How high of a bluff modifier would I need...

[Dr.Epic]

...to convince an inanimate object of something?

I am dead serious.:smallwink:

[Amnestic]

Don't thinks need to be able to hear (or understand the language) to believe bluff attempts? Inanimate objects generally can't do that, being inanimate so...you can't?

[KillianHawkeye]

That depends... what is the inanimate object's Sense Motive score? :smallsigh:

[Dr.Epic]

Don't thinks need to be able to hear (or understand the language) to believe bluff attempts? Inanimate objects generally can't do that, being inanimate so...you can't?

Oh please, if the Epic Level Handbook's taught me anything, nothing is impossible: balancing on a cloud, swimming up a waterfall, climbing a perfectly smooth ceiling.

[Krobar]

Fine.

As far as you can tell, the large rock believes every word you say. Yet, mysteriously, it continues sitting there very nonchalantly, like it just doesn't care.

Now what?

[Pickford]

...to convince an inanimate object of something?

I am dead serious.:smallwink:

What reason does the object have to think you are lying to it?

[Daftendirekt]

As far as you can tell, the large rock believes every word you say. Yet, mysteriously, it continues sitting there very nonchalantly, like it just doesn't care.

I feel like I'm reading a Douglas Adams novel.

[Gnome Alone]

I feel like I'm reading a Douglas Adams novel.


Or an text adventure game with an uncannily well-prepared parser.

Dr. Epic: Less than the modifier needed for Perform (Interpretative Dance) to charm it to sentience.

[Kornaki]

To make the discussion a little more focused, what is the DC to bluff a waterfall into becoming a waterrise?

"No, seriously, you're flowing the wrong way dude"

[The Dark Fiddler]

You can't/you automatically succeed.

More context is necessary for any actual answers, Mr. "Dead Serious." :smalltongue:

[FreakyCheeseMan]

127.

What? You doubting me?

[Flickerdart]

To make the discussion a little more focused, what is the DC to bluff a waterfall into becoming a waterrise?

"No, seriously, you're flowing the wrong way dude"
Well, if it's +50 to instill a suggestion, and suggestion is a 3rd level spell, it goes to follow that control water would be +70 and reverse gravity would be +130. :smalltongue:

[Dr.Epic]

You can't/you automatically succeed.

More context is necessary for any actual answers, Mr. "Dead Serious." :smalltongue:

Well, I want to convince an inanimate object that it's a sentient being. How high would I have to roll?

[Flickerdart]

Well, I want to convince an inanimate object that it's a sentient being. How high would I have to roll?
According to my baseless assumption above, a 5th level spell (Awaken) is +90 to the DC, which is already "way out there" for another +20. As an inanimate object it can't make skill checks, so it can't oppose you, putting the final DC at 110 to Awaken an object for one round. Of course, it has to be aware of you, so you need something like Tongue of the Sun and Moon.

[Dr.Epic]

According to my baseless assumption above, a 5th level spell (Awaken) is +90 to the DC, which is already "way out there" for another +20. As an inanimate object it can't make skill checks, so it can't oppose you, putting the final DC at 110 to Awaken an object for one round. Of course, it has to be aware of you, so you need something like Tongue of the Sun and Moon.

Awesome! I'm gonna have the bestest rogue of all time!

[OracleofWuffing]

It'll probably be easier to optimize forgery, and write down your bluff instead.

[Dr.Epic]

It'll probably be easier to optimize forgery, and write down your bluff instead.

I'm sticking with the bluff.

[Mongrel]

Just to warn you, I'm virtually certain you can't use bluff to Awaken or Animate objects by RAW, and most DMs (myself included) would probably just laugh at you.

Depending on what your game is like, however, it could be appropriate.

[FreakyCheeseMan]

Just to warn you, I'm virtually certain you can't use bluff to Awaken or Animate objects by RAW, and most DMs (myself included) would probably just laugh at you.

Depending on what your game is like, however, it could be appropriate.

Sure you can. You just have to be a little subtle about.

