Please help me with a "light" gish.

[cherubim02]

Ok, my first post here. So I wrote a meele character for a running campaign, I'll play the melee character. The group consists of 1 sun elven wizard/ultimate magus/... , 1 whisper gnome swashbuckler/rogue, 1 strongheart halfling druid, 1 human cleric/radiant servant of Lathander and me. We are at level twelve.

So I went with this build: human paladin of mystra (mystic fire knight)

1.lvl paladin 1; feat: combat casting, exotic w. prof.: s.chain
2.lvl paladin 2;
3.lvl paladin 3; feat: weapon finesse
4.lvl paladin 4;
5.lvl paladin 5;
6.lvl paladin 6; feat: sword of the arcane order
7.lvl knight of the weave 1;
8.lvl knight of the weave 2;
9.lvl knight of the weave 3; feat: combat reflexes
10.lvl knight of the weave 4;
11.lvl abjurant champion 1;
12.lvl abjurant champion 2; feat: power attack
13.lvl abjurant champion 3;
14.lvl abjurant champion 4;
15.lvl abjurant champion 5; feat: robilar's gambit
16.lvl spell sword 1;
17.lvl sacred exorcist 1;
18.lvl sacred exorcist 2; feat: divine might
19.lvl sacred exorcist 3;
20.lvl sacred exorcist 4;

abjurant champion and spell sword will go into knight of the weave, and sacred exorcist into paladin casting. So far so good. So I'll get spells up to 6th level. I'm only permitted to use spells from the PHB and the Spell Compendium.

So I thought of these spells: Enlarge Person, wraithstrike, fly, haste, dispel magic, greater dispel magic, bite of the weretiger, shield, mirror images

Since I've never played an arcane character I was hoping for your help on spells. :smallwink:

Thanks in advance.

[Krobar]

Maybe wield a Katana (2-handed) with improved critical, power attack, and arcane strike?

A Katana can be used with Finesse, and Power Attack, and when wielded two-handed its critical multiplier goes to x3 and you've got 1.5x the STR bonus to damage, and with Improved Critical it's 15-20/x3. Combined with the Arcane Strike, and double the damage bonus from Power Attack, this can add up to PAIN pretty fast at higher levels.

I know you were asking more for spell selection, but I've played a couple lower tier casters with utility spells like this, and they become brutes pretty fast.

And Whirling Blade is a cool spell for a character like this, too.

Just something to consider.

[ddude987]

Maybe wield a Katana (2-handed) with improved critical, power attack, and arcane strike?

A Katana can be used with Finesse, and Power Attack, and when wielded two-handed its critical multiplier goes to x3 and you've got 1.5x the STR bonus to damage, and with Improved Critical it's 15-20/x3. Combined with the Arcane Strike, and double the damage bonus from Power Attack, this can add up to PAIN pretty fast at higher levels.

I know you were asking more for spell selection, but I've played a couple lower tier casters with utility spells like this, and they become brutes pretty fast.

And Whirling Blade is a cool spell for a character like this, too.

Just something to consider.

I agree with this. In a campaign I am in right now we have a gishing Katana wielding badass and with PA damage is amazing.

I would suggest getting spellsword earlier if you plan on wearing armor earlier than that. The % reduction is really good. Allows a mithral chainshirt to have 0% spell failure. Or something with 25% to go to 5% which can be reduced to 0% with thisledown padding

[cherubim02]

Thanks, guys! :smallbiggrin:


II would suggest getting spellsword earlier if you plan on wearing armor earlier than that. The % reduction is really good. Allows a mithral chainshirt to have 0% spell failure. Or something with 25% to go to 5% which can be reduced to 0% with thisledown padding

Knight of the Weave 2 gives me the "armored caster (light)" ability, so I'm good on that side. I only took Spellsword, since it gives a CL, full BAB and d10 HD, while needing combat casting, which I allready have. I read up on arcane strike and liked it. I think I'll remove sword of the arcane order (which is a relic of the first version of this build), move power attack up and take arcane strike at level 12.

But i'll keep the chain, using Robilars Gambit, i need to be able to reach the enemy.

[Andezzar]

A Katana can be used with Finesse, and Power Attack, and when wielded two-handed its critical multiplier goes to x3 and you've got 1.5x the STR bonus to damage, and with Improved Critical it's 15-20/x3. Combined with the Arcane Strike, and double the damage bonus from Power Attack, this can add up to PAIN pretty fast at higher levels.Where do you get those rules? A katana is a masterwork bastard sword, nothing more nothing less. Only with at least one level of Iaijutsu Master (Oriental Adventures) can you apply Weapon Finesse to the katana. With Improved Critical or Keen the critical range changes from 19-20/x2 to 17-20/x2.

