Master transmogrifist (A.K.A nifty poltmorphing PrC) build help?

[_flint_]

Originally questions on how polyorph worked. Now I'm posting the build i was working on at the time, requesting help.

Dham the Unknowable

THE FLUFF
Entered the material plane by accident and has been stranded there ever since.

NAME:Dham the Unknowable
ALIGNMENT:Chaotic neutral
STR:8
DEX:16
CON:14
INT:18
WIS:8
CHA:8
CLASS:Wizard
RACE:Neraphim
LANGUAGES:Neraphim, slaad, common, celestial, abyssal
DOMAINS:Transmutation
FAMILIAR:Toad
ALTERNATE CLASS FEATURES:Domain wizard, spontaneous divination
BOOKS USED:Core, Planar Handbook, Unearthed Arcana, Complete Arcane, Complete Mage

THE BUILD
Dham
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|Wizard 1 |
+0|
+0|
+0|
+2|Bluff 2, concentration 4, disguise 2, knowledge(arcana) 4, knowledge(the planes) 4, spellcraft 4|Scribe scroll, spell focus (transmutation)|Scribe scroll bonus feat, familiar

2nd|Wizard 2 |
+1|
+0|
+0|
+3|Concentration 5, disguise 2.5, knowledge(arcana) 5, knowledge(the planes) 5, knowledge(anything) 1, spellcraft 5|None|None

3rd|Wizard 3 |
+1|
+1|
+1|
+3|Concentration 6, disguise 3, knowledge(arcana) 6, knowledge(the planes) 6, knowledge(anything) 2, spellcraft 6|Extend spell|None

4th|Wizard 4 |
+2|
+1|
+1|
+4|Concentration 7, disguise 3.5, knowledge(arcana) 7, knowledge(the planes) 7, knowledge(anything) 3, spellcraft 7|None|None

5th|Wizard 5 |
+2|
+1|
+1|
+4|Concentration 8, disguise 4, knowledge(arcana) 8, knowledge(the planes) 8, knowledge(anything) 4, spellcraft 8|Metamagic school focus|Wizard bonus feat

6th|Wizard 6 |
+3|
+2|
+2|
+5|Concentration 9, disguise 4.5, knowledge(arcana) 9, knowledge(the planes) 9, knowledge(anything) 5, spellcraft 9|Eschew materials|None

7th|Wizard 7 |
+3|
+2|
+2|
+5|Concentration 10, disguise 5, knowledge(arcana) 10, knowledge(the planes) 10, knowledge(anything) 6, spellcraft 10|None|None

8th|Master transmogrifist 1 |
+3|
+2|
+2|
+7|Bluff 5, concentration 11, knowledge(arcana) 11, spellcraft 11|None|Extend change, favored shape

9th|Master transmogrifist 2 |
+4|
+2|
+2[center]|[center]+8|Bluff 8, concentration 12, knowledge(arcana) 12, spellcraft 12|Chain spell|Manifest senses

10th|Master transmogrifist 3 |
+4|
+3|
+3|
+8|Bluff 11, concentration 13, knowledge(arcana) 13, spellcraft 13|None|Battle mastery +2

11th|Master transmogrifist 4 |
+5|
+3|
+3|
+9|Bluff 14, concentration 14, knowledge(arcana) 14, spellcraft 14|None|Effortless change

12th|Master transmogrifist 5 |
+5|
+3|
+3|
+9|Bluff 15, concentration 15, disguise 7, knowledge(arcana) 15, spellcraft 15|Arcane thesis(Polymorph)|Shapechanger

13th|Master transmogrifist 6 |
+6|
+4|
+4|
+10|Bluff 16, concentration 16, disguise 9, knowledge(arcana) 16, spellcraft 16|None|Battle mastery +4

14th|Master transmogrifist 7 |
+6|
+4|
+4|
+10|Bluff 17, concentration 17, disguise 11, knowledge(arcana) 17, spellcraft 17|None|Reflexive change

15th|Master transmogrifist 8 |
+7|
+4|
+4|
+11|Bluff 18, concentration 18, disguise 13, knowledge(arcana) 18, spellcraft 18|Practiced spellcaster|Manifest qualities

16th|Master transmogrifist 9 |
+7|
+5|
+5|
+11|Bluff 19, concentration 19, disguise 15, knowledge(arcana) 19, spellcraft 19|None|Battle master +6

17th|Master transmogrifist 10 |
+8|
+5|
+5|
+12|Bluff 20, concentration 20, disguise 17, knowledge(arcana) 20, spellcraft 20|None|Infinite variety

18th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

19th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

20th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

SPELLS
Spells per day/Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th|New Spells

1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

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11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

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16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

LEVEL RUNDOWN

Level 1-5
Description Here

Level 6-10
Description Here

Level 11-15
Description Here

Level 16-20
Description Here
(original post)
Got the idea of a character specializing in transforming himself. Help with the build would be appreciated, but what I really came here for is to clarify something to myself: When you are poplymorphed, do you lose anything aside from your previous physical stats and creature type?

Example; drow polymorphs himself into a rust monster. Does he retain his racial ability to cast faerie fire once per day as a spell-like ability?

[GenericMook]

Short Answer: Yeah, you do. I'm not 100% sure with SLA's, but if you were a spellcaster turning into a Rust Monster, you would lose your spellcasting.

Long Answer: Here's what Polymorph says:


This spell functions like alter self, except that you change the willing subject into another form of living creature.

And here's what Alter Self says:


You retain all supernatural and spell-like special attacks and qualities of your normal form, except for those requiring a body part that the new form does not have (such as a mouth for a breath weapon or eyes for a gaze attack).

Because an SLA has no "no verbal, somatic, or material component," you're good.

[_flint_]

Thanks, man. Exactly what I needed. :)

[Vaz]

In regards to spellcasting; from the SRD;


If the new form is capable of speech, you can communicate normally. You retain any spellcasting ability you had in your original form, but the new form must be able to speak intelligibly (that is, speak a language) to use verbal components and must have limbs capable of fine manipulation to use somatic or material components.

If you have Natural Spell, then fantastic. Make Rust Monster noises, and wave your Antennae around and you're good to go. Problem is, that is Druid Territory; and without Shapechange, a 9th level spell, or Alter Self which does not make you into said Rust Monster, then there is only limited Polymorphing. Outside of Wild Shape of course.

To get the most out of Polymorph; try looking at Monsters by HD here; chet.kindredcircle.org/. If your DM is into giving hints about what is coming up, you can make things quicker in play by making some character sheets for your "Drow as Rust Monster/whatever"

[Pandiano]

Got the idea of a character specializing in transforming himself. Help with the build would be appreciated, but what I really came here for is to clarify something to myself: When you are poplymorphed, do you lose anything aside from your previous physical stats and creature type?

Example; drow polymorphs himself into a rust monster. Does he retain his racial ability to cast faerie fire once per day as a spell-like ability?

As far a I know you do not lose your creature type. Quite the contrary, you'll keep your own, incl. subtypes regardless of the form you shape in.

[GenericMook]

As far a I know you do not lose your creature type. Quite the contrary, you'll keep your own, incl. subtypes regardless of the form you shape in.

From the Polymorph spell description:


This spell functions like alter self, except that you change the willing subject into another form of living creature. The new form may be of the same type as the subject or any of the following types: aberration, animal, dragon, fey, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, plant, or vermin. The assumed form can’t have more Hit Dice than your caster level (or the subject’s HD, whichever is lower), to a maximum of 15 HD at 15th level. You can’t cause a subject to assume a form smaller than Fine, nor can you cause a subject to assume an incorporeal or gaseous form. The subject’s creature type and subtype (if any) change to match the new form.

[_flint_]

Hmm, I was going to post a new thread but seeing as this one's still here, I'll post what I've got.

This is a prototype build I am working on just for backup. Not quite done yet, but I thought I would get your guys' help on it:

Dham the Unknowable

THE FLUFF
Entered the material plane by accident and has been stranded there ever since.

NAME:Dham the Unknowable
ALIGNMENT:Chaotic neutral
STR:8
DEX:16
CON:14
INT:18
WIS:8
CHA:8
CLASS:Wizard
RACE:Neraphim
LANGUAGES:Neraphim, slaad, common, celestial, abyssal
DOMAINS:Transmutation
FAMILIAR:Toad
ALTERNATE CLASS FEATURES:Domain wizard, spontaneous divination
BOOKS USED:Core, Planar Handbook, Unearthed Arcana, Complete Arcane, Complete Mage

THE BUILD
Dham
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

1st|Wizard 1 |
+0|
+0|
+0|
+2|Bluff 2, concentration 4, disguise 2, knowledge(arcana) 4, knowledge(the planes) 4, spellcraft 4|Scribe scroll, spell focus (transmutation)|Scribe scroll bonus feat, familiar

2nd|Wizard 2 |
+1|
+0|
+0|
+3|Concentration 5, disguise 2.5, knowledge(arcana) 5, knowledge(the planes) 5, knowledge(anything) 1, spellcraft 5|None|None

3rd|Wizard 3 |
+1|
+1|
+1|
+3|Concentration 6, disguise 3, knowledge(arcana) 6, knowledge(the planes) 6, knowledge(anything) 2, spellcraft 6|Extend spell|None

4th|Wizard 4 |
+2|
+1|
+1|
+4|Concentration 7, disguise 3.5, knowledge(arcana) 7, knowledge(the planes) 7, knowledge(anything) 3, spellcraft 7|None|None

5th|Wizard 5 |
+2|
+1|
+1|
+4|Concentration 8, disguise 4, knowledge(arcana) 8, knowledge(the planes) 8, knowledge(anything) 4, spellcraft 8|Metamagic school focus|Wizard bonus feat

6th|Wizard 6 |
+3|
+2|
+2|
+5|Concentration 9, disguise 4.5, knowledge(arcana) 9, knowledge(the planes) 9, knowledge(anything) 5, spellcraft 9|Eschew materials|None

7th|Wizard 7 |
+3|
+2|
+2|
+5|Concentration 10, disguise 5, knowledge(arcana) 10, knowledge(the planes) 10, knowledge(anything) 6, spellcraft 10|None|None

8th|Master transmogrifist 1 |
+3|
+2|
+2|
+7|Bluff 5, concentration 11, knowledge(arcana) 11, spellcraft 11|None|Extend change, favored shape

9th|Master transmogrifist 2 |
+4|
+2|
+2[center]|[center]+8|Bluff 8, concentration 12, knowledge(arcana) 12, spellcraft 12|Chain spell|Manifest senses

10th|Master transmogrifist 3 |
+4|
+3|
+3|
+8|Bluff 11, concentration 13, knowledge(arcana) 13, spellcraft 13|None|Battle mastery +2

11th|Master transmogrifist 4 |
+5|
+3|
+3|
+9|Bluff 14, concentration 14, knowledge(arcana) 14, spellcraft 14|None|Effortless change

12th|Master transmogrifist 5 |
+5|
+3|
+3|
+9|Bluff 15, concentration 15, disguise 7, knowledge(arcana) 15, spellcraft 15|Arcane thesis(Polymorph)|Shapechanger

13th|Master transmogrifist 6 |
+6|
+4|
+4|
+10|Bluff 16, concentration 16, disguise 9, knowledge(arcana) 16, spellcraft 16|None|Battle mastery +4

14th|Master transmogrifist 7 |
+6|
+4|
+4|
+10|Bluff 17, concentration 17, disguise 11, knowledge(arcana) 17, spellcraft 17|None|Reflexive change

15th|Master transmogrifist 8 |
+7|
+4|
+4|
+11|Bluff 18, concentration 18, disguise 13, knowledge(arcana) 18, spellcraft 18|Practiced spellcaster|Manifest qualities

16th|Master transmogrifist 9 |
+7|
+5|
+5|
+11|Bluff 19, concentration 19, disguise 15, knowledge(arcana) 19, spellcraft 19|None|Battle master +6

17th|Master transmogrifist 10 |
+8|
+5|
+5|
+12|Bluff 20, concentration 20, disguise 17, knowledge(arcana) 20, spellcraft 20|None|Infinite variety

18th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

19th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

20th|New Class Level|
+x|
+x|
+x|
+x|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

SPELLS
Spells per day/Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th|New Spells

1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

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17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

LEVEL RUNDOWN

Level 1-5
Description Here

Level 6-10
Description Here

Level 11-15
Description Here

Level 16-20
Description Here

Any suggestions?

[_flint_]

In the same vein, what happens when you polymorph into a creature of less HD than your own?

[_flint_]

Hey, i posted this last night. No body responded, but i still need help. Bumping

[GenericMook]

There's lots and lots of lovely things for wizards that want to Polymorph. I've never personally experimented with the Master Transmogrifist, but since it revolves around polymorph, it's gonna involve cheese.

I'd recommend going into Incantatrix (PGtF(?)) to get the Metamagic Effect class feature. I'm AFB atm, but I'm sure you get the ability without going through all 10 levels. Metamagic Effect lets you persist spells like Polymorph/Polymorph Any Object/Shapechange as you please.

[_flint_]

Ooh, that's very attractive. The thin I like about master transmogrifist is that it lets you gain the special qualities of some select forms, and later lets you combine two forms into new ones

[GenericMook]

Alright, I took a look at the Master Transmogrifist, and the big problem is that there's 6/10 caster progression. Generally speaking, losing a level of casting progression is looked down upon. Since Polymorph is hilariously broken, I suppose this isn't that bad.

Still, 6/10 caster progression means that you'll only get to 8th level spells. No shapechange if you go for MT.

[_flint_]

Yeah, I figured that would balance out the polymorph theme. Think of anything for early entry?

[GenericMook]

Unless you want to engage in some serious, serious cheese, you can't do that. IIRC, early entry for Master Transmogrifist involves Loredrake Dragonwrought Kobold cheese.

The main problem is getting access to Polymorph, which is a fourth level spell. Normally, you can't get in until you're a 7th level Wizard.

Edit: White Dragonspawn Loredrake Dragonwrought Kobold.

Quick google-fu shows that, and it's really unlikely a DM will let you do that.