Sly Cooper Base class 3.5 (WIP)

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Cooper

http://th07.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/f/2011/158/0/0/sly_cooper___thieves_in_time_by_benji_xd-d3i9mt5.jpg

Alignment
Any Chaotic

Hit Die
d6.

Class Skills
A Cooper's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disable Device (Int), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (local) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Open Lock (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Tumble (Dex), Use Magic Device (Cha), and Use Rope (Dex).

Skill Points at 1st Level
(8 + Int modifier) ×4.

Skill Points at Each Additional Level
8 + Int modifier.



Level
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Special
AC Bonus


1st
+0
+0
+2
+0
The Cane, Sneak Attack +1d6, Take-down Slam
+0


2nd
+1
+0
+3
+0
Evasion, Smoke Bomb
+0


3rd
+2
+1
+3
+1
Sneak Attack +2d6
+0


4th
+3
+1
+4
+1
Uncanny Dodge, Combat dodge
+1


5th
+3
+1
+4
+1
Sneak Attack +3d6, Voltage Attack
+1


6th
+4
+2
+5
+2
Rail Balance, Rocket Boots
+1


7th
+5
+2
+5
+2
Sneak Attack +4d6, Decoy
+1


8th
+6/+1
+2
+6
+2
Improved Uncanny Dodge, Thief Reflexes
+2


9th
+6/+1
+3
+6
+3
Sneak Attack +5d6, Silent Obliteration
+2


10th
+7/+2
+3
+7
+3
Improved Evasion, Mega Jump
+2


11th
+8/+3
+3
+7
+3
Sneak Attack +6d6, Paraglider
+2


12th
+9/+4
+4
+8
+4
Shadow Form
+3


13th
+9/+4
+4
+8
+4
Sneak Attack +7d6
+3


14th
+10/+5
+4
+9
+4
Slippery Mind
+3


15th
+11/+6/+1
+5
+9
+5
Sneak Attack 8d6, Improved Shadow Form
+3


16th
+12/+7/+2
+5
+10
+5
Lightning Spin
+4


17th
+12/+7/+2
+5
+10
+5
Sneak Attack +9d6
+4


18th
+13/+8/+3
+6
+11
+6
One With Shadow
+4


19th
+14/+9/+4
+6
+11
+6
Sneak Attack +10d6
+4


20th
+15/+10/+5
+6
+12
+6
Thieving Legend
+5


Class Features
All of the following are class features of a Cooper
Weapon and Armor Proficiency
Coopers are proficient with all simple weapons and his chosen Cane. Coopers are not proficient with any armor or shields.

AC Bonus (Ex)
When unarmored and unencumbered, the Cooper adds his Charisma bonus (if any) to his AC. In addition, a Cooper gains a +1 bonus to AC at 4th level. This bonus increases by 1 for every four Cooper levels thereafter (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, and +5 at 20th level).

These bonuses to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the Cooper is flat-footed. He loses these bonuses when he is immobilized or helpless, when he wears any armor, when he carries a shield, or when he carries a medium or heavy load.

The Cane
At 1st level the Cooper chooses a weapon, that weapon becomes the Cooper's Cane, and gains a hook attachment. If the Cooper chooses a light weapon he may make a second weapon of the same type, his cane as well. All other creatures treat the weapon as if they were non-proficient and take a -8 penalty to attack. The Hook attachment allows the wielder to make trip and disarm attempts while attacking. If the Cooper chooses a ranged weapon as his Cane, he may still make trip and disarm attempts while attacking, but only if the intended target is withing 30'.
Additionally while wielding his Cane a Cooper gains the feats Improved Trip and Improved Disarm even if he doesn't meet the prerequisites for them.

Sneak Attack
If a Cooper can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from his attack, he can strike a vital spot for extra damage.

A Cooper’s attack deals extra damage any time his target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when a Cooper flanks his target. This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and it increases by 1d6 every two Cooper levels thereafter. Should A Cooper score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied.

Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet.

He can use a weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, without the usual -4 penalty.

A Cooper can sneak attack only living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks. A Cooper must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. A Cooper cannot sneak attack while striking a creature with concealment or striking the limbs of a creature whose vitals are beyond reach.

