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Mr Tumnus
2013-03-04, 05:24 PM
List of the legal 3.5 summon monsters sorted by hit dice. I just got polymorph and was wondering what kind of crazy shenanigans I could get myself into and wanted a comprehensive list of all the hit dice available so I made one.

I can only do up to about SM IV-SM V right now, I'll get the rest of the list down when I can.

Summon Monster 1


Hit Dice
Creature Name
Source


1
Celestial Badger
SRD


1
Celestial Dog
SRD


1
Celestial Owl
SRD


1
Celestial Giant Fire Beetle
SRD


1
Celestial Monkey
SRD


2
Celestial Porpoise
SRD


1
Elysian Thrushx
PLH 118


1
Fiendish Dire Rat
SRD


>1
Fiendish Hawk
SRD


1
Fiendish Monstrous Centipede, Medium
SRD


1
Fiendish Monstrous Crab, Small
SW 141


1
Fiendish Monstrous Diving Spider, Small
SW 169


1
Fiendish Monstrous Scorpion, Small
SRD


1
Fiendish Monstrous Spider, Small
SRD


2
Fiendish Octopus
SRD


>1
Fiendish Raven
SRD


1
Fiendish Sea Snake, Small
SW 170


1
Fiendish Snake, Small Viper
SRD



Summon Monster 2


Hit Dice
Creature Name
Source


2
Celestial Bombardier Beetle
SRD


1
Celestial Eagle
SRD


3
Celestial Giant Bee
SRD


2
Celestial Riding Dog
SRD


1
Clockwork Mender
MMIV


2
Devil Lemure
SRD


2
Fetid Fungus
MMV 56


3
Fiendish Monstrous Centipede, Large
SRD


3
Fiendish Monstrous Crab, Medium
SW 141


2
Fiendish Monstrous Diving Spider, Medium
SW 169


2
Fiendish Monstrous Scorpion, Medium
SRD


2
Fiendish Monstrous Spider, Medium
SRD


2
Fiendish Sea Snake, Medium
SW 170


2
Fiendish Snake, Medium Viper
SRD


3
Fiendish Squid
SRD


2
Fiendish Wolf
SRD


2
Howler Wasp
MMIV 74


2
Kaorti
FF 108


1
Nerra, Varoot
FF 130



Summon Monster 3


Hit Dice
Creature Name
Source


2
Bacchae
FF 18


3
Bauriau
BoED 165


3
Celestial Black Bear
SRD


5
Celestial Bison
SRD


3
Celestial Dire Badger
SRD


3
Celestial Hippogriff
SRD


2
Demon, Dretch
SRD


4
Demon, Nashrou
MMIV 44


2
Eladrin, Coure
BoED 168


2
Elemental, Small
SRD


4
Fiendish Ape
SRD


3
Fiendish Boar
SRD


3
Fiendish Crocodile
SRD


4
Fiendish Dire Bat
SRD


3
Fiendish Dire Weasel
SRD


6
Fiendish Monstrous Centipede, Huge
SRD


3
Fiendish Sea Snake, Large
SW 170


3
Fiendish Snake, Constrictor
SRD


3
Fiendish Snake, Large Viper
SRD


2
Guardinal, Musteval
BoED 174


4
Hell Hound
SRD


1
Kalabon
FC2 120


1
Windrazor
FF 130



Summon Monster 4


Hit Dice
Creature Name
Source


4
Abishai, White
FC2 110


3
Aoa Droplet
FF 15


8
Arcadian Avenger
MMV 8


1
Archon, Lantern
SRD


4
Celestial Giant Eagle
SRD


4
Celestial Giant Owl
SRD


5
Celestial Lion
SRD


3
Demon, Carnage
MMV 22


4
Demon, Gadacro
MMV 26


4
Demon, Skulvyn
FF 55


3
Elemental Grue
CAr 153


6
Fiendish Dire Eel
SW 148


6
Fiendish Dire Wolf
SRD


4
Fiendish Giant Praying Mantis
SRD


5
Fiendish Giant Wasp
SRD


4
Fiendish Monstrous Diving Spider, Large
SW 169


4
Fiendish Monstrous Spider, Large
SRD


6
Fiendish Sea Snake, Huge
SW 170


7
Fiendish Shark, Large
SRD


6
Fiendish Snake, Huge Viper
SRD


4
Guardinal, Cervidal
MMII 42


6
Howler
SRD


4
Imp, Bloodbag
FF 98


4
Imp, Euphoric
FF 99


2
Imp, Filth
FF 100


3
Mephit
SRD


3
Mephit, Glass
Sa 75


3
Mephit, Sulfur
Sa 76


3
Nerra, Kalareem
FF 128


6
Nightmare, Lesser
PLH 127


5
Rhek
BoED 181


3
Spined Devil
FC2 136


2
Storm Elemental, Small
MMIII 48


3
Yeth Hound
SRD


4
Yugoloth, Skeroloth
FF 197


5
Yugoloth, Voor
MMIV 193


4
Wrackspawn
MMIV 182



Summon Monster 5


Hit Dice
Creature Name
Source


5
Abshai, Black
FC2 109


6
Achaierai
SRD


6
Archon, Hound
SRD


6
Celestial Brown Bear
SRD


7
Celestial Giant Stag Beetle
SRD


7
Celestial Griffon
SRD


6
Celestial Sea Cat
SRD


6
Devil, Bearded
SRD


5
Dwarf Ancestor
MMIV


4
Elemental, Medium
SRD


5
Energon, Any
PLH 119


4
Fiendish Deionychus
SRD


5
Fiendish Dire Ape
SRD


8
Fiendish Dire Barracuda
SW 147


7
Fiendish Dire Boar
SRD


5
Fiendish Dire Wolverine
SRD


7
Fiendish Giant Crocodile
SRD


5
Fiendish Monstrous Crab, Large
SW 141


5
Fiendish Monstrous Scorpion, Large
SRD


10
Fiendish Shark, Huge
SRD


6
Fiendish Tiger
SRD


6
Leskylor
BoED 177


4
Shadow Mastiff
SRD

HalfQuart
2013-03-05, 09:24 PM
Nice. There is some existing stuff out there already.. not sure if you're already aware. I recommend this page about Valgrim the Summoner (http://geek-related.com/session-summaries/rise-of-the-runelords/valgrim-the-summoner/). I especially like the link he's got to the Summonable Monster Stats Cheat Sheet (http://www.mindspring.com/~ernestm/summoning/Summonable%20Monsters.xls) -- it's an Excel file with lots of useful details split up with each Summon Monster version on a separate worksheet.

Flickerdart
2013-03-05, 09:27 PM
What does being able to cast polymorph have to do with summon monster spells?

Jack_Simth
2013-03-05, 09:35 PM
By any chance are you making use of Imbued Summoning? - Nevermind; that's limited to 3rd level or lower spells. Hmm.

What does being able to cast polymorph have to do with summon monster spells?
He's planning on casting Polymorph on his Summoned minions, to turn them into something more useful, obviously. That Feindish Giant Crocodile from Summon Monster V could be a seven-headed hydra, instead.

Flickerdart
2013-03-05, 09:36 PM
Two spell slots just to get a mediocre minion seems really inefficient to me.

Jack_Simth
2013-03-05, 09:38 PM
Two spell slots just to get a mediocre minion seems really inefficient to me.
Just because something isn't optimal doesn't mean it's not cool. If he's got some way to do the Polymorph as the beast is appearing, he'll have people scratching their heads on how he's getting these beasties.

Mr Tumnus
2013-03-06, 09:05 PM
By any chance are you making use of Imbued Summoning? - Nevermind; that's limited to 3rd level or lower spells. Hmm.

He's planning on casting Polymorph on his Summoned minions, to turn them into something more useful, obviously. That Feindish Giant Crocodile from Summon Monster V could be a seven-headed hydra, instead.

That's exactly what I wanted to do.


Two spell slots just to get a mediocre minion seems really inefficient to me.

Never said it was optimized, just having fun with some cheesy spells.

Deaxsa
2013-03-06, 09:15 PM
Player: I summon a fiendish dire shark!
DM: .... You're on land...
Player: I know!
DM: ...ok.... it's flopping around... 17 rounds til it dies...
*next round*
Player: 16 now! i cast polymorph! It's a 10-headed hydra now!
DM: ..... are you kidding me? *facepalm*


^ how it wold work

Mr Tumnus
2013-03-14, 03:01 PM
Player: I summon a fiendish dire shark!
DM: .... You're on land...
Player: I know!
DM: ...ok.... it's flopping around... 17 rounds til it dies...
*next round*
Player: 16 now! i cast polymorph! It's a 10-headed hydra now!
DM: ..... are you kidding me? *facepalm*


^ how it wold work

I know you're being sarcastic but what's wrong with playing around with magic? Also, you can't actually summon a creature into an environment that cannot support it. Fish onto dry land, rhino underwater, etc.

Fouredged Sword
2013-03-14, 03:11 PM
Actually the shark is able to be supported by the air environment for longer than the duration of it's summon until you hit level 17. That is a strong argument that it CAN be summoned onto land to flop around.

HalfQuart
2013-03-14, 03:18 PM
Actually the shark is able to be supported by the air environment for longer than the duration of it's summon until you hit level 17. That is a strong argument that it CAN be summoned onto land to flop around.
Actually, the note on the table for the aquatic summons is somewhat more specific than the text of the spell. It says:

May be summoned only into an aquatic or watery environment.
You might argue that the description trumps the table, but in this case I think the table is just providing additional detail to support the meaning of the description.

killem2
2013-03-14, 07:26 PM
By any chance are you making use of Imbued Summoning? - Nevermind; that's limited to 3rd level or lower spells. Hmm.

He's planning on casting Polymorph on his Summoned minions, to turn them into something more useful, obviously. That Feindish Giant Crocodile from Summon Monster V could be a seven-headed hydra, instead.

I would take the crocs in this case, but it wouldbe fun to turn those left over sm1s, into humanoids and get aid another from them all :D

Lonely Tylenol
2013-03-15, 12:43 PM
By any chance are you making use of Imbued Summoning? - Nevermind; that's limited to 3rd level or lower spells. Hmm.

He's planning on casting Polymorph on his Summoned minions, to turn them into something more useful, obviously. That Feindish Giant Crocodile from Summon Monster V could be a seven-headed hydra, instead.

Or, as I just learned five minutes ago, that Arcadian Avenger from Summon Monster IV could be an 8-headed hydra. :smallcool:

Pretty sure the end game here is to Incantatrix up these spells so that you're shooting out persisted Summon Monster eye beams so that you can have a Dragonite Oppa whatever the Hell you please for the day. But then, I'm privy to knowledge that you all aren't, here. :smalltongue: In any case, this list could also be useful for knowing which summons to use if you want to avoid the ill effects of HD-dependent spells and the like. For instance, I know that I want a Celestial Bison if I want something that can just eat through Color Spray and Sleep. For low-level summons, Hit Dice are also a valuable commodity, since spell-like abilities are precious and few, and so you're going to want the biggest, beefiest thing with the highest attack bonus for those spell slots, and Hit Dice offers all of those things.

nedz
2013-03-15, 12:57 PM
For low-level summons, Hit Dice are also a valuable commodity, since spell-like abilities are precious and few, and so you're going to want the biggest, beefiest thing with the highest attack bonus for those spell slots, and Hit Dice offers all of those things.

Not all HD are created equal, but it is an important consideration.


Actually the shark is able to be supported by the air environment for longer than the duration of it's summon until you hit level 17. That is a strong argument that it CAN be summoned onto land to flop around.


Quickened Summon Water
Greater Arcane Fusion (Summon Monster X, Polymorph) — summon shark
Augment and Imbue
Profit

Unusual Muse
2013-03-15, 01:06 PM
Two spell slots just to get a mediocre minion seems really inefficient to me.

The main benefit I see here is that if the wizard turns into a hydra it still has wizard hit points, whereas if the wizard summons a beefy high-HP critter and turns it into a hydra, it's going to last longer.

Flickerdart
2013-03-15, 02:10 PM
The main benefit I see here is that if the wizard turns into a hydra it still has wizard hit points, whereas if the wizard summons a beefy high-HP critter and turns it into a hydra, it's going to last longer.
Yeah, but two rounds in (one to summon and one to buff) it's very rarely going to matter, since most encounters are almost over by then.

If you use an Imbued Summon Monster combined with Rapid Summoning and Sanctum Polymorph then it doesn't suck anymore, but anything that needs to cheese out Sanctum to work isn't really kosher in most games.

Lonely Tylenol
2013-03-15, 03:24 PM
Yeah, but two rounds in (one to summon and one to buff) it's very rarely going to matter, since most encounters are almost over by then.

If you use an Imbued Summon Monster combined with Rapid Summoning and Sanctum Polymorph then it doesn't suck anymore, but anything that needs to cheese out Sanctum to work isn't really kosher in most games.

Ocular Summon Monsters can be Persisted.

Fouredged Sword
2013-03-15, 03:25 PM
I shoot sharks out of my EYEESSSSS!!!!!!

Flickerdart
2013-03-15, 04:29 PM
Ocular Summon Monsters can be Persisted.
Summon Monster can't be made Ocular because "only ray spells and spells with a target other than personal can be cast as ocular spells" and Summon Monster is not a targeted spell.

Mr Tumnus
2013-03-15, 09:44 PM
Summon Monster can't be made Ocular because "only ray spells and spells with a target other than personal can be cast as ocular spells" and Summon Monster is not a targeted spell.

Summon Monster Isn't Personal

Flickerdart
2013-03-15, 09:46 PM
Summon Monster Isn't Personal
No part of my post suggested that it was. Summon Monster is not a spell with a target, therefore it does not qualify for the statement "spell with a target other than personal".

Lonely Tylenol
2013-03-15, 10:53 PM
Summon Monster can't be made Ocular because "only ray spells and spells with a target other than personal can be cast as ocular spells" and Summon Monster is not a targeted spell.

I must have missed this. Why it is three sentences separate from the other qualifying language at the beginning of the feat, however, is beyond me.

Flickerdart
2013-03-16, 12:16 AM
I must have missed this. Why it is three sentences separate from the other qualifying language at the beginning of the feat, however, is beyond me.
Because WotC's policy towards editing is "lol, what's that?".

Jack_Simth
2013-03-16, 12:41 AM
Because WotC's policy towards editing is "lol, what's that?".
More like "Must get it to press! We'll issue errata for the bad stuff if enough people complain."

Of course, then there's the infamous daWizard (http://everything2.com/title/DaWizard).

Lonely Tylenol
2013-03-16, 02:42 AM
Because WotC's policy towards editing is "lol, what's that?".

You're right, of course. I don't know how this manages to still surprise me.


More like "Must get it to press! We'll issue errata for the bad stuff if enough people complain."

Of course, then there's the infamous daWizard (http://everything2.com/title/DaWizard).

Hey, don't laugh. "DaWizard" is something you hear a lot of among the local groups here in Hawai'i. :smallbiggrin:

Of course, now I'll wonder if they're talking about damage or Wizards... :smallconfused: