Were-Bear Druid Optimization

[Yogibear41]

Any advice on how to optimize this character to be a primary melee/tank using only natural attacks ( 2 claws and 1 bite) while using a few druid spells for self healing/combat control (entangle type effects)

Plan I have so Far about half way to this:

1 Druid (Swift and deadly Hunter AFC)/6 WereBear Template Class

AFC= no wildshape but AC Bonus, and Speed Bonuses as a Monk, and Favored Enemies as a Ranger

In hybrid Form:

Str:33 (including +1 from 4th level)
Dex: 18
Con: 24
Int: 15
Wis: 18
Cha: 10
AC: 24
DR 14/Silver

These Stats are with no items what so ever

I can cast Spells and talk normally while in hybrid form.

Feats: Endurance, Iron Will, Run, Track, Able Learner, Nymph's Kiss, Thick Skinnedx2 Level 6 feat still undecided but will probably go Improved Natural Attack: Claw


I know its not really Optimizing since in the long run im probably worse of for going Were-Bear with the druid AFC but I enjoy playing as one using natural attacks and would like to get the most out of it that I can. ( Its a dangerous world that we play in :smallsmile: )

[Rubik]

The best optimization would be to replace werebear with druid, take anthropomorphic bear as your base race, buy off the relatively minuscule LA (or shifter, with no LA), and use wild shape to shapeshift.

After all, your druid levels are completely wasted. Not only are you 6 levels behind, but you can't use any of your druid abilities, since werebears are Lawful Good, and if you aren't LG you soon will be, since the template forces you into it.

[Yogibear41]

Im Neutral Good, talked the DM into letting me not have to be lawful good.
If anything I have a better chance of shifting to neutral or worse, as in the current campaign pretty much all lycanthropes are evil and those that aren't are highly feared and in some places hunted down and killed regardless of their alignment.

[Phelix-Mu]

Im Neutral Good, talked the DM into letting me not have to be lawful good.
If anything I have a better chance of shifting to neutral or worse, as in the current campaign pretty much all lycanthropes are evil and those that aren't are highly feared and in some places hunted down and killed regardless of their alignment.

The alignment restrictions for lycanthropes should be relegated to fluff, because they are silly and based on some kind of weird genre precedence. Anyone that knows anything about animals knows that an angry bear isn't any less dangerous/evil than an angry wolf. The logic behind this was weird and way too tied to other sources outside D&D, imho.

[Rubik]

Im Neutral Good, talked the DM into letting me not have to be lawful good.
If anything I have a better chance of shifting to neutral or worse, as in the current campaign pretty much all lycanthropes are evil and those that aren't are highly feared and in some places hunted down and killed regardless of their alignment.All the more reason to NOT go werebear. Use similar options, because those six levels are going to kill you.

And you can rightfully say that you're a very odd form of lycanthrope, since you're not subject to alignment swings, and you're fully in control of yourself at all times, unlike others. Perhaps you can garner trust with people as they hear of your rather unusual differences than what they're used to.

[Yogibear41]

Not going Were-Bear is not an option its already there its part of the backstory.

He is natural born and is in full of control of his actions he does not have to make control shape checks he comes from a long line of werebears, the only alignment swings he would be subject to would be a direct result of how I played him sorry if I caused some confusion on that part. In the land surrounding the village and forest that I grew up in people more or less know not to worry about my family unforntunanetly I am about 200 miles away from their. But the small village the party is currently adventuring out of Knows that I turn into a bear and while slightly uncomfortable with it they have not tried to kill me (yet) probably because our party has worked to save 30ish or so of their people who were taken as slaves by Gnolls.

But this really has nothing to do with the question I asked

I know I could be more optimized going full on druid, I choose to play as a Were-Bear for fun, I was merely asking for advice on how to improve the character within the lines of how I wanted to play him.

[Phelix-Mu]

If you plan on changing form a lot, consider picking up some version of a rapid change feat. I think it might be in Savage Species? Something like that.

Consider picking up Warshaper PrC at some point in the future. You've already lost significant spell access, so that won't be much relevant except for self-buffs and access to healing and utility summons. Warshaper has great usefulness for any kind of shapechanger, and it is geared toward improving combat ability and defenses. It's in Complete Warrior.

Practiced Spellcaster might be a good idea, too, if only to keep the durations of your spells relevant.

[Yogibear41]

If you plan on changing form a lot, consider picking up some version of a rapid change feat. I think it might be in Savage Species? Something like that.


Generally spend almost all of my time in bear (animal form) to avoid having to waist time changing its pretty funny though when I hear or see something that no one else does and have to try to signal to them in someway because I can't talk in regular animal form.(tried to signal to them that I heard a war horn blown last game and they all thought I wanted something to drink! lol) The party has never actually seen me in hybrid form even though all the players know im a lycanthrope their characters don't, perhaps soon in the future I'll start going hybrid so I can actually talk lol.

Practice Spell caster is the feat that increases your caster level by +4 but only up to a maximum of your hit die correct?


Also for your signature you should go werewolf lord their stronger than normal werewolves :smallsmile:

[Phelix-Mu]

Practice Spell caster is the feat that increases your caster level by +4 but only up to a maximum of your hit die correct?


Also for your signature you should go werewolf lord their stronger than normal werewolves :smallsmile:

That is indeed the feat. It should cover some of your animal HD, if I recall correctly.

As for the signature, I actually have to fix that...I lost the werewolf thing a while back, as it was an acquired template for me. I could always get it back, but it seems the plot of my dreams have settled for me being a normal human again. I picked up another couple levels, too, not easy at this point, as I pretty much have to save the planet solo to level.

