Never knew this rule existed!

[TopCheese]

So I've never knew this, this is from d20srd.org...

"Start/Complete Full-Round Action
The "start full-round action" standard action lets you start undertaking a full-round action, which you can complete in the following round by using another standard action. You can’t use this action to start or complete a full attack, charge, run, or withdraw."

As a Mage I could move, start casting a spell that takes a full round (standard action), then move next round, then finally finish casting the full round action spell (standard).

Has anyone used this in actual game play? Doesn't this take away the spell casters main problem with longer casting spells? What would be the best action to use with this? I don't know all the classes/prc sooo there might be a way out there to abuse this rule.

[SamBurke]

So I've never knew this, this is from d20srd.org...

"Start/Complete Full-Round Action
The "start full-round action" standard action lets you start undertaking a full-round action, which you can complete in the following round by using another standard action. You can’t use this action to start or complete a full attack, charge, run, or withdraw."

As a Mage I could move, start casting a spell that takes a full round (standard action), then move next round, then finally finish casting the full round action spell (standard).

Has anyone used this in actual game play? Doesn't this take away the spell casters main problem with longer casting spells? What would be the best action to use with this? I don't know all the classes/prc sooo there might be a way out there to abuse this rule.
I don't know of enough really, really, important Full-Round-Actions (other than full-round attacks, I guess?) that would require this rule.

[ericgrau]

But then you only get 1 spell in 2 rounds instead of 2 spells in 2 rounds. You may also be confused a full round action casting time with a 1 round casting time. The first gets resolved this turn, the second gets resolved next turn.

If you need to move before doing something and have no other standard actions to fill your time, the option is a hair better than waiting until next turn. But otherwise I don't know anything special to do with it. I mean you're trading a standard+standard to get a move+standard; that's usually a downgrade.

I think I've used the rule one time ever as a rogue to move to a lock or trap and then overcome it. As it turned out the next round I didn't need my move for anything.

[Hand_of_Vecna]

Splitting a Full-round cast up is legit, but it being advantageous seems like it should be a niche case. I suppose you might need a better position before casting and moving after casting is always nice, but your spending an entire run through the initiative being in mid cast presumably in the open in a position of strategical advantage.

That's the opposite of normal use of cover in a battle where barring access to pop out rules, you would move out of cover, fire cast/attack, wait through initiative, attack/cast again, get behind cover.

I simplest exploitation of this tactic I can think of is also very niche would be to start a full move action one round and finish it the next. This would allow you to stay in hiding, cover, etc before sprinting accross the field the next round to a place where you need to perform a move action letting you snatch, grab, pull, push, activate whatever without sucking up a round of attacks first. Again, very niche, but something that could happen in a game allowing a player with greater rules mastery to save the day.

[nedz]

This rule is normally applied in the case of characters being slowed or nauseated — i.e. when you only have a single action each round.

[Deaxsa]

don't forget all of the concentration checks you'll need to make if you get smacked while running to and fro ( and the concentration check for running to and fro, i mean, that's got to be pretty bad for the spell)

[Tr011]

Has anyone used this in actual game play?

No. But all of those "PHB rules" that are not too basic (like the sharing spell with familiar option to just have the familiar get a personal spell) are often overlooked somehow because nobody re-reads the PHB rule sections.

You might start casting a maximized fireball (as a sorcerer, so this shouldn't be too unlikely and takes a full-round action) and in the next round open the door to the tavern of evil and finish casting your spell. Might be one option. It's not too great but essentially gets around the "metamagic+spontanous=fullround" rule in this given situation.

[Andre]

You might start casting a maximized fireball (as a sorcerer, so this shouldn't be too unlikely and takes a full-round action) and in the next round open the door to the tavern of evil and finish casting your spell. Might be one option. It's not too great but essentially gets around the "metamagic+spontanous=fullround" rule in this given situation.

That's what we call "prefire". :smallcool:

[Person_Man]

Combat doesn't start until the DM says that it starts, usually when one side or the other takes a hostile action. Usually this a party to set up an ambush, or for an Assassin to observe an enemy for 3 rounds prior and then Death Attack on the first round of combat. But a caster can also prepare a spell that's a full round action or 1 round action to cast, and then release it during the Surprise round (which is limited to a single Standard Action).

[ericgrau]

It would seem difficult for the first of those 2 rounds to not be the surprise round though, unless it's a silent spell. Spell verbal components must be spoken in a strong voice.

I think if there is any exploit then it would involve immediately moving or performing another move action after the action. Perhaps a hit and run tactic. Something like invisibility could keep you hidden during the first of the two rounds. Or do what the OP said with a spell so that you aren't left wide open for a full round. You stay somewhere safe, begin casting, then all out once you move out and cast.

[Flickerdart]

Spell verbal components must be spoken in a strong voice.
Unless you have nonverbal spell, in which case you can get away with anything else of the same noise, such as birdsong or a loud fart.

[BowStreetRunner]

You may also be confused a full round action casting time with a 1 round casting time. The first gets resolved this turn, the second gets resolved next turn.

I'm not sure where you are getting this...check the SRD under casting time. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#castingTime)


A spell that takes 1 round to cast is a full-round action. It comes into effect just before the beginning of your turn in the round after you began casting the spell.

