Add Con modifier to saving throws?

[Sheogoroth]

Is there any kind of class dip or feat progression that allows you to use your con for other saving throws? I'm building a Arctic-Proto-Mongrelfolk Forsaker Tank and he's got 32 Con, but his Will and Ref are lacking somewhat.
Thanks!

[Sir_Thaddeus]

Not sure about Reflex, but Steadfast Determination (PHII, I think) gives you Con to Will. And makes it so that a nat 1 on Fort isn't an automatic failure; all in all, an excellent feat.

[TuggyNE]

X Stat to Y bonus is generally good for these sorts of things. And sure enough, there are several ways to get it to Reflex saves, quite a few to get it to Will, and even a way to double up on Fort.

[Sheogoroth]

That's super useful for a lot of things I'm trying to do.
Thanks!

[Phelix-Mu]

X Stat to Y bonus is generally good for these sorts of things. And sure enough, there are several ways to get it to Reflex saves, quite a few to get it to Will, and even a way to double up on Fort.

Now nominating for sainthood tuggyne and anyone else that links this early and often. Excellent resource. Hurray to Person_Man for salvaging the info; well-worth the effort.

[SowZ]

Not sure about Reflex, but Steadfast Determination (PHII, I think) gives you Con to Will. And makes it so that a nat 1 on Fort isn't an automatic failure; all in all, an excellent feat.

It does have Endurance as a pre req, though. You can, however, take the feat Tireless in place of Endurance for any pre req. Tireless is a feat that makes you immune to fatigue and you treat being exhausted as being fatigued. It is restricted to humans, orcs, dwarfs, and a few other monster races, though. And you have to take it as a first level feat.

Anyway, Tireless is a good feat for Barbarians. Rangers get Endurance anyway. Fighters get so many feats if you go straight Fighter that spending a feat on fatigue immunity to get good Will saves isn't a bad option. (Tireless is straight up better than Endurance since it ALSO means you don't get fatigued sleeping in armor. Heavy, armor, too.)

[Sir_Thaddeus]

It does have Endurance as a pre req, though. You can, however, take the feat Tireless in place of Endurance for any pre req. Tireless is a feat that makes you immune to fatigue and you treat being exhausted as being fatigued. It is restricted to humans, orcs, dwarfs, and a few other monster races, though. And you have to take it as a first level feat.

Anyway, Tireless is a good feat for Barbarians. Rangers get Endurance anyway. Fighters get so many feats if you go straight Fighter that spending a feat on fatigue immunity to get good Will saves isn't a bad option. (Tireless is straight up better than Endurance since it ALSO means you don't get fatigued sleeping in armor. Heavy, armor, too.)

Out of curiosity, where is this "tireless" feat from? It sounds quite good.

[Flickerdart]

Out of curiosity, where is this "tireless" feat from? It sounds quite good.
It's a regional feat from Player's Guide to Faerun.

[Aasimar]

The summary of X to Y is like distilled 'what I hate about what d&d has become'

[TroubleBrewing]

There's no 'wrong way' to play. If you don't like the resource, don't use it.

[Flickerdart]

The summary of X to Y is like distilled 'what I hate about what d&d has become'
You hate that a warrior can rely on cunning and finesse rather than just huge throbbing muscles?

[Phelix-Mu]

The summary of X to Y is like distilled 'what I hate about what d&d has become'

It's no less valid a way to search for input than googling or crowdsourcing for suggestions on builds and such here on the forum. Some people will be most comfortable asking someone else for help, some want to turn the old-fashioned pages, some want to homebrew, some want an excel spreadsheet measuring optimal BAB by level for their build.

In short, if you are disgusted, ignore it. That's what I did about 4e.:smallcool:

[Aasimar]

No, I mean the excessive 'building' of character builds, where damn near any kind of insanity is possible with the right feat or class or race or spell or item, and it's only a matter of tracking it down.

Con to reflex saves? Con to will saves? why not con to ranged damage? Or to arcane spells known? Or your spellcraft check?


Yeah, you're right, I should just ignore it.

[JKTrickster]

No, I mean the excessive 'building' of character builds, where damn near any kind of insanity is possible with the right feat or class or race or spell or item, and it's only a matter of tracking it down.

Con to reflex saves? Con to will saves? why not con to ranged damage? Or to arcane spells known? Or your spellcraft check?


Aside from balance issues (someone completely Con SAD would be quite strong) what's the problem with being to build anything under the son?

Isn't the strength of DnD 3.5 the ability to build "damn near any kind of insanity" you want? Why is that a bad thing?

[Juntao112]

No, I mean the excessive 'building' of character builds, where damn near any kind of insanity is possible with the right feat or class or race or spell or item, and it's only a matter of tracking it down.

Wait, that's a bad thing? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116838)

[Metahuman1]

No, I mean the excessive 'building' of character builds, where damn near any kind of insanity is possible with the right feat or class or race or spell or item, and it's only a matter of tracking it down.

Con to reflex saves? Con to will saves? why not con to ranged damage? Or to arcane spells known? Or your spellcraft check?


Yeah, you're right, I should just ignore it.

I hear 4.0 made it a big point to get rid of ALL of that sort of thing with out exceptions.

Course, 4.0 was so brilliant that after a 2 year run they re-released 1st edition, limited re-released 3.5 and announced the start of a heavily play-tested 5th edition to launch in like 2 years at that time.

And seriously, what's wrong with a Warrior who needs Brains (Wis or Int) and agile finesse (Dex) to funtion instead of Hulk Smash?

Or a Paladin who's whole thing is that there sheer force of devotion to the cuase of fighting evil is literally all they need to kick ass? (Cha SAD.)