Building for Faerun [3.5]

[Tokuhara]

I'm joining a party in a Faerun game with the following party:

A cleric (heal/buff)
2 beatsticks
A swordsage
A skillmonkey/trap sponge

The party claims they want a Blaster, but personally I've never seen the appeal. So, using Faerun as the background and theme, please build me a Faerunian PC that can be a benefit to this party.

Here's the rules:

All 3.5 and Faerun sources, Dragon Magazine
3-20
Generally powerful, but not overly cheesy.

[andromax]

Eberron also?

[Tokuhara]

Eberron also?


Unless it is Setting Neutral (Artificer, majority of the races sans Kalishtar), no. If Eberron is necessary, please explain the fluff with the Faerunian filter (ie: Warforged were created by the mages of Thay for their army). The meet & greet is this Sunday, so I am in a bit of a hurry.

Also forgot: 28 pb and wbl appropriate

[Palanan]

Arcane Hierophant? Or Green Whisperer, since Dragon is allowed.

Also, in the Realms, a druid of Mielikki is allowed to wear metal armor and use metal weapons. Mielikki is especially popular for just that reason.

:smalltongue:

[Tokuhara]

Arcane Hierophant? Or Green Whisperer, since Dragon is allowed.

Also, in the Realms, a druid of Mielikki is allowed to wear metal armor and use metal weapons. Mielikki is especially popular for just that reason.

:smalltongue:

I'm normally all for Druid, but I want to shy away from my "crutch"

[Palanan]

Arcane Hierophant using Favored Soul?

No idea if that would even work, the little grey cells just came up with that. :smallbiggrin:

[Tokuhara]

Arcane Hierophant using Favored Soul?

No idea if that would even work, the little grey cells just came up with that. :smallbiggrin:

It wouldn't unless you were able to give FS half of druid's class features.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

DFI Bard.

Silverbrow Human, Savage Bard, get Melodic Casting, Dragonfire Inspiration, and Song of the Heart. If you can take flaws, pick up Dreadful Wrath and Wild Cohort. Get a Badge of Valor and learn Inspirational Boost.

Have a high enough Int score to take Words of Creation at 6th level. Plan to go something like Savage Bard 8/ Virtuoso 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Virtuoso 8.

You can get a Magebred Warbeast Riding Dog for your Wild Cohort, as Magebred is only prohibited specifically to Druids and Rangers specifically for animal companions. Have an Elvencraft Composite Shortbow as it can be used as either a bow or a club, you'll have to pay double masterwork for both functions.

With 28 pointbuy I'd go middle-age and start Str 11, Dex 13, Con 13, Int 14, Wis 9, Cha 15, so your ability scores will actually be Str 10, Dex 12, Con 12, Int 15, Wis 10, Cha 16. Note that you need to be Exalted to get Words of Creation, so if you don't think you'll be able to maintain that level of radiant goodness (or if your party would compromise your exalted status) then go with a considerably lower Int score and skip that feat altogether.

[Tokuhara]

DFI Bard.

Silverbrow Human, Savage Bard, get Melodic Casting, Dragonfire Inspiration, and Song of the Heart. If you can take flaws, pick up Dreadful Wrath and Wild Cohort. Get a Badge of Valor and learn Inspirational Boost.

Have a high enough Int score to take Words of Creation at 6th level. Plan to go something like Savage Bard 8/ Virtuoso 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Virtuoso 8.

You can get a Magebred Warbeast Riding Dog for your Wild Cohort, as Magebred is only prohibited specifically to Druids and Rangers specifically for animal companions. Have an Elvencraft Composite Shortbow as it can be used as either a bow or a club, you'll have to pay double masterwork for both functions.

With 28 pointbuy I'd go middle-age and start Str 11, Dex 13, Con 13, Int 14, Wis 9, Cha 15, so your ability scores will actually be Str 10, Dex 12, Con 12, Int 15, Wis 10, Cha 16. Note that you need to be Exalted to get Words of Creation, so if you don't think you'll be able to maintain that level of radiant goodness (or if your party would compromise your exalted status) then go with a considerably lower Int score and skip that feat altogether.

My thing with this is I spoke with a couple of the players and they keep telling me that the cleric will be buffing and healing, apparently making Bard less useful. And the sneaky will likely cost me my exalted status.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

My thing with this is I spoke with a couple of the players and they keep telling me that the cleric will be buffing and healing, apparently making Bard less useful. And the sneaky will likely cost me my exalted status.

Well then, maybe try a different bard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252815#4).

[Tokuhara]

Well then, maybe try a different bard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252815#4).

However, the issue is the Cleric IS exalted.

And to clarify, the rogue is the type where we as a party need to deal with a "Thief Tax"

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

However, the issue is the Cleric IS exalted.

