Is anyone hoping for a Bobby Ewing Moment?

[Gorm_the_DBA]

For those who are younger than about 35...http://www.ultimatedallas.com/episodeguide/dreamzonefaq.htm

So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

Would it ruin the story for you if it were?

[Armaius]

Yes, because "it was all just a dream" is lazy, hack writing and a cheap copout to boot.

[sam79]

I think that would be, to say the least, pretty lame.

[Shale]

The final strip will be Elan as an autistic boy playing with miniatures while reading a 3.5e handbook.

[Xelbiuj]

It only only be funny if it was a double sike out and in the same comic. as to not waste time.
Have Belkar think it was all Girard's illusion, then wake up and realize it's real and they're sol.

[NerdyKris]

For those who are younger than about 35...http://www.ultimatedallas.com/episodeguide/dreamzonefaq.htm

So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

Would it ruin the story for you if it were?

That would be the absolute most awful, terrible, insulting plot twist imaginable.

Who would hope that all this plot and character development is just a dream? I would seriously question if the author had gone completely insane.

No. The Dallas "twist" was widely reviled in it's day and for good reason. It's simply the laziest form of tying up a plot line that has ever been invented. It renders the entire story (in this case an entire season) pointless, and is nothing more than a giant "HA HA!" to anyone watching. That "HA HA!" increases in direct correlation to the length of the "fake" story. You can get away with it in very small doses, but not when it contains what the audience believes are major plot points. You're basically destroying any sense of uncertainty in the story, because now they don't know if that major threat is real or "just a dream! HA HA!". Imagine Roy's death, or the entire battle of Azure City if we had that albatross lurking in the back of our minds. It would have had no impact, becasue we'd be expecting the "It was just a dream!" twist coming up any minute now.


(Please note that this is for drama/ongoing stories that build on themselves. Something like, say, the Stewie Kills Lois episode or the American Dad Apocalypse episodes are funny because those shows AREN'T built on character or plot development.)

[pendell]

It would also be a ....

...drumroll...

A Deus Ex Machina! Yes! A plot twist pulled out of nowhere to fix a plot when the author has painted himself into a corner! It may not quite be the dictionary definition but it'll do.

Now you folks excuse me while I go wash my hands. Just typing the DEM word makes me feel all dirty. Everytime someone types that phrase on this forum, The Death Star blows up a planet filled with cute kittens and fluffy bunnies and smiling, chirping birds.

AND NOW THEY'RE ALL DEAD, BECAUSE YOU MADE ME USE THE PHRASE!

Wanders away sadly,

Brian P.

[NerdyKris]

Nah. A deus ex machina at least resolves the plot line somehow. "It was all a dream" just ignores it. Like a show cancelled on a cliffhanger.

I'm not saying there's no good way to do "It was all a dream". But the uncertainty about reality has to be there from the start, not revealed at the end. Like the Buffy episode where she isn't sure if she was in an insane asylum. (Although that plot line is a ridiculous cliche, it did allow for some fourth wall breaking meta discussion of the show's plot)

The fact that the Draketooth clan casts illusions isn't enough. There would have to have been other signs. Plus, this is the culmination of plot threads for several characters. It would completely destroy any character development of V if they suddenly said "Oh, you didn't really murder all the Draketooths!". V would rationalize that therefore it was not likely that the Black Dragons ever mated with humans, just like before.

[allenw]

I was still considering the possibility that this was all/mostly Girard's Phantasmagorical Holodeck of Horrors... but it seems realy, really unlikely and undesirable at this point.

[Mastikator]

Invalidating the story without foreshadowing makes it irrelevant and anything that might happen in the future might also be a dream, ultimately undermining the story.
So no. Durkon is no more, there is only Durkula.

[factotum]

As everyone else says, making this all be illusion/dream would be the most horrendous cop-out in the history of horrendous cop-outs. Not to mention: who is having this dream, if that's what it is?

[SavageWombat]

As everyone else says, making this all be illusion/dream would be the most horrendous cop-out in the history of horrendous cop-outs. Not to mention: who is having this dream, if that's what it is?

Clearly Roy. It's his worst nightmare, of course - Durkon worse than dead, Belkar not.

This is all part of Gerard's devious trap.

... people liked it when 8-bit theater ended with an enormous copout, right?