[3drinks]

Unless you have nonverbal spell, in which case you can get away with anything else of the same noise, such as birdsong or a loud fart.

Yeah, this just got sig'd. lmao

[TuggyNE]

I'm not sure where you are getting this...check the SRD under casting time. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#castingTime)

Yes, and for example:
If a spell’s normal casting time is 1 standard action, casting a metamagic version of the spell is a full-round action for a sorcerer or bard. Note that this isn’t the same as a spell with a 1-round casting time—the spell takes effect in the same round that you begin casting, and you aren’t required to continue the invocations, gestures, and concentration until your next turn.

A 1-round cast spell requires a full-round action, but a spell cast as a full-round action does not necessarily take 1 round to come into effect.

[Deaxsa]

Unless you have nonverbal spell, in which case you can get away with anything else of the same noise, such as birdsong or a loud fart.

can i sig this?

[Flickerdart]

can i sig this?
Sure, why not.

[BowStreetRunner]

A 1-round cast spell requires a full-round action, but a spell cast as a full-round action does not necessarily take 1 round to come into effect.

Is a metamagic spell the only example of a spell cast as a full-round action that takes effect the same turn?

[Flickerdart]

Is a metamagic spell the only example of a spell cast as a full-round action that takes effect the same turn?
All the "Channelled" spells from PHB2 and CMage have full-round action as one of their casting times.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Is a metamagic spell the only example of a spell cast as a full-round action that takes effect the same turn?

Not at all. In fact, full-round action casting times are much more common that 1 round casting times. The only example of the latter I can think of off the top of my head is the summon monster line.

[Ernir]

Not at all. In fact, full-round action casting times are much more common that 1 round casting times. The only example of the latter I can think of off the top of my head is the summon monster line.

I don't think so.

Just in core, for spells with a 1 round casting time, we notably have:
The Summon lines
Dominate Person/Monster/Animal
(Mass) enlarge/reduce Person
Sleep/Deep Slumber
Lesser Geas
Along with a plethora of stuff we never use (in combat), like Call Lightning/Lightning Storm, Firestorm, Enthrall, Hypnotism, Statue, Mount, Storm of Vengeance and Zone of Silence.

But a spell with a 1 full round casting time? I can't remember one. :smallconfused:

[Killer Angel]

As a Mage I could move, start casting a spell that takes a full round (standard action), then move next round, then finally finish casting the full round action spell (standard).

Has anyone used this in actual game play? Doesn't this take away the spell casters main problem with longer casting spells? What would be the best action to use with this? I don't know all the classes/prc sooo there might be a way out there to abuse this rule.

It's very useful for a druid, when you're in eagle form and decide to summon, so you don't have to worry about howering (a thing you cannot do in eagle form). You move, start casting (first round) , then finish the casting and move again (second round). No fall! :smallwink:

[nedz]

I don't think so.

Just in core, for spells with a 1 round casting time, we notably have:
The Summon lines
Dominate Person/Monster/Animal
(Mass) enlarge/reduce Person
Sleep/Deep Slumber
Lesser Geas
Along with a plethora of stuff we never use (in combat), like Call Lightning/Lightning Storm, Firestorm, Enthrall, Hypnotism, Statue, Mount, Storm of Vengeance and Zone of Silence.

But a spell with a 1 full round casting time? I can't remember one. :smallconfused:

The, now standard, spell filter/search tool lists 106 spells with a "full round" casting. There are none in core — though Regenerate is 3 Full Rounds. There are 14 in CDiv, 11 in CMage, 0 in CArc and 0 in SpC.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Huh. Not sure why I thought that was true.

[nedz]

There are 179 with a casting time of "1 round", as opposed to "1 full round".

23 of these are in Core

Antilife Shell
Call Lightning
Changestaff
Creeping Doom
Dominate Animal
Dominate Person
Enlarge Person
Enthrall
Fire Storm
Geas, Lesser
Hypnotism
Insect Plague
Modify Memory
Mount
Reduce Person
Sleep
Statue
Storm of Vengeance
Summon Instrument
Summon Monster I
Summon Nature's Ally I
Summon Swarm
Zone of Silence


Note: Summon Monster X and Summon Nature's Ally X are counted as two spells rather than 18.

[BowStreetRunner]

The Rules Compendium pp.124-125 makes no distinction between spells that are described as '1 round' and 'full round' to cast. In these cases "the spell comes into effect just before the beginning of your turn in the round after the one in which you began casting the spell." On the other hand, it explains that spontaneous metamagic spells that normally take 1 standard action take a full round to cast but the spell still "takes effect during the same turn that the spellcaster begins casting it."

[nedz]

Yes, I was wondering about that since the SRD doesn't make any distinction either. I couldn't find any distinction in the Completes — even those which feature these spells. The fact that the SpC doesn't contain any "1 Full Round" spells is also problematic.

The standard interpretation, and this may be wrong, is :-

"1 Round" — the spell comes off on the start of your next round.
"1 Full Round" — the spell is cast as a Full Round Action, and so comes off this round. I think that this comes from the Sorcerer Metamagic rule.