And to clarify, the rogue is the type where we as a party need to deal with a "Thief Tax"

In that case, go Psion or (StP) Erudite and be a spectacular blaster. Take the feat Poison Immunity (BoVD, general) for Black Lotus Extract and use Psionic Minor Creation to put it on everything. If you don't go Shaper then get that via Hidden Talent rather than Expanded Knowledge.

Always have Share Pain: Psicrystal active and don't forget that its Hardness 8 reduces every instance of damage it takes from Share Pain, regardless of the damage type of the original attack. Keep it in a compartment on your person so opponents will never have line of sight/effect to it (an athletic cup works), and put a Healing Belt on it so it can cure you when needed.

Energy Stun: Electric is one of the best powers ever printed, especially if you ignore the CP nerf. Plan on picking up Persistent Power (3.0 Psionics Handbook but still valid, also here (http://www.wizards.com/d20/files/msrd/ArcanaOccupationsandFeats.rtf)) by 12th level for Force Screen, Mental Barrier, Defensive Precognition, Psionic Freedom of Movement, etc.

[Tokuhara]

In that case, go Psion or (StP) Erudite and be a spectacular blaster. Take the feat Poison Immunity (BoVD, general) for Black Lotus Extract and use Psionic Minor Creation to put it on everything. If you don't go Shaper then get that via Hidden Talent rather than Expanded Knowledge.

Always have Share Pain: Psicrystal active and don't forget that its Hardness 8 reduces every instance of damage it takes from Share Pain, regardless of the damage type of the original attack. Keep it in a compartment on your person so opponents will never have line of sight/effect to it (an athletic cup works), and put a Healing Belt on it so it can cure you when needed.

Energy Stun: Electric is one of the best powers ever printed, especially if you ignore the CP nerf. Plan on picking up Persistent Power (3.0 Psionics Handbook but still valid, also here (http://www.wizards.com/d20/files/msrd/ArcanaOccupationsandFeats.rtf)) by 12th level for Force Screen, Mental Barrier, Defensive Precognition, Psionic Freedom of Movement, etc.

I almost thought an Erudite, but I've had an Arcane itch I've needed to scratch. Normally, this is a tumorous and dangerous itch, but there should be a way to build an arcanist who doesn't steal the show.

Anyone got an idea for something that won't rule the group but still make blasting cool and with a spicy kicker of Battlefield Control

[Urpriest]

I almost thought an Erudite, but I've had an Arcane itch I've needed to scratch. Normally, this is a tumorous and dangerous itch, but there should be a way to build an arcanist who doesn't steal the show.

Anyone got an idea for something that won't rule the group but still make blasting cool and with a spicy kicker of Battlefield Control

Depending on how easily bored you are, Dragonfire Adept does a share of that.

[Tokuhara]

Depending on how easily bored you are, Dragonfire Adept does a share of that.

The party threw up a resounding no to DFA.

[8wGremlin]

I'm joining a party in a Faerun game with the following party:

A cleric (heal/buff)
2 beatsticks
A swordsage
A skillmonkey/trap


So no arcane support at all?
Play a wizard, any of the standard types would do, perhaps

Shadowcraft Mage?

Use your figments to cast save or dies, buffs, etc

And go read how to be a god... The wizards handbook

[Piggy Knowles]

+1 to Dragonfire Adept, for something fun out of the box. It pretends to be a blaster while secretly being a fun little battlefield controller. It's also my favorite BFC choice when dealing with parties not used to working with that style of mage, since you can use Endure Elements to give your allies immunity to your entangling breaths.

EDIT: Sorry, just saw your party veto to DFA.

For three takes on somewhat blast-y arcane casters from the Tempest Stormwind/RadicalTaoist crew, they put together three builds that are surprisingly fun and work at all levels, including...

The Nuker (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/29194961/) (Gray elf, Evoker 3 / Warmage 2 / Ultimate Magus 10 / Master Specialist 3 / Archmage 2) - An attempt to make direct damage work without resorting to action abuse like the mailman. It puts out the highest numerical damage of any of the three builds, but it's also the one that has the most trouble in the lower levels.

The Wizsassin (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/29138521/) (Illumian, Wizard 5 / Assassin 3 / Ultimate Magus 10 / Unseen Seer 2) - A sneaky wizard, with decent stealth skills, that unlike the typical UM build instead uses wizard spells to persist some of the cooler assassin buffs. Also functions as an excellent ray mage, with +10d6 sneak, Split Ray, etc.

The #1 Snoipah (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/29367765/) (Human, Spellthief 1 / Sorcerer 4 / Unseen Seer 10 / Spellwarp Sniper 5) - An attempt to build the ultimate "sniper" style character, this one's got excellent stealth skills (+49 Hide/Move Silently plus Darkstalker), combined with single high-damage ray attacks.