[KillingAScarab]

Well, thank you for reminding me how much I loathe the Internet on April 1st. I will be making extra reminders for myself to avoid it this year, especially GitP.


... people liked it when 8-bit theater ended with an enormous copout, right?Clevinger's light warriors weren't even at the first temple yet when that happened.

[Math_Mage]

OP doesn't even coherently establish which part of the story is supposed to be a dream. So, really, this is just a hypothetical about dream sequences for the sake of having dream sequences, which is a miserable idea.

[pearl jam]

Ha ha. I thought last year's Ponies in the Playground bit was pretty amusing.

[Bulldog Psion]

The dream sequence idea is one of the foulest, most disappointing ways to totally wreck someone's enjoyment of something, ever. "It was all a dream" sucks. Completely, totally, and without exception, IMO.

Since Mr. Burlew is a skilled author, I doubt that he will turn his story into a big airy nil like that.

[armourer eric]

V wakes up lying in bed next to Bob Neuhart in a Chicago apartment

[sims796]

The dream sequence idea is one of the foulest, most disappointing ways to totally wreck someone's enjoyment of something, ever. "It was all a dream" sucks. Completely, totally, and without exception, IMO.

Since Mr. Burlew is a skilled author, I doubt that he will turn his story into a big airy nil like that.

Well, it has its place in sitcom television,l for those cheap "what if" scenarios, but even then...

...and it isn't like those are the pinnacle of writing, anyway.

[dps]

Hoping for a "Bobby Ewing Moment" is like hoping for someone to kick you in the groin, or hoping for someone to poke needles in your eyes.

[nonamearisto]

The only point where it might have been funny if is Tsukiko were still alive, and for a page, she dreams that Xykon finally returned her love, but the dream ends next page. Then again, that comic would be just filler, and it's too late for it now.

[GigaGuess]

Understand, "It was all just a dream" is a full on reset button. Everything snaps back. No Durklua, yeah, but also no V dealing with the ramifications of his actions, no Belkar seeming inexplicably shaken over a sacrifice on his behalf, whatever characterization has happened...gone.

To say people would feel cheated is an understatement.

[Porthos]

The dream sequence idea is one of the foulest, most disappointing ways to totally wreck someone's enjoyment of something, ever. "It was all a dream" sucks. Completely, totally, and without exception, IMO.

I wouldn't go quite that far. There are plenty of instances of 'Dream Episodes' where it worked, both on action/adventure type shows and comedies where it is seen more often.

All Just a Dream. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AllJustADream)

Now where it tends to work more often (in non-comedic examples) is if there is foreshadowing that Something Just Ain't Right Here or if it is self-contained in an episode. Or if there is an EXTREMLY justified Real Life reason for it (Married With Children comes to mind). It works even better if there is lasting consequences for the character. They learned something about themselves or others as a part of the dream.

But here? I think there is very very very very <INSERT LOTS AND LOTS AND LOTS OF VERY'S> very little chance it could really pay off. And I think it is even a smaller chance that it is something that Rich is remotely interested in. :smallwink:

[veti]

Yeah. No.

The current plotline is truly horrifying and I hate it, so much so that I now have a feeling of dread instead of anticipation when I see an update. I'm starting to wish I'd never discovered the comic until it was well past this arc.

But "just a dream" wouldn't resolve any of that: it would mean that the author was messing with me just for fun, rather than in the interests of furthering the story.

[KillianHawkeye]

Nobody is hoping for that. Nobody.

[rodneyAnonymous]

No I am not.

[ti'esar]

Sincere question: disregarding self-contained elements (episodes, installments, whatever) of a story where it's revealed before the element is over, has there ever been an ending of this type that people actually liked?

[Porthos]

Sincere question: disregarding self-contained elements (episodes, installments, whatever) of a story where it's revealed before the element is over, has there ever been an ending of this type that people actually liked?

Newhart comes to mind as the embodiment of the Good Use of this.

ETA: And, as I referenced earlier, I think the audience 'accepted' the use of it in Married With Children when they found out the RL reason for it (Katey Sagal's miscarriage).

[KillingAScarab]

The dream sequence idea is one of the foulest, most disappointing ways to totally wreck someone's enjoyment of something, ever. "It was all a dream" sucks. Completely, totally, and without exception, IMO.It wasn't so bad with the North American version of Super Mario Bros. 2. Not great literature, certainly, but I think people prefer that Subcon didn't exist.

[NerdyKris]

It wasn't so bad with the North American version of Super Mario Bros. 2. Not great literature, certainly, but I think people prefer that Subcon didn't exist.

Anyone who read the instruction booklet knew Subcon was Dreamland. It starts with Mario being told in a dream to save them. He then falls out of bed and goes on a picnic where he finds the door.

Oh yeah, and they say "Welcome to Subcon, the land of dreams". So not the twist people like to pretend it was nowadays. It was intended to be clear.


Sincere question: disregarding self-contained elements (episodes, installments, whatever) of a story where it's revealed before the element is over, has there ever been an ending of this type that people actually liked?

edit- I totally missed the disregarding part of your question. So a lot of these don't count.

There was a Superman story where he thought he was still on Krypton that's considered a classic. (Mogul used a plant creature on his chest)

Inception is technically one of those, even though we know it's a dream throughout.

Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind as well.

Picard on Star Trek once dreamt he spent an entire lifetime on another planet. A plot point repeated twice on Deep Space Nine and I believe on Voyager as well, all with good episodes.

There's plenty of examples, but they all have one thing in common. Only one character is being focused on, there are hints that it's not real, or outright knowing it isn't, and it's not used as a reset button, but a method of introspection.

Oh, and House of M and Age of X, but I can't speak to the quality of those.

Oh, and that fantastic season finale of House where he kills the patient and doesn't wake up for a minute, leading him and the viewers to believe that the "It's all a dream" statements were a red herring.

[Chilingsworth]

It might be alright if something like this happened at the end of the comic. (Say, maybe we meet the players behind the Order and the DM or something.)

Now, absolutely not.

[KillingAScarab]

Anyone who read the instruction booklet knew Subcon was Dreamland.In my advanced age the only thing I remember from that instruction booklet is the derogatory description of Birdo, only because I read the manual again years later.

[NerdyKris]

In my advanced age the only thing I remember from that instruction booklet is the derogatory description of Birdo, only because I read the manual again years later.

"He thinks he is a girl and spits eggs from his mouth" isn't really derogatory. It just says that he's a physical male identifying as female. That's not to say the Japanese translation wasn't derogatory (I wouldn't know, I'm looking at the manual I have), or later versions, but the original American release just said it was a male who wanted to be female.

[Mike Havran]

No, I do not.

Yes, it would.

[Sunken Valley]

Oh it's all a Bobby Ewing. The whole strip is Xykon's dream about someone beating him. When Roy kills him we see him wake up, sweaty and gasping. Redcloak comes to check on him. Then Suddenly, Roy comes out of nowhere and stabs Redcloak. Xykon wakes up. He goes to get some water. Then in the mirror, Roy is standing behind him. Xykon wakes up. To Redcloak standing over him, :redcloak: Heal.

It could also be a dying dream of Elan. He died in this strip due to Durkon's incompetance (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0007.html) and the whole comic has been building up to this revenge fantasy.

Or it could be Roy's dream, as he died here. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0036.html)

[sam79]

Sincere question: disregarding self-contained elements (episodes, installments, whatever) of a story where it's revealed before the element is over, has there ever been an ending of this type that people actually liked?

Wasn't there a Zelda game for the Gameboy that ended like that? Link's Awakening if my memory serves? I liked this game.

ETA: this may not count as a 'story'. And if it does, it may count as a self-contained 'episode' in the larger Zelda mythology. So...yeah.

[The Pilgrim]

They all died in the castle explosion (including Xykon and Redcloak). The rest of the strip is just their travel through Purgatory.

[Shred-Bot]

What if instead of a Bobby Ewing moment, we had a PATRICK Ewing moment? Elan grows a little taller (enlarge person?), puts on some muscle, gets himself a glorious flat-top hairstyle and some low-post moves... tell me this couldn't work.

Then the Order could challenge Team Evil to a basketball game for ownership of Girard's gate, Xykon tries to use his energy drain spells to steal the talent from the Order but Roy comes out of retirement and he is the best of all so the Order wins. Then Xykon metor swarms the gate and after the krackackoom things are back to normal in the race for Kraagor's gate.

(Okay fine this is even worse than Bobby Ewing... but if the Giant is going to destroy his story, wouldn't you want him to do it in spectacular fashion? I'd rather see things devolve into Space Jam than a boring soap opera)

[Snails]

It only only be funny if it was a double sike out and in the same comic. as to not waste time.
Have Belkar think it was all Girard's illusion, then wake up and realize it's real and they're sol.

This. Not a bad way to hint at further moral growth for Belkar, by, say, imagining himself being a far better person than anyone (including himself) would expect.

[KillingAScarab]

Wasn't there a Zelda game for the Gameboy that ended like that? Link's Awakening if my memory serves? I liked this game.

ETA: this may not count as a 'story'. And if it does, it may count as a self-contained 'episode' in the larger Zelda mythology. So...yeah.I'm not one to argue for continuity amongst the Legend of Zelda series. However, I did play Link's Awakening and enjoyed it quite a bit.
It wasn't actually Link's dream. Link was in the Wind Fish's dream and the entire island of Koholint was a figment. The bosses were referred to as "nightmares" and I think there's something which explicitly tells you about the nature of Koholint, but I cannot remember how far into the game you go before learning that. Interestingly, Link must play the Song of Awakening, which is just the Ballad of the Wind Fish which Marin is able to teach you very near the beginning. The song wasn't secret knowledge, but the instruments guarded by the bosses were required to end the dream.

[Incom]

"It was all a dream" as a reset button does not work.

"It was all a dream" as a way to create more conflict (ie. "Koholint is a dream world" or "please wake up from the lotus-eater plant Superman" as mentioned above) can work.

[TopCheese]

8 Bit Theatre was the only story that pulled the "it was a dream" correctly.

[Holy_Knight]

Inception is technically one of those, even though we know it's a dream throughout.
I was thinking of Inception too, although part of why it's interesting is that only some parts of it are dreams, and it's not always clear which ones. Especially the end, which seems intentionally ambiguous. That being said, I think there are enough clues to reasonably conclude that:

Dom never woke up, and his "return home" was still just a dream.



There's plenty of examples, but they all have one thing in common. Only one character is being focused on, there are hints that it's not real, or outright knowing it isn't, and it's not used as a reset button, but a method of introspection.

I don't know that it has to focus on only one character, but otherwise I think you're right about this. Aside from your examples, I can think of two from Batman: The Animated Series:

1) Batman is trapped by the Mad Hatter in a dream that is supposed to be everything he ever wanted. After he starts noticing little things that don't quite make sense, he has to give up (the illusion of) the happy life he might have had, and figure out how to force himself to wake up.

2) Batgirl dies, and in the wake of her death Commissioner Gordon finds out who Batman is, blames her death on him, and vows revenge. He and the rest of the cops storm Wayne Manor and Batman and Nightwing have to go on the run. Things get progressively worse as the vigilantes are hunted down by their former allies, culminating in even greater tragedy at the end. ...Then we find out that actually Batgirl never died, but she had been dosed with fear toxin and hallucinated all the other events. Even though it was basically a reset button for that episode, it was cool because it allowed the exploration of the characters' fears and raised issues of trust, betrayal, and so on.

I think those episodes were called "Perchance to Dream" and "Over the Edge", but I'm less sure about the first one.

[Dr.Epic]

Only if it was done like this. (http://www.nuklearpower.com/2008/12/11/episode-1070-what-were-you-expecting/)

[TheWolfe]

This made me think of this theory (http://www.risingstarforums.net/threads/1884-Was-Pokemon-All-A-Dream), which proposes that all of pokemon is a coma-dream. It actually makes a lot of sense.

But I have to agree with the others that it would be stupid if OOTS was just a dream. That would be like LOTR ending with Frodo waking up and realising he dreamed all of Middle-Earth, or Star Wars ending with Luke waking up and finding out it was all a dream.

[Giggling Ghast]

:elan: Going to Mom's funeral has given me the strangest dreams. You were there! And you were there! And you were there! And you were there!

(Elan points to the dolls on his shelf that resemble the OOTS members)

You were the bestest friends I ever had.

(Realizes he is alone again, starts crying)

[nonamearisto]

Maybe it was all a nightmare that young black dragon had, only he's a hatchling and fears elves attacking. Not to mention familicide is so overpowered as to be worthy of a nightmare. lol.

