Effective Arcane Trickster Setup

[Blackadam]

I've played DnD alot but have never played any type of spell caster due to the fact we would spend COUNTLESS hours waiting for all the spell casters to finish with their spell list which for everyone in the groups would say okay be back in an hour and if lucky they would be set.

I want to venture out of my safety non magic realm and would like to play an Arcane Trickster what really draws me to the is was the description. The type of arcane trickster i would like to play is the support class not the run of the mill
"I magic missile fireball from HADES to the 15 spell empowered maximized yada yada slot!!" kill everything in the room type but more like casting slow on the enemies haste on the party type of deal with a few damage dealing mainly focused on AOE.

i did see someone Maximized Empowered Scorching ray and was like wtf that spell normal does crap damage and they went into the explanation of it and i was like "unhu... whatever that was cool"

anyway sorry for the rant. how would you guys create this type of character round 15th lvl.

[StreamOfTheSky]

What books are allowed?

Entering ~ 5 levels of Unseen Seer from C.Mage before Arcane Trickster is generally a good idea. You may also want to get your sneak attack dice from a swordsage dip for Assassin's Stance.

[docnessuno]

Spellwarp sniper is another good candidate for AT builds.

[gorfnab]

Sneak Attacking Spellcasters Handbook (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1240)
Rogue or Spellthief 1/ Wizard 5 (Spontaneous Divination ACF, CC)/ Unseen Seer 10/ Arcane Trickster 4 - Rogue is nice for the added skill points at first level. However Spellthief with the feat Master Spellthief is not too shabby either.

[StreamOfTheSky]

Unseen Seer 10 takes too many CL penalties.

[gorfnab]

Unseen Seer 10 takes too many CL penalties.
Practiced Spellcaster

[ZaSeroulIs]

Unseen Seer 10 takes too many CL penalties.

I believe you can counter that with [Practiced Spellcaster] feat (US get you at -3 and 1 lvl in rogue/whatever gets you to a total of -4. There. It's perfect...)
I would also like to suggest Spellwarp Sniper, its so nice of a prestige class.
I like the idea of Rogue1/Wizard5(Spontaneous Divination ACF)/Unseen Seer 2/Spellwarp Sniper5/Unseen Seer+7
with feats:
Point-Blank Shot(1)
Practiced Spellcaster(3)
??(6)
Silent Spell (8,US 2)
Energy Substitution(9)
Precise Shot(11, SS3)
Energy Admixture(12)
??(15)
??(18)
and at lvl 8 (through Advanced Learning) get the spell Hunter's Eye (http://dndtools.eu/spells/players-handbook-ii--80/hunters-eye--2941/) for extra sneak attack damage (and even getting at lvl 6 Extend Spell and lvl 18 Persist Spell for them buts thats up to the feel)

This is what I'm gonna play if my current character dies :smile: (though as human to get Able Learner).

[demigodus]

I've played DnD alot but have never played any type of spell caster due to the fact we would spend COUNTLESS hours waiting for all the spell casters to finish with their spell list which for everyone in the groups would say okay be back in an hour and if lucky they would be set.

General rule at my table is that you come to the game with your spell load out prepared. If you change your prepared spells for the day when the party is resting, the game continues going at regular pace. You have until everything related to the resting is completed to figure out your new spell selection. Period. If you aren't done, you are operating on less spells per day (or can just quickly tick off a few extra ones to fill up the list without really considering it).

No figuring out spell load outs at the table. Because yes, it CAN take hours.


"I magic missile fireball from HADES to the 15 spell empowered maximized yada yada slot!!" kill everything in the room type but more like casting slow on the enemies haste on the party type of deal with a few damage dealing mainly focused on AOE.

For the record, you can apply sneak attack damage to a numer of spells with attack rolls. So you can actually get better damage from single target spells sometimes. That said, the general tip with metamagic I believe is to go all or nothing. Either spend all your feats on getting them, and using metamagic reducers, or don't really use them much.


anyway sorry for the rant. how would you guys create this type of character round 15th lvl.

Spellthief 1 / Wizard 5 / Unseen Seer 1 / Arcane Trickster 8

is my preferred rout. Pick up the Master Spellthief feat.

You lose only 1 casting level, and with a successful sneak attack, you can steal level 8 spells from your opponent. Also, your wizard wears light armor now.

A potential altenative option, in case you want to confuse the crap out of your party is:
dwarf Sneak Attack Fighter (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#fighter) 1 / Wizard 4 / Runesmith 1 / Unseen Seer 1 / Arcane Trickster 8

So they think rogues can't wear full plate? They think wizards have to wear skirts? Well f**k Them! You are a dwarf in full plate, and you are both a rogue, AND a wizard. Because you are a dwarf that is why!

[StreamOfTheSky]

Practiced Spellcaster

You're already losing CL from some sort of rogue-ish levels, too. I'm saying, -3 from US 10 and those losses is more than Practiced Spellcaster might be able to cover.