All three get 9th-level spells and are designed to be played through the ranks, rather than just being level 20 builds, which is nice. They can all function as BFC mages but still put out tremendous spike damage when desired. The #1 Snoipah is in many ways the coolest, IMO, but it also is the one that might cross into cheese territory - Spell Matrix and some Sanctum Spell shenanigans (no early entry stuff, but uses Sanctum Spell to lower effective spell levels for Spell Matrix/Contingency/Imbue Familiar).

[Tokuhara]

I was almost toying with a similar build to the Wizassin with a Beguiler chassis and Slayer of Domiel, but the Thief Tax is a bit expensive to deal with.

Perhaps, considering Faerûn is Deity heavy, something clever with a deity themed arcanist?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Illumian (Krau/anything), Beguiler 1/ Wizard 4/ Ultimate Magus 10/ Mindbender 1/ Incantatrix 4. Two flaws, get Able Learner, Versatile Spellcaster, Practiced Spellcaster: Beguiler, and any metamagic feat by 3rd level. Use Martial Wizard to get Improved Initiative instead of Scribe Scroll. I'd go specialist Conjurer with Abrupt Jaunt.

With Versatile Spellcaster you can spend two Beguiler spell slots of the same level to cast any Wizard spell you know of one level higher, though you'll probably need to have your spellbook open to it and read it as you cast it. Get Iron Will for Incantatrix via the Otyugh Hole, and be sure to pick up Mindsight. This character is built for versatility while still getting 19/20 Wizard casting.



Spellthief 1/ Psion or Ardent 4/ Psychic Assassin (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723d) 6/ Slayer 9 is extremely strong, especially with Mind Cripple from Psychic Assassin. That one level of Spellthief allows you to use wands of Wizard spells from most of the schools, namely Wraithstrike.

Psion is the better choice if you'll never hit 20th due to power selection. Ardent gets you 9th level powers and +16 BAB at 20th, but only use it if you can include Substitute Powers (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a).

[Tokuhara]

Hmmm....

Build 1 is sexy, but really scares me due to the power scale.

Build 2 is good, but Assassin, and therefore its psionic counterpart, requires Evil alignment.

Thinking this over, I've always had a soft spot for Gishing like a beast. Is it possible to divided three ways between Gishing, Battlefield Control, and Blasting?

For that, I'd almost say Warmage/Crusader/JPM/Eldritch Knight build that combines a Tank-y Gish with Blasting Control.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

That Ultimate Magus build isn't much stronger than any other Wizard until way late (15+), at which point you sort of need that considering this is FR and you'll almost certainly run afoul of one of the many ECL 20+ NPCs like Manshoon, Fzoul, Halaster Blackcloak, Szass Tam, etc.


See if you can remove Death Attack in exchange for ignoring the alignment and special prerequisites of a given Assassin class.


For a Gish build, start out either Fighter 2/ Wizard 4/ Spellsword 1, or Human or Elf Paragon 1/ Fighter 1/ Wizard 2/ Human or Elf Paragon 2/ Spellsword 1. Only use Fighter 2 if you plan on using Dungeoncrasher with Melf's Unicorn Arrow, which does not necessarily have to strike from the direction of the caster. At that point you're 7th level with 5/7 casting and 5/7 BAB. From there your build should include Abjurant Champion 5/ Incantatrix 4 in whatever order you choose, and then finish with Eldritch Knight 4.

The alternative would be Paladin 2/ Sorcerer 4/ Spellsword 1/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 8. Get Ancestral Relic for a custom Runestaff, I've posted about this trick plenty of times (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=255316#5). It's not the persistent-buff-machine that the above build is, though you can use Illumian with Naenhoon to persist two spells/day once you hit Sacred Exorcist.

[8wGremlin]

Use srd generic spellcaster, and use their sneak attack, and versatile caster to get in to arcane trickster

Potent spells due to sorcerer like spell casting, but from cleric, Druid and sorcerer/wizard spells?

[Tokuhara]

So Biffoniacus_Furiou, I'm assuming a Ecclectic Warmage/Crusader/Abjurant Champion/Spellsword/Jade Phoenix Mage isn't a powerhouse of a gish? I almost thought a Warsader JPM could definitely give the party an excellent option.

And sadly, IF I did a Wizard, I'd be hard pressed to not make a Grey Elf Easy Bake Wizard/Elf Paragon3/Incantrix x/Metaphysical Spellshaper 3/Divine Oracle 1, which may be entirely too powerful for the party.

[Amphetryon]

Beguiler/Hathran. Fits the party's apparent need for an Arcane type without forcing your into blaster territory, and certainly suits Faerun.