[Aquatosic]

if this is all a dream, I will drive all the way to wherever Rich Burlew lives and personally bitch-slap him:smallyuk:

[Aquatosic]

if it was a dream, it was all Roy's dream in the moments before he hit the ground after Xykon knocked him off the zombie dragon during the Battle for Azure City.

[KillingAScarab]

What if instead of a Bobby Ewing moment, we had a PATRICK Ewing moment? Elan grows a little taller (enlarge person?), puts on some muscle, gets himself a glorious flat-top hairstyle and some low-post moves... tell me this couldn't work.Sorry it took me so long to notice this. I want to see this. Forget about, "it was all a dream." We need it to be a Dream Team. Also, Elan is totally the Larry Bird to Nale's "Magic" Johnson. I mean, Nale actually casts magic!

[Domino Quartz]

NO. It would be horrible and terrible story-telling to make this all just a dream.

[Windup]

Yes, because "it was all just a dream" is lazy, hack writing and a cheap copout to boot.

To be fair to the Dallas writers of thirty years ago, it wasn't so much "lazy" writing as "gun to your head" writing. It has to suck when your bosses point-blank order you to resurrect a character in a setting with no resurrection.

[Killer Angel]

For those who are younger than about 35...http://www.ultimatedallas.com/episodeguide/dreamzonefaq.htm

So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

Would it ruin the story for you if it were?

It depends.
The comic "it was all a dream", will be posted on the 1st of april?

[pendell]

The best way I've seen this done is the 90's movie Total Recall (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_Recall_(1990_film)). I believe the novelization made it clear that the entire thing had in fact been a dream sequence which the protaganist had paid for.

If something is going to be "all a dream", then the fact that it must be a dream must be foreshadowed and must be a part of the plot. If it IS a dream, it must still be satisfactorily resolved. You can't simply have the character wake up and pop the dream world as if it were a soap bubble.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Velaryon]

What if instead of a Bobby Ewing moment, we had a PATRICK Ewing moment? Elan grows a little taller (enlarge person?), puts on some muscle, gets himself a glorious flat-top hairstyle and some low-post moves... tell me this couldn't work.

Then the Order could challenge Team Evil to a basketball game for ownership of Girard's gate, Xykon tries to use his energy drain spells to steal the talent from the Order but Roy comes out of retirement and he is the best of all so the Order wins. Then Xykon metor swarms the gate and after the krackackoom things are back to normal in the race for Kraagor's gate.

(Okay fine this is even worse than Bobby Ewing... but if the Giant is going to destroy his story, wouldn't you want him to do it in spectacular fashion? I'd rather see things devolve into Space Jam than a boring soap opera)

I would love to see this as an story in another Snips, Snails, and Dragon Tails style of book. :smallsmile:


To be fair to the Dallas writers of thirty years ago, it wasn't so much "lazy" writing as "gun to your head" writing. It has to suck when your bosses point-blank order you to resurrect a character in a setting with no resurrection.

I came in to say something about this. The Dallas writers had to bring back a character that had been killed off, because the ratings took a nose dive after he left and they had to bring him back in order to save the show. The "it was all a dream" copout may have been the only thing they could do.

[kruemeli]

For those who are younger than about 35...http://www.ultimatedallas.com/episodeguide/dreamzonefaq.htm

I was there... as it were...


So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

No. I'd rather it was more the Fallon/alien intervention storyline...


Would it ruin the story for you if it were?

:mitd: Difficult to answer... I would certainly stop checking often to see if there were updates... maybe check in once a month or so to read through a few strips at once... most webcomics end up fading this way for me.

[Unisus]

The best way I've seen this done is the 90's movie Total Recall (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_Recall_(1990_film)). I believe the novelization made it clear that the entire thing had in fact been a dream sequence which the protaganist had paid for.

If something is going to be "all a dream", then the fact that it must be a dream must be foreshadowed and must be a part of the plot. If it IS a dream, it must still be satisfactorily resolved. You can't simply have the character wake up and pop the dream world as if it were a soap bubble.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

If i remember correctly, the whole story was not a dream - at least there was never a statement that it was one. There are bits that point more in the "not a dream" direction.

On topic: i agree that it would destroy a lot of the story, if this should have been a dream - of course, there were enough comments on gaming that it could be a funny ending, should we actually see the gamers leaving the table after the session, with paper minis of the OotS cast still standing around. But the dream of one of the characters? No way - in this environment there is not even the "we had to do this because there was no other way" reasoning.

[BaronOfHell]

If it is not too late to participate.....


So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

It'd honestly depend on what I'd wake up to. :smallsmile:

Also it'd suck major whale testicles waking up on a cliffhanger at "883 Fiend Swap" and never find out the rest of the story, should the story of OOTS only have been imaginary. So if it's a dream, don't wake me up yet, please. :smallbiggrin:

[davidbofinger]

The final strip will be Elan as an autistic boy playing with miniatures while reading a 3.5e handbook.

If you were going to do this - which would be a brain-numbingly bad idea - it would be Roy, I think. Roy is a kid forced to learn mathematics (i.e. wizardry) when he'd rather play football (i.e. fighter stuff - use whatever meaning of "football" is common in your country). Elan could be Roy's puppy.

The best way to do "It was all a dream" is probably the way Red Dwarf did it. The characters are revealed to have been inside a computer game, then it's revealed that the series reality is actually real and the computer game a dream, but a frisson of doubt remains.

[Gift Jeraff]

I'm hoping for a Bobby Hill moment.

:elan: That's my dwarf! I don't know you!
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g68/Cats_Are_Aliens/Banners/Malack.png :smalleek:
:roy: That bard ain't right...

[Themrys]

Yes, because "it was all just a dream" is lazy, hack writing and a cheap copout to boot.

Not always. If you write it as dream sequence from the start, and accordingly unrealistic, then that can be okay, or even good.

However, the Giant is a good writer, and the comic hasn't gotten weirder than usual in the last few strips. There is nothing to suggest this is a dream, and I think he has put enough planning into it to not need a cheap copout.

[Sky_Schemer]

V wakes up lying in bed next to Bob Neuhart in a Chicago apartment

Or Suzanne Pleshette.

[SowZ]

I just LOVE it when I find out that I've invested two hours/a week/a few years into a story that finally tells me that nothing I've seen or read actually happened within the story! It's great! What a fantastically clever way to wash over any plot holes and avoid giving legitimate closure, too!

[Shred-Bot]

I just LOVE it when I find out that I've invested two hours/a week/a few years into a story that finally tells me that nothing I've seen or read actually happened within the story! It's great! What a fantastically clever way to wash over any plot holes and avoid giving legitimate closure, too!

"Thanks for getting attached to the characters and invested in the story while I deliberately wasted your time, everyone!"

Yeah I can't see the Giant doing that.

[martianmister]

Does #886 counts? :smalltongue:

[Math_Mage]

Does #886 counts? :smalltongue:

No, because it is not a plausible referent of the 'this' in the OP, as the sequence of events that brought it about happened after the OP was written.

[Porthos]

Also, as has been stated in the thread before, there are plenty of self-contained instances where This Wasn't Real Folks works brilliantly. Any works of art that ever use the Lotus Eater (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LotusEaterMachine) trope falls directly into this, for example. Or ones that reference a battle for control of a mind (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CuckooNest) (like Frame of Mind from TNG).

But the death of Durkon (which is what the OP was referencing)? No. Not even on the same continent, never mind same ballpark.

[SowZ]

Also, as has been stated in the thread before, there are plenty of self-contained instances where This Wasn't Real Folks works brilliantly. Any works of art that ever use the Lotus Eater (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LotusEaterMachine) trope falls directly into this, for example. Or ones that reference a battle for control of a mind (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CuckooNest) (like Frame of Mind from TNG).

But the death of Durkon (which is what the OP was referencing)? No. Not even on the same continent, never mind same ballpark.

We had one strip of that just recently?

[Porthos]

We had one strip of that just recently?

I'm afraid I don't understand your question. :smallredface: :smallsmile:

[SowZ]

I'm afraid I don't understand your question. :smallredface: :smallsmile:

We had a very miniature it was all a dream sequence. The question mark was to indicate uncertainty, sorry. We don't know exactly what happened so I can't say for sure but it really seems that way.

[Math_Mage]

We had a very miniature it was all a dream sequence. The question mark was to indicate uncertainty, sorry. We don't know exactly what happened so I can't say for sure but it really seems that way.

Yes, that's what martianmister referenced, and what we rejected. All agreed, then. :smallsmile: