Pathfinder confusion and advice

[ezrider23]

Hey all out there,
I'm brand new to this forum and it seems mega tough to navigate. I'm looking for any sort of Pathfinder type advice. Guides? Builds? General advice?

It's been so long since i've played a 3.whatever style game and there are so many options that i'm crazy confused on how to start getting a character together. I have a "concept" of what i'd like to do/go i just need to start.

I'm not ready for optimization yet just not looking to build a terrible character either.

Please help.

[evil-frosty]

Well for starters, what is your concept? We will be able to point you in the best direction if we knew that. Also you should probably look through the races and class sections of the core rule book of Pathfinder and see what best fits your concept as a starter.

[Ravens_cry]

Agreed. The first question is . . . what do you want to play? Throw out a concept that intrigues you, and we'll see if we can help without making things too complicated.

[ezrider23]

Well for starters, what is your concept? We will be able to point you in the best direction if we knew that. Also you should probably look through the races and class sections of the core rule book of Pathfinder and see what best fits your concept as a starter.

I'm looking to go down the route, eventually, of a "Jedi Protector" type. This is going to be started at 1st level in a Pathfinder Society game. The group i'm going to be joining is lacking in a "healer/Leader" type so i was looking at going for a Human Cleric of Nethys(Knowledge/Protection Domains) who will eventually try to MC into Magus.

The secondary portion of this is not necessary seeing as i could just refluff the Cleric as a Jedi. I'm just getting all twisted about stat alignment and what not.

Character creation for Pathfinder is wayyy different than for 4e, which i've been playing since it came out.

[ezrider23]

Agreed. The first question is . . . what do you want to play? Throw out a concept that intrigues you, and we'll see if we can help without making things too complicated.

A Jedi is the concept, mostly. I don't know really if Pathfinder follows the same base assupmptions as 4e such as "Roles". Defender/Leader/Striker/Controller.

I like party balance and fitting needs of the group while still meeting my character concept ideas. This all somewhat new to me as i'm just getting back into this version of RPG's.:smalleek:

[SamBurke]

A Jedi is the concept, mostly. I don't know really if Pathfinder follows the same base assupmptions as 4e such as "Roles". Defender/Leader/Striker/Controller.

I like party balance and fitting needs of the group while still meeting my character concept ideas. This all somewhat new to me as i'm just getting back into this version of RPG's.:smalleek:

It follows very similar, but silent assumptions. I recommend you look at the Paladin, as it may be a little bit better at the Striker side of things.

Which leads to a question: Which of those four do you want most? Secondary? Tertiary?

[Ravens_cry]

Well, I wouldn't multi-class magus, it spreads your abilities a bit too thin and doesn't have much synergy with cleric.
In fact, if you want to make a protector with healing type, I'd go Paladin. As long as you're not primary healer, you should be able to provide some healing with your channels, mercy's and laying on of the hands, while been a frankly awesome beatstick against evil. You can even raise the dead.

[JusticeZero]

Well, what are you thinking about when you say "Jedi"? Obviously you won't get an exact copy of Luke Skywalker, but there are a lot of possible ways to interpret the idea that can analogue in. What are some conceptual things you're looking for exactly?

[ezrider23]

It follows very similar, but silent assumptions. I recommend you look at the Paladin, as it may be a little bit better at the Striker side of things.

Which leads to a question: Which of those four do you want most? Secondary? Tertiary?
We have a Dwarf Paladin in the group already so i'm trying to not overlap on to many fronts.
The group should consist of..
1. Dwarf Paladin
2. Tiefling Fighter
3. Druid
4. Sorcerer
5. Witch
6. Fighter
7. Me?
I'm looking to go for the Leader Primary and Defender secondary with Striker Tertiary. I'm also looking to go for a more legend/lore skillsy feel. I can abandon the Jedi idea or just role-play up the Knowledge/Wisdom for defense angle.

My thinking is Human Cleric of Nethys who focuses on the Knowledge and Protection Domains, maybe sword or mace and shield.
Where should my stat focus be? That group really seems like an aweful lot of frontliners so it could get a tad crowded but i could stick around the Witch and Sorcerer and act as a back-up defender for them.

[Arbane]

We have a Dwarf Paladin in the group already so i'm trying to not overlap on to many fronts.
The group should consist of..
1. Dwarf Paladin
2. Tiefling Fighter
3. Druid
4. Sorcerer
5. Witch
6. Fighter
7. Me?
I'm looking to go for the Leader Primary and Defender secondary with Striker Tertiary. I'm also looking to go for a more legend/lore skillsy feel. I can abandon the Jedi idea or just role-play up the Knowledge/Wisdom for defense angle.