[Tokuhara]

Beguiler/Hathran. Fits the party's apparent need for an Arcane type without forcing your into blaster territory, and certainly suits Faerun.

I would, if I didn't exclusively play male PCs

[Coidzor]

However, the issue is the Cleric IS exalted.

And to clarify, the rogue is the type where we as a party need to deal with a "Thief Tax"

If you're going to have to constantly watch out for being backstabbed and robbed from and the cleric has an extra stick up his butt for the divine, then clearly the party wants its own GOD.


The party threw up a resounding no to DFA.

Are you sure you want to play with a bunch of control freaks though? :smallconfused:

[Amphetryon]

I would, if I didn't exclusively play male PCs

Beguiler/Magelord, then? A bit more annoying to get into it, but you can be male without house rules.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

So Biffoniacus_Furiou, I'm assuming a Ecclectic Warmage/Crusader/Abjurant Champion/Spellsword/Jade Phoenix Mage isn't a powerhouse of a gish? I almost thought a Warsader JPM could definitely give the party an excellent option.

You only get Eclectic Learning from Warmage class levels, so with that build you'll have one 0-level non-warmage spell that's cast as a 1st level spell, and be even more lacking in personal buffs than a single-class Warmage. Maybe, big maybe as DMs tend to dislike it, if you get Versatile Spellcaster and Magical Training and add more Wizard spells to that spellbook to cast via Versatile Spellcaster, then you would at least get long-duration buffs to apply out of combat. It's still extremely lacking in its Gish capabilities.

You honestly just need to pick something, and don't pick too many things because your character will end up being mediocre at all of them. If you want a gish, make a gish. If you want a tanky blaster, make a Runesmith, or maybe a Warforged Psion with Adamantine Body. A Gish with blasting, even if it's good at both those things, won't be able to do both in a given round.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Amphetryon
Beguiler/Hathran. Fits the party's apparent need for an Arcane type without forcing your into blaster territory, and certainly suits Faerûn.

This is simple and elegant; now I want to play one.

As far as house rules go, allowing a male Hathran doesn't seem like much to ask. But clearly your group has some strong opinions.

: /

[Urpriest]

The party threw up a resounding no to DFA.

Why? If we understand more about your party's decisions we can make more insightful suggestions, rather than simply assuming they're troglodytic throwbacks.

Anyway, Duskblade is all about blasting, just sometimes it's blasting along a sword.

[Tokuhara]

Sorry. I forgot how tight focus should be.

Thinking things over (again,) considering the rogue's sticky fingers and the Cleric's determination on being a rather large stick in the mud, I need to plan my steps accordingly.

And concerning the party's control-freak tendancies, the issue was in the integration of Dragonmarks in Faerun. They want to avoid anything overtly Eberron

[Urpriest]

Sorry. I forgot how tight focus should be.

Thinking things over (again,) considering the rogue's sticky fingers and the Cleric's determination on being a rather large stick in the mud, I need to plan my steps accordingly.

And concerning the party's control-freak tendancies, the issue was in the integration of Dragonmarks in Faerun. They want to avoid anything overtly Eberron

Dragonfire Adept isn't about Dragonmarks. You're thinking of something else.

[Coidzor]

Thinking things over (again,) considering the rogue's sticky fingers and the Cleric's determination on being a rather large stick in the mud, I need to plan my steps accordingly.

You need to be capable of buffaloing the rogue or taking off his fingers and probably just need to whack the cleric's player if he decides to be a giant killjoy. Or switch those around, really.


And concerning the party's control-freak tendancies, the issue was in the integration of Dragonmarks in Faerun. They want to avoid anything overtly Eberron

What? :smallconfused: Dragonfire Adepts didn't have anything to do with dragonmarks last time I checked, they're not even from an Eberron book.

[Tokuhara]

To Explain:

I was going to have Lesser Mark of the Sentinel and Breath of Siberys as feats. Sadly, when they told me it would be a Faerun game, I took that as No.

However. I think I found a Base Class to use: Sha'ir from Dragon Magazine Compendium. Now I know this isn't a class everyone is familiar with, but there is a region in Faerun where a Sha'ir ould be found: Zakhara.

So I found a class (finally) and am looking for building around the Zakhara region. And I kind of want to play of the Desert-Dwelling Genie-Binder theme in both race & build.

[8wGremlin]

Sha'ir binder anima Mage
Sha'ir is a class from dragon magazine compendium
It has a unique way to get spells, and can change these when needed

Binder to get The diplomacy buff and take 10

Anima Mage to have free meta magic , and enhancing both classes

[Tokuhara]

Sha'ir binder anima Mage
Sha'ir is a class from dragon magazine compendium
It has a unique way to get spells, and can change these when needed

Binder to get The diplomacy buff and take 10

Anima Mage to have free meta magic , and enhancing both classes

Love this.