Defensive casting

[Nozinach]

Assuming a regular dnd 3.5 game
Can a character cast defensively whenever she wants?
about this question i want to ask, even not she is threatened?
if she didnt know the assasin staying near her(with a way that she cannot detect the assasin, for example invisibility) can she still say i want to cast defensively?

If the answer is yes can anybody explain how can she defend herself against an unknown foe? or even if she knows/doubts/fears/assumes there is somebody staying near her(but still cannot detect), with which technique can she defend herself without knowing any information about the assasin.

If you are still not convinced then a player can say at the begining of a campaign. "hey just remind that i ll cast every spell with defensive casting from now on dont expect from me to say it again." Is there not even one backlash about using defensive casting?

and as a reasonable dnd 3.5 dm i really dont want such things to be said in my games.
Please inform me. Thank you for your time

[JaronK]

Defensive Casting just means you're not concentrating entirely on the spell, but also on avoiding making openings to attack. It's just like fighting defensively... you'd still get the AC bonus, even if you didn't actually realize who was going to attack you.

The only reason not to always cast defensively is that you might fail your concentration check.

JaronK

[HunterOfJello]

IIRC the DC for Defensive Casting is 15 + the spell level. So, if the person has 23 Concentration, then they can always successfully cast defensively.

If a person could do that, I probably wouldn't stop them. There are still ways for them to be attacked while casting spells. There's a feat to be able to get an AoO even if someone is casting defensively and NPCs can ready actions to attack them if they begin casting a spell.

[Laura Eternata]

and as a reasonable dnd 3.5 dm i really dont want such things to be said in my games.
Please inform me. Thank you for your time

That's the most important part of your post. If you're the DM, it's your call, and I'd say disallowing defensive casting outside of combat is a perfectly reasonable one. I don't have the book in front of me, so I'm not sure what fluff defensive casting is given, but assuming JaronK's description is accurate, I'd agree with you that it's impossible to avoid making openings to attack if you're unaware of the potential attacker's location. RAW-wise, however, it is legal to cast defensively at any time.

As for backlash, the caster still has to make a concentration check that, at least on early levels, isn't exactly trivial (DC 15+spell level) or lose the spell.

[Nozinach]

i thought it is should be like combat expertise feat. you can only add your defensive stats when you are actually fighting. when you are not fighting you cannot defend yourself. i think they might just have skiped this point. and i dont want to pick mage slayer feat just to ignore defensive casting. that would be cheap.


and thank you. im reasonable but the power "im dm what i decide is the rule" thing is also not my way. because it is actually the easiest way to avoid reasonable conversations. they really have no power against that sentence. i try to use rules as much as possible but im more involved in reality and role playing and logic(yea i know it's so hard in dnd because chop-chop).

[Emmerask]

Assuming a regular dnd 3.5 game
Can a character cast defensively whenever she wants?
about this question i want to ask, even not she is threatened?
if she didnt know the assasin staying near her(with a way that she cannot detect the assasin, for example invisibility) can she still say i want to cast defensively?

If the answer is yes can anybody explain how can she defend herself against an unknown foe? or even if she knows/doubts/fears/assumes there is somebody staying near her(but still cannot detect), with which technique can she defend herself without knowing any information about the assasin.

If you are still not convinced then a player can say at the begining of a campaign. "hey just remind that i ll cast every spell with defensive casting from now on dont expect from me to say it again." Is there not even one backlash about using defensive casting?

and as a reasonable dnd 3.5 dm i really dont want such things to be said in my games.
Please inform me. Thank you for your time

Well you are correct in that casting defensively should have a bigger negative then the concentration check, which at later levels will most likely be an auto success.
A good way would have been to make the action take longer normal cast -> full round etc etc but it is not.

Then again d&d is a deeply flawed and unbalanced system so what do you expect? ^^

What the assassin could do however is just ready an action to attack when the caster casts, no amount of defensive casting helps there :smallwink:

[Edenbeast]

If you are still not convinced then a player can say at the begining of a campaign. "hey just remind that i ll cast every spell with defensive casting from now on dont expect from me to say it again." Is there not even one backlash about using defensive casting?

I would say, for this part, eventhough there is no reason to always cast defensively, the player can if she wants (she does seems a bit overly paranoid, but well, funny concept). However:


Casting on the Defensive

Casting a spell while on the defensive does not provoke an attack of opportunity. It does, however, require a Concentration check (DC 15 + spell level) to pull off. Failure means that you lose the spell.

If she casts every spell defensively, she will have to roll for a concentation check, always. And she will definitely see some spells fail because of her paranoia, even when there was no reason to do so, which could be quite fun story wise. But I would say that's an action a player will have to declare and not yours as DM to remind the player of... Just like a thief will be too late when he says: "then I'll open the door!" DM: "Ok" When the players hear a few dice rolls behind the DM screen, the thief says: "Ho wait, did I say I open the door? Of course I mean I always check for traps before I open a door..." BOOM!

[Nozinach]

paranoid defensive caster idea is cute :D
thank you for helping me. i think i could use my dm initiative to solve this problem. i cant find an alternative backlash for it but making it full-round is a little bit too harsh for both clerics and wizards, maybe i just make a DC table about concentration checks for preventing auto-success so players can think twice in critical moments.

[docnessuno]

paranoid defensive caster idea is cute :D
thank you for helping me. i think i could use my dm initiative to solve this problem. i cant find an alternative backlash for it but making it full-round is a little bit too harsh for both clerics and wizards, maybe i just make a DC table about concentration checks for preventing auto-success so players can think twice in critical moments.

Increasing the DC to 15 + 2x spell level is an houserule i often use in 3.5, in that way (assuming no Con change and Concentration maxed) the DC to cast your highest levels spell defensively is constant trought the game, and only the lower-level stuff becomes easyer.

[TuggyNE]

But I would say that's an action a player will have to declare and not yours as DM to remind the player of... Just like a thief will be too late when he says: "then I'll open the door!" DM: "Ok" When the players hear a few dice rolls behind the DM screen, the thief says: "Ho wait, did I say I open the door? Of course I mean I always check for traps before I open a door..." BOOM!

That's a little tedious. If a player has written down somewhere the DM can easily reference that their character always does X when Y, why are you trying to put gotchas in? Sometimes, it's annoying to have to work through all the little details every single time you have your character do something, especially if the player is not very good at remembering things.

Now, after-the-fact "er, I totally always do X when Y, didn't I tell you that at the start of the game? No? Oops, must have forgotten, but it still counts right?" — that's obviously not going to fly.

[Flickerdart]

If should be remembered that the players are not their characters. If the character is a dwarven rogue who has been picking locks and dodging traps for 2 centuries, it should be assumed that he's probably going to check an object for traps before interacting with it. Otherwise you get a scenario like this:
DM: You see a door.
Player: I check for traps.
DM: There are no traps.
Player: I open the door.
DM: Beyond, you see a chest.
Player: I check for traps.
DM: There are no traps.
Player: I open the chest.
DM: You see a book.
Player: I check for traps.
DM: There are no traps.
Player: I take the book.
Just assume he's always taking 10 on his Search check if he's not pressed for time. If he is pressed for time, say because he just stole the MacGuffin from the sultan's treasure vault and the guards will be here any minute, remind him that he could check the door of the escape tunnel for traps if he wanted to, but it would cost him precious seconds he might need to get away...