Europa Universalis III

[Artanis]

Inspired by a couple of relatively recent LP's, I decided to get this game a couple of weeks ago. So far I'm loving it, so rather than clogging up an LP thread with questions and discussion, I decided to make a new thread for doing so.





I'm currently on my first "real" game (what was technically my first game was mostly just to learn how to play), playing as England. It's the mid-1500's, and I just finished watching (and helping) my favorite moment so far: the complete and utter collapse of France. A decade ago, France was an almost unblemished blue blob stretching from Madrid to Antwerpen, with the world's biggest economy and an army that had just whipped Castille and Austria at the same time. Then Austria gave it another go, and thanks in no small part to my naval blockades, Austria's armies managed to beat France's, at which point an epic dogpile got started (and by "epic dogpile", I mean "even the Aztecs declared war"). When the dust settled, France owned just fifteen revolt-plagued provinces in six unconnected clusters amid a patchwork of newly-independent nations. It. Was. Glorious.

[Leecros]

I had a game about 6 months ago that had France expanding uncontrollably. They had crushed Castille and expanded into Iberia, defeated and conquered a large portion of the Holy Roman Empire, and crippled England. They also colonized a large part of South and North America. I was playing the game as Persia so i couldn't really do much to stop them. Eventually France conquered a coastal line through the Empire and Austria and conquered Croatia and Greece(land i was working on getting). This resulted in a massive war between France and I that took probably 20-30 years to resolve. After that, Everybody from the major powers to the minor powers and even what was left of the Inca dogpiled France and they spend the rest of the game in constant war. It was glorious.

Europa is a great game, i love it. I can't wait until EU IV comes out this year.

[Grif]

France is definitely powerful in EU III, (Unlike Crusader Kings 2!) in no small part due to its "Lucky Nation" status and its bloody ability to keep spawning five stars leaders.

Though, it sounds like both of the dogpile on France you guys saw was probably the French accumulating too much infamy. Heh. Badboy rating is a bad, bad thing to go over.

In my own game, I steamrolled France as Austria (and Holy Roman Emperor) with superior landtech and using sheer numbers. It's quite amusing how France crumbled to bits afterwards and reduced to a rump on the Brittany coast.

[Leecros]

Though, it sounds like both of the dogpile on France you guys saw was probably the French accumulating too much infamy. Heh. Badboy rating is a bad, bad thing to go over.

France definitely has a tendency to accumulate too much infamy, but in my game that wasn't the case. It just got to the point where everyone had some reason to declare war or had an ally that did. It was rather amusing.

[Kurgan]

Anyone else remember the old days when France was the blue blob of death, and basically the final boss of the game? Ever since HTTT, France has about a 50% chance of imploding it seems, and by the time a successor state takes hold, all the other powers, especially the player, are a fair pace ahead of them.

[Artanis]

France is definitely powerful in EU III, (Unlike Crusader Kings 2!) in no small part due to its "Lucky Nation" status and its bloody ability to keep spawning five stars leaders.

Though, it sounds like both of the dogpile on France you guys saw was probably the French accumulating too much infamy. Heh. Badboy rating is a bad, bad thing to go over.

In my own game, I steamrolled France as Austria (and Holy Roman Emperor) with superior landtech and using sheer numbers. It's quite amusing how France crumbled to bits afterwards and reduced to a rump on the Brittany coast.
My situation was pretty much the same as Leecros's. France had pissed off everybody - only seven countries had a relationship of 0 or better with them - and when their military got close to collapse, all their enemies pounced.

And now that the truces have expired, it looks like they're coming back to finish the job.

[Cespenar]

France breaks into pieces as often as it dominates the game, in my experience. It's England which is constant. Their location is just too damn cozy, those darn Brits! :smalltongue:

[Grif]

France breaks into pieces as often as it dominates the game, in my experience. It's England which is constant. Their location is just too damn cozy, those darn Brits! :smalltongue:

You mean how the British Isles turn into that ugly shade of red every single time? :smalltongue::smallbiggrin:

[Leecros]

I remember three games where England didn't form Great Britain.

The first one was when i actually saw an AI Scotland beat them.

The second one was when i saw Castille ally with France and actually conquered a large part of England.

The third one was when Cornwall, yes Cornwall, conquered England. It makes sense when you consider that i was playing Scotland and broke England over my knee before releasing Cornwall and then Cornwall went insane and crushed England into the ground. Strangely enough England looks better pink than red. :smalltongue:

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

The third one was when Cornwall, yes Cornwall, conquered England. It makes sense when you consider that i was playing Scotland and broke England over my knee before releasing Cornwall and then Cornwall went insane and crushed England into the ground. Strangely enough England looks better pink than red. :smalltongue:

I remember old Victorian maps of the british empire where they would colour them in pink.

Pink is the most british of colours

[Artanis]

I uh...I think Austria wants their CoT back :smalleek:

http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll41/LegacyCWAL/VeniceAustria_zps31ddddf0.png
Thank God for the 27 Big Ships parked just offscreen :smallbiggrin:

[Grif]

The real question is why Venice is Austrian to begin with. :smalltongue:

(In my games, they always manage to stay independent.)

[Artanis]

Austria took it from France when we bludgeoned France into implosion. I have no idea how France had gotten its hands on it though.

[Hiro Protagonest]

When I get a meaty machine, I'm getting this and CKII.

Not only are these massive games with long campaigns, they have good replayability! Really worth the money.

What do people think of Hearts of Iron?

[Weezer]

When I get a meaty machine, I'm getting this and CKII.

Not only are these massive games with long campaigns, they have good replayability! Really worth the money.

What do people think of Hearts of Iron?

I love it. It was my first paradox grand strategy, so it has a special place in my heart.

[Leecros]

I uh...I think Austria wants their CoT back :smalleek:


the sad part is that the AI does that and then suffer massive attrition and their war exhaustion rises and they run the risk of imploding and/or running out of manpower.

[Hiro Protagonest]

I love it. It was my first paradox grand strategy, so it has a special place in my heart.

Looking at it again...

Oh man, it's WWII? I thought it was one of the wars back in the days when people lined up to shoot muskets at each other (that is, Napoleon's era (yay! Another Paradox game where France is a superpower!), Revolutionary War, or Civil War). This is much better.

...

Maybe I can convince everybody to buy good gaming PCs and computer mics (that'll only cost about $800 a person, right?), then we can play multiplayer over Teamspeak rather than having to set up A&A once every couple of months. :smalltongue:

[Grif]

I found a screenshot of an old game of mine:

http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/577855495908236413/83F9251ADAA34ABA74870F08BC81AF18E69DAC56/

EDIT: Oh and that Byzantium in Greece? A sultanate. :smallbiggrin:

[Closet_Skeleton]

The real question is why Venice is Austrian to begin with. :smalltongue:

(In my games, they always manage to stay independent.)

Austria has a completely ahistorical mission to conquer Venetian provinces and get cores on them that they almost always get at their first or second mission, so Venice is pretty much doomed in EU3. It may stay independent but never with its historical territory that in kept for 400 years in real life.



