Shadow Jaunt and Sudden Leap Questions

[joca4christ]

Hypothetically, if one had the Shadow Jaunt maneuver as a swordsage, could one "jaunt" a rope across a 50ft chasm? I mean, having said rope tied about the waist on one end, and the other end in the hand of a party member?

Also, with Sudden Leap, could one jump straight up, as opposed to just forward using this maneuver?

[Answerer]

Hypothetically, if one had the Shadow Jaunt maneuver as a swordsage, could one "jaunt" a rope across a 50ft chasm? I mean, having said rope tied about the waist on one end, and the other end in the hand of a party member?
I'm reasonably certain the rules don't really cover this case. Generally speaking, I'd guess not since it would mean the rope is being half-teleported, but ask your DM. Even though the rules probably don't support it I'd probably allow it.


Also, with Sudden Leap, could one jump straight up, as opposed to just forward using this maneuver?
I can't recall the exact wording, but I'd think so.

[DEMON]

Also, with Sudden Leap, could one jump straight up, as opposed to just forward using this maneuver?

One could, using the DCs for high jump, instead of a long jump, to determine the distance.

[joca4christ]

Not actually playing in a game now. Just reading and toying with ideas. Like playing a Hadozee (you know, the monkey/flying squirrel from Stormwrack) swordsage. Wondering how using a combo of Shadow Jaunt/SuddenLeap and the gliding that is racially inherent would work out. Namely, jumping really high, Shadow Jaunting up and over, gliding while mediating to regain Jaunt should it be necessary to travel further.

[Lord Il Palazzo]

Hypothetically, if one had the Shadow Jaunt maneuver as a swordsage, could one "jaunt" a rope across a 50ft chasm? I mean, having said rope tied about the waist on one end, and the other end in the hand of a party member?[Quote]I'd rule in my game that it doesn't work, though there doesn't seem to be any hard and fast rule. It would probably either make the maneuver fail or more likely have the swordsage teleport without the rope.

[Quote]Also, with Sudden Leap, could one jump straight up, as opposed to just forward using this maneuver?It says that you "move the distance determined by your [jump] check result" and that "you must move in a straight line". Besides that, there are no limitations so I don't see why you couldn't jump straight up. Bear in mind that a vertical jump has higher DCs than a horizontal jump (8 per foot rather than 2 per foot, with no running start)

[joca4christ]

Looking at the wording of Sudden Leap, you roll a Jump check, and move that distance. So no DC necessary by verbiage. So if I rolled a 20, had 10 for modifier, I could, in theory, leap 30 ft straight up.

[DEMON]

Looking at the wording of Sudden Leap, you roll a Jump check, and move that distance. So no DC necessary by verbiage. So if I rolled a 20, had 10 for modifier, I could, in theory, leap 30 ft straight up.

Except not, because the distance is determined by your jump check (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/jump.htm).

[joca4christ]

Except not, because the distance is determined by your jump check (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/jump.htm).

Right. So if I rolled a nat 20, and had a modifier of +10, wouldn't that mean I would jump, in a straight line, 30 ft?

[joca4christ]

Except not, because the distance is determined by your jump check (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/jump.htm).

Nevermind. Read the link. Makes sense now. Thanks!

[DEMON]

Right. So if I rolled a nat 20, and had a modifier of +10, wouldn't that mean I would jump, in a straight line, 30 ft?

Jumping up? Without a running start? With a check of 30, you would jump 3 ft. In case Hadozees are treated as always having a running start for the purposes of jumping, then you would jump 6 ft. straight up.

Edit: You're welcome :smallsmile:

[Lord Il Palazzo]

Right. So if I rolled a nat 20, and had a modifier of +10, wouldn't that mean I would jump, in a straight line, 30 ft?No. The maneuver doesn't say you move a distance equal to the result of your jump check; it says you move a distance "determined by your check result". The way the jump skill determines how far you can go is the DC tables in the PHB/SRD.

If the distance was supposed to be equal to your jump check result, the maneuver would say so, like how Insightful Strike deals damage "equal to the check result."

[joca4christ]

So then, in theory, if I were to get a running start (i.e. A charge?) and I moved my 60ft (base speed 30) would I be able to use sudden leap to see if I could cover the rest of the distance, say the opponent was 70ft away?

[joca4christ]

But I could jaunt the 50 ft straight up, then glide.

Would you allow the mediation necessary to reset maneuvers if I were gliding, as, in essence, I'd be "falling with style"?

[Lord Il Palazzo]

So then, in theory, if I were to get a running start (i.e. A charge?) and I moved my 60ft (base speed 30) would I be able to use sudden leap to see if I could cover the rest of the distance, say the opponent was 70ft away?Not if your DM is strict about the rules. You can't pause in the middle of one action (like between the movement and attack of a charge) to take another action (like initiating a maneuver). I'd probably allow it, but that's just me.

You should be able to use a move action to move your speed and use that as the running start for a sudden leap and still have a standard action available when you land. You'd just need to be sure the last 20 feet of your (pre-leap) movement were in a straight line in the direction you want to jump. If you can make more than 30 on a jump check, you could actually cover more distance before attacking than you would with a charge.

EDIT:

But I could jaunt the 50 ft straight up, then glide.It's a little iffy. The rules for conjuration magic, including the teleportation sub-school say:

A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it.Since teleporting yourself doesn't involve a creature being transported to your location but rather you (a creature) being transported to another location, you should be fine. Just be aware that there's a little basis to argue it.


Would you allow the mediation necessary to reset maneuvers if I were gliding, as, in essence, I'd be "falling with style"?I'd say yes, but that you can't do anything else during the round you spend meditating, including steering. If you're fine with gliding in a straight line for those rounds, you should be ok. As always, your DM's mileage may vary.

[Answerer]

Would you allow the mediation necessary to reset maneuvers if I were gliding, as, in essence, I'd be "falling with style"?
Not all refresh methods require meditation, but for the Swordsage... eh, probably.

[tyckspoon]

Jumping up? Without a running start? With a check of 30, you would jump 3 ft. In case Hadozees are treated as always having a running start for the purposes of jumping, then you would jump 6 ft. straight up.

Edit: You're welcome :smallsmile:

It's worth noting that the Leaping Dragon stance, in addition to allowing you to always be treated as having a running start, adds +10 feet to your jump check. Not +10 to your check result, but a flat 10 feet. You can get some pretty crazy jumps out of that if you're willing to devote your stance to it.

[joca4christ]

Thanks for the feedback, and apologies for my obtuseness. I only wish I had a GM to run this stuff thru. So hard to find gamers in my area that can play when I could play. As it is, was just reading and going...I wonder if...

You've all been a great help!

[Diarmuid]

Couple points from the Jump skill to keep in mind:


Distance moved by jumping is counted against your normal maximum movement in a round.


Action: None. A Jump check is included in your movement, so it is part of a move action. If you run out of movement mid-jump, your next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn) must be a move action to complete the jump.

You cannot exceed your normal movement with insance Jump checks.

[joca4christ]

Couple points from the Jump skill to keep in mind:





You cannot exceed your normal movement with insance Jump checks.

So a swift action that triggers a maneuver that enable movement cannot exceed any movement you have taken or will take?

[DEMON]

Normally, the jump is made as part of your move action and is limited by your maximum movement speed. If you were to take 2 move actions in a round (giving up your standard action for a move action) you would be able to jump 2x your movement speed. In case of Sudden Leap you, are able to jump as a swift action, and you are once again limited to a maximum distance of your movement speed. You does not, however, prevent you from taking a Move action after (or prior to) using this maneuver and moving the maximum distance allowed by your movement speed.