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View Full Version : [PF] SOS! Need tactical help - 7th level party against Fire Giants!



OverdrivePrime
2013-01-24, 10:45 AM
TL:DR - 7th level party, ranger, rogue, fighter, druid and necromancer vs a fire giant squad. We're going to try to ambush them. How do we get them to surrender?

So, we kind of got in over our head, and now a squad of fire giants (we're expecting between 5 and 7) is coming to destroy a village we want to protect. We're the first line of defense, but the 2nd and last line of defense is a bunch of potters and farmers with badly-attended spears.

Here's the lay of things:
1. We've sneakily provided intel to the giants that the best, fastest way to get to our village is through a long, narrow path through a forest. It's winter and the forest is quite snowy.

2. We have persuaded a winter wolf and his huge pack of normal wolves to join in the fight, since the winter wolf hates fire creatures. We're not sure how much help they'll be, and they won't be under our control.

3. There are about 5 miles between the place we've currently chosen for an ambush and our town. We got a signal that the giants left their lair... about five minutes ago, and it'll take them five hours to reach the town at a forced march. That means we have about three hours to setup before we engage. Not much, but it's alright.

4. The DM has said our casters (the druid and the necromancer) can spend an hour to pick new spells, while the other characters and I work to set up an ambush.

5. In very snowy, heavily forested terrain, the giants will be funneled down a 15 foot wide path between the trees toward a 100 foot clearing.

Our forces:
One 7th level Ranger Guide. Me. (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=432487)
I can do ranged, but I'm much better in melee, thanks to vital strike and lead blades. Because I have the Guide archetype, my posse all gets +2 to initiative, stealth, survival and perception in the forest. I get a +4 bonus vs one opponent that I call, twice per day. I'm planning to go after the first giant spellcaster I see.

One 7th level Wind Druid. (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=432835) The DM has said she can meditate on new spells. She can cast a couple 4th level spells, and wind the wind druid archetype has a pretty cool ranged bullrush attack that I don't think will be too effective against giants.

One 7th level H'orc Fighter Tank. (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=437203) He's a sword & board fighter, and has the death or glory feat, but not much else going for him against giants besides his spiked adamantine full plate, which will at least lessen the blows a big. I'm worried about him.

One 7th level Necromancer whose character sheet I don't have access to. He's played by a D&D veteran, but his character is very secretive and doesn't show his full power often. I honestly have no idea what he's capable of casting besides a handful of necromancy spells from 1-4, and enlarge person. The tank and I are hoping for some enlarge person goodness getting cast on us. Bonus: thanks to an amulet we just stole from a fire giant we killed in the city, he now controls 50 zombies. I have no idea what use zombies are going to be against fire giants, but at least we have a lot of them to use as cannon fodder.

One 7th level Rogue Sniper (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=499257). She can sneak attack up to 50 feet away and has an Oathbow... and zero other equipment besides a handful of arrows and a loincloth. It's this player's first game and the DM is having her drop out of the sky thanks to A Wizard, who clearly did it. :smalleek:
She can cast true flippin' strike 4 times per day, and mage hand five times per day. She also has the hellcat stealth feat and the surprise attack rogue perk. I plan to give her most of my character's arrows.

We also have access to two ballistas that we can have the zombies move to the clearing for us. My character is easily capable of disguising everyone in the snow.

Our goal here is to hit the giants hard enough that they sue for peace. I want to disable or eliminate as many giants as we can, as fast as we can, and then present terms of surrender while they're off balance. I have no illusions that our tiny, mid-level team can destroy a fire giant clan in one day, but even if we can't get a peace agreement out of them, we are desperate to protect the city. If even two giants get past us, that city is toast.

So what would you recommend? Most importantly - what spells should the druid prepare? I was thinking spike stones (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/spike-stones) would be critical. What else?

I'm really worried about a TPK if our first two rounds go badly. How can we put them on their heels?

raspberrybadger
2013-01-24, 11:45 AM
Yes, if you have a good number of fire giants, that's a TPK waiting to happen. You are going to have to rely heavily on your full spellcasters and a good plan.
If you get in melee with multiple fire giants nearby, you will die. Also, if you let them focus fire throwing rocks at one of you, that person will die. Unless the necromancer has protection from arrows (it works on the thrown boulders I think). So the key is to lock the giants down so they can do nothing.

Fortunately, your necromancer is an experienced player. Which means he probably hasn't banned conjuration, and he very likely has solid fog in case he needs it. If he doesn't he'll have black tentacles. Solid fog would be better.
He may or may not have create pit, which is amazing in this situation - it's a ref save. He certainly has glitterdust. If he's experienced, he likely will know what to do with those. If he's banned conjuration as a challenge or for RP reasons... ow. Illusion? Charm monster?

Also, you are in a forest. That's good for your druid. If you've got water nearby and your DM lets you use it in winter, control water is amazing in these situations. 14' high wall of water, 70' by 70', or 140' by 35'. With a standard action at long range, that you can put on top of them, lasting 10 min/level.

Failing that, spike stones, yes. Also assuming your DM says there is stone to do it with. Failing spike stones, spike growth, and entangle + plant growth. Spike growth can be put up well in advance. Then fog clouds to stop the ones you aren't focusing on from throwing boulders. If they are sufficiently locked down, the druid can spend standard actions from a single call lightning to deal damage from a range.

subject42
2013-01-24, 12:03 PM
You have 5 hours. Enlist the villagers. Give them shovels and turn the entire area leading to the village into a morass of mud, pits, spikes, and caltrops. Remove every rock larger than a pebble from the surrounding terrain. The more you can deny the giants movement, the longer you can sit there and plink at them from a distance.