For instance, you could train up your bluff check, and use it to convince a high-level wizard that it was in his best interests to Awaken or Animate the object for you.

Other than that, though, you're out of options.

[nedz]

9001

Alternatively: what's your DM's sense motive like ?
Bluffing your way through the fourth wall is likely easier.

[Dr.Epic]

Just to warn you, I'm virtually certain you can't use bluff to Awaken or Animate objects by RAW, and most DMs (myself included) would probably just laugh at you.

Depending on what your game is like, however, it could be appropriate.

But, how do you or your character know they themselves aren't an inanimate object that someone just performed a really good bluff check on? Can you be certain of this?

:smalleek:

[Vaern]

I once cast Glibness and attempted to convincing a locked door in a dungeon that it wanted to open for my party. Someone on the other side, who had locked himself in the room to hide from something, heard me and opened the door to let us in. So, in a way, my attempt to bluff an inanimate object worked.

And that is how I gained the title, "Doortalker."

[Almaseti]

What would you need this for? Tricking someone with a spell that lets them ask inanimate objects what happened near them?

[Menzath]

1. Urban Druid. Have to use a spell though, but you aren't really talking to the rock, but the spirit of the rock or some such nonsense.

2. It is not a bluff check but either a Diplomacy or that urban wild empathy check. Unless you are outright trying to convice it of a falsehood that it knows to be false(As in something it has seen or heard).

3. As mentioned abouve, the rock most likely will not care either way.
So thats a average check of 10 /+ alot depending. Conving it to tell you something is easy, getting it to care about anything else you have to say is darn hard.

[RFLS]

Just to warn you, I'm virtually certain you can't use bluff to Awaken or Animate objects by RAW, and most DMs (myself included) would probably just laugh at you.

Depending on what your game is like, however, it could be appropriate.

Woah, really? Call the media.

I really do want to know why you're asking, though. It sounds like an awesome story.

[Kazyan]

But, how do you or your character know they themselves aren't an inanimate object that someone just performed a really good bluff check on? Can you be certain of this?

:smalleek:

Because they're moving. And if you call out one's perceptions with the "but you can't be suuuuure" line, the question becomes meaningless because then we're debating what "certainty" means.

[Dr.Epic]

Because they're moving. And if you call out one's perceptions with the "but you can't be suuuuure" line, the question becomes meaningless because then we're debating what "certainty" means.

Or is it just an illusion, and we're merely convinced they're moving?

:smalleek:

[Mongrel]

Well while we're on that subject, how do you know you're not just a character that someone's playing in an RPG somewhere?

This is mostly circular logic.

[Kazyan]

Or is it just an illusion, and we're merely convinced they're moving?

:smalleek:

That's the point of the rest of my post. There is nothing I can say that cannot be dismissed as possibly an illusion or something, and then followed with asking for more evidence, which will be dismissed in the same way. It's completely counter to how the search for truth works, so I'm not lending it credence. If there is no possible distinction between reality and illusion, how are they not equivalent?

EDIT: If anyone needs any spare typos, I have some...

[Dr.Epic]

Well while we're on that subject, how do you know you're not just a character that someone's playing in an RPG somewhere?

This is mostly circular logic.

I have no girlfriend, and I sit around half the day and annoy people on the internet. Who would want to play me as a character?:smallconfused:

[Mongrel]

I have no girlfriend, and I sit around half the day and annoy people on the internet. Who would want to play me as a character?:smallconfused:

Maybe you only think you have no girlfriend and sit around all day

=O

[ericgrau]

Twisted rpg.

But for the OP's question, the answer is still N/A. Epic lets you do some crazy things, but it still doesn't let you do everything with any skill. Each skill applies to something different.

[Hikarizu]

With enough alcohol you start losing sense motive checks against inanimate objects' bluff checks. So if we get the inanimate object drunk...

[ahenobarbi]

It'll probably be easier to optimize forgery, and write down your bluff instead.

Won't work on stones that took level in barbarian :smallwink: