Benefits of nonlethal damage.

[Elric VIII]

Without going for any of that BoED over-the-top-good stuff, what benefits exist for a character that wants to focus on nonlethal damage/not killing?

For example, are there any feats that augment damage or provide additional options or abilities?

[kardar233]

A Justiciar from CW can deal nonlethal damage with no attack penalty, gets a slightly slow nonlethal Sneak Attack progression and can deal 1 point of Strength damage whenever they strike with nonlethal damage. That's a good start. Check the Iron Chef challenge with Justiciar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=255215) for ideas.

[Frozen_Feet]

Unarmed strikes are easy to switch between non-lethal and lethal damage with. Consider unarmed / grappling-focused build.

[panaikhan]

My Warforged Juggernaut has a weapon that is Vicious and Merciful.

[Chilingsworth]

My Warforged Juggernaut has a weapon that is Vicious and Merciful.

So... it deals an extra 4d6 damge, with all damage being nonlethal. Plus 1d6 nonlethal damage to you, to which you're immune. Is that right?

[Firest Kathon]

My Warforged Juggernaut has a weapon that is Vicious and Merciful.
To expand on the post, the merciful enchantment (for a +1 cost) for weapons makes them deal +1d6 damage, and all that damage is nonlethal. You can switch it of to deal lethal damage with the weapon, but then you don't get the +1d6, of course.
Sources: D20 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#merciful), PF (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-weapons/magic-weapon-special-abilities/merciful)

[Daftendirekt]

My Warforged Juggernaut has a weapon that is Vicious and Merciful.


So... it deals an extra 4d6 damge, with all damage being nonlethal. Plus 1d6 nonlethal damage to you, to which you're immune. Is that right?

That is a pretty wicked combo for somebody going the non-lethal route. Nice.

[panaikhan]

So... it deals an extra 4d6 damge, with all damage being nonlethal. Plus 1d6 nonlethal damage to you, to which you're immune. Is that right?

Yup. Indeed it is. It's also a custom Weapon Familiar (articulated tail with a Morning Star on the end, taking up the Belt Slot)

[Gwazi Magnum]

How to increase it I would like to know myself.

Advice and Pro's on non-lethal however would be...

1. Monks unarmed is non-lethal if you wish, and that eventually builds up to 2d10

2. No enemies die? Lots of hostages, NPCs view you as merciful

[Vaz]

Enemies are helpless while Unconcious. You can stack up Nonelethal damage easily, and then quickly bind them for whatever naughty ritual you desire.

Perhaps an Army of Intellect Devourers?

[gorfnab]

A Rogue with a non-lethal weapon (such as a sap) deals non-lethal sneak attack.

Shadowcaster has a few mysteries that deal non-lethal damage.

[Venger]

when you're fighting creatures with death throes, such as a balor, bonking the hell out of him with a lot of nonlethal damage will let you KO him, take his whip and sword (and whatever other stuff), retreat to beyond his death throes range, and blow him up from a safe distance


So... it deals an extra 4d6 damge, with all damage being nonlethal. Plus 1d6 nonlethal damage to you, to which you're immune. Is that right?

how are you getting 3d6? vicious adds 2d6, merciful adds 1d6, where's the last one coming from?

[Chilingsworth]

how are you getting 4d6? vicious adds 2d6, merciful adds 1d6, where's the last one coming from?

I thought merciful added 2d6. :smallredface:

[The Viscount]

The other advantage of nonlethal damage is things that grant extra nonlethal aren't afraid to give you healthy amounts because you can't kill someone. For example, nightmare spinner gets to add 1d6 nonlethal for every fear stage you advance someone

[Slipperychicken]

If you have a good Intimidate and Sense Motive check, torture (as described in BoVD) is a surprisingly good way to grab information when your brain-scanning magic isn't available. Also doesn't have the limitations of Speak With Dead. Obviously, nonlethal damage is useful for taking your victim alive, as it's more difficult to interrogate a corpse.

[Elric VIII]

These are some good options, but most of them rely on certain classes. Are there any options that may be added to a character that already has his build worked out?

[Gwazi Magnum]

These are some good options, but most of them rely on certain classes. Are there any options that may be added to a character that already has his build worked out?

Enchant a weapon with mercy

[Greenish]

Enchant a weapon with mercyOr, if you're poor, get a weapon that deals non-lethal damage, like sap or truncheon.

[Big Fau]

There's a PrC in Dragonmarked that combines nonlethal damage and fear stacking. It's really quite good, but the name escapes me ATM.

[Darius Kane]

Subduing Strike will let you use any melee weapon you want to deal non-lethal.

[Greenish]

There's a PrC in Dragonmarked that combines nonlethal damage and fear stacking. It's really quite good, but the name escapes me ATM.Deneith Warden.

[Mirakk]

I know you said no BoED over the top good stuff, but the feat Nonlethal Substitution is in BoED and is not an exalted feat. It's a vanilla metamagic feat that anyone can take regardless of alignment.

Nonlethal Fireball? Yup, that just happened.


The feat is worth mentioning.

[Venger]

I know you said no BoED over the top good stuff, but the feat Nonlethal Substitution is in BoED and is not an exalted feat. It's a vanilla metamagic feat that anyone can take regardless of alignment.

Nonlethal Fireball? Yup, that just happened.


The feat is worth mentioning.

for LA+1, the feat's usefulnes is... debatable, but it can still be fun

[Elric VIII]

I know you said no BoED over the top good stuff, but the feat Nonlethal Substitution is in BoED and is not an exalted feat. It's a vanilla metamagic feat that anyone can take regardless of alignment.

Nonlethal Fireball? Yup, that just happened.


The feat is worth mentioning.

Mostly I'm just saying I don't want VoNV or VoPe.

Although it seems that there is a decided lack of feat support for this type of thing. Thanks anyway.

[Alaris]

In regards to "Nonlethal Substitition," There's actually a version of the feat that doesn't raise the spell level. However, it is restricted by energy type (you choose an energy type when you choose the feat, and you can make any spell of that type nonlethal).

http://dndtools.eu/feats/tome-and-blood-a-guidebook-to-wizards-and-sorcerers--51/subdual-substitution--2807/

Technically 3.0 I think...

[zlefin]

there's a pathfinder feat that lets you make a free intimidate check whenever you deal nonlethal damage with a melee weapon.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/enforcer-combat

[Venger]

In regards to "Nonlethal Substitition," There's actually a version of the feat that doesn't raise the spell level. However, it is restricted by energy type (you choose an energy type when you choose the feat, and you can make any spell of that type nonlethal).

http://dndtools.eu/feats/tome-and-blood-a-guidebook-to-wizards-and-sorcerers--51/subdual-substitution--2807/

Technically 3.0 I think...

they're different enough that I'd allow this one at my table instead of saying that the 3.5 one superceded it entirely.

tome and blood is indeed 3.0. complete arcane, where nonlethal substitution is reprinted, was intended as its replacement, featuring predominantly pasta of its content with a few changes here and there, and the odd omission (we'll miss you candlecaster!)

[Metahuman1]

If the DM makes you fight a member of your clan in an OA game, and you used nonlethal damage to subdue him after he refused to identify himself too you by name, you don't get back to the capitol city and find out the member of your clan was in fact your Daimyo's second youngest son.



A DM did that too me once, except the party killed him and my character got put on suicide first charge duty when war broke out next session.

[Elric VIII]

there's a pathfinder feat that lets you make a free intimidate check whenever you deal nonlethal damage with a melee weapon.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/enforcer-combat

Now that's getting somewhere. Thank you.

[Norin]

Also the spells Whelm and Whelm, mass if you can use casting.

[Greenish]

A good barrister could probably argue that the use of non-lethal damage dealing spells fall under assault under the Code of Galifar (as "spells that incapacitate a target"), instead of armed assault (as spells that "inflict physical damage on another being").

So that's one advantage of non-lethal damage.

[Venger]

Also the spells Whelm and Whelm, mass if you can use casting.

inevitable defeat is also a pretty good spell