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hamlet
2013-02-18, 11:30 AM
Just a stupid quesiton from one who's not played a lot of 3.x and just wants a quick primer on some of the archery feats in the PHB.

I'm going to, probably, be playing in a 3.x game soonish, and I'll be playing what's called an "Infiltrator." Essentially, it's a Kingdoms of Kalamar class which is the framework of a Rogue with the sneak attack dialed back just a bit and the evasion stripped out and the trap detection toned down, but with the martial weapon proficiencies, tracking ability, woodsy capabilities of a ranger bolted on. It's, in my eye, a lot of fun looking.

However, I just wanted to get a quick question in on the archery feats (quick shot, many shot, etc.) in the PHB and their utility. Are there any there that are absolute must haves for an archer? Any that are, like toughness, traps for the unwary?

Any ways to make a really effective sneaky archer in terms of combinations? (just be aware that for the most part, I'm limited to the PHB, but can grab some feats and things from the Complete X books on a case by case basis if it works and isn't too silly.

And no multi-classing.

Gwendol
2013-02-18, 01:59 PM
Do you get the feats of the ranger? In any case I have a feeling the straight ranger would serve you better simply from ranger casting and bonus feat.
With what you have I'd focus on rapid shot, precise shot and point blank shot to start with. Stealth will be important to trigger sneak attack, although ranged SA is notoriously difficult.

Flickerdart
2013-02-18, 02:03 PM
Archery needs many feats to work well. Rapid Shot is a must, its Improved version is not necessary since all it goes is remove the -2 penalty. Woodland Archer is really nice. Most of the feats you'll be picking up though are less "this will be cool" and more "it sucks not to have these" - Precise Shot because otherwise you have a -4 penalty for firing into melee, and Point Blank Shot because otherwise you can't qualify for anything.

For a sneak attacker, crossbows might work out better than bows - the feat investment is even tougher, but there's feats to, for instance expand SA range to 60 feet.

Killer Angel
2013-02-18, 02:11 PM
Any ways to make a really effective sneaky archer in terms of combinations?

This is unrelated to feats, but if you can afford it, pick a ring of blinking (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rings.htm). Leaving aside the various goodies of the ring, you strike as an invisible creature (SA all the way!).

hamlet
2013-02-18, 03:36 PM
Interesting.

Well, just a few quick replies:

1) Yeah, I realize that the Infiltrator (if anybody actually has a copy of the books that is) is . . . sub par I suppose. It has a bit of breadth of capability and not depth. It has some sneak attack ability (up to +7d6), but lacks the evasion of the rogue. It has the ability to track like a Ranger (which I realize is only one feat away, but it's kinda nice) and has trackless step and a few other goodies, but lacks the favored enemy feature (which I just don't like anyway). It does not get the "combat styles" of the ranger which basically amount to bonus feats from a narrow range, but does get enhanced movement +30 feet, uncanny dodge and its improved version, and an ability called "moving target" which gets him a bonus to AC when he's moving around. Essentially, it's a combo of the bounty hunter, spy, assassin, cross country type of guy.

2) Prestige classes are, in this campaign, almost a non-starter. The DM runs it like, I think, it should be run, in that if you want to multi-class you have to seek out somebody in game to teach you. If you want to join the secret order, you have to find a member in game and convince them to let you in. It makes it tougher to make those complicated builds that people are fond of, but I really like the way it works out in game. Creates interesting oportunities for role play and adventure when you want to convince your party that they should come with you to the other side of the country so that you can seek out a special master teacher who will give you the secret knowledge of whatever cult or something. Works out well IME.

3) I thought about the crossbow, but I've semi-shelved the idea because I don't like the fact that I have to spend a move action reloading unless I take another feat, and half of what makes this class work is mobility and less about straight combat. For the most part, the class is about information retrieval and the odd killing (usually when the target is alone and so mass combat is less of a thing) in any location. Yeah, the Ranger and the Rogue can both do that, but not without some baggage from their archetypes. It's still a thing to consider though.

Also, keep in mind that I'm not trying to create a combat monster, just somebody who doesn't suck out loud because I stink at optimization.


EDIT: Also also, I'm also seriously considering a cleric for the campaign as well. A cleric of a healing god which grants healing spells (all of them) at 1 level lower and access to two domains at the same time that improve your facility with those spells (I figure I could just about max out the limits on a Cure Light Wounds at first level, casting it as a 0-level spell) all in exchange for reduced weapons access, light armor, and a d6 HD. Oh, and increased skill points.