Take-down Slam (Ex)
When the Cooper would make a sneak attack with his chosen Cane, he can do so as a full round action to add a number of d6s equal to his Cooper level to his damage dice. This extra damage stacks with the damage gained from sneak attack. Doing this causes a loud noise that alerts all creatures within (10ft perbonus d6s done) to his presence, provided they can hear.

Evasion (Ex)
At 2nd level and higher, a Cooper can avoid even magical and unusual attacks with great agility. If he makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, he instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if the Cooper is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless Cooper does not gain the benefit of evasion.

Smoke Bomb (Sp)
A 2nd level Cooper gains Fog Cloud as a spell-like ability, usable a number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier. He must be holding his Cane to use this ability.

Uncanny Dodge (Ex)
Starting at 4th level, a Cooper can react to danger before his senses would normally allow him to do so. He retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized.

If a Cooper already has uncanny dodge from a different class he automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

Combat Dodge (Ex)
When an opponent attacks a 4th level Cooper and misses, the Cooper may take a 5' step without provoking an attack of opportunity.

Voltage Attack (Ex)
A 5th level Cooper can electrically charge his chosen Cane as a swift action, causing it to deal extra electricity damage on a successful hit. This damage starts at 1d6 at 5th level and increasing by 1d6 every five levels after. On a critical hit, the damage dice are changed to d10s. He may do this a number of times per day equal to his Cooper level. This effect lasts indefinitely, but ends when the Cane touches any creature besides the Cooper.

Rail Balance
A 6th level Cooper can take 10 on an any balance check involving a narrow surface, and is not considered flat-footed while balancing. He may also add his class level to his balance check.

Rocket Boots (Ex)
A 6th level Cooper gains the feat Run even if he doesn't meet the prerequisites for it. He can also move his full speed while Moving Silently without taking the normal -5 penalty. He may also move a twice his normal speed as a move action, a number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier.

Decoy (Sp)
A 7nd level Cooper gains Major Image as a spell-like ability, usable a number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier. He must be holding his Cane to use this ability.

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex)
A Cooper of 8th level or higher can no longer be flanked.

This defense denies any class with sneak attack the ability to sneak attack the character by flanking him, unless the attacker has at least four more levels in a class with sneak attack than the target does.

If a character already has uncanny dodge from a second class, the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead, and the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum class level required to flank the character.

Thief Reflexes (Sp)
At 8th level, while holding his chosen Cane, a Cooper can act as if affected by the spell Haste for a number of rounds per day equal to his Charisma modifier. These rounds need not be consecutive.

Silent Obliteration (Ex)
When a 9th level Cooper uses his Take-down Slam he may choose do so silently, and there by not alert those nearby to his presence. By do this he must forfeit his next turn's move action.

Improved Evasion (Ex)
This ability works like evasion, except that while the Cooper still takes no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks henceforth he takes only half damage on a failed save. A helpless Cooper does not gain the benefit of improved evasion.

Mega Jump (Ex)
A 10th level Cooper may use his Dexterity bonus instead of his Strength bonus on jump checks. He also adds his class level to his jump check.

Paraglider (Su)
An 11th level Cooper can cast Feather Fall as the spell at will. he must be wielding his cane to use this ability.

Shadow Form (Su)
While using his chosen Cane a 12th level Cooper can turn Invisible, as the spell, for a number of rounds per day equal to his Cooper level + his Charisma modifier. These rounds need not be consecutive. while invisible he may not do any strenuous action, and may only move at a speed of 10'.

Slippery Mind (Ex)
If a 14th level Cooper is affected by an enchantment spell or effect and fails his saving throw, he can attempt it again 1 round later at the same DC. He gets only this one extra chance to succeed on his saving throw.

Improved Shadow Form (Su)
At 15th level a Coopers Shadow Form improves. A Cooper can now remain invisble for a number of rounds equal to his Cooper level + his Charisma modifier, times two. These rounds need not be consecutive. The Cooper can act normally but cannot attack or activate offensive abilities. He may also take 10 on any hide check regardless of the circumstances.

Lightning Spin (Sp)
While a 16th level Cooper has his Voltage Attack active he may, as a full round action, make an attack at each creature within 5' at his full base attack bonus. The Voltage Attack damage is applied to each enemy hit this way. This ability is usable a number of time per day equal to his Dexterity score.

One With Shadow (Ex)
At 18th level a Cooper's Shadow Form Improves even further. The Cooper can remain invisible for a number of minutes per day equal to his Cooper level + his Charisma modifier. These rounds need not be consecutive. He may replenish a number of minutes equal to his Charisma modifier by meditating in complete darkness for one minute. He may now also attack and use offensive abilities. He may also give up a minute of Shadow Form to take 20 on a hide check regardless of the circumstances.

Thieving Legend (Ex)
"There's no honor, no challenge, no fun, in stealing from ordinary people. You rip off a master criminal, then you know you're a master thief."
At 20th level, the Cooper may only be noticed with mundane senses, which may require a Spot or Listen check. While See Invisibility and the like still allow creatures to see him in Shadow Form as if he were normally visible, the Cooper is invisible to magical detection--not even Mindsight or divinations reveal his presence. (If the Cooper has the now-obsolete Darkstalker feat, he may change it to one other feat he qualifies for.)

In addition, if the Cooper leaves a personal and recognizable 'calling card' in place of an object he steals, all divinations that would reveal information about his heist automatically fail.

[ScrambledBrains]

First, let me get my thanks out of the way. As someone who adores the Sly Cooper games, this class, and your other projects, make me a very happy man. :smallbiggrin: Tell me, you have any plans to make base classes for Murray or Bently?

Now that that's out of the way, I feel I should mention that Improved Uncanny Dodge should say, 'This defense denies any class with sneak attack the ability to sneak attack the character by flanking him, unless the attacker has at least four more Cooper levels than the target does.'

Otherwise, looks good so far, and I'll be keeping a firm eye on this project. :smallsmile:

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

First, let me get my thanks out of the way. As someone who adores the Sly Cooper games, this class, and your other projects, make me a very happy man. :smallbiggrin: Tell me, you have any plans to make base classes for Murray or Bently?


well if this turns out good, then yes i will make classes for them.



Now that that's out of the way, I feel I should mention that Improved Uncanny Dodge should say, 'This defense denies any class with sneak attack the ability to sneak attack the character by flanking him, unless the attacker has at least four more Cooper levels than the target does.'

Otherwise, looks good so far, and I'll be keeping a firm eye on this project. :smallsmile:
thanks for that

[ScrambledBrains]

thanks for that

:smallsmile: You are welcome.

[ScrambledBrains]

Don't mean to double post, but found another Copy-Paste error. In your AC Bonus feature, you have it say Monk for the last paragraph, when it should be Cooper. :smallsmile:

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Don't mean to double post, but found another Copy-Paste error. In your AC Bonus feature, you have it say Monk for the last paragraph, when it should be Cooper. :smallsmile:
Got it, thanks again. But i still need a capstone ability. can you think of anything?

[ScrambledBrains]

Got it, thanks again. But i still need a capstone ability. can you think of anything?

Hmm...well, let's see:

You're captured Sly's use of gadgets through some of the abilities this class can use.

You have the iconic Cane as a feature that can be used to modify an existing weapon, which is awesome, and thematically appropriate.

He obviously has the stereotypical thief abilities he needs, plus the rail walking and other awesome things Sly does regularly...

And you've even made him pretty competent in a fight, at least partially, with sneak attack.

What would you be looking for in a capstone, exactly? Just so I know my advice makes sense.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Hmm...well, let's see:
What would you be looking for in a capstone, exactly? Just so I know my advice makes sense.

Well I already titled it "Thieving Legend"
I was going to go with something along the lines of he never ages, and gets massive stealth abilities. or somesuch

[ScrambledBrains]

Well I already titled it "Thieving Legend"
I was going to go with something along the lines of he never ages, and gets massive stealth abilities. or somesuch

Not sure about that. I mean, in the fourth game you have a Cooper who very clearly did age, to the point he retires from the business. The massive stealth abilites though, seem appropriate, but that seems a bit lacking by itself, as you probably noted.

Also, a couple quick side points/questions:

You never put in what Knockout Dive does, and it's still currently blank.

