Armoured Rhino Question

[Legolam]

So one of our players has decided to roll a new character (Druid 7/Beastmaster 1).
He wants a Rhino which he intends to armour in the equivalent of full plate.
My question is, can a rhino wear armour that heavy? How much would such armour cost? Etc.

[Diarmuid]

It would be 4 times as expensive and weigh twice as much as normal full plate.

This only puts the weight at 100lbs and is easily within the carrying capacity for a Rhino (26 Str).

Speed reduction for mounts with speed 30 isnt on the table, but I imagine it's movement would be reduced to 20 while wearing the full plate.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/armor.htm#armorForUnusualCreatures

[Glimbur]

Amusingly, the rhino needs Heavy Armor proficiency or else the full plate will penalize his attack rolls and such. That might be enough to talk him out of it.

[Gotterdammerung]

Full plate barding. yeh he can do it. Rules are in the player's handbook.

[Greenish]

Amusingly, the rhino needs Heavy Armor proficiency or else the full plate will penalize his attack rolls and such. That might be enough to talk him out of it.Warbeast (MMII template applicable with Handle Animal) would make it proficient with armour. The sample warbeast is actually a rhinoceros with scale barding.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_137.jpg

[Gotterdammerung]

Animals don't need armor proficiency to wear barding.

[Deaxsa]

Animals don't need armor proficiency to wear barding.

nobody needs proficiency to wear/use anything. it just penalizes attack rolls if you do.

[Gotterdammerung]

nobody needs proficiency to wear/use anything. it just penalizes attack rolls if you do.

No I mean to say they don't need the armor proficiency feat. If they are trained for war they are automatically proficient with armor barding.

[Greenish]

No I mean to say they don't need the armor proficiency feat. If they are trained for war they are automatically proficient with armor barding.Are you sure? I can't find that from the skill section (on Handle Animal) or the Equipment section (for mounts and their barding).

[Starbuck_II]

No I mean to say they don't need the armor proficiency feat. If they are trained for war they are automatically proficient with armor barding.

Citation needed here. Because that isn't a rule.
Riding Dogs are special.

[Deaxsa]

Citation needed here. Because that isn't a rule.
Riding Dogs are special.

wait, what? am i missing something, or is this some kind of inside joke...? i'm confused

[Immabozo]

Warbeast (MMII template applicable with Handle Animal) would make it proficient with armour. The sample warbeast is actually a rhinoceros with scale barding.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_137.jpg


No I mean to say they don't need the armor proficiency feat. If they are trained for war they are automatically proficient with armor barding.

war beast is trained for war. Without this template, they are not trained for war

[Gotterdammerung]

Animal Type

An animal is a living, nonhuman creature, usually a vertebrate with no magical abilities and no innate capacity for language or culture.
Features

An animal has the following features (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).

8-sided Hit Dice.
Base attack bonus equal to ¾ total Hit Dice (as cleric).
Good Fortitude and Reflex saves (certain animals have different good saves, for instance dire animals have good Fortitude, Reflex, and Will saves).
Skill points equal to (2 + Int modifier, minimum 1) per Hit Die, with quadruple skill points for the first Hit Die.

Traits

An animal possesses the following traits (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).

Intelligence score of 1 or 2 (no creature with an Intelligence score of 3 or higher can be an animal).
Low-light vision.
Alignment: Always neutral.
Treasure: None.
Proficient with its natural weapons only. A noncombative herbivore uses its natural weapons as a secondary attack. Such attacks are made with a -5 penalty on the creature’s attack rolls, and the animal receives only ½ its Strength modifier as a damage adjustment.
Proficient with no armor unless trained for war.
Animals eat, sleep, and breathe.

It says so in the animal type description. If an animal is trained for war it is proficient with armor.

[Khedrac]

And the Warbeast Template disqualifies an animal for use as a companion...

Animal companions have to be "normal" examples of the animal (before companion modifiers) therefore no templates allowed by RAW - the DM can choose otherwise.

[Immabozo]

It says so in the animal type description. If an animal is trained for war it is proficient with armor.