Maybe I can convince everybody to buy good gaming PCs and computer mics (that'll only cost about $800 a person, right?), then we can play multiplayer over Teamspeak rather than having to set up A&A once every couple of months. :smalltongue:

You shouldn't need that good a machine to run EU3. Its an 5 year old game.


Oh man, it's WWII? I thought it was one of the wars back in the days when people lined up to shoot muskets at each other (that is, Napoleon's era (yay! Another Paradox game where France is a superpower!), Revolutionary War, or Civil War). This is much better.

March of the Eagles is a Napoleonic era one that's coming out tomorrow.

[Artanis]

I found a screenshot of an old game of mine:

http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/577855495908236413/83F9251ADAA34ABA74870F08BC81AF18E69DAC56/
Who's that in the Western Isles and in Orkney?

[Grif]

I found a screenshot of an old game of mine:

http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/577855495908236413/83F9251ADAA34ABA74870F08BC81AF18E69DAC56/
Who's that in the Western Isles and in Orkney?

I think that was mine. (I remembered I later took pieces of Scotland from the UK, just to gain a foothold there. Also vassalised Genoa and their vast colonial empire.)

[Leecros]

Austria has a completely ahistorical mission to conquer Venetian provinces and get cores on them that they almost always get at their first or second mission, so Venice is pretty much doomed in EU3. It may stay independent but never with its historical territory that in kept for 400 years in real life.


I generally don't see Venice doing too bad. Unless Austria conquers hungary and gets a lot of docks, or Venice's fleet is destroyed somehow. It's incredibly difficult for them to lose Venezia.

[Kurgan]

On Venice: I usually see Venice to pretty well for itself in EU. It doesn't always have an empire, but with its easily defended capital and strong starter fleet, it can do wonders. More than once I have played either Venice or Byzantium and made use of strong fleets to completely cripple the Ottomans. Turns out that when your country is split in half like that, being blockaded sucks.

On computer strength: Yeah, EU3 does not need that strong a computer to play, until about a year ago my 'gaming rig' was a 10 year old computer with about 500mb of ram. Did it take awhile to load and lag sometimes? Sure. But it was still quite playable.

On Hearts of Iron: I haven't played that series since the very first game. It was fun back then at least. If you want to give it a shot, Hearts of Iron III is on the current Indie Gala (http://www.indiegala.com/), so you can get it plus several other games for cheap.

[Murska]

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/ww213/Bestrafer_fin/Eu3%20Pics/TachibanaAfrica.jpg

Oh man. I've had some interesting things happen in EU3 over the years. From Minamoto becoming the Emperor of the HRE to Finland conquering Africa, England and France both imploding on themselves resulting in Great Britain controlling one province... in Sjaelland. ("England has declared war on Great Britain.") "Prussian Castille" located in Central America. A friend conquered the entire world with Frankfurt by inheriting France and Poland-Lithuania in the first couple decades.

Note, all of the previous have happened without any input from myself and, aside from the last one, any other player. AI shenanigans, that is to say.

[Hiro Protagonest]

For some inexplicable reason, it is now my goal in life to play Crusader Kings II, Europa Universalis III (or IV), and Hearts of Iron III. In that order. As the same nation.

...

So, guess I'm playing England.

[Closet_Skeleton]

So, guess I'm playing England.

Technically England isn't in Vicky 2 or Hearts of Iron III.


I generally don't see Venice doing too bad. Unless Austria conquers hungary and gets a lot of docks, or Venice's fleet is destroyed somehow. It's incredibly difficult for them to lose Venezia.

Not losing Venezia is a joke, since the real Venice did a lot better than that. Venice being reduced to just an island is pathetic.

[Artanis]

So...I need to pick a fight with Portugal and/or Castille. I really want to take their stuff in the Caribbean, but I can't manage to get a CB on either of them. I guess I can just eat the -2 stab if it comes to that, but I'd rather not if I don't have to. An Infamy-reducing one would be even better.

Potentially helpful factors:
-I'm Protestant (and can become DotF pretty much whenever I want), and they're Catholic.
-They both hate me (-200 for both).
-One of my allies is a French successor state on Castille's border who seems to have inherited France's talent for pissing people off.

Any suggestions? (Either one will do, since they're allied).


As a side note, when war finally breaks out, I'm virtually guaranteed to win. My big ships almost outnumber Castille's and Portugal's combined entire navies, and my inflation-adjusted income is more than theirs combined.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Technically England isn't in Vicky 2 or Hearts of Iron III.

UK, Great Britain, whatever.

I'm actually going to start as Normandy in CKII. It's my job to conquer England!

[Murska]

Not losing Venezia is a joke, since the real Venice did a lot better than that. Venice being reduced to just an island is pathetic.

How about Venezia taking over almost the entire North America?

[Kurgan]

So...I need to pick a fight with Portugal and/or Castille. I really want to take their stuff in the Caribbean, but I can't manage to get a CB on either of them. I guess I can just eat the -2 stab if it comes to that, but I'd rather not if I don't have to. An Infamy-reducing one would be even better.

Potentially helpful factors:
-I'm Protestant (and can become DotF pretty much whenever I want), and they're Catholic.
-They both hate me (-200 for both).
-One of my allies is a French successor state on Castille's border who seems to have inherited France's talent for pissing people off.

Any suggestions? (Either one will do, since they're allied).


As a side note, when war finally breaks out, I'm virtually guaranteed to win. My big ships almost outnumber Castille's and Portugal's combined entire navies, and my inflation-adjusted income is more than theirs combined.


It has been awhile since I have played Europa, but if memory serves there is a national idea that lets you declare war on other religious groups without massive stability hit. Honestly forget if it can be used against catholics as a protestant though...


For some inexplicable reason, it is now my goal in life to play Crusader Kings II, Europa Universalis III (or IV), and Hearts of Iron III. In that order. As the same nation.

...

So, guess I'm playing England.

I think it is with older games, but if memory serves it was Crusader Kings, Europa III, Victoria I [with its expansions], and Hearts of Iron II that Paradox actually released a download that let you continue in one game where the previous one left off. I never used it, but it always did sound interesting to me.

[Leecros]

It has been awhile since I have played Europa, but if memory serves there is a national idea that lets you declare war on other religious groups without massive stability hit. Honestly forget if it can be used against catholics as a protestant though...


the Unam Sanctam Idea lets you declare war on Heretics

[Weezer]

UK, Great Britain, whatever.

I'm actually going to start as Normandy in CKII. It's my job to conquer England!

I dunno if you'd be interested, but there are some save converters floating around that let you transfer your save from one game to another. They're incredibly bugged and don't work all that well, but if you really want to play one game for all ~900 years, it'll let you do it. Though after a while it'd get boring I would imagine, so much blobbing...


the Unam Sanctam Idea lets you declare war on Heretics

And it does allow protestants to declare war on catholics. It's a pretty nice mid/late game idea for that very reason. I like going protestant just to take advantage of it and vassalize everything in reach.

[Closet_Skeleton]

the Unam Sanctam Idea lets you declare war on Heretics

Bill of rites gives you a free people against anyone who owns cores of a non-existent country.


How about Venezia taking over almost the entire North America?

Pretty rare. Usually they colonise Africa, but so many other minors do that so the achievement in minimal. Venice owning large areas of America is them doing something they never did in real life, them sharing America with Aquila, a country they annexed in real life, is just the game being stupid.

