PDA

View Full Version : WH 40K: Dark Heresey - Advice on the Scum class



Unregistered
2013-02-10, 06:41 PM
Hello!

For about a year, our group has been playing more or less regularily Dark Heresy.

For my character I rolled a Hive World Scum (I chose to roll everything, including home world and class). My starting characteristics were (those we didn't roll in order but could assign as we wanted):

WS 29 BS 29 S 31 T 32 Ag 42 (+2 from divination) Int 33 Per 34 WP 34 and Fel 48

I wasn't too thrilled about being a hive worlder because of the low toughness, it led me into putting a 17 into T just for having a TB of 3 (which I thought to be important). First I thought, I could play the Scum as you could the Rogue in D&D: Skill monkey. It became quickly apparent that this wasn't possible because I didn't get more skills than others (or more XP) so that I wasn't necessarily better in typical Rogue things than others. Others get Inquiry, Blather, Barter, Move Silently, Security, Concealment, Charm, Scrutiny and Sleight of Hand as well, not even necessarily later or more expensive. So, I am a bit lost at what is the defining role for a Scum. He's not better at being the Party face than a Cleric, not better at breaking somewhere in or hiding than an Assassin, not better in gathering information than an Arbitrator or better at knowing things than an Adept.

For combat, I frist thought I could go TWW Ballistic with Autopistol but that takes too long and is too expensive if I see my main role as skill monkey (which I still kind of do). Plus, our Assassin is doing this now, including the Gunmetal city cheese.

Now, I still want to focus more on skills and talents outside of combat. I am now in the Rogue rank with 3200 XP spent (Starting skill: Dodge, Starting Talent: Unremarkable + the fixed ones). I spent those on:
Characterstic advances:
BS +10, Ag + 10 and Fel +5

Skills:
Barter
Awareness up to + 20
Charm
CL (Underworld) up to +10,
Concealemt
Inquiry
Security
Search
Sleight of Hand
Ciphers (Underworld)
Deceive +10
Dodge +10
Silent Move

Talents:
Quick Draw
Rapid Reload
Hard Target
BWT (Launcher)
Sound Constitution (x2)
Leap Up

Now, I still try to do the skill monkey role and while I do have many skills I consider defining for a rogue-like class, I am not very good at them.

For combat, I focus on the idea of zipping across the battlefield to get quickly somewhere important (e.g. to the switch to set a machine in motion or to grab something before somebody else does it), with my high Ag. That's why I chose Hard Target and Leap up (even if I don't consider them very good talents) and that's why I'm thinking about getting the Sprint talent (though I hope to get good quality bionic legs - I already have common quality ones, due to a grenade accident). By taking the BWT (Launcher), I think I can be of some use in combat by using different type of grenades (especially Krak and Photon grenades), plus it fitted nicely with the grenade accident. Of course, no Autofire and no red dot laser for a grenade launcher which means my chance of hitting is not too great. My other weapons are a combat shotgun (which I want to trade in for a Vanaheim shotgun) and an Autopistol.

So do you have any advice on how to proceed? I do not want an optimized scum (I also think that's too late) but do you think I made some glaring mistakes? What do you think, is the roll of a Scum? Are there skills and talents I absoutely should take? Equipment I should pick up?
For the next 2800 XP in the Rogue rank, I thought about increasing my BS by +15, my Fel by +10, my Ag by + 15 and Int and Per by + 5 each (though I am not sure if that is worth it. On the other hand, it's hard to get better at search or Tech use without advancing these characteristics). Is my try to be "jack-of-all-trades" in the skill departement viable or do I have to specialize in something? (But then I really don't see why I shouldn't just take an Assassin to get all the stealth skills and a buttload of great combat talents)

For skills, I wanted to take Barter +10, Scrutiny (why does it cost the scum 200 XP?) and Tech use, maybe Drive and/or Gamble and Evaluate. Also, I think I should take Secret Tongue (GUtter) for a convincing scum.

For talents maybe Ambidextrous (maybe not worth it if I don't go the TWW-route), Light Sleeper, Sprint, Rapid reaction and Marksman.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Edit: Oh, and any thoughts which of the two open paths (Cutter/Fixer) to take?

ArcturusV
2013-02-11, 01:00 AM
Ah, Dark Heresy. I usually randomly roll mine too, leaving it up to fate. Which probably explains why I've had "Hiver Scum" for about 90% of my characters.

The thing is though... I never could really figure out a "Scum" thing to do either. I mean the Skillmonkey role is not the Scum, that's the Adept, or for the "Tech" stuff is the Tech Priest. Or a Psyker if you want to walk on the wild side. The "Sneak Attack" sort of thing is all about the Assassins.

The only real niche I could find for Scum was "General Underworld Contact". It's really about the only thing that the Scum has going for it is that you get a lot of Skills and Talents that support your ability to blend into underworld society. Gambling, contacts, ciphers, inquiry, blather, charm.

Other than that? The only advice I can give you is that you'd an "okay" third reliever in the team. You're never going to be the best sniper, or the second best sniper, but you can be the third best sniper. Same with a lot of other fields.

Unregistered
2013-02-11, 02:49 PM
Thank you for your insight and more or less confirming my impression. Did your hive world scums make it further than Rogue and do you have any advice on the two alternate paths? I think Charlatan is more fitting...but the Gang Lord-path brings Dodge +20 way earlier and that's quite important I think, especially with the combat role I habe in mind.

Thanks again...maybe somebody else has some scum experience as well that we both can benefit from.

ArcturusV
2013-02-11, 03:07 PM
Well since you're going for the Combat Focus I'd take the Crime Lord path for the obvious reasons. I never went that way with my Hiver Scum and focused more on being a quick talker. It's usually about the one role that as a Scum that the other members of your party won't have sewn up, better than you, excepting in situations where they have the relevant talent to mark them as a colleague of an organization and the perks that come with being able to say they are one of (Arbites, Ministorium, Machine Cult, etc). Usually if they take interaction skills I usually see it more along the lines of Interrogation.

Unregistered
2013-02-11, 10:15 PM
Sorry, I may have been not so clear: I do not want to focus on combat per se but for the role in combat I have in my mind for my character (being highly mobile on the battle field with Hard Target, Leap up, high Ag and Sprint, see my first post), I think the Dodge +20-skill and Step aside-Talent offered by the Cutter rank are very important. I still see my character more of the quick talker variant - so that the Fixer/Charlatan route is more attractive for the skills. But I am not sure to live long enough to get the +20 to Charm, Deceive and so on as Charlatan whereas Dodge +20 and Step Aside are right there on the next rank (Cutter).

Destro_Yersul
2013-02-13, 11:57 AM
Scum are an in-between career, for the most part. They're not as talky as a cleric, or as skilled as an assassin, but they can do BOTH better than either of the other two. They can also take Medicae at rank 2, which is earlier than everyone else can (Tech-priests excepted). They get the best underworld-related skills, too. Scum will almost never be the best man for the job, but they'll often end up the only man for the job, or the backup plan when the main chap botches his roll. They tend to be a support class.

Plus, with a bit of optimisation, (Metallican Gunslingers ho!) you can make them a damn good combatant. They're the only career capable of taking the Reclaimator alt-rank out of the Inquisitor's Handbook, which is a great route to go if you want them to be a little more on the technologically minded side of things. Alt-ranks are the scum's best friend if he wants to specialise a bit more, really. Lathemaster is an especially hilarious one which lets you play a stronger, tougher, smarter scum who can kick-start technology by hitting it really hard.

Unregistered
2013-02-13, 05:28 PM
Thanks to you too. Hmm, I haven't looked at the other alternate ranks from the Inquisitor's handbook, maybe they offer something.

Still, it both confirms and saddens me that the Scum has no real defining role in Dark Heresy.

holywhippet
2013-02-13, 06:57 PM
Keep in mind the system isn't exactly meant to be perfectly balanced between classes. The psyker class for example can be massively powerful, of course there's the whole negative side effect table which makes them like a ticking time bomb. Life isn't fair and the Warhammer 40K setting reflects this.

king.com
2013-02-13, 07:06 PM
Thanks to you too. Hmm, I haven't looked at the other alternate ranks from the Inquisitor's handbook, maybe they offer something.

Still, it both confirms and saddens me that the Scum has no real defining role in Dark Heresy.

Scum are still one of the most powerful Dark Heresy classes in the game. They are the only talky characters to comfortably pick up Step Aside and Dodge +20 and they get dirt cheap Ballistic Skill advances along with Fellowship. Your much like the Han Solo character, hes not the best combat character but hes a crack shot, hes not the best talker but hes a smooth operator, hes not the smartest guy around but he can keep his ship running. His job is to do a bit of everything meaning he ALWAYS has something to do hes pretty good at.

Destro_Yersul
2013-02-14, 06:58 PM
The main disadvantage of the scum is their rather paltry income, but there's this lovely rule buried in the back of the IH that says having a Trade skill upgrades your income to Trading Class. Scum by default can't get trade skills without GM permission, but if you can find an alt rank that has one, or you can secure GM permission for the advance, it's a good way to shore up their deficiency in the area of Getting Money.

Unregistered
2013-02-15, 09:02 AM
Keep in mind the system isn't exactly meant to be perfectly balanced between classes. The psyker class for example can be massively powerful, of course there's the whole negative side effect table which makes them like a ticking time bomb. Life isn't fair and the Warhammer 40K setting reflects this.

Hehe, that's what I actually said to our GM: it's more fitting for Dark Heresy to play a character that you're unhappy with :smallbiggrin:


Scum are still one of the most powerful Dark Heresy classes in the game. They are the only talky characters to comfortably pick up Step Aside and Dodge +20 and they get dirt cheap Ballistic Skill advances along with Fellowship. Your much like the Han Solo character, hes not the best combat character but hes a crack shot, hes not the best talker but hes a smooth operator, hes not the smartest guy around but he can keep his ship running. His job is to do a bit of everything meaning he ALWAYS has something to do hes pretty good at.

Hmm, I don't know - as far as I know, your only chance to get Dodge+20 and Step Aside is by taking the Fixer rank...and then you won't get Charm +10/+20 or even Blather +10/+20. No wait, I see it now: the Shark gets Step Aside and The Charlatan gets Dodge +20 as well. Ok, so it's possible but not so comfortably I think, it's pretty late in the development.

Still, thanks for showing that, now I am quite sure that I will take the Fixer route.


The main disadvantage of the scum is their rather paltry income, but there's this lovely rule buried in the back of the IH that says having a Trade skill upgrades your income to Trading Class. Scum by default can't get trade skills without GM permission, but if you can find an alt rank that has one, or you can secure GM permission for the advance, it's a good way to shore up their deficiency in the area of Getting Money.

I don't understand the income rule for scum but we don't use the income rule, so no problem yet.

Thanks to you all again!