[Krobar]

Where do you get those rules? A katana is a masterwork bastard sword, nothing more nothing less. Only with at least one level of Iaijutsu Master (Oriental Adventures) can you apply Weapon Finesse to the katana. With Improved Critical or Keen the critical range changes from 19-20/x2 to 17-20/x2.

I don't remember now. It may have been d&d wiki or dungeons.wikia or something.

But that aside, a Katana is most assuredly NOT a masterwork Bastard Sword by any stretch of the imagination, no matter WHAT WOTC had to say about them. I've actually wielded both, and have studied Kendo in real life (along with Kali and Pencak Silat) and can say this with utmost certainty. A katana is NOT a bastard sword by a different name. It is a finesse weapon and deserves much more than WOTC gave it.

--owner of a Paul Chen Ronin Katana.

[Fouredged Sword]

A katana as it is actually wielded is closes to a elven courtblade or thinblade than a bastard sword.

If a thinblade is a longsword exotic weapon, and a courtblade is a greatsword variation, a katana would be some kind of finesseable sword between the two sizes that can be wielded 1 or 2 handed, so a finessable bastard sword.

But yes, RAW a katana is a bastard sword, you can't trust anything on DNDWiki, expecaily about katanas, and Dnd dosen't do the katana justice.

[Darth_Versity]

I don't remember now. It may have been d&d wiki or dungeons.wikia or something.

But that aside, a Katana is most assuredly NOT a masterwork Bastard Sword by any stretch of the imagination, no matter WHAT WOTC had to say about them. I've actually wielded both, and have studied Kendo in real life (along with Kali and Pencak Silat) and can say this with utmost certainty. A katana is NOT a bastard sword by a different name. It is a finesse weapon and deserves much more than WOTC gave it.

--owner of a Paul Chen Ronin Katana.

While that may be true for real life, DnD isn't. In real life you can't leap off of a hundred foot cliff and expect your hit points to save you, guess what you can do in DnD.

For rules purposes a Katana is simply a masterwork Bastard Sword. Same stats and everything.

[Krobar]

While that may be true for real life, DnD isn't. In real life you can't leap off of a hundred foot cliff and expect your hit points to save you, guess what you can do in DnD.

For rules purposes a Katana is simply a masterwork Bastard Sword. Same stats and everything.

And for rules purposes Polymorph Any Object twice can make you immortal. And Gate allows you to call forth noble djinn and spam wishes for free. Thought bottles? Lol. I could go on all day about rules that were poorly thought out, if they were thought about at all.

There are a whole slew of stupid rules that WOtC put out. My biggest problem with getting them all correct is our games allow all kinds of third party and homebrew stuff and I don't always remember which is which, especially when I'm away from my books, which is most of the time. And I've been playing since 1980, so there's lots of stuff I might get wrong, lol.

[Darth_Versity]

And for rules purposes Polymorph Any Object twice can make you immortal. And Gate allows you to call forth noble djinn and spam wishes for free. Thought bottles? Lol. I could go on all day about rules that were poorly thought out, if they were thought about at all.

There are a whole slew of stupid rules that WOtC put out. My biggest problem with getting them all correct is our games allow all kinds of third party and homebrew stuff and I don't always remember which is which, especially when I'm away from my books, which is most of the time. And I've been playing since 1980, so there's lots of stuff I might get wrong, lol.

Thats kinda my point as well. With all the ridiculous rules and loopholes in the game, complaining that a Katana and Bastard Sword are nothing alike is pretty low on the list of priority. :smallbiggrin:

[Newoblivion]

Maybe wield a Katana (2-handed) with improved critical, power attack, and arcane strike?

A Katana can be used with Finesse, and Power Attack, and when wielded two-handed its critical multiplier goes to x3 and you've got 1.5x the STR bonus to damage, and with Improved Critical it's 15-20/x3. Combined with the Arcane Strike, and double the damage bonus from Power Attack, this can add up to PAIN pretty fast at higher levels.

I know you were asking more for spell selection, but I've played a couple lower tier casters with utility spells like this, and they become brutes pretty fast.

And Whirling Blade is a cool spell for a character like this, too.

Just something to consider.

Are there new rules for Katanas? the DMG say it's a MW bastard sword :smallconfused:

[Krobar]

Are there new rules for Katanas? the DMG say it's a MW bastard sword :smallconfused:

How about you read the rest of the thread before asking questions that have already been discussed?

[nedz]

I don't remember now. It may have been d&d wiki or dungeons.wikia or something.

But that aside, a Katana is most assuredly NOT a masterwork Bastard Sword by any stretch of the imagination, no matter WHAT WOTC had to say about them. I've actually wielded both, and have studied Kendo in real life (along with Kali and Pencak Silat) and can say this with utmost certainty. A katana is NOT a bastard sword by a different name. It is a finesse weapon and deserves much more than WOTC gave it.

--owner of a Paul Chen Ronin Katana.

This gave me a hunch that you were using danddwiki, and I appear to be correct (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Katana_%283.5e_Equipment%29).
So basically your Katana is some random home-brew off the internet.

[Andezzar]

This gave me a hunch that you were using danddwiki, and I appear to be correct (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Katana_%283.5e_Equipment%29).
So basically your Katana is some random home-brew off the internet.Very funny that thing. I bet the munchkins at dandwiki don't realize, that their katana does not get any extra damage from power attack (light weapon).

[Krobar]

This gave me a hunch that you were using danddwiki, and I appear to be correct (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Katana_%283.5e_Equipment%29).
So basically your Katana is some random home-brew off the internet.

I'm sure you're right, but it takes forever for pages to load on my phone so I'll have to check for myself later. Like I said... 30+ years of D&D, over multiple iterations and editions, with homebrew, third party, and every WOTC book there is between us, can blur things together pretty heavily.

That said, that random homebrew actually makes sense for a Katana, based on how they actually handle. In my game, if someone was using one (nobody is currently), I would houserule that in. Truly, a Katana does not handle anything like a Bastard Sword. I have no idea why WOTC shortchanged it like that. It makes -zero- sense.

But oh well. No big deal. If they got everything right there wouldn't be any need for houserules.

[nedz]

I'm sure you're right, but it takes forever for pages to load on my phone so I'll have to check for myself later. Like I said... 30+ years of D&D, over multiple iterations and editions, with homebrew, third party, and every WOTC book there is between us, can blur things together pretty heavily.

That said, that random homebrew actually makes sense for a Katana, based on how they actually handle. In my game, if someone was using one (nobody is currently), I would houserule that in. Truly, a Katana does not handle anything like a Bastard Sword. I have no idea why WOTC shortchanged it like that. It makes -zero- sense.

But oh well. No big deal. If they got everything right there wouldn't be any need for houserules.

Most D&D weapons are unrealistic: take a look at longsword sometime.
But that's not really the point, D&D is not about realism.
If this offends your sense of verisimilitude then go with this Katana.

[cherubim02]

All that katana stuff is great guys. But what about spells for my character...

[Krobar]

Since you're going melee, I'd start with Greater Magic Weapon (so you can always have a decent sword), and Whirling Blade so you can throw it (lol) and hurt multiple opponents, and some personal buffs. For sure Wraithstrike, even though it only lasts one round. Maybe your DM will let you write a higher level version that has a longer duration. I would. It's too good not to.

[Andezzar]

How about True Strike, Ray of Enfeeblement and shivering touch (sorry, not a PHB spell) and Polymorph?

[cherubim02]

For sure Wraithstrike, even though it only lasts one round. Maybe your DM will let you write a higher level version that has a longer duration. I would. It's too good not to.
Wraithdtrike is pretty neat, thought only one round (And my DM will never allow it to go on longer), wraithstrike + divine might + arcane strike + robilar's gambit + power attack should hurt pretty badly...

I'll have to read up on polymorph, since I've never used or seen it in action.

Is there a spell, which will help me against miss chance in min/level?

[Turalisj]

A katana as it is actually wielded is closes to a elven courtblade or thinblade than a bastard sword.

If a thinblade is a longsword exotic weapon, and a courtblade is a greatsword variation, a katana would be some kind of finesseable sword between the two sizes that can be wielded 1 or 2 handed, so a finessable bastard sword.

But yes, RAW a katana is a bastard sword, you can't trust anything on DNDWiki, expecaily about katanas, and Dnd dosen't do the katana justice.

Let's not start this "katana r bettars!" conversation again. The katana is, mechanically, a masterwork bastard sword. Nothing more.