Is taking off your backpack a swift action?

[bendking]

I mean, seriously, it has to be... right?

[Lapak]

I mean, seriously, it has to be... right?No, I wouldn't think that it is. Swift actions are things that happen in an eyeblink. Shrugging off even an unsecured pack would definitely be no easier than "ready/loose a shield" (which is a move action); an adventurer's pack is almost certainly strapped in place since you're expecting to climb and crawl and dodge in it, so it could easily be a standard action. But in no way is it a swift action.

EDIT: To answer your question directly, I'd rule it in the same category as 'store/retrieve an item' and 'ready/loose a shield', so I'd call it a move action. I was just talking about standards for emphasis.

[Newoblivion]

I would go with move action. Unless the player tells me that his backpack is not fasten to his body because he is ready to drop it at any sign of trouble. Then it will be swift.

[Pink]

Technically 'drop an item' is a free action.

Now, that is personally how I rule it in my games, encumberence can be such a bother some times. There is nothing inherently wrong with ruling it a move action though. Personally if you want to make it a bit more defined, it would make sense that setting the bag down carefully is a move action, but dropping it ASAP is a free action that could risk breaking valuable delicate things inside the pack.

In either event, if this is a regular occurrence by players to get around encumberence penalties and you as a GM wish encumberence to be a larger part of the game, consider the logical conclusion that some enemies, upon seeing a bag of valuables drop to the ground and their owner distracted some distance away in combat, may very well choose to abscond with the backpack and skip the fight altogether. Tha will make players think twice about dropping a backpack.

[Diarmuid]

"Drop an Item" also implies you have it in your hand and simply need to open your hand for it to fall to the ground.

Removing your backpack would certainly involve more time than that and I agree that it should be at least a Move Action, but I definitely could see a case made for it being a Standard.

[Pink]

"Drop an Item" also implies you have it in your hand and simply need to open your hand for it to fall to the ground.

Removing your backpack would certainly involve more time than that and I agree that it should be at least a Move Action, but I definitely could see a case made for it being a Standard.

"Drop an Item" does not mention anything that the item has to be carried with your hands, or anything about hands at all. There is no implication in the text itself, only that we commonly drop things from our hands, but this should not exclude dropping things from other parts of anatomy such as the back or shoulders.

Now, I don't know about you, but it doesn't take me any time at all to shrug a backpack off my shoulders and have it land indelicately against the ground. Gravity works pretty fast when you work with it.

[jindra34]

"Drop an Item" does not mention anything that the item has to be carried with your hands, or anything about hands at all. There is no implication in the text itself, only that we commonly drop things from our hands, but this should not exclude dropping things from other parts of anatomy such as the back or shoulders.

Now, I don't know about you, but it doesn't take me any time at all to shrug a backpack off my shoulders and have it land indelicately against the ground. Gravity works pretty fast when you work with it.

Now try it while carrying a 2' stick in hand. Without loosing focus on what is in front of you. In about a second.

[Pink]

Now try it while carrying a 2' stick in hand. Without loosing focus on what is in front of you. In about a second.

Hey, I don't claim to be a D&D PC or combat trained or anything, if we're going to relate a strict break down of all the conditions that happen in game to real life this will turn into commoner backpack railgun or something. But if a D&D PC can shoot fire from his hands and kill an opponent four times their size when they can only hit the enemy's feet, I'm certainly not denying them the ability to drop a backpack within a second.

I'm just arguing that default rule is as a free action, you're free to houserule otherwise, but I personally think that it's a trivial thing to worry about in the scheme of the game. Just trying to give a RAW answer instead of different opinion.

[Psyren]

Now try it while carrying a 2' stick in hand. Without loosing focus on what is in front of you. In about a second.

You can switch that stick from 2H to one of your hands as a free action as well. I'm inclined to agree with "shrugging off the backpack." The action cost already comes into play if you want to pick it back up or rummage through it.

[jindra34]

You can switch that stick from 2H to one of your hands as a free action as well. I'm inclined to agree with "shrugging off the backpack." The action cost already comes into play if you want to pick it back up or rummage through it.

Note that a 2' stick is close to a shortsword, and would still provoke delays and coordination. And thats assuming a common rucksack backpack as opposed to something actually meant to safely carry lots of weight (which I would probably put at a full round action because it has things you actually have to undo.)

[Ashtagon]

Now, I don't know about you, but it doesn't take me any time at all to shrug a backpack off my shoulders and have it land indelicately against the ground. Gravity works pretty fast when you work with it.

Now try shrugging it off when it is strapped securely on to you. With your hands full. And paying attention to the armed gribbly staring you down a pace away.

Move action.

[Curmudgeon]

Here's my house rule:

If your hands are empty, dropping a backpack is a free action.
If you're carrying anything in either hand, it's a move action.

That's probably being generous if you've got both hands occupied (carrying a bow with knocked arrow, crossbow, or two-handed weapon). It's probably a bit chary if you're carrying a sling, which has no sharp edges you would need to keep the backpack straps away from. It's probably about right for a bladed weapon in one hand.

[Fouredged Sword]

I would allow a quick release latch much like quick release armor. Other than that, move action.

[Psyren]

What about a Handy Haversack or similar? You wouldn't need a plethora of buckles and straps on that to carry a lot of weight. Something like that should be easy to dispose of.

[Slipperychicken]

Make the backpack cost an extra 50-300gp. Say it's specially designed with straps and buckles to optimize release speed, so you can press some button to release it as a Swift action.

Edit: use Quick-Release armor add-on (AFB, but I think Stormwrack) as a template. It's like +300gp or something. Practically free.

[Ellrin]

Personally, I'd rule it either a move action or a swift action, depending on whether the character takes a move action (not just a move-equivalent action) that round. If he isn't taking a move action, then it would be a move action (unless it was secured, in which case standard or full-round, depending on how well secured), because even if you're used to shrugging off a pack (as I'm assuming most PCs would have to be), while the act itself can be almost instantaneous, the motion itself precludes many other kinds of motion. That said, speaking from personal experience, it can easily be taken care of while you're doing something else, especially walking. Again, the motion precludes many other kinds of movements, so it certainly wouldn't be free, but for an unsecured pack, a swift shrug of the shoulders is totally possible while moving your speed.

Of course, given all the different situations that can come up, that might be a little overcomplex for optimal gameflow, depending on how realistically you want to try to rule it.

[SinsI]

Depends on the backpack. Quite a few of those would take at least a minute, similar to a full plate armor.

[Unusual Muse]

Traditionally, I think of the word "drop" as meaning releasing something you are holding in your hand.

In the case of a typical adventurer, when I think of "backpack" I'm not thinking of a sleek little messenger bag; I'm thinking of a small hiking backpack, with some type of reinforced frame and with two or three belts/clasps to keep its weight evenly distributed and secured, in order to make it easier to move/fight while wearing the thing. Considering the amount of gear that people typically have their characters carry, I think this scenario is more likely. Try packing all that adventure gear in the typical small backpack used for carrying books to school, then put it on; when you have it that loaded, it's going to be so ungainly and unbalancing so to make it really awkward to move tactically. A well-loaded and well-secured hiking pack is less awkward because it's designed to hold more gear, in a way that you can still move effectively... but the point is, there's no way you can unfasten and remove a hiking pack in the same amount of time that you can let go of something that you're holding in your hand, especially considering that the tech in-game probably involves buckles rather than quick-release plastic clasps. You can't shrug off a hiking pack.

[Lapak]

There's also a strong argument to be made that it should provoke an attack of opportunity, since virtually all backpacks will require that you bring one or both arms down and back to slide the straps off; that's an open invitation for someone standing in front of you to stab you in the unguarded torso. Again, nothing in the RAW covers this exact situation, but it's something to think on.

[Unusual Muse]

There's also a strong argument to be made that it should provoke an attack of opportunity, since virtually all backpacks will require that you bring one or both arms down and back to slide the straps off; that's an open invitation for someone standing in front of you to stab you in the unguarded torso. Again, nothing in the RAW covers this exact situation, but it's something to think on.

I like that... totally makes sense.

[haplessvictim]

I think it should be at least a move action. In Pathfinder, some examples of move actions are:

Mounting or dismounting a horse
Opening or closing a door
Picking up an item
Retreiving a stored item from your backpack

while swift actions are basically restricted to certain types of spell casting (Quickened spells, mostly, but also some magical class abilities).

There's quite a bit of variability in the real-world times of the move actions I list above (for example, opening a door takes the average person a lot less time than getting on a horse), but my own RAI-sense tells me that getting out of your backpack (especially one loaded with 40+ lbs of possible fragile equipment), is comfortably within this range.