And lastly, what if a Cooper wants to put hooks on two weapons? Dual wielding is a common, though not precisely perfect, method of combat in 3.5, after all.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Not sure about that. I mean, in the fourth game you have a Cooper who very clearly did age, to the point he retires from the business. The massive stealth abilites though, seem appropriate, but that seems a bit lacking by itself, as you probably noted.

yes maybe more stealth and some combat abilities instead


Also, a couple quick side points/questions:

You never put in what Knockout Dive does, and it's still currently blank.

I'm not entirely sure how to make that function in-game


And lastly, what if a Cooper wants to put hooks on two weapons? Dual wielding is a common, though not precisely perfect, method of combat in 3.5, after all.
yes I see what you mean and i raise you it could be very easily abused.

[ScrambledBrains]

yes maybe more stealth and some combat abilities instead

Maybe you could crib something from one of the other stealth-based classes?(Rogue, Ninja, etc.)



I'm not entirely sure how to make that function in-game

Remind me, as I currently cannot turn on my PS3 and check, what does it do normally?


yes I see what you mean and i raise you it could be very easily abused.

Of course, of course. But, that point raised, it's both something with precident in the Sly Cooper series itself, and something that someone will eventually ask about doing in any playtesting/playing of this class. Better to either specify only one weapon can be cane-ified, or make the concession to dual wielders.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Maybe you could crib something from one of the other stealth-based classes?(Rogue, Ninja, etc.)

Remind me, as I currently cannot turn on my PS3 and check, what does it do normally?

"Sly dives into an enemy to knock them out while spinning his cane." quoted from the wiki.

Also since you have a PS3 and i do not i will guess you have played sly 4, i will also have to ask that you do not spoil anything for me, as i have not played it yet. BUT I WANT TO SOOOO MUCH.



Of course, of course. But, that point raised, it's both something with precident in the Sly Cooper series itself, and something that someone will eventually ask about doing in any playtesting/playing of this class. Better to either specify only one weapon can be cane-ified, or make the concession to dual wielders.
i guess i could make it work for only dual weilding light weapons...

[ScrambledBrains]

"Sly dives into an enemy to knock them out while spinning his cane." quoted from the wiki.

Some kind of charge or bull rush thing?


Also since you have a PS3 and i do not i will guess you have played sly 4, i will also have to ask that you do not spoil anything for me, as i have not played it yet. BUT I WANT TO SOOOO MUCH.

I won't. But the game is awesome. :smallbiggrin:


i guess i could make it work for only dual weilding light weapons...

That would be more than fair, I feel. :smallsmile:

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Some kind of charge or bull rush thing?


Yeah but its more of a jump



I won't. But the game is awesome. :smallbiggrin:



That would be more than fair, I feel. :smallsmile:

Did it!

[ScrambledBrains]

Yeah but its more of a jump

That does complicate things...maybe it's a charge that can be performed after jumping above an enemy?

If that doesn't work, you could always get rid of it and find another of Sly's abilites to place there instead.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

That does complicate things...maybe it's a charge that can be performed after jumping above an enemy?

If that doesn't work, you could always get rid of it and find another of Sly's abilites to place there instead.

well when you put it that way i guess it doesn't really need the ability

[ScrambledBrains]

well when you put it that way i guess it doesn't really need the ability

Why not add something relating to the Cooper's pickpocketing instead? Like a bonus to, and special ways to use, his Sleight of Hand skill?

[Kazyan]

Good stuff, here. I like it, so here's some input that might make it better. Everything I don't mention is peachy.


AC Bonus (Ex)
When unarmored and unencumbered, the Cooper adds his Wisdom bonus (if any) to his AC. In addition, a Cooper gains a +1 bonus to AC at 4th level. This bonus increases by 1 for every four Cooper levels thereafter (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, and +5 at 20th level).

These bonuses to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the Cooper is flat-footed. He loses these bonuses when he is immobilized or helpless, when he wears any armor, when he carries a shield, or when he carries a medium or heavy load.

Sly and his entire family strikes me as more of a Charisma sort of people. Perhaps you should key the various abilities off Cha instead of Wis--while I'm sure Sly had nonnegative modifiers for all three mental abilities, I think Wisdom was the lowest of the three. Thoughts? It's a good abilitity to model Sly's lack of armor, either way.


Take-down Slam (Ex)
When sneak attacking and holding his chosen cane, a Cooper may, as a full round action, add a number of d6s equal to his Cooper level to his damage dice.. Doing this causes a loud noise that alerts nearby creatures within 30' to his presence.

Full round action is a good balancer, but at the same time, it feels iffy. This is a lot of damage at low levels. On the other hand, it compares less and less favorably with just full-attacking at higher levels...this should probably be playtested. It might be fine as-is.

It should also be reworded slightly. RAW, you have to take that full round action in the middle of a sneak attack. How about this:

"Take-down Slam (Ex)
When the Cooper would make a sneak attack with his chosen Cane, he can do so as a full round action to add a number of d6s equal to his Cooper level to his damage dice. Doing this causes a loud noise that alerts nearby creatures within 30' to his presence, provided they can hear."

I'll point out that the Cooper is looking like a very nice one-level dip. I'm not exactly sure what I'd do with it, though...


Smoke Bomb (Sp)
While holding his chosen Cane a 2nd level Cooper can cast Fog Cloud on his position a number of times per day equal to his Cooper level + his Wisdom modifier.

I wouldn't go with "cast", since that implies a spellcasting mechanic. This is an SLA.

"Smoke Bomb (Sp)
A 2nd level Cooper gains Fog Cloud as a spell-like ability, useable a number of times per day equal to his Cooper level + his Wisdom modifier. He must be holding his Cane to use this ability."

Similarly, you can change Decoy.


Combat Dodge (Ex)
When a Cooper successfully dodges an attack made by an opponent he may take a 5' step without provoking an attack of opportunity.

Dodging isn't strictly defined. Nitpicky, but I'd prefer:

"Combat Dodge (Ex)
When an opponent attacks a 4th level Cooper and misses, the Cooper may take a 5' step without provoking an attack of opportunity."


Voltage Attack (Ex)
A 5th level Cooper can Electrically charge his chosen Cane causing it to deal extra shock damage. this damage starts at 1d6 at 5th level and increasing by 1d6 every five levels after. This damage is changed to d10s and is multiplied on a critical. He may only do this a number of times per day equal to his Cooper level. This effect is removed on contact with a creature.

What action is required to charge the Cane? Swift, probably? More wording and clarity nitpicks:

"Voltage Attack (Ex)
A 5th level Cooper can electrically charge his chosen Cane as a swift action, causing it to deal extra electricity damage on a sucessful hit. This damage starts at 1d6 at 5th level and increasing by 1d6 every five levels after. On a ciritcal hit, the damage dice are changed to d10s, and are multiplied by the critical hit multiplier (even though extra damage dice are not normally multiplied). He may do this a number of times per day equal to his Cooper level. This effect lasts indefinitely, but ends when the Cane touches any creature besides the Cooper."


Thieving Legend (Ex)
At 20th level

How about this?

"Thieving Legend (Ex)
There's no honor, no challenge, no fun, in stealing from ordinary people. You rip off a master criminal, then you know you're a master thief. At 20th level, the Cooper may only be noticed with mundane senses, which may require a Spot or Listen check. While See Invisibility and the like still allow creatures to see him in Shadow Form as if he were normally visible, the Cooper is invisible to magical detection--not even Mindsight or divinations reveal his presence. (If the Cooper has the now-obsolete Darkstalker feat, he may change it to one other feat he qualifies for.)

In addition, if the Cooper leaves a personal and recognizeable 'calling card' in place of an object he steals, all divinations that would reveal information about his heist automatically fail."

The first ability is one that every stealthly character would give their Dexterity score for, and the second is more thematic.

Overall, I think the Cooper is a tad strong, but a great class. Really captures the feel of the games.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Good stuff, here. I like it, so here's some input that might make it better. Everything I don't mention is peachy.


thanks for the help. sorry, recovering from being sick.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

Not sure if i made enough updates to justify a thread necromancy.
But i will list them.

*Changed all the spell like abilities from Level +cha/day to just cha/day
*Changed takedown slam to make more noise the more damage you do.
*changed silent obliteration to optional with the side effect of consuming your next move action
*changed the shadow form abilities duration.

So, tell me if its still overpowered?