Mini-elemental swarm things

[Qwertystop]

I remember reading something in some book about a monster that's like a swarm of tiny elementals. A bunch of little flames, pebbles, droplets, or... was it breezes? not sure. I only really remember the water and fire ones. The water definitely had the ability to try to drown people. Any idea what it's called or what book it was in? I'm working on a homebrew rework of the major elementals, and these guys are important to the Water one, and maybe also the Air when I get to it.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Well, there's a Cinder swarm of Fire elementals in the MM3, but I don't remember any other elemental varieties.

Not quite what you're looking for, but it could serve as a starting point if you can't find what you're looking for.

[Deophaun]

Elementite Swarm, Planar Handbook

[Qwertystop]

Thanks!

Unfortunately, it doesn't seem my idea for them will work. I was thinking of varieties of Elemental that might be able to shed some of their material (go down a size category and lose some HP) to form Swarms of the same element under their control, but these things are 7 HD with no Advancement or easy way to back-extrapolate, and my Elemental ideas are 8 HD. Do you think it could work anyway? Just seems a bit OP to let them summon creatures as powerful as themselves until they run out of healing sources (such as ponds, metal, strong winds, or fire. Or allies with healing spells).

[Toy Killer]

Would re-fluffing an undead with swarm-shifter work?

Start by using necromental on the Elemental in question, tack on swarm shifter (Both templates from Libris Mortis, by the way) and use the 'Undead parts' swarm and you have a water elemental that breaks up into water elemental bits and back again.

Fluff as needed for the encounter. As an extra bonus, it also would allow a, say, large water elemental, into spaces it normally wouldn't fit (Although, I tend to roll with elementals as being whatever shape they need be, but point still remains.)

[Qwertystop]

Would re-fluffing an undead with swarm-shifter work?

Start by using necromental on the Elemental in question, tack on swarm shifter (Both templates from Libris Mortis, by the way) and use the 'Undead parts' swarm and you have a water elemental that breaks up into water elemental bits and back again.

Fluff as needed for the encounter. As an extra bonus, it also would allow a, say, large water elemental, into spaces it normally wouldn't fit (Although, I tend to roll with elementals as being whatever shape they need be, but point still remains.)

No, I wanted this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=267455) (second one) to have the ability to effectively "summon" Elementite Swarms by shedding some of its material. That wouldn't work because A: It's template stacking and B: It's transformation, not making mini-allies.

Basically, I had assumed that the swarm of tiny elemental droplets would be weak. But it turns out it isn't.

[Toy Killer]

Ah, I over looked the homebrew in you're OP. Now, I understand...

... But, what's stopping you from stripping the mechanics behind it?

If the swarm is supposed to be separate from the elemental, but the elemental is still there, just reducing in HD? Consider applying the template to a Small or medium elemental and finding the stats for the "undead" parts, replace causing fear with drowning and you have a much more appropriate swarm for the elemental to 'Shed' (? sweat? Pupate?...) off on to the battlefield.

[Qwertystop]

Ah, I over looked the homebrew in you're OP. Now, I understand...

... But, what's stopping you from stripping the mechanics behind it?

If the swarm is supposed to be separate from the elemental, but the elemental is still there, just reducing in HD? Consider applying the template to a Small or medium elemental and finding the stats for the "undead" parts, replace causing fear with drowning and you have a much more appropriate swarm for the elemental to 'Shed' (? sweat? Pupate?...) off on to the battlefield.

Um...

Well, actually, not much. I've rethought the Water one since I posted this thread, but my vague idea for the Fire one seems like it would like that. Except not drowning, but burning. Thanks for the tip. Any PEACH on the homebrew linked?

[rot42]

A Spider Swarm (MMI 239) might be close enough to be refluffed. Two HD, CR 1, and a poison that can be replaced with Dex damage (heat leeching into the swarm).