[Murska]

I don't see why something happening that didn't happen in real life is necessarily stupid. Sometimes, unlikely things happen. And the events that happened in real life weren't always the most likely ones to come to pass.

[Grif]

UK, Great Britain, whatever.

I'm actually going to start as Normandy in CKII. It's my job to conquer England!

If you're starting with Normandy, I'd recommend starting with the second start. (ie. Norman England proper). It's only a few months after Stamford Bridge and you get England handed to you in a pretty package. Should you choose to replay Stamford Bridge as William the Bastard, be prepared for years of siege warfare.

[Artanis]

I'll definitely take a look at Unam Santam. I had considered it earlier, but started looking for other options since my utter inability to fight a land war in Europe* and the Iberian dominance of non-British colonizing means they're the only two I'm going to be fighting anytime soon. I figured if there was a way just to take on those two, it'd save me an NI slot.


*Seriously, I recently lost 30,000 men in three weeks trying to invade two-province Brabant :smallfrown:

[Grif]

I'll definitely take a look at Unam Santam. I had considered it earlier, but started looking for other options since my utter inability to fight a land war in Europe* and the Iberian dominance of non-British colonizing means they're the only two I'm going to be fighting anytime soon. I figured if there was a way just to take on those two, it'd save me an NI slot.


*Seriously, I recently lost 30,000 men in three weeks trying to invade two-province Brabant :smallfrown:

What was your land tech? Anything less than a solid 5 point lead over the next rival means your WC won't be proceeding smoothly. :smalltongue:

[Artanis]

What was your land tech? Anything less than a solid 5 point lead over the next rival means your WC won't be proceeding smoothly. :smalltongue:
Land tech is definitely my biggest problem in continental wars: I'm actually ~3 levels behind the likes of Castille and Austria when it comes to land tech.

However, even when I do get my hands on some up-to-date troops (the Brabant invasion, for instance, used troops built in some Danish cores I took a while ago), I just get stomped anyways because my generals are horrific and I have no land NIs. Suffice it to say, most of my land operations against Western Europeans involve staying as far away from enemy troops as possible.

[Weezer]

Land tech is definitely my biggest problem in continental wars: I'm actually ~3 levels behind the likes of Castille and Austria when it comes to land tech.

However, even when I do get my hands on some up-to-date troops (the Brabant invasion, for instance, used troops built in some Danish cores I took a while ago), I just get stomped anyways because my generals are horrific and I have no land NIs. Suffice it to say, most of my land operations against Western Europeans involve staying as far away from enemy troops as possible.

I'm assuming that you have a solid naval advantage? If that's the case, one thing that works really well is to just blockade people into submission. A long term total blockade will result in some decent warscore and most importantly massive amounts of war exhaustion for your enemy. This will eventually result in mass revolt, and allow you to seize a victory even if you couldn't beat them on land. Of course this only works with non-landlocked countries, but it's a good way to deal with france/castille type powers.

[Artanis]

I'm assuming that you have a solid naval advantage? If that's the case, one thing that works really well is to just blockade people into submission. A long term total blockade will result in some decent warscore and most importantly massive amounts of war exhaustion for your enemy. This will eventually result in mass revolt, and allow you to seize a victory even if you couldn't beat them on land. Of course this only works with non-landlocked countries, but it's a good way to deal with france/castille type powers.
I have a MASSIVE naval advantage. I have higher Naval tech than almost anybody, and I have more big ships than the next six or eight navies combined :smallbiggrin:

And yeah, I've been using blockades quite a bit. My first step in any war is to find and either sink or trap the enemy navy, then spread out and blockade their entire coast. Blockade-spawned revolts were my primary contribution to France's implosion.



Tangential note: France doesn't look to be around much longer. Every year or two, I see, "France launched the Reconquest of <place> against <successor state>", then six months later, "France agreed to cede <provinces> to <same successor state>". They're down to about half a dozen provinces left :smalltongue:

[Grif]

Hm. I intend to pick this game up for a bit. (after my CK2 binge.)

Any European nation to suggest?

[Cespenar]

Hm. I intend to pick this game up for a bit. (after my CK2 binge.)

Any European nation to suggest?

Depends on your preferences. My two last games were Brittany and Papal States, which were both fun.

[Grif]

Depends on your preferences. My two last games were Brittany and Papal States, which were both fun.

Hm Brittany sounds like a challenge. (Being bordered by France always is anyway.)

Yes, I think I'll start with it.

[Cespenar]

Hm Brittany sounds like a challenge. (Being bordered by France always is anyway.)

Challenging minors always seem more fun to me. Heck, my list in EU2 went something like: Leinster, Navarre, Teutonic Order (eh), Iroquois, Knights of St. John, Bosnia, Cyprus. Only managed to succeed on the first three, though, sadly.

[Artanis]

I found a CB I could use: I discovered completely by accident that if you have a colony next to a foreign city, you get a CB to take that city. I'm not entirely sure in what circumstances it'll still trigger (e.g. if the CB goes away when your colony becomes a city itself), but it was enough to get the job done.



Challenging minors always seem more fun to me. Heck, my list in EU2 went something like: Leinster, Navarre, Teutonic Order (eh), Iroquois, Knights of St. John, Bosnia, Cyprus. Only managed to succeed on the first three, though, sadly.
Sounds like you'd enjoy Japan in Divine Wind then.

[Cespenar]

Sounds like you'd enjoy Japan in Divine Wind then.

I had enough of Japan in Shogun 2 though, so maybe not.

[Leecros]

Japan is an incredibly slow game anyways...until you actually manage to form Japan. You either have to slog through decades of slowly grabbing territory from the other daimyo(that are quite expensive infamy-wise unless you get a core), or be cheap and abuse the fact that no nation starts with a legitimate heir and force at least one....possibly two if you're lucky of your fellow daimyo into Personal Unions.

[RPGuru1331]

Japan doesn't seem to get much love in general. It's also splintered into its more-or-less accurate sengoku period at the start of the grand campaign in MEIOU, whereas the Heian clans remain in power through all of vanilla. Though, without MEIOU's provinces, there's literally no way to fit all the sengoku clans at any rate....


So, guess I'm playing England.

If you play old versions, or if you grab one of the fan converters, you can just play straight through, but really, that's the wrong way of looking at CK2. You don't play a nation, you play an individual noble line and all their associated titles.

I'm not sure how you feel about the colonies, OP, but you should consider, in the future, slowing the spread of land and sea provinces. I find it makes colonization more of an investment.

[Grif]

I forgot how unforgiving EU 3 was compared to CK 2.

:smalleek:

Playing with Brittany means I had to sit around doing nothing while waiting for my first national idea. (Going straight for New World.) Meanwhile, I tried starting a little war with Provence, since hey, small kingdom right? Plus, I had cores. Next thing I knew, England, Aragon, the entire ****ing HRE (actually, only Bohemia, but I think a few other HRE OPMs declared as well) and France declares on me.

It only had an alliance with Naples to start with.

Oh boy. Should have remembered how cascading alliances work.