D&D3.5/PF don't really 'do' the formalized Leader/Striker/Etc thing. But a cleric who picks mostly buff spells and occasionally does some head-bashing themselves sounds like would work fine with that party.



My thinking is Human Cleric of Nethys who focuses on the Knowledge and Protection Domains, maybe sword or mace and shield.
Where should my stat focus be? That group really seems like an aweful lot of frontliners so it could get a tad crowded but i could stick around the Witch and Sorcerer and act as a back-up defender for them.

How about being an archer? You can hit stuff and stay as a rear-guard, and carry a melee weapon for if the enemies get behind the frontliners.


Here's a few Cleric guide that _might_ be useful. (I haven't played a cleric yet, but I've been in a group with an effective one.)
https://docs.google.com/document/edit?id=1bGYV4nTaUQ7DZ0K-bLJsigtWujhQl9gJsW5tVOtmuuE#
http://pfs.shadowsofcommand.com/Cleric%20Optomization.htm
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1h6-_4HvPvV-Tt7I67Gi_oPhgHmeDVA5SBl-WrJSgf5s/edit?hl=en#

Remember, perfect optimization isn't necessary as long as you're having fun.

The big strength clerics have is that they have unfettered access to their spell-list and can pick new spells every day. This makes clerics relatively hard to screw up. If you know what you're going to be up against, you're golden. If not... you have a lot of spells to cast as Cure (Whatever) Wounds.

[ezrider23]

Thanks Arbane.
Those guides will really come in handy. I'm really not worried with OP and i'm looking forward to just having fun but i wanted to make sure i wasn't making bad stat and feat choices. Really no point in trying to be the best there is if this is my first Pathfinder game and i really don't think the rest of the group will even worry about optimization.
I'll just sit down and work through a Cleric that focuses on protecting and buffing my allies and maybe go down the classic route of Armor/Shield and Mace.

[Acanous]

you have a party with 7 players and no social skills. Play a Gnome Ninja with Bewildering Koan. Put points in all your social skills, and play up being charismatic, lucky and Yoda-like in stature.

You get Sneak Attack, smoke bombs, and a Ki pool.
The Ki pool is your force points.

[AttilaTheGeek]

The bigger the party, the more effective buffs are. For example, a Bard's Inspire Courage doesn't do much if it's only buffing one person, but in a party of 7 it's six times as effective.

[ezrider23]

Thanks for all the reply's.

Due to the nature of of the "campaign", we are playing the the First steps scenario in PFS, i really didn't worry too much about any OP and covered some missing stuff at the time. I decided to go with and Urban Switch Hitter Ranger. Human for the bonus feat and skill point. We now have a Rogue so i may switch to a different Ranger archtype or just regular ranger. If something were to happen to my Ranger i'll probably go with a Cleric of some sort, most likely a ranged type.

[Squirrel_Dude]

I'm looking to go down the route, eventually, of a "Jedi Protector" type. This is going to be started at 1st level in a Pathfinder Society game. The group i'm going to be joining is lacking in a "healer/Leader" type so i was looking at going for a Human Cleric of Nethys(Knowledge/Protection Domains) who will eventually try to MC into Magus.

The secondary portion of this is not necessary seeing as i could just refluff the Cleric as a Jedi. I'm just getting all twisted about stat alignment and what not.

Character creation for Pathfinder is wayyy different than for 4e, which i've been playing since it came out.I wouldn't go Cleric-Magus because you'll be MADer than a monk. You'd need strength for your damage, dex to hit and AC, Con for not dying, Int for Magus spells, Wis for Cleric spells, and charisma if you ever consider using channel energy.

If you want a Healer/Leader/tanky character, try a Cleric of Sarenrae (Healing/Glory Domains).

- Healing will make all of your healing spells empowered for free, which is cool.
- Glory allows you to add your cleric level to a charisma based skill check.

Another option is a Cleric of Gorum. Great favored weapon, and great domains for combat. As for being a striker: Greatsword + power attack + furious focus = Good times.


Magus is also a valid standalone, but I can't say as much about that class as I have yet to try and build one or mess with it much. I just wouldn't try and combine it with a Cleric.

[gr8artist]

There is a cleric domain that gets the ability to throw their melee weapon out to 30' range and have it return to them.
If that doesn't scream "Jedi," then i don't know what does.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo---domains/magic-domain

[Slipperychicken]

I'm looking to go for the Leader Primary and Defender secondary with Striker Tertiary. I'm also looking to go for a more legend/lore skillsy feel. I can abandon the Jedi idea or just role-play up the Knowledge/Wisdom for defense angle.