[Yogibear41]

Should Ye prove worth perhaps Ursus will also gift thee with the spirit of the bear friend.

[Rubik]

Should Ye prove worth perhaps Ursus will also gift thee with the spirit of the bear friend.Just make sure to use protection.

[Yogibear41]

Sound like my DM lol :smallsmile: Ursus is a spirit not my character

[LTwerewolf]

Just to make sure you're aware, practiced spellcaster does not give you higher spell levels or more spells per day.

[Fouredged Sword]

Take the Druidic avenger ACF and go into bear warrior for a single level. Take extra rage as a feat and you can turn into a bear 3x per day.

Lost caster level - 1

[Synovia]

Not going Were-Bear is not an option its already there its part of the backstory.

He is natural born and is in full of control of his actions he does not have to make control shape checks he comes from a long line of werebears,

You can be a werebear and not take the were bear template.

In my games, "I'm a druid who only uses wildshape to turn into bear forms" would be good enough for you to call yourself a were-bear.

The crunch is there to help model the fiction. If the particular crunch doesn't model the fiction well, use other crunch.

[Rubik]

You can be a werebear and not take the were bear template.

In my games, "I'm a druid who only uses wildshape to turn into bear forms" would be good enough for you to call yourself a were-bear.

The crunch is there to help model the fiction. If the particular crunch doesn't model the fiction well, use other crunch.Exactly this. Just because you want to play a martial artist (and call yourself a monk) doesn't mean you need to go monk 20. Unarmed swordsage does "monk" so much better, as does monk 2/psychic warrior 18 with Tashalatora, or even dungeoncrasher fighter 6/prC X focused on using Improved Unarmed Strike or gauntlets. The fluff can be identical, and your personality and motives can be the exact same, but you don't need to be monk 20 to be a monk.

CALLING yourself a werebear is fine and dandy, but by Pun-Pun don't bother with the template (or class progression). There are lots of ways to make a werebear that are so much more viable, and won't make you so underpowered that you're likely to die to the first attack of each fight.

[Namfuak]

See if your DM would let you change your LA into animal HD, so you could at least have somewhat on par health. I'd second warshaper, and you may want multi-attack (there is precedent that you qualify, but whether your claw and bite attack count is up to your DM, your other natural attack is your unarmed strike). Fist of the Forest gives you Con to AC, and getting improved unarmed strike for that isn't really a waste of a feat since you can actually use it while in bear form to take advantage of iteratives. On that note, unless you're really set on druid for some reason I'd say just ditch the level and go with either barbarian, warblade, or swordsage. If the former, the con to AC from fist of the forest (one level dip gets you this) will offset the AC lost when raging, and full BAB+DR doesn't hurt. If the latter two, tiger claw manuevers will work well with your natural attacks. Swordsage will get you wisdom to AC, which would stack with con to AC from FotF, so I'd probably go with that over Warblade if you can't change your stats (note that you would technically need to errata the swordsage Wis to AC to work while unarmored as well as in light armor, or wear some form of armor that doesn't go away when you take another shape with a wildling clasp or using the wild enchantment).

[Yogibear41]

I am able to buy off the LA of the were-bear as per the unearthed arcane rules so that solves that problem althought it will be awhile til all of them are gone.

I've considered both fist of the forest and warshaper, but im not sure if my DM will allow me to enter 2 prestige classes so if I had to pick which do you think would be better? I have none of the prereq feats for the fist currently.

I can use multiattakc improved natural attack and weapon focus feats, not sure about other feats that i would qualify for with hybrid though without asking.

is 16 str, 8 con, 2 dex, and 7 natural armor and natural attacks really that bad of a trade off for 6 levels?

With my damage reduction ive been close to untouchable the last couple of adventures til some gnolls finally wised up and started using some silver tipped arrows against me.

[Artillery]

I am able to buy off the LA of the were-bear as per the unearthed arcane rules so that solves that problem althought it will be awhile til all of them are gone.

I've considered both fist of the forest and warshaper, but im not sure if my DM will allow me to enter 2 prestige classes so if I had to pick which do you think would be better? I have none of the prereq feats for the fist currently.

I can use multiattakc improved natural attack and weapon focus feats, not sure about other feats that i would qualify for with hybrid though without asking.

is 16 str, 8 con, 2 dex, and 7 natural armor and natural attacks really that bad of a trade off for 6 levels?

With my damage reduction ive been close to untouchable the last couple of adventures til some gnolls finally wised up and started using some silver tipped arrows against me.

Well compared to a Half-minotaur Water Orc. Which is LA+1.
He gets
+16 Str, +8 Con, -2 Dex, -4 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha, NA +2, Large size

4 dex, 4 int, 2 wis, 2 cha, and +5 NA aren't worth 5 more levels in my opinion.

[Last Laugh]

is 16 str, 8 con, 2 dex, and 7 natural armor and natural attacks really that bad of a trade off for 6 levels?


Yes actually, If you were straight druid you would have full access to casting, and while I'm AFB you can beat all of those stats with spells, sometimes extended, some good druid spells have hour/level durations.

Bite of the were rat is available from level 3 and gives + 6 dex, +3 NA
At 7 you get bite of the wereboar for +4 str, +6 con, +8 NA.

Greater magic fang makes your attacks better, you have huge access to natural attacks (go bear, have better magic attacks than your bear) you can blast, reconstruct the battlefield, and cast reincarnation (the best fluff. half orc barbarian turned fluffy bunny!)

plus druid 7 would actually be TWO bears.

[Yogibear41]

The spells are enhancment bonuses those the stats from the werebear are not so theoretically i could cast bite of the werebear when im already a werebear once I get enough levels of druid.


Artillery: suppose you are right though, good ole 3.5 balance eh? lol