Things you houserule in from 4th ed

[Sylthia]

This isn't a 4th ed bash topic.

Those of you who play 3.5 or PF, what are some things you like about 4th ed? I use the rule that a PC doesn't die until negative half their max HP. It scales better than a flat -10 and I like having a buffer that can put a PC down for the count, but not die.

[jedipilot24]

Shadar-Kai
more sensible racial heights
Short and Extended Rests
Action Points
streamlined skills
backgrounds

[soveliss24]

Better of two abilities to each save (from defenses in 4e). Str or Con to Fortitude, Dex or Int to Reflex, Wis or Cha to Will.

[Gazzien]

This isn't a 4th ed bash topic.

Those of you who play 3.5 or PF, what are some things you like about 4th ed? I use the rule that a PC doesn't die until negative half their max HP. It scales better than a flat -10 and I like having a buffer that can put a PC down for the count, but not die.

I like the epic destinies, but that's taken care of by RAW :P
Yay for online!

[Urpriest]

Shadar-Kai

What's the problem with 3.5's Shadar-Kai?

[NotScaryBats]

I like the points of light fluff.

[ArcturusV]

The combining and streamlining of skills. Yes I know PF does that, or have heard it. Though I don't have PF. Having fewer skills with wider applications allows for more fluid gaming I find. And allows you to have players do "neat" stuff more often, and having the general skill basis where you aren't required to heavily invest to be useful, and more out of combat utility even if you are a mundane character.

[JoshuaZ]

The combining and streamlining of skills. Yes I know PF does that, or have heard it. Though I don't have PF. Having fewer skills with wider applications allows for more fluid gaming I find. And allows you to have players do "neat" stuff more often, and having the general skill basis where you aren't required to heavily invest to be useful, and more out of combat utility even if you are a mundane character.

PF is available at d20pfsrd.com

My example: Bloodied. It is really helpful for players (and enemies) to have some idea how injured an opponent is.

[icthenue]

Two things:

1. Bloodied - Easy way to let everyone know how low the big bad is without being too meta.

2. Minions - Swarms of hard hitting, but weak to the point of one shot kills helps me keep adventurers on their toes while making them still feel stronger than your average joe, especially if I don't make it very obvious which ones are minions.

[Alienist]

Healing surges spreads the healbot role to everyone, making them responsible for managing their own healing.

Balance between casters and mundanes. Which is to say, fighters get cool stuff too.

Feats are better balanced too.

I like the way they do rituals, I just wish they weren't so darned expensive.

Their crafting rules are better, even though they're more restricted. (PF probably has a best of both worlds thing going for it here)

Skills matter a lot more (which simply is a side effect of removing the caster's "I win" button)

They fixed two handers, making other melee builds viable.

Races are more balanced.

[Kazyan]

Our group is a little metagamey and has shifting DMs, and we've collectively adopted "bloodied".

[Zeb]

1. Bloodied - Easy way to let everyone know how low the big bad is without being too meta.

2. Minions - Swarms of hard hitting, but weak to the point of one shot kills helps me keep adventurers on their toes while making them still feel stronger than your average joe, especially if I don't make it very obvious which ones are minions.

+1

Nothing like a large group to make the PCs respect numbers even in 75% are just minions

[Sylthia]

I forgot about minions. I use the idea a lot, if not a true 1 HP NPC. I often want to have large battles, but if each enemy had its by-the-book HP, it would take a while, and I don't want to nerf their Con, since it would mess up the Fort save. So, "A dozen archers (with 20 HP, instead of 50) ambush you" can be a balanced fight and not a TPK where it's not intended to be.

[Metahuman1]

I personally like the better of two ability's to a save. Helps with MAD and SAD issues.

Minions is a cool concept.

Some of the fluff was cool.

[Sylthia]

I've heard MAD, but what is SAD? Single Ability score Dependent? How is that a bad thing?