[Leecros]

I had a nice little Ottoman Empire game going yesterday....until i saw this

http://oi46.tinypic.com/2eebi9s.jpg



Yeeeaaaahhhhhh.....Turns out that 125k Timurid troops spilling across your borders is terrifying.

[Grif]

I had a nice little Ottoman Empire game going yesterday....until i saw this

http://oi46.tinypic.com/2eebi9s.jpg



Yeeeaaaahhhhhh.....Turns out that 125k Timurid troops spilling across your borders is terrifying.

I'm already quacking in my boots everything I see a stack larger than 10k, never mind 125k. :smalleek:

[Artanis]

Oh boy. Should have remembered how cascading alliances work.

Strangely, I just found myself on the other end of a cascading alliance. Hansa invaded Wurttemburg, so Wurttemburg called Cleves, who called Sweden, who called me.


I'm not sure how you feel about the colonies, OP, but you should consider, in the future, slowing the spread of land and sea provinces. I find it makes colonization more of an investment.

Would that be helpful or hurtful to the guy going for the colonizing? Because in my current game, I own pretty much everything from Panama to Greenland.


I had a nice little Ottoman Empire game going yesterday....until i saw this

http://oi46.tinypic.com/2eebi9s.jpg
:smalleek:

[Weezer]

I'm already quacking in my boots everything I see a stack larger than 10k, never mind 125k. :smalleek:

The best way to deal with the timurids (or any powerful horde) is just to throw some cash their way.

[Leecros]

The best way to deal with the timurids (or any powerful horde) is just to throw some cash their way.

That or scorch the land their besieging and watch attrition decimate them. Unfortunately i had just finished a war with Venice and my armies were all over in Greece and the Balkans, so i wasn't in a position to actually do that. Unfortunately thanks to all the 20k stacks they were throwing at me, i fear they would have just barreled through the scorched provinces.

It's been awhile since the horde's given me such a beating that i had to pay them tribute. That just goes to show that EUIII can be quite unpredictable and merciless at times. The Ottomans is one of the few exceptions to larger nations that i play. They just start in such a position that makes them a challenge. With the Timurids and Golden Horde raiding your land as well as Castille, France, Austria, Venice, and others all having a stake there. France and Castille typically have guarantees and nations under their sphere of influence there. Austria tends to push southwards toward you. Venice downright starts in Greece and has a more powerful fleet to boot. Expanding can be quite challenging and you can easily find yourself getting caught in an alliance cascade.

[Hiro Protagonest]

If you play old versions, or if you grab one of the fan converters, you can just play straight through, but really, that's the wrong way of looking at CK2. You don't play a nation, you play an individual noble line and all their associated titles.

Yeah, I know it's technically possible to start out as an Irish warlord, build up a ton of prestige and war technology and gold and claims, then hire a ton of mercenaries and take over England and now you're considered King of England and the title supersedes Count of Desmond or whatever you were.

Or through a string of really poor luck/deliberately bad decisions, you could start off as the Holy Roman Emperor and end up with the guy under player control heir to the throne of England.

But it's just simpler to start off as William after he became king, or perhaps the king of Scotland.

[RPGuru1331]

Would that be helpful or hurtful to the guy going for the colonizing? Because in my current game, I own pretty much everything from Panama to Greenland
It helps people who pick up QftNW, since it slows down the natural map spread. Basically, by default after what, 25 years? A land province you discover will be spread to the other European powers. They'll get sight of it on their own and all that jazz. If you increase that, they have to send their own conquistadors and navigators, since the natural spread is slower. Or they can wait 100 years. I think I like MEIOU's colonization better (It fundamentally can't be done without a Colonization Idea), but it's still a pretty decent setup.

[Artanis]

It helps people who pick up QftNW, since it slows down the natural map spread. Basically, by default after what, 25 years? A land province you discover will be spread to the other European powers. They'll get sight of it on their own and all that jazz. If you increase that, they have to send their own conquistadors and navigators, since the natural spread is slower. Or they can wait 100 years. I think I like MEIOU's colonization better (It fundamentally can't be done without a Colonization Idea), but it's still a pretty decent setup.
That makes sense, I'll definitely keep that in mind in the future. Thank you :smallsmile:

[Weezer]

Yeah, I know it's technically possible to start out as an Irish warlord, build up a ton of prestige and war technology and gold and claims, then hire a ton of mercenaries and take over England and now you're considered King of England and the title supersedes Count of Desmond or whatever you were.

Or through a string of really poor luck/deliberately bad decisions, you could start off as the Holy Roman Emperor and end up with the guy under player control heir to the throne of England.

But it's just simpler to start off as William after he became king, or perhaps the king of Scotland.

Yeah but that's boring. Half the fun of CK2 for me is starting as some count/weak duke and gaining some unexpected level of power.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Yeah but that's boring. Half the fun of CK2 for me is starting as some count/weak duke and gaining some unexpected level of power.

Well, I'm still going to try and get as big an empire as possible. You start off with about a third of the British Isles, so your first job is to conquer the rest of it. Then tactfully avoid France (unless it falls to infighting, in which case, pounce! You have a beachhead in the form of Normandy!) until you scoop up Spain, then go for France. Then... build up prestige, gold, tech, and claims until the HRE starts to waver. Or build up a navy and turn your attention northwards.

[Leecros]

Yeah but that's boring. Half the fun of CK2 for me is starting as some count/weak duke and gaining some unexpected level of power.

The last time i played as CKII i started as the Count of Nurnburg. Now if you don't know where that is, it's a small county in Bavaria. I planned on becoming the King of Bavaria. Well, it didn't really take me long to unite the Dutchy of Bavaria...although the Kingdom still isn't united, 200 years into the game i Inherit Aquitaine and all of the dutchies and counties that are controlled by them at the beginning of the game...So the Dutchies of Aquitaine, Bourbon, Poitou, and parts of Gasgone and Auvergne, i believe.

Specifics aren't important, but it gave me enough land to form the Kingdom of Aquitaine under the HRE and now France is this torn up mess of it's former glory. I do remember marrying off my daughter or sister or something in a matrilineal marriage to the Duke of Aquitaine, but i didn't really keep track of it...So it came to quite a surprise when i suddenly inherited more than twice the number of counties that i originally had...

[toasty]

Specifics aren't important, but it gave me enough land to form the Kingdom of Aquitaine under the HRE and now France is this torn up mess of it's former glory. I do remember marrying off my daughter or sister or something in a matrilineal marriage to the Duke of Aquitaine, but i didn't really keep track of it...So it came to quite a surprise when i suddenly inherited more than twice the number of counties that i originally had...

My current game of CK2 (where I'm being boring and playing an easy-mode Ireland game) has France similarily destroyed by the HRE. I'm not sure what happened, but I just noticed that France... got destroyed. Now the King of France only rules like... part of Northern France.

Meanwhile, I'm the King of Ireland, Wales and Brittany (is it just me or is it really easy to snag Brittany?), England is kinda just getting weaker and weaker (constant civil wars and Scottish/Irish poking hasn't helped).

Of course, once I form the Empire of Britannia I'm not sure what I'm going to do. Maybe I could join a Crusade...

