the one taking it way too seriously.

Most of the people here could offer good ways to make the joke a great, sophisticated, and actually FUNNY one, instead of what you're offering here. The critique might make the class actually playable but still holding the essence of comedy all around (like, say, instead of making Monty Python jokes, you're actually playing a knight who says 'Ni'), or provide class features that, while horribly unbalanced for actual play, can actually make people laugh. You're missing on a wonderful opportunity here by thinking everybody is against you for pointing something out (which probably is "we don't get the joke, sorry man").

So, as mentioned before: read this well, don't take it too seriously, don't get too deep for this, and actually explain the darn joke for once!

AuraTwilight
2013-01-01, 05:00 PM
It's not meant to be meaningful.

Then why am I reading numbers and data points? Why not have put "DM Fiat" for everything?


Thanks for directly insulting my everything. And, you know, actually doing it deliberately. And assuming I was trying to insult you. That was just lovely.

I'm not insulting 'your everything'. At worst I'm insulting your class idea, but I'm not even doing that so much as critiquing it. Again, if you can't handle critical opinions you shouldn't post them for public review.

I took your earlier statement as an insult because you were apparently implying that I didn't like it because I didn't get it.


Yes you can. As soon as you use the write in ability - which you can so long as the DM is not in a dead magic area - they stop being in a dead magic area.

That's not how Dead Magic works. The target is in a Dead Magic area, so in order for the DM's supernatural ability to work on the target, it has to be able to 'reach' him. Targets within Dead Magic areas cannot be effected by supernatural effects from outside of the Dead Magic Zone.


It's meant to be mildly amusing. Is that not "funny, and yet not totally hilarious"?

I don't personally find it to be such; as I've said before, the arbitrarily high numbers kill the joke for me, as well as its inherent unplayability even in a theoretical sense. I've seen other "Dungeon Master" joke builds that were atleast feasibly playable in a way that increases the joke.

And, again, it's homebrew. If it's not usable, it shouldn't be on this subforum. There was probably a better place for meta-humor.


If you've just come to insult me, leave. No-one's forcing you to be vile to me.

I'm not. I don't feel any personal animosity to you at all. I just don't sugar-coat what I say whatsoever. Were you honestly expecting that everyone would love this, on a forum where even good homebrew is picked at near-incessantly?

Also, T. G. Oskar's 100% on the mark, here.

PEACH
2013-01-01, 07:33 PM
Sidenote: If there's meant to be a joke here, the joke has to be something beyond "Hey, look! TROPES!"

References in general are not funny. Pointing out "hey, this is like something!" is just... not humorous, at least not "cold." Without a callback (e.g. stand up comedians referencing jokes from earlier in the show in their later jokes) or some kind of reason for a reference to be a clever response to something (e.g. achievements on Mark of the Ninja being references to other stealth games), there's not really anything clever about being able to make a reference. Since this is the internet, you really can't have either of those, nor "timing" in general, so it makes reference based comedy really difficult.

This is even worse if the references are to either TvTropes, or Monty Python. Honestly, I don't even know which is referenced more often for no reason other than to reference it, but I'm going to say TvTropes is probably the worse offender at this point because it's gotten so pervasive that when discussing things with my friends, serious references to TvTropes happen. You have to know your audience, and in general the internet, and especially GitP, is already way too saturated with links to TvTropes in every context for simply referencing it to be funny in almost any context.

Another problem with this joke: dead weight. It's absolutely full of it. Jokes don't need to be short, but adding to the length should add to the comedy (sidenote within a sidenote: That's why a lot of people hate Dane Cook, the other part being he's probably overrated. He tells two stories and goes on 50 tangents that aren't as funny). Assuming the joke is that "this is what the DM would be as a PC, and also some TvTropes references," this could have been a 1 level template that just said "you can do anything" written a bit snappier, and all of the joke in this thread would be there.

Like T.G. Oskar said as well, some jokes (especially references) are better done as actions, not simply mentioning them. If you played a character that was convinced he/she was the DM or a character in a D&D game (think Deadpool), and/or who acted incredibly cliche and took actions that were clearly trope based (think Elan), you'd wind up with a lot better results than actually making a dungeonmaster/TvTropes reference class.