[Urpriest]

You're already losing CL from some sort of rogue-ish levels, too. I'm saying, -3 from US 10 and those losses is more than Practiced Spellcaster might be able to cover.

It's only one rogue level, and all the PrC levels advance casting fully. Practiced Spellcaster covers the deficit perfectly.

[Norin]

You're already losing CL from some sort of rogue-ish levels, too. I'm saying, -3 from US 10 and those losses is more than Practiced Spellcaster might be able to cover.

If you want to go the SA + caster route you still need to get the SA somewhere. 1 (or more?) level(s) of Rogue is quite nice that way.

If you do not have any suggestions on how to make this work with only caster classes/prc's?

[Keld Denar]

It doesn't sound like the OP really wants to Sneak Attack with spells. In that right, I'd actually suggest something like Beguiler instead. Great skills, Int focus, great spells for buffing, debuffing, BC, and misdirection. That is support. Most Arcane Trickster builds focus on Sneak Attacking people in the face with an Empowered Orb of Fire while Greater Invis'ed.

[nedz]

Unseen Seer 10 takes too many CL penalties.

What ?

Last time I checked US was 10/10 spellcasting.

Am I missing something ?

[Urpriest]

What ?

Last time I checked US was 10/10 spellcasting.

Am I missing something ?

Unseen Seer takes a scaling CL penalty to all non-Divination spells, and gains a CL bonus to Divination.

[nedz]

Unseen Seer takes a scaling CL penalty to all non-Divination spells, and gains a CL bonus to Divination.

Ah, I hadn't spotted that. Possibly because it's listed under a class feature whose name implies a dissociated benefit.

[StreamOfTheSky]

Ah, I hadn't spotted that. Possibly because it's listed under a class feature whose name implies a dissociated benefit.

WotC's tricky like that.

In any case, I suggested Unseen Seer not only because it's great for any rogue/arcanist, but also because it does come with a lot of built in utility benefits. Getting to cherry pick divination spells off any list is great, you get protections from divinations, and so forth. It's a great class for recon and intel.

[Blackadam]

I know it has been awhile since i started this, it is now an 8th level campaign. and this is what i was able to do thus far far

House Rules:

30 extra skill points at 1st level

All complete books are okay anything out side of that has to be shown to DM so he can approve it.

Once you take a class of something when it comes to the skill points he deems it ridiculous to only put SP in what that class allows you to without a cross class penalty. As long as a class you has has that ability it will always be a class skill.

I get to know 20 spells in each circle of magic from 0-3rd level


27,000gp

8th Level

Fractional Base Attack Bonus

My TOON

Grey Elf (-2 STR and -2 CON, +2 DEX and +2 INT) Not sure if it is a race in his campaign or from a book i got it from the DM

Rolled Stats

STR 12
DEX 17
CON 16
INT 18
WIS 17
CHA 13

LEVELS

1st level Rogue

2nd Level Ninja

5 Levels Wizard (I chose mage over wizard so i can test out different spells and see what works)

1 Arcane Trickster

Feats

Point Blank

Precise

Improved Initiative

Spell Penetration

Skills (116)

Skill Total = Ranks + Modifier

Appraise 7 = 1 + 6

Balance 5 = 0 + 5

Bluff 3 = 2 + 1

Concentration 13 = 11 + 2

Decipher Script 16 = 10 + 6

Diplomacy 11 = 10 + 1

Disable Device 16 = 10 + 6

Escape Artist 16 = 11 + 5

Gather Information 1 = 0 + 1

Hide 6 = 0 + 6

Knowledge Arcana 17 = 11 + 6

Knowledge History 6 = 0 + 6

Knowledge Nobility 6 = 0 + 6

Knowledge Planes 6 = 0 + 6

Listen 15 = 11 + 4

Move Silently 6 = 1 + 5

Open Lock 6 = 1 + 5

Profession Cook 4 = 0 + 4

Search 17 = 11 + 6

Sense Motive 7 = 3 + 4

Sleight of Hand 6 = 1 + 5

Spell Craft 17 = 11 + 6

Spot 4 = 0 + 4

Tumble 16 = 11 + 5

Spells (at least what i think want)

0 Level

Detect Magic

Touch of Fatigue

Detect Poison

Ray of Frost



1st Level

Ray Of Enfeeblement

Summon Monster I

Grease


2nd Level

Summon Monster II

Scorching Ray

Invisibility


3rd Level

Fly

Fire Ball

Slow

Magic Items

Heward's Handy Havorsak

Wand of Cure Light wounds (2)

Wand Haste

Wand Shield

Wand Cat's Grace

Swordbow light (this i don't know if i'll keep or use)

Ring of Int + 2

Bracer's of Armor + 1

Cloak of Resistance + 2

With this gear my STATS, SAVES, and B.A.B are:

STR 10

DEX 20

CON 14

INT 22

WIS 18

CHA 13

Saves

FORT 5

REFLEX 14

WILL 12

B.A.B. 4.5



i printed out everyone's suggestions and have them with my toon so i can level accordingly