Bard, take Perform (Oratory) so you're making inspirational speeches instead of singing. They certainly handle skills very well, especially social and Knowledge skills. Cast spells in addition to Inspiration to buff your many melee characters, multiplying the spells' effectiveness. Consider the Arcane Duelist archetype if you wish to focus more on combat than Knowledge skills. Primary "leader" (i.e. buffing with your presumably-inspiring words): covered.

Your d8 hit dice will give you plenty of hitpoints, and you can safely participate in melee if you invest a 14 in Con. Secondary tank role.

3/4 BAB let you still swing in combat, although you won't be Power Attacking as much (Tertiary striker role). If I wanted to do a striker Bard, I'd consider an Arcane Duelist to make up for the attack bonus. Also, you may want to go Human and take the archery feats (get Precise Shot ASAP), because melee will be crowded and others are tanking for you.

[Daftendirekt]

I wouldn't go Cleric-Magus

Magus is also a valid standalone, but I can't say as much about that class as I have yet to try and build one or mess with it much. I just wouldn't try and combine it with a Cleric.

I second the "don't mix Cleric-Magus" sentiment. Mostly because multiclassing is almost always a subpar option in Pathfinder. It's designed to make taking a single class 1-20 the most desirable option in most cases. The PrCs are largely pretty "Meh" and there aren't many multiclass builds that are better than a straight class (Maneuver Master Monk 2 Lore Warden Fighter 18 is the only one that I can think of off the top of my head).

That said, taking a single class to cover your "jedi" concept... I think Magus would be a pretty good fit actually. Lightly armored, high DEX, single 1h weapon with no shield. Especially if you go Bladebound (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus/archetypes/paizo---magus-archetypes/bladebound), getting a sword that scales with you as you level up.

[Baroncognito]

I think Bard to Duelist works well for a Jedi. Since you're not going up to 6th level spells with the multi-class, you can have your cha a bit lower and get a good intelligence score.

Why bard?

Mage Hand
Call weapon
Charm Person
Unseen Servant
Detect Thoughts
Retrieve Item
Returning Weapon
Suggestion
Good Hope
Seek Thoughts

If you don't have a Rogue, you can go Bard (Archaeologist) and get pretty good at disarming traps (If you're allowed traits, get Vagabond Child (Disable Device) to make it a class skill).

There's really no reason you can't go straight bard to make a Jedi, but Bard/Duelist will have a slightly better BAB and get Canny Defense for Int to AC.

Edit:

On the other hand, a Kensei Magus would also get Canny Defense and gets some good spells too:

Shocking Grasp
Gust of Wind
Levitate
Returning Weapon
Force Punch
Lightning Bolt
Forceful strike

[Squirrel_Dude]

I'll second the idea of doing some kind of Martial Bard.

[Daftendirekt]

Shocking Grasp
Gust of Wind
Levitate
Returning Weapon
Force Punch
Lightning Bolt
Forceful strike

Don't forget Hydraulic Push/Torrent. Just refluff the water as force(or Force :smallwink: ). Then you can do this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0RuR3FREFw#t=04m04s).

[sepchan]

I'm also looking to go for a more legend/lore skillsy feel. I can abandon the Jedi idea or just role-play up the Knowledge/Wisdom for defense angle.

You should look into the Inquisitor both for the standard class features and and some of the archetypes. It can offer quite a bit of flexibility in and out of combat with 2/3 spontaneous divine spell progression, options for melee and ranged combat, and good knowledge and cha skill bonuses.

[Hendel]

Maybe not what you are looking for in this campaign, but my first non-3.5 converted Pathfinder character was a Human Oracle of Life. Pathfinder really rewards not multi-classing more than any other system.

I was able to have the armor and weapon that I needed to make me a second level fighter type. I fit in behind a paladin and the inquisitor. I had so much healing that I didn't know what to do with it all. That helped me to heal myself if I got into a sticky situation or heal others. I quickly became everyone's favorite friend.

I did not have to worry about a high wisdom and a high charisma, I just sank it all into charisma. That helped my channel energy and my ability to win and influence people.

When we fought undead, everyone just stood back in amazement as I unleashed. Otherwise, I was the guy with the party buff, second only to a bard, and I was the guy who risked it all to move into flank to help the other fighter types (Grace helps with this a lot, too).

It gives you the spell casting, the fighting potential, the buffs, and the charisma to be the leader that you may want to be in the party.

(I actually let the paladin lead but was by his side with direction and counsel all the time)