[Grif]

Hee, I hate to be THAT guy, but this is a Europa Universalis III thread, not a Crusader Kings 2 thread. :smalltongue:


That said, in response to both of you above, France and England often gets themselves embroiled in civil wars, same with all big nations and empires. Unlike the HRE or ERE however, they lack the manpower to consistently smack down their vassals, especially if more than half revolts. (The Kaiser doomstack regularly approaches 10k at game start and often swells to 40-50k by the mid 12th century.)

[Artanis]

So...I just discovered that one of my kings fathered his heir when he was nine :smalleek:



Also: (venting, feel free to ignore)

I picked a fight with the Iberians again. After sweeping the rest of the world clean of enemy forces, I invaded the mainland, and the invasion ultimately came down to a single battle where we had roughly equivalent generals (Castille's had 1 more shock, mine had 2 more maneuver), but I had twice as many troops and Castille had SIX points worth of terrain/crossing penalties. The only way I could possibly lose was to get nothing but 0-1 rolls in every shock phase as he got nothing but 8-9 rolls.

Aaaaaaaand that's exactly what happened. :smallfrown:

[Grif]

My Brittany game seems to be going well. It's the mid 1400s and I'm sitting pretty on my perch off the coast of France. It helped that the French didn't get a mission to conquer me immediately. I was also helped by the fact that France tried and failed to grab a province off Burgundy (who also called in Bohemia and me just for lulz.) Bohemia immediately forced France to release Normandy and Avignon, splintering the French further. Then England swooped in and reclaimed some of their remaining cores on the French. (after the standard conquest of Scotland and Ireland. Seriously, why does the British Isles have to be so predictable in EU3?)

All this while, I'm busy upping my Trade and beelining to the New World. :smallbiggrin: Soon North America will be Breton!

[Closet_Skeleton]

So...I just discovered that one of my kings fathered his heir when he was nine :smalleek:


When I get an heir the moment a regency ends I tend to assume that's a brother or a cousin or something.

[Leecros]

So...I just discovered that one of my kings fathered his heir when he was nine :smalleek:

An heir doesn't have to be the son of a king. It could be a cousin, nephew, brother, or and more distant relatives(with lower claims).

It's still amusing to imagine it that way though sometimes as i've had Kings father their heirs before they were born...:smalltongue:

[Weezer]

So...I just discovered that one of my kings fathered his heir when he was nine :smalleek:



Also: (venting, feel free to ignore)

I picked a fight with the Iberians again. After sweeping the rest of the world clean of enemy forces, I invaded the mainland, and the invasion ultimately came down to a single battle where we had roughly equivalent generals (Castille's had 1 more shock, mine had 2 more maneuver), but I had twice as many troops and Castille had SIX points worth of terrain/crossing penalties. The only way I could possibly lose was to get nothing but 0-1 rolls in every shock phase as he got nothing but 8-9 rolls.

Aaaaaaaand that's exactly what happened. :smallfrown:

Well that was your trouble, in any game based on dice rolls if you pinpoint the highly unlikely string of rolls it would take you to lose, it's inevitable that those rolls will come up. :smalltongue:

Source: years and years of warhammer

[Grif]

Just got got kneed in the nuts by France. God I'm starting to hate that blue blob of doom.

At least I still got England to back me up...

[QuickLyRaiNbow]

Just got got kneed in the nuts by France. God I'm starting to hate that blue blob of doom.

At least I still got England to back me up...

Use attrition against them. Be careful with your borders to keep them to a single invasion point if possible, fortify up and let them park a stack seiging it and taking attrition. Scorch if you need to. If they assault, move in. Fight on your territory to avoid big hits to WE and be careful with your positioning and morale. The way the EU3 peace system works, you'll win every war. You just have to be stubborn enough.

[Artanis]

So I've found that I may have misjudged my land forces' competence. Recent wildly successful land wars have shown me that part of my problem was that I had been sending my troops into buzzsaws like France and Austria that would shred almost anybody anyways. Against lesser opposition, throwing 100K Danish-core-built troops at them seems to work fairly well.



Just got got kneed in the nuts by France. God I'm starting to hate that blue blob of doom.

At least I still got England to back me up...
I've only played half a game and I already hate them. Not only are they pricks, but they just...won't...die. In less than fifty years, they've gone from three rebel-plagued provinces to holding most of modern-day France and using one of the biggest armies in the world to repeatedly beat up Hungary and massive HRE coalitions :smallannoyed:

[Grif]

Use attrition against them. Be careful with your borders to keep them to a single invasion point if possible, fortify up and let them park a stack seiging it and taking attrition. Scorch if you need to. If they assault, move in. Fight on your territory to avoid big hits to WE and be careful with your positioning and morale. The way the EU3 peace system works, you'll win every war. You just have to be stubborn enough.

Being Brittany means the French can swarm on me on all sides. In hindsight I should joined in any wars against them more aggressively.

Alternatively, I think I'm going to start as Burgundy and smack the French down. Just like I did with Austria. Being 5 land tech ahead of the pesky French AND having better troop types means you can mop their doomstacks.

[Artanis]

I need some advice on buildings. So far my building construction has been...haphazard at best, and definitely far from optimal. So what are some of the general rules of thumb for where to send Magistrates? Get as many Docks and Marketplaces as possible, or focus on the high-value (e.g. Coffee, Sugar, etc.) provinces? When and where to upgrade Fort levels? Good times to build Manufactories? That sort of thing.

[Leecros]

Really the only game rule i have for building construction is Constables, Constables, Constables. Other than that it depends on what you're trying to accomplish. If you rely heavily on trade then build Marketplaces and proceed up that route in your high-value area. If you're a naval power then build docks, but you don't need docks unless you want to be a naval power. I've never had any real use for the buildings that increase manpower and things like that, unless you're a smaller nation who's constantly running short on manpower.

[Grif]

To be honest, I only built Manufactories if I'm swimming in ducats and have reaaalllllyyyyy nothing else to spend it on. (ie. being the emperor of HRE).

That said, Constables are good for all-round investment. I'd also add Churches, since they do take a considerable slice off your stability investment. (IIRC, it's -4.0 stab cost BEFORE any modifiers are applied. So if you're Catholic, you only need to pay +16.0 per province instead of +20.0 like you normally do.)

EDIT: I must admit, playing Burgundy feels like playing on Easy Mode. You get a lot of missions to crush all the German OPMs around you and get free cores to boot.

[Weezer]

I go for constables, and then the trade/production one for the high value provinces. I usually only get churches if I'm rolling in cash or am trying to westernize. As for forts, unless I'm dominating so hard that no one ever sieges my provinces I get them as fast as possible for all my provinces, working from the at risk borders inwards.

EDIT: And yeah, Burgundy can be easy mode, especially if you get lucky with missions. In some ways I've found it easier than France, once you get off the ground you can use France as a buffer between you, Spain and England, leaving you free to expand into the HRE using your tasty missions.

[Leecros]

EDIT: I must admit, playing Burgundy feels like playing on Easy Mode. You get a lot of missions to crush all the German OPMs around you and get free cores to boot.

It sounds similar to how Bavaria is played. With the exception that Bavaria is quite a bit smaller. Of course Burgundy doesn't always have it good either, if France decides they really want to ruin your day early and get lucky, they may very well be able to.