If possible, give the villagers bows, slings, and crossbows. Even if they aren't proficient. A few dozen projectiles in the air will do something.

OverdrivePrime
2013-01-24, 12:30 PM
Wow, awesome idea with the control water. I'll check with the DM. We're doing our best to keep the giants hemmed into the forest path so that they have to come at us one at a time, and they'll have trouble throwing boulders into melee over one another's heads.

I want the Druid to use plant growth on the trees all around the path, so that the giants don't have a prayer of moving off the path and flanking us. Plant growth plus entange plus either spike stones or spike growth should mean that we don't have to worry about engaging more than one giant at a time in melee.

When the ambush begins, we'll have the 50 armed and armored zombies (they were all a mercenary band when alive) rise up out of the snow to either side of the path, and aid another to have the focused attacks of 10 zombies (6 aiding, four attacking, plus flanking bonus) on each of the first give giants. That should average out to a +6 to +10 attack bonus, giving the zombies a chance to actually inflict some damage. Hopefully the wolves pitch in as well, but I'm not going to count on it, particularly with undead around.

And I'm hoping that the shock of an ambush, plus the shock of seeing one or two giants quickly get cut down, plus the shock of one of their own being raised as a giant zombie, will put the giants on their heels enough to be open to peace.

Ravenica
2013-01-24, 01:16 PM
druid needs to enlarge the winter wolf, making him capable of tripping the giants

that will give you a tactical advantage, if your fighter has improved (and greater) trip he can take an enlargement as well and that gives you two serious ways to mess up the giant fighting line, same goes for improved disarm since you can do both as part of a full attack in PF.

Druid:
4; Arboreal hammer(ultimate magic) you are in a forest, army of trees baby
Geyser(apg) is another good one even with the fire damage being useless as its a reflex save or knock down and take falling damage (3d6 in your case) as well the geyser persists based on concentration making it good for area control as anyone entering its square has to make the same reflex save or be thrown in the air
Control Water (Core) create a swamp, makes difficult terrain so no charging, requires an existing body of water and would have to be part of the prep
Ice Storm(Core) pretty much a must have with a fire giants weakness, also obscures their vision so no rock flinging within it
Spike stones(core) combined with the other battlefield control mentioned here you can pretty much soften this war party up to the point where the fight is a cakewalk
3; burrow (UM) cause lets face it invincible movement
Hydralic torrent(APG) you have your geyser, now make the water bull rush these giants, lets face it fighting fire with water is just too obvious, and if your GM loves you he may even grant it a bonus
Sleetstorm, spike growth, snare, plant growth all core, all battlefield control that can slow them down and/or pick away at hp and/or hamper ranged attacks (plant growth can easily be used to hide a pit trap, even a shallow one can be used to for a reflex save to trip a giant heh or even an area of "gopher holes" sized for them)
Other: Wilderness soldiers(UC Druid 2) eh maybe, more plant minions
SNA series, more minions
mostly use lower level spells for buffs i would think or maybe soften earth and stone for your ambush point setup

I wouldn't worry about your necromancer, he should be able to handle himself, as for you and the rogue, focus on the same guy and you will drop them fast but if you see a single giant start to cast it is GTFO time, your group probably cant handle fire giants with class levels at this point

subject42
2013-01-24, 01:56 PM
When the ambush begins, we'll have the 50 armed and armored zombies (they were all a mercenary band when alive) rise up out of the snow to either side of the path, and aid another to have the focused attacks of 10 zombies (6 aiding, four attacking, plus flanking bonus) on each of the first give giants. That should average out to a +6 to +10 attack bonus, giving the zombies a chance to actually inflict some damage. Hopefully the wolves pitch in as well, but I'm not going to count on it, particularly with undead around.

Can you flood the path? Giants need to breathe, but zombies don't.

winter92
2013-01-24, 02:26 PM
If you have enough damage/control spells can you make this a running battle? For instance, if you're going to use geyser and pit during the fight, can the druid sneak out ahead of you guys to soften them up with spike stones or repeated lightning strikes before they get to the main ambush? Can the sniper tag them with arrows while they approach?

This would let you deal some good damage on many of them or perhaps kill a targeted one or two prior the fight. Hopefully they couldn't find you as you attack from the trees, and their attempts plus various terrain-roughening might buy you more ambush set-up time. Obviously it depends on what you have in the way of time, spells, and arrows, but starting the ambush with a few already dead or the enough wounded that they lose 4-5 right away might back them off a bit. (In addition, if they have healing or class skills it might come out during the running fight)

OverdrivePrime
2013-01-24, 06:04 PM
Sweet. Awesome ideas, guys. I'll let you know how it goes!

OverdrivePrime
2013-01-25, 10:23 AM
Ha! Okay, that game was ridiculous.

We got to the pinch point, set everything up, and it turns out we had gotten bad intelligence. :smallsigh:

Instead of 5 fire giants, in came marching 25 Azer (with one task master) and two fire giants.

The zombies led the attack early, the necromancer opened up with stinking cloud, and the druid dropped an ice storm.

The fighter and I moved up and started slashing our way to the giants, but not before the rogue hit one of the giants with a nasty crit with her oathbow. The druid hit the other with moonstruck... with worked. And holy crap that is an amazing spell.

Anyway, long story short, we were able to mop up pretty quickly, and got the surviving Azers to surrender after their taskmaster dropped.

I have a feeling the next fight is going to be the dangerous one.