[Arcanist]

In my FR games I impose a rule that makes magic impeded (post Spellplague) :smallbiggrin:

[ArcturusV]

Spellplague Encounter Campaign for 4th edition... so painful... so stupid... *shudders in PTSD over it*

[Dimers]

I'm pretty fond of the [W]s for weapons. Of course, that's hard to bring in to anything besides ToB without heavy houseruling, because [W]s are so closely related to powers. But if you find a way, [W]s are a more balanced and sensible way to scale weapon-based effects than the flat bonuses available in normal 3.X.

[Coidzor]

I'm pretty fond of the [W]s for weapons. Of course, that's hard to bring in to anything besides ToB without heavy houseruling, because [W]s are so closely related to powers. But if you find a way, [W]s are a more balanced and sensible way to scale weapon-based effects than the flat bonuses available in normal 3.X.

I'm rusty here, what does [W] stand for again?

[Venger]

I've heard MAD, but what is SAD? Single Ability score Dependent? How is that a bad thing?

yes, it is single ability dependent. it's not a bad thing. the "problem" as it were is that it's a good thing.

if one player rolls paladin, for example, they need good scores in str, con, wis, and cha (or not cha if they burn a feat on serentiy) with a non-negative dex and a decent int sinc they are expected by the game to skills

compare to druid, for example, who doesn't care about str or dex because wildshape, invests normal points into con as any living character does and just pumps wis.

assuming you use a point buy in the interests of fairness, one player is at a distinct advantage compared to the other. druid can dump everything but wis essentially but pally (and monks, rogues, etc) can't.

that's the problem with SAD

[Dimers]

I'm rusty here, what does [W] stand for again?

Powers that use weapons (as opposed to magical implements) deal damage in multiples of a value based on the weapon. If Attack Power X has a damage rating of 3[W], you deal 3d12 using a greatsword and only 3d4 with a dagger. This provides another way to differentiate various fighting styles, special abilities, class abilities and so on. For example, rogues get lots of bonus damage, more than any other striker ... but their weapon powers require them to use ittybitty weapons, so their base damage doesn't make them overpowered. The THF fighter can dish out substantially more hurtin' than the sword-n-board because two-handed weapons have higher [W]s, but she loses a hefty defense bonus at the same time. And so on.

[Coidzor]

Powers that use weapons (as opposed to magical implements) deal damage in multiples of a value based on the weapon. If Attack Power X has a damage rating of 3[W], you deal 3d12 using a greatsword and only 3d4 with a dagger. This provides another way to differentiate various fighting styles, special abilities, class abilities and so on. For example, rogues get lots of bonus damage, more than any other striker ... but their weapon powers require them to use ittybitty weapons, so their base damage doesn't make them overpowered. The THF fighter can dish out substantially more hurtin' than the sword-n-board because two-handed weapons have higher [W]s, but she loses a hefty defense bonus at the same time. And so on.

Ahh, yeah, I remember now, that was one of the things I'd thought about tinkering with back when I was exploring 4e. That and the starting HP being the constitution score plus some bonus based on the class/type of HD.

Never did make up my mind whether I was for or against backporting the Non-AC Defenses > Saves dual-stat linkages though.

[Ashtagon]

Shadar-Kai
more sensible racial heights
Short and Extended Rests
Action Points
streamlined skills
backgrounds

Short and extended rests existed in 3.5, except extended rest was called a good night's sleep, and short rest was ToB's five-minute rest.

Action points existed in 3.5 (Eberron, SRD, and d20 Modern).

Backgrounds existed in d20 Modern (as occupations), although I'm not sure if the mechanics are the same as 4e style backgrounds.

You got me on the others.

[Norin]

In my FR games I impose a rule that makes magic impeded (post Spellplague) :smallbiggrin:

How, if you do not mind me asking?

[Tsriel]

This isn't a 4th ed bash topic.

Those of you who play 3.5 or PF, what are some things you like about 4th ed? I use the rule that a PC doesn't die until negative half their max HP. It scales better than a flat -10 and I like having a buffer that can put a PC down for the count, but not die.

I allow my players to take 2 attribute points instead of 1 every four levels. I balance this by restricting items that give flat stat enhancements to rare frequency.

Action Points: because every player has that "oh ****" moment. I only give them out for excellent play though.