[Grif]

I'm actually trying to goad France into a fight now that my land tech is superior so that I can secure the two halves between Burgundy. Also, need to force them to release all those delicious duchies they snapped up in the interim. (They're starting to blob south towards Aragon. I do not like the looks of that.)

EDIT: Okay, looks like France is well and truly splintered. :smallbiggrin: Amazing how small France looks once you got her to release all those small duchies.

[Artanis]

Thank you for the responses, everybody :smallbiggrin:


For reference, I'm playing as Britain, and my holdings are the British Isles, a half-dozen provinces each in non-Isles Europe and sub-Saharan Africa plus ~150 in the New World. I'm having a lot of trouble making Merchants stick - my monopoly count is hovering around 5, but only one is in a CoT that's worth more than 500 ducats. So right now, the majority of my income is from tariffs. Also, I'm Protestant, though I still have a fair number of Catholic/Reformed provinces and a couple Pagan ones that I'm gradually converting.


To be honest, I'd largely forgotten Constables because I'd gotten so used to seeing 1-3 base tax paired with Cotton or something, and mentally went, "OK, Dock and Marketplace first". I'll take a closer look for places to put Constables, especially my New World CoTs.

And yeah, Forts have been my highest priority. Every time I get a Magistrate, the first thing I check for is provinces that need a Fort 1, and if I have one, I give it a Fort 1.

As for Churches, I built a lot of them earlier in the game, but my stab costs have gotten so high and Magistrates have gotten in such short supply that I've been focusing more on econ buildings.


With the reliance on tariffs and crappiness of my Traders in mind, I've been wondering if Trade-category buildings boost the production/tariff income of a province. The extra income from increased CoT value would be almost unnoticeable, but if they boost a province's production/tariff output, I have a lot of Coffee and whatnot that would benefit from a Marketplace and Canal.

[Grif]

Well, put it this way. Tariffs are an amalgamation of your base tax and production income you would have received if it wasn't overseas. Anything that boosts those obviously would benefit. But it wouldn't be as beneficial as upgrading equivalent holdings on the mainland.

Since you said you have ~150 holdings, better grab all those NIs that gives a bonus to tariffs. (Viceroys and Slaves.)

[RPGuru1331]

Docks and marketplaces are good even ifyou aren't a trade power, but there's no downside to being one in 3, even if you're huge - just t hat other sliders will be more pressing, plausibly. And yes, focus on them in high-trade good value provinces.

Constables, however, should probably be more pressing if you aren't dominating the CoT they're working in. Churches are pretty unimpressive unless you're going for world conquest, which will cause a lot of stability hits.

Production income is Production Efficiency * Trade Income, so yes, you will benefit from them even if you don't trade.

[Grif]

Pretty, ain't it? :smallsmile:

http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/577856513387270732/C89A517BA0C314E9F2C18330F0F0C3FAC5E41D8B/

(Not shown, personal union with England. :smallbiggrin: )

[Cespenar]

Pretty, ain't it? :smallsmile:

http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/577856513387270732/C89A517BA0C314E9F2C18330F0F0C3FAC5E41D8B/

(Not shown, personal union with England. :smallbiggrin: )

Is that... super-Hungary?

[Kurgan]

Pretty, ain't it? :smallsmile:

http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/577856513387270732/C89A517BA0C314E9F2C18330F0F0C3FAC5E41D8B/

(Not shown, personal union with England. :smallbiggrin: )

How did Hungary get so big? I have played a lot of games, and have never once seen Hungary survive as a powerhouse. It almost always gets gobbled up by Golden Horde, Austria, Poland, Lithuania, Bohemia, and the Ottomans, or on the occasions it survives, I usually see it as owning all of 2-3 provinces.

[Grif]

Being Emperor of HRE for a spell certainly helped. :smallwink: Also, for some reason, Austria was preoccupied with Aquileia and Venice, so they didn't really declare on Hungary. Same with Bohemia.

(Also not shown on that screenshot, the ERE managing to survive as a rump around Constantinople and on the Baltic sea. This is despite stacks of 20k Ottoman troops marching around Asia Minor. This is shaping up to be one of the most interesting alternate history the game thrown at me yet.)

Unfortunately for Hungary, (around 1505, which is roughly ten years after this) it later got declared on by Austria, Poland and Ottomans together and imploded spectacularly. That is probably the scenario you guys are more familiar with. :smallbiggrin:

[Artanis]

A sudden thought: what penalties are associated with moving your capital? If I put a little effort into it, I'm pretty sure I could have Hudson Bay connected to Tierra Del Fuego in under a decade, at which point moving my capital to the New World would roughly quintuple my not-overseas-provinces count. My troop production would suffer (98% of my land troops are built in Danish cores to take advantage of Denmark's tech), but I can't think of many other downsides that wouldn't be overcome by equivalent upsides on the other side of the pond.

[RPGuru1331]

IIRC, an astronomical gold cost and a Stab hit. And yes, emigrating to the New World isn't that bad a strategy, especially with a european minor (which I don't recall whether you are or aren't)

[Artanis]

IIRC, an astronomical gold cost and a Stab hit. And yes, emigrating to the New World isn't that bad a strategy, especially with a european minor (which I don't recall whether you are or aren't)
I'm Great Britain, though I only have six non-Isles European provinces (and two of those are in Iceland).

[RPGuru1331]

Well, keep in mind that the european provinces have MUCH better base taxes than most of the Americas and by no means have all bad trade goods. Still, you have access to your exact numbers. Either way, a stab hit and a huge gold cost await, but plausibly, these are both worthy expenditures.

[TheDarkOne]

Does anyone else like taking the primitives and Europeanizing them (or whatever it's called, I forget) I had a relatively successful game as the Huron's I think. It does involve a bit of luck because you need there to a be European power with a territory bordering yours, who's preferably not interesting in just wiping you out, and a leader with high enough scores for the Europeanizing event to be an option.

[Artanis]

So much for my capital-moving idea: it won't let me move overseas since my capital is too secure. I do have a couple spots in Europe that I think it'd let me move from, but there's no way that getting my capital across the Atlantic could possibly make up for two moves' worth of money and stab loss :smallfrown:


Does anyone else like taking the primitives and Europeanizing them (or whatever it's called, I forget) I had a relatively successful game as the Huron's I think. It does involve a bit of luck because you need there to a be European power with a territory bordering yours, who's preferably not interesting in just wiping you out, and a leader with high enough scores for the Europeanizing event to be an option.
I think it's called "Westernizing". I haven't tried it yet (and probably won't for quite some time) since I'm so new at the game though :smallwink:

[Leecros]

As for Churches, I built a lot of them earlier in the game, but my stab costs have gotten so high and Magistrates have gotten in such short supply that I've been focusing more on econ buildings.

That is something I've noticed about Vanilla. For larger nations, you don't really get enough magistrates to build everything you need to build. It makes it look like smaller nations are these utopias where they can get their people any building or amenity and large nations are these large wastelands where they can't even build a fort until a year after they become a city.

In this sense, i like the MEIOU mod, when you adopt an Imperial Administration other than turning you into an empire like it does in Vanilla, it also gives you an extra like...+3 magistrates/year. It kind of makes larger nations more powerful; which is probably why that decision was made in Vanilla, to nerf Blobs. However, as mentioned above it's kind of weird with the way they have it.

[Grif]

I just realised there's a beta patch 5.2 for Divine Wind.

Is it worth playing?

[Leecros]

I've been tempted to download the 5.2 beta patch a few times, but i play a lot of Multiplayer and that requires everyone to have the same version (If it wasn't for Paradox's Checksum system, their multiplayer stuff would be so much better). Unfortunately there's a few people i play with who won't play the 5.2 beta for.......I don't really know why. :smallannoyed:

[RPGuru1331]

Honestly, even MEIOU's Empires don't 'fix' the inability of blobs to properly develop, because MEIOU adds more buildings and more provinces. Blobs may get a little more ability to build up infrastructure, but they're not much less screwed. Which is good, because the game favors blobbing enough as it is.

5.2 makes Manpower an actual resource. I can't see why multiplayer players wouldn't like that. It recovers from zero to full over 10 years, just so we're clear on what I mean.

[Leecros]

5.2 makes Manpower an actual resource. I can't see why multiplayer players wouldn't like that. It recovers from zero to full over 10 years, just so we're clear on what I mean.

It's essentially a laziness on their part other than any kind of complaint with how the 5.2 patch works.

[RPGuru1331]

Well, talk to everyone you play with about the mechanics and see how they all feel. If everyone else wants to upgrade on their own, I bet the one you mean will.

[Artanis]

Grr, stupid Japan is cheating. I have two CB's on Minamoto but am not allowed to use them, while I can't find any way whatsoever to get a CB on the Emperor :smallannoyed:

[Closet_Skeleton]

Grr, stupid Japan is cheating. I have two CB's on Minamoto but am not allowed to use them, while I can't find any way whatsoever to get a CB on the Emperor :smallannoyed:

The Emperor isn't a real country anyway.

Declare war on the Shogun.

[Artanis]

The Emperor isn't a real country anyway.

Declare war on the Shogun.
I'm trying, but it won't let me declare war on any of 'em. Maybe my game is bugged or something.

[Leecros]

I'm trying, but it won't let me declare war on any of 'em. Maybe my game is bugged or something.

Check the Shogun Influence and see how high it is. In Japan, the abilities of the Daimyo to do stuff is limited to how powerful the Shogun is(with a more powerful shogun meaning the Daimyo can do less) I believe it's 90-100 influence where the Daimyo can't even declare war on someone.

[Artanis]

I checked after I got off work last night*, and I'm starting to become convinced that something is buggy. Here's the specifics of the situation:
-The Shogun (Minamoto) has 100 Shogun influence.
-When the human is controlling Minamoto, Minamoto is able to contact foreign nations with all the usual diplomatic options in the diplomacy screen. Clicking "Declare War" brings up the usual popup with CB options, the target's alliances, etc. I didn't try clicking "I do" on that popup though, come to think of it.
-When the computer is controlling Minamoto, they seem to have no problems declaring war on people. They've declared on Mutapa and Swahili multiple times, and on Portugal once or twice (the attacks on Portugal being how me-as-Britain wound up with two CBs on Minamoto, incidentally).
-When the human is controlling Great Britain (who I'm playing as), the diplomacy screen when clicking Minamoto has no options, just a blank box, exactly like the other three Daimyos.
-Clicking on Japan (the Emperor) brings up all the usual diplomacy options, including Declare War. However, I don't want to do that since I have no CB on the Emperor.

What I'll probably do when I decide to declare war is save, load up as Minamoto, have them declare on GB, save, and load up as GB again. It'd be roughly the same effect as me-as-GB declaring on Minamoto with one of my CBs (i.e. no stab hit for either and no CB for either that will actually affect the end negotiations). Then I'll just hope that the Japanese spam reconquest CBs on me for the next few decades until I conquer them. I'm hoping I can find another way, but since it's working around a bug or design flaw to do what I should be allowed to do in the first place, I don't consider doing that to be "real" cheating.


*Current circumstances mean that for the next week or so, I have no internet on my personal machine :smallfrown:


Edit: On a side note, does 5.2 fix some of the problems with Japan?

[Leecros]

I checked after I got off work last night*, and I'm starting to become convinced that something is buggy. Here's the specifics of the situation:
-The Shogun (Minamoto) has 100 Shogun influence.
-When the human is controlling Minamoto, Minamoto is able to contact foreign nations with all the usual diplomatic options in the diplomacy screen. Clicking "Declare War" brings up the usual popup with CB options, the target's alliances, etc. I didn't try clicking "I do" on that popup though, come to think of it.
-When the computer is controlling Minamoto, they seem to have no problems declaring war on people. They've declared on Mutapa and Swahili multiple times, and on Portugal once or twice (the attacks on Portugal being how me-as-Britain wound up with two CBs on Minamoto, incidentally).
-When the human is controlling Great Britain (who I'm playing as), the diplomacy screen when clicking Minamoto has no options, just a blank box, exactly like the other three Daimyos.
-Clicking on Japan (the Emperor) brings up all the usual diplomacy options, including Declare War. However, I don't want to do that since I have no CB on the Emperor.

I see, I think i understand now. Yeah, Japan and the Daimyo system has quite a bit of weirdness behind it. It's been awhile since i've dealt with Japan enough to know this for certain, but....

The only nation that can do foreign diplomacy in Japan is the Shogun, they're the ones whom(i believe) have the power to declare war on people and things like that. However as far as foreign powers are concerned, they can only interact with Japan through the Emperor in Kyoto....which basically means any CB you have against the Daimyo are useless until you disband the shogunate.

I was a little confused there, because when you said you couldn't get a CB on the Emperor, i thought you were playing as one of the Daimyo and trying to conquer 'Japan' .

[Artanis]

I see, I think i understand now. Yeah, Japan and the Daimyo system has quite a bit of weirdness behind it. It's been awhile since i've dealt with Japan enough to know this for certain, but....

The only nation that can do foreign diplomacy in Japan is the Shogun, they're the ones whom(i believe) have the power to declare war on people and things like that. However as far as foreign powers are concerned, they can only interact with Japan through the Emperor in Kyoto....which basically means any CB you have against the Daimyo are useless until you disband the shogunate.

I was a little confused there, because when you said you couldn't get a CB on the Emperor, i thought you were playing as one of the Daimyo and trying to conquer 'Japan' .
*looks back up at post* *sees he didn't mention who he was playing as*

...oops. Yeah, I don't blame you for getting a bit mixed up. My bad :smallredface:


Do you know if 5.2 fixes some of the issues with Japan?

[Leecros]

Do you know if 5.2 fixes some of the issues with Japan?

I don't know if they all have been, but here's the ones i found about the Shogun, Japan, and Daimyo.



- Shogun will no longer write satires about himself.
- When sending diplomatic offers as the shogun to countries outside of the shogunate, there's a message telling that you're doing this as Japan.
- The shogunate now properly disbands from occupation of all capitals.
- It is now possible to become Shogun when starting when a daimyo had been annexed.
- rebel_types.txt - ikko-ikki and ronin_rebels will only occur in Japanese culture provinces
- When negotiating peace with Japan, it's now valid to take the capital of a daimyo if it's their last province.
- Japanese rebels can now only appear in Japan.
- Non daimyo countries can no longer release daimyo countries.
- Daimyo's can no longer call in other nations into wars due to defender of faith.