War beast IS training for war. You cant train an animal by deciding it is trained, you have to actually train it. After training it for war (which goes beyond normal tricks), it earns the warbeast template

[Urpriest]

War beast IS training for war. You cant train an animal by deciding it is trained, you have to actually train it. After training it for war (which goes beyond normal tricks), it earns the warbeast template

False. Warbeasts are warbeasts as soon as they emerge from the womb, you cannot train a non-warbeast to make it a warbeast.

That said, trained for war is indeed not typically a function of handle animal, but rather of the particular monster (Warhorse, Riding Dog, Warbeasts, etc.)

[Legolam]

Animal Type

An animal is a living, nonhuman creature, usually a vertebrate with no magical abilities and no innate capacity for language or culture.
Features

An animal has the following features (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).

8-sided Hit Dice.
Base attack bonus equal to ¾ total Hit Dice (as cleric).
Good Fortitude and Reflex saves (certain animals have different good saves, for instance dire animals have good Fortitude, Reflex, and Will saves).
Skill points equal to (2 + Int modifier, minimum 1) per Hit Die, with quadruple skill points for the first Hit Die.

Traits

An animal possesses the following traits (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).

Intelligence score of 1 or 2 (no creature with an Intelligence score of 3 or higher can be an animal).
Low-light vision.
Alignment: Always neutral.
Treasure: None.
Proficient with its natural weapons only. A noncombative herbivore uses its natural weapons as a secondary attack. Such attacks are made with a -5 penalty on the creature’s attack rolls, and the animal receives only ½ its Strength modifier as a damage adjustment.
Proficient with no armor unless trained for war.
Animals eat, sleep, and breathe.

So I'm assuming this is in the monster manual.

Otherwise, what would be required to train the rhino for? Would training it for combat riding count?

Or would it just be easier if I granted the rhino feats for the extra hit dice it's getting as an animal companion and have it take armor proficency.

[Cog]

Or would it just be easier if I granted the rhino feats for the extra hit dice it's getting as an animal companion and have it take weapon proficency.
This would be easiest, as it should be getting those feats anyway. You want armor proficiency, not weapon proficiency, though.

[Gotterdammerung]

So I'm assuming this is in the monster manual.

Otherwise, what would be required to train the rhino for? Would training it for combat riding count?

As far as raw is concerned it is an unanswerable question. We know that trained for war is a thing. And we know it falls under the capability of handle animal easily. But there isn't a specific DC for it. And there is no material directly saying how to do it. There is only material saying that "trained for war" exists.

As a GM, deciding a DC for "trained for war" under handle animal is fine. Or using the "combat riding" existing DC is also fine. You could also decide that training a creature for war is more involved and force the player to rear the subject from infancy. These are all choices you can make that are reasonable.



Or would it just be easier if I granted the rhino feats for the extra hit dice it's getting as an animal companion and have it take weapon proficency.

An animal companion already gets feats for extra hit dice. So you don't need to grant them. And yes having the player just burn one of his animals feats for proficiency is an easy way to resolve the scenario.

There is also the option of buying barding with no armor check penalty. The non-proficiency penalty for armor with a -0 armor check penalty is a -0. There are special materials and even magical enhancements that lower armor check penalty.

So in a sense, this problem can be fixed by

-fleshing out the missing rules as a DM

- having the player use a feat resource

- or lastly, by having the player use his wealth.

[Coidzor]

Or would it just be easier if I granted the rhino feats for the extra hit dice it's getting as an animal companion and have it take armor proficency.

Considering it's supposed to be getting those feats anyway, yeah, probably.

I suppose really though you're just lucky that he doesn't want to give his Rhino Rhino Hide armor so he can have rhino hide on his rhino hide so he can rhino hide while he rhino hides.

[Sir_Thaddeus]

I suppose really though you're just lucky that he doesn't want to give his Rhino Rhino Hide armor so he can have rhino hide on his rhino hide so he can rhino hide while he rhino hides.

And train his rhino in the Hide skill. Rhino hide on a hiding rhino. And since the player is a Druid, he can easily add a few more iterations to this.

That said, I agree with those people suggesting using feats on armour proficiency; could cost a few feats that could be doing other things, yes, but still the simplest, least debatable solution to the problem.