So, certainly some of the weirdness has been fixed, but not all of it. Hopefully Japan is cleaned up more in Europa Universalis IV because it's been a long time that Japan's been rather messed up in III and it's only getting a little better.

[Artanis]

- Shogun will no longer write satires about himself.
- When sending diplomatic offers as the shogun to countries outside of the shogunate, there's a message telling that you're doing this as Japan.
- The shogunate now properly disbands from occupation of all capitals.
- It is now possible to become Shogun when starting when a daimyo had been annexed.
- rebel_types.txt - ikko-ikki and ronin_rebels will only occur in Japanese culture provinces
- When negotiating peace with Japan, it's now valid to take the capital of a daimyo if it's their last province.
- Japanese rebels can now only appear in Japan.
- Non daimyo countries can no longer release daimyo countries.
- Daimyo's can no longer call in other nations into wars due to defender of faith
Well, it's something at least.

Also, lol @ the satire thing.



So, certainly some of the weirdness has been fixed, but not all of it. Hopefully Japan is cleaned up more in Europa Universalis IV because it's been a long time that Japan's been rather messed up in III and it's only getting a little better.
I agree. I've always found Japan to be fairly interesting in how it interacts with "outsiders" during its history, and would love to see it get a proper treatment in a game like this. However, the scale of EU undoubtedly makes it really difficult for the designers to do so - if nothing else, there's only so much detail you can put into a landmass the size of Japan when there's the rest of the world needing attention as well.

On the topic of EU4 Japan, the official forums' "EU4 facts thread" (http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?625530-Just-the-facts-ma-am-collected-information-from-the-devs-READ-BEFORE-POSTING!) has a couple tidbits about Japan:
-Japan will apparently have fewer provinces
-The Shogunate system is gone, but Japan won't necessarily be united

[Weezer]

Honestly in my games I tend to completely ignore Japan unless it manages to disband the Shogunate. The system is just too much of a pain to deal with, especially if you try to play as one of the daimyos.

[Artanis]

Question: is there any way to chase down fleeing enemy ships after a naval battle, like how you can run down a beaten land force? Winning at sea is great and all, but having to park 40 ships outside a port because only two ships out of an enemy swarm sank before they broke can get annoying.

Of the things I've tried that haven't worked:
-Getting the winning fleet to the next sea zone after the losers get there, but before they leave that next zone
-Beating the losers to their next sea zone with the winning fleet
-Doing one (or both) of the above, but with a separate fleet
-Parking ships in multiple sea zones along the losers' route before they get there

Hell, once I tried all four of these things in a single chase, and the enemy ships still got all the way from Oresund to a port in Italy.

[Leecros]

I think a fleeing fleet has to make port before it can be engaged again. It's a similar function as to why you can't intercept a fleeing army until it reaches the next region, only instead of region; it's a port. It's rather weird and annoying, but generally speaking if you can beat their navy and force them into a port, then their threat is neutralized.


This is of course hampered if you have two naval powers fighting against you, but as far as suggestions go....I suggest getting military access to a nation that shares the same water 'region'(if possible) and station your fleet in their port until the cowardly enemy fleet comes out and intercept them before they make it to the next area.

[Weezer]

I think a fleeing fleet has to make port before it can be engaged again. It's a similar function as to why you can't intercept a fleeing army until it reaches the next region, only instead of region; it's a port. It's rather weird and annoying, but generally speaking if you can beat their navy and force them into a port, then their threat is neutralized.


This is of course hampered if you have two naval powers fighting against you, but as far as suggestions go....I suggest getting military access to a nation that shares the same water 'region'(if possible) and station your fleet in their port until the cowardly enemy fleet comes out and intercept them before they make it to the next area.

I think there are a couple exceptions to this, when you're fighting very far from the closest enemy port (did this against france as the ottoman's recently and they decided to run into the black sea), or if they have no unoccupied ports and have no where to go.

[satorian]

The last EU I played was 2. I have fond memories of winning by points because I had successfully engaged in so many political marriages that my diplomacy shot through the roof. That still possible?

(Also, Leecros, you still doing your let's play? I've been lurking quite entertained.)

[Weezer]

The last EU I played was 2. I have fond memories of winning by points because I had successfully engaged in so many political marriages that my diplomacy shot through the roof. That still possible?

(Also, Leecros, you still doing your let's play? I've been lurking quite entertained.)

EU3 doesn't have a victory condition, diplomatic or otherwise, so I guess that's one change.

[satorian]

Well, it's been 7 years since I last played. As I remember it, though, I still had to play until the end (18- whatever), but got a sort of victory message. I think that was what happened. Certainly, the intermarriage method protected me from pretty much all war and still allowed me to create a Spain that covered Iberia.

[Grif]

Question: is there any way to chase down fleeing enemy ships after a naval battle, like how you can run down a beaten land force? Winning at sea is great and all, but having to park 40 ships outside a port because only two ships out of an enemy swarm sank before they broke can get annoying.

Of the things I've tried that haven't worked:
-Getting the winning fleet to the next sea zone after the losers get there, but before they leave that next zone
-Beating the losers to their next sea zone with the winning fleet
-Doing one (or both) of the above, but with a separate fleet
-Parking ships in multiple sea zones along the losers' route before they get there

Hell, once I tried all four of these things in a single chase, and the enemy ships still got all the way from Oresund to a port in Italy.

Alternatively, if the port is under enemy control, land troops and siege the province. :smallbiggrin:

[Leecros]

(Also, Leecros, you still doing your let's play? I've been lurking quite entertained.)

Yeah....I really need to get back to that before it falls into obscurity. I wasn't feeling well after the last update and I took a little break from it and decided to play with England for awhile....It sort of turned into a longer break.



Note: This is the MEIOU mod
On the bright side i'm doing very well....France has been eliminated and i have formed the Anglo-French Union, i've started colonizing North America and have dismantled the HRE system leaving many small minor nations at the mercy of the bigger non-HRE members such as Poland, Hungary, and Sweden.

http://oi50.tinypic.com/2d6qf0n.jpg
Not shown: Personal unions with Aragon, Milan, Flanders, and Austria

[Artanis]

I think there are a couple exceptions to this, when you're fighting very far from the closest enemy port (did this against france as the ottoman's recently and they decided to run into the black sea), or if they have no unoccupied ports and have no where to go.
I recently encountered the "no available ports" one in a recent war. It surprised the hell out of me when it happened, too, since I'm used to fighting big alliances that have 190312570 total ports between them :smalltongue:

Haven't seen the "too far away" one yet though.


Alternatively, if the port is under enemy control, land troops and siege the province. :smallbiggrin:
I've done that quite a few times. I even renamed one of my armies "The Tsunami" for the way it would appear out of nowhere, obliterate a coastal fort (leading to a smashed enemy fleet shortly thereafter), and then be back at sea before help could arrive :smallbiggrin: