Dilemma: Can't build my character right

[Ithquentbvare]

I have been playing my character Ithquentbvare (human name: Ryokou Kavallion) for about fourteen years in various online text based games. I have been trying to convert him over to 3.5 for the longest time but every time I build him I have second-thoughts and scrap the whole project. The only reason why I haven't changed him currently is because I have an ongoing game with my brothers and close friends and would prefer to at least get some playing done. The game is a high level gestalt game and the party is full of dragons.

Unfortunately I made the character when I was much younger and so he has gone through several different incarnations when it comes to species: Andalite, saiyan, demon, vampire to name a few. (Props to those who know what an Andalite is.) So really I have gotten his personality down more than his species and abilities. I know a few things I want him to be able to do, but not everything and it is difficult because I cannot place him into a true class. And I think I have somewhat of an idea for a species. Sadly when I think of his back story for coming into being, I wind up detesting it but keep it in place as a placeholder.

I will admit that I still have a penchant for him to retain a few abilities/weapons from characters I like, mainly because I think they are pretty awesome. Luckily I have narrowed it down to two to three characters: Vergil from the Devil May Cry series (yes even the new one), Raziel from the Soul Reaver series and Magneto in X-Men. For items I have also narrowed it down to three: Vergil's Yamato, the So'Ounga from the third InuYasha movie and the Sesshomaru's Tenseiga from the InuYasha series.

The latter two are actually quite minor; from Raziel I enjoy the idea of the Wraith Blade, specifically the part that makes it a Soulknife. However the blade itself is the Soulknife, it isn't an ability Raziel has himself. Magneto's only contribution here is the metalo-kinesis, but I was just looking for a straight forward telekinesis. I like Magneto far more than Jean, whose powers would be more accurate, but preferred to give the Master of Magnetism the credit. Last is Vergil, and this is the tricky part. I like pretty much all of his abilities (short teleports, the ability to manifest spectral swords to throw at opponents to do damage which can be used in conjunction with the teleports, the ability to create a temporary doppleganger which mimics his attacks for a short period of time, and the capabilities of his sword Yamato. These abilities are essentially a "wind blade" affect that is seen in pretty much every anime or manga ever, and the ability to use something called a Judgment Cut which is essentially a distance cut through space and time.) From the So'Ounga and Tenseiga I am looking at the Dragon Twister and Meido, respectively. Dragon Twister would be best described as the psionic power Tornado Blast which reanimates those killed into zombies, and the Meido is a ranged Greater Plane Shift to hell. In some variants it does an automatic kill by opening up a rift inside an opponent it has cut, and teleport items, attacks or landscape like rocks.

The original part for Ryo is that I have finally settled on him being a dragon. I am rather fond of the Silver and Red dragons and have him written as a hybrid (sort of like how in Eberron color doesn't declare alignment) and the child of Bahamut and Tiamat as per Io's intentions. I have had mixed reception on this idea ranging anywhere from me being unoriginal and having a ****ty back story, to some thinking it is really cool. I was hoping to make up my own dragon that merely appeared to look like the Silver/Red hybrid but have it's own unique stats, spells, breath weapon, etc. For the breath I wanted flurry of hail with ice in it. (This idea was inspired by the hail used to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah, at least according to my old Hebrew school teachers).

In our campaign he is a 47 Silver Dragon/20 Wizard/10 Incantatrix/4 Master of the Unseen Hand/12 Dragon Ascendant/1 Swordsage (remember this is gestalt). He has the Wyrm of War Archetype from Eberron (Bonus fighter feat/draconic combat feat every 4 levels), plays Xorvintaal (from Monster Manual 4) and has the Spellhoarding insanity (Dragon #313) which I am regretting a bit, but the idea of the runes was really cool.

The Swordsage was to try and mimic Vergil as per stated earlier (Shadow Stride maneuver for the teleports, and a few others leading up to Time Stands Still). The Unseen Hand, Wizard and Incantantrix were to get enough spells for him to have some versatile spells and get enough spells to power the Innate Spell feat in Complete Arcane so he could have Telekinesis at will. The Dragon Ascendant was to play off of his wanting to ascend to godhood like his parents. Last my DM helped me make a custom Item Familiar that let me use several Soulknife abilities to approximate the swords, even letting me mix in a few higher level items to approximate the Plane Shift attack.

During actual play I have found most of the levels in Wizard to be relatively useless as I utilize the telekinesis and sword when I am in my human form, which was my intent but I never realized how much "wasted space" there was, so to speak. Between a vacation, our DM not having a weekend off and Easter I have several weeks. I have been hoping to try and rectify my problem and finally get this unsettling feeling to go away.

I've tried everything to get this to work: from making him a level 150 character (this was years ago when I was no where close to proficient with DnD), to trying to making a human character with class levels that can let him alternate form into a dragon at will and just manipulating the "flavor text" to make it seem like his true form is the dragon and he just stays in human form a lot (I've been thinking of going back to this option), to trying to make a were-dragon template, to his current incarnation. I have exhausted all options, and I am asking for some help.

Ideals:
The unique Silver/Red Dragon I mentioned earlier with the Holy Hail breath.
Telekinesis at will.
Minor evocation properties, even like an Archmage's Arcane Fire ability (I know how bad Evocation is, but I have always seen him as a mix of blaster and controller)
Short teleportation.
Some mix of the swords I detailed above.

If anyone could come up with some ideas to help me, it would be beyond appreciated. This is something I have been working myself up to joining and posting about for quite some time. I tried it on the Wizards boards before and those guys were immense help, but I always pulled back some of the information for fear of being judged and ridiculed. Even doing this post has been terribly stressful and several weeks in the making. I am sorry for the wall of text, but this has almost become an obsession for me and I want to finally put this whole thing to rest. I am willing to supply more information/learn how to do things myself, I just need a teacher. Even if nobody replies it felt good to get this off my chest. But it definitely wouldn't hurt to get some help with this. I can't imagine I am the only person to ever have issues like this.

Thank you in advance guys, and thank you for baring with me up until this point. I am well aware I am pretty ridiculous.

-Ith

[limejuicepowder]

Andalites are the where it's at - I've got the entire series sitting 10 ft from me as I write this.

Anyways, the first question is an easy one: what level are you aiming for? Level 50 gestalt, or something a little more sane? As is the case for most anime/comic inspired characters, some kind of gish is the way to go, and I'm thinking Jade Pheonix Mage or Ruby Knight Vindicator.

The JPM, besides giving duel spell and initiator progressions, has several very nice auras and short-term boosts. They have the advantage over the RKV in that they are arcane based. I'm leaning towards this one cause arcane spells are going to better reflect the abilities you say you want.

However, RKV get the ability to burn turn undead attempts for extra actions, this is very very good and mostly takes care of one of your stated abilities. They progress divine (usually cleric) casting, which is a different spell list.

My next question is Do you want a true dragon form, or is a breath weapon good enough? If it's the former, that's going to be kind of hard, but not impossible. If it's the latter, either the half-dragon template or dragonfire adept is the way to go. This is where gestalt would come in handy.

I think warblade 1 dragonfire adept 19//sorcerer 6/jade pheonix mage 10/abjurant champion 4 is the way to go.

The warblade level is very good for JPM entry, though it's not strictly necessary; you could take the martial strike feat, but that robs you of a recovery mechanic. I put it on the dragonfire side because JPM already looses 2 caster levels, so if your not full caster you won't get 9ths. If you don't mind giving up the JPM capstone, you can take only 9 levels in it to get the 5th level of abjurant champ, which provides some small numerical benefits and the ability to quicken your 3rd level abjuration spells (as is you can only do 2nd level or lower).

Unfortunately your BaB suffers a little; you will not get the 4th attack. If this bothers you, change out some of the dragonfire levels for warblade levels (though this will lose you access to the best invocations; not worth it in my book). Besides that, chose your spells to do what you need to do. The best gish spells with a little bit of refluff should serve you pretty well; haste, shield, whirling blade (refluff it so it's the "air slice" thing), wraith strike, fly (though an invocation can do the same thing), dimension door, etc.

[Ithquentbvare]

Anyways, the first question is an easy one: what level are you aiming for? Level 50 gestalt, or something a little more sane?

The 50 is kind of a necessity, the whole group are Great Wyrm dragons, kind of the campaign setting. The rest of the group is a mix of 40-47, and I am the youngest so it wouldn't be awful if I had less levels than my siblings or wife.


My next question is Do you want a true dragon form, or is a breath weapon good enough?

I would prefer the true dragon form in some way. I figure it would also help as it would count for a decent amount of one half of the gestalt as well.


As is the case for most anime/comic inspired characters, some kind of gish is the way to go, and I'm thinking Jade Pheonix Mage or Ruby Knight Vindicator.

The JPM, besides giving duel spell and initiator progressions, has several very nice auras and short-term boosts. They have the advantage over the RKV in that they are arcane based. I'm leaning towards this one cause arcane spells are going to better reflect the abilities you say you want.

However, RKV get the ability to burn turn undead attempts for extra actions, this is very very good and mostly takes care of one of your stated abilities. They progress divine (usually cleric) casting, which is a different spell list.

If we still are going this route after the revelation about the dragon form I would have to agree. As nice as some of the Cleric spells are I really think he is an arcane caster.


The best gish spells with a little bit of refluff should serve you pretty well; haste, shield, whirling blade (refluff it so it's the "air slice" thing), wraith strike, fly (though an invocation can do the same thing), dimension door, etc.

One of the things suggested to me in an earlier post for the air slice was to use something similar to the Nightblade of Arvandor in BoED, would that work as well?

Thank you for your response.

[Ithquentbvare]

Bump? Anyone else have any input?

[Waker]

Since you have already made the comparison to several psionic classes, you might consider taking some levels in the class. I believe there is a psion/initiator theurge, though I don't have the class in front of me to confirm. Binder can also give you several of the abilities that you want, such as teleporting with Thought Travel when bound to Dantalion or some telekinesis from Far Hand with Ronove.

[Ithquentbvare]

I was hoping to maintain an arcane route.

I have heard that you can get telekinesis at will as an anima mage, how does that work? Also where is the spell greater telekinesis from?

[limejuicepowder]

How familiar are you with Binders? Though there's probably another way to do it, the 1st level vestige, Ronove, gives a telekinesis power that's usable at will. Anima mage gives duel advancement of arcane casting and binding, so that would be one way to get telekinesis.

Keep in mind though that if you are a true dragon, they gain spellcasting as a sorcerer. If you're gestalting dragon HD with class levels, it won't be necessary to gain additional casting with a class.

90% of the abilities you say you need are easily represented with a spell, so the dragon HD are going to accomplish most of what you want. Pick another class to either fill in those last few abilities, or just pick something that looks fun.

I suggest binder or warlock - both have a plethora of at-will abilities and charisma synergy.

[Yogibear41]

Andalites are the where it's at - I've got the entire series sitting 10 ft from me as I write this.


Pssh Andalites, Hork-Bajir ftw! :smallcool:

[Ithquentbvare]

How familiar are you with Binders? Though there's probably another way to do it, the 1st level vestige, Ronove, gives a telekinesis power that's usable at will. Anima mage gives duel advancement of arcane casting and binding, so that would be one way to get telekinesis.

Keep in mind though that if you are a true dragon, they gain spellcasting as a sorcerer. If you're gestalting dragon HD with class levels, it won't be necessary to gain additional casting with a class.

90% of the abilities you say you need are easily represented with a spell, so the dragon HD are going to accomplish most of what you want. Pick another class to either fill in those last few abilities, or just pick something that looks fun.

I suggest binder or warlock - both have a plethora of at-will abilities and charisma synergy.

The Spellhoarding Dragon lets me cast spells as a Wizard and use Int instead. Any thoughts on what might work there? Or would Charisma be a better option for Dragons?

[limejuicepowder]

The Spellhoarding Dragon lets me cast spells as a Wizard and use Int instead. Any thoughts on what might work there? Or would Charisma be a better option for Dragons?

If you'd like to be Int-focused (this is a good idea anyways, since int > cha), then factotum is 100% what you need to use. If you are not familiar, they are a 20-level class from dungeonscape, and they can do ANYTHING - use all skills, add int to attack, damage, AC, skill checks, str and dex checks, take extra actions, copy other class abilities, go nova with a sneak attack, heal, and even cast a few spells. Because of their immense versatility, IMO factotums make the best model for many pop-culture characters, like Indiana Jones, Jack Sparrow, McGyver, Sherlock Holmes, Rambo, Michael Weston, etc; mundane characters with large skillsets that can think or work their way out of anything they have to.

Definitely check it out. Note that the feat font of inspiration, taken multiple times, is needed to really make the class hum.

[limejuicepowder]

Pssh Andalites, Hork-Bajir ftw! :smallcool:

Yeah I love the Hork-Bajir too; I've even considered giving them DnD stats and using them in a game.

How would you stat out the average Hork-Bajir?

[Phelix-Mu]

If you are feeling crazy, consider extra age categories as per Advanced Dragons in the Epic Level Handbook. Besides all the dragon coolness, there are a couple extra perks, from what I remember. Improved Spell Capacity as a bonus feat is what I mainly remember. Very handy for npcs and villains, and at least worth a look if you are already sinking so much into being an old dragon. The main benefit, as with all dragon coolness, is that all the stats go up with each age category (except Dex). The numbers get quite silly in a hurry.

I'm not sure how much practical use you get out of dragon ascendent. Actual immortality versus practical immortality and all, though I guess you are put in danger if it's a very high-powered campaign.

Good luck. It sounds like a very interesting character with an interesting history. Long-running characters are some of my personal favorites.

[Ithquentbvare]

If you'd like to be Int-focused (this is a good idea anyways, since int > cha), then factotum is 100% what you need to use. If you are not familiar, they are a 20-level class from dungeonscape, and they can do ANYTHING - use all skills, add int to attack, damage, AC, skill checks, str and dex checks, take extra actions, copy other class abilities, go nova with a sneak attack, heal, and even cast a few spells. Because of their immense versatility, IMO factotums make the best model for many pop-culture characters, like Indiana Jones, Jack Sparrow, McGyver, Sherlock Holmes, Rambo, Michael Weston, etc; mundane characters with large skillsets that can think or work their way out of anything they have to.

Definitely check it out. Note that the feat font of inspiration, taken multiple times, is needed to really make the class hum.

That is brilliant, thank you so much. I am checking out the handbook to see if any of the suggestions or Prestige Classes work for me.


Yeah I love the Hork-Bajir too; I've even considered giving them DnD stats and using them in a game.

How would you stat out the average Hork-Bajir?

Large Monstrous Humanoid. -2 Int, -2 Wis +2 Str, +2 Dex maybe even higher on the physical scores. The Hork Bajir are fast and strong but aren't exactly renowned scholars, barring seers. They would have several "blade" attacks (claw damage I would presume), two on their arms and two on their feet. I never read about the horns doing damage so I doubt they would have a horn attack. Decent natural armor as well, they have a thick reptilian hide.


If you are feeling crazy, consider extra age categories as per Advanced Dragons in the Epic Level Handbook. Besides all the dragon coolness, there are a couple extra perks, from what I remember. Improved Spell Capacity as a bonus feat is what I mainly remember. Very handy for npcs and villains, and at least worth a look if you are already sinking so much into being an old dragon. The main benefit, as with all dragon coolness, is that all the stats go up with each age category (except Dex). The numbers get quite silly in a hurry.

I'm not sure how much practical use you get out of dragon ascendent. Actual immortality versus practical immortality and all, though I guess you are put in danger if it's a very high-powered campaign.

Good luck. It sounds like a very interesting character with an interesting history. Long-running characters are some of my personal favorites.

One side of the gestalt will be extra age categories. It will probably just be a 50 Dragon with class levels on the other side.

Dragon Ascendant has some nifty things but the entrance requirements are pretty much all bad feats (Lightning Reflexes, Iron Will AND Great Fortitude are all needed)

[Getsugaru]

I'm going to post a lot of info, so first I'll post this as is, then edit it. :smallsmile:

OK, here we go:

First off, I have a question. How is your DM ruling the Xorvintaal? There are two ways DM's read it, and knowing which way your DM leans is kind of important. The issue is this: under "Creating a Xorvintaal Dragon," there is a note that says "Spells: Xorvintaal dragons lose the ability to cast spells." Now, as I said, there are two ways DM's read this:

The template removes the Dragon's natural spellcasting, and does not affect casting gained through class levels.
The template affects all forms of casting for the Dragon, including spellcasting gained from class levels.
If your DM is of the former's idealism, then you lose your natural casting, but can keep any casting gained from class levels. However, if your DM reads it similarly to the latter, then the only way you can cast spells of any kind is through Use Magic Device, or STP Erudite. This information is crucial to building your character.

Secondly, evocation is not the only way to get blasting, and some of the best ways are, in fact, conjuration: the "Orb of X" spells. So, depending on the type of blasting you want to be able to do, different routes would be more efficient. More on that later...

Third, you mentioned that you wanted to have a "Holy Hailstorm" type breath weapon, correct? How much value do you put on the type of breath weapon you use, especially the "Holy" aspect of it? With this information, I can give you multiple variations that could work for you.

Fourth, there is the issue of weapons. As a dragon, some weapons are entirely unnecessary for you. Is the importance in the abilities, or the fact that they are weapons? This information could be considered vital to your build.

Fifth, you said you wanted to be able to transform into a humanoid form, correct? If "yes", then do I have some good news for you. So far, you've made it clear that you own or have access to the Draconomicon, Dragons of Eberron, Monster Manual 5 (Great Game is in 5, not 4), and a few others. Of importance is Dragons of Eberron, which has a feat that grants you the Alter Self ability. This means you can pick any dragon you want as your base, and still have that ability. This also allows you to look at dragons by their abilities up to great wyrm without limiting your selection to the few dragons that naturally have this ability.

How much importance are you putting on your natural dragon abilities? Do they matter deeply to you? Do you not care? Do you want to be invincible, or just your average epic-level dragon? Depending on your answer, this will affect the build I offer.

...Okay, I think that's far enough. I'll wait to continue until after those questions are answered, out of fear of overloading you. :smalltongue:

Ja-ne! (Japanese for "see ya!")

[Ithquentbvare]

I'm going to post a lot of info, so first I'll post this as is, then edit it. :smallsmile:

OK, here we go:

First off, I have a question. How is your DM ruling the Xorvintaal? There are two ways DM's read it, and knowing which way your DM leans is kind of important. The issue is this: under "Creating a Xorvintaal Dragon," there is a note that says "Spells: Xorvintaal dragons lose the ability to cast spells." Now, as I said, there are two ways DM's read this:

The template removes the Dragon's natural spellcasting, and does not affect casting gained through class levels.
The template affects all forms of casting for the Dragon, including spellcasting gained from class levels.
If your DM is of the former's idealism, then you lose your natural casting, but can keep any casting gained from class levels. However, if your DM reads it similarly to the latter, then the only way you can cast spells of any kind is through Use Magic Device, or STP Erudite. This information is crucial to building your character.

The first idealism.


Secondly, evocation is not the only way to get blasting, and some of the best ways are, in fact, conjuration: the "Orb of X" spells. So, depending on the type of blasting you want to be able to do, different routes would be more efficient. More on that later...

As I mentioned earlier the Archmage's Arcane Fire was an option, but after reviewing the Orbs I think I might prefer those. Was thinking of being a Conjuration specialist as that would also handle the short teleports. (PHII I believe)


Third, you mentioned that you wanted to have a "Holy Hailstorm" type breath weapon, correct? How much value do you put on the type of breath weapon you use, especially the "Holy" aspect of it? With this information, I can give you multiple variations that could work for you.

As I mentioned earlier it is supposed to be fire encased in ice. While the origin is divine, I would presume the damage would be half fire and half cold. I only called it Holy Hail because that is the terminology I was given in class. I would presume it is either a variant of the Breath Weapon Admixture spell OR just a regular breath weapon with half damage cold and the other half fire. In theory I could use Innate Spell on Breath Weapon Admixture, but that would be giving up a level 17 spell slot.


Fourth, there is the issue of weapons. As a dragon, some weapons are entirely unnecessary for you. Is the importance in the abilities, or the fact that they are weapons? This information could be considered vital to your build.

Honestly it is a mix. The Summoned Swords and teleporting seem like something the character can do more than the blade. The Soul Reaver aspect I have decided to drop. So really the sword can do the ranged Plane Shift, a reanimating Tornado Blast (which I am positive is an epic level spell. The original draft has it so the sword knows the spell but the caster has to expend the slot)


Fifth, you said you wanted to be able to transform into a humanoid form, correct? If "yes", then do I have some good news for you. So far, you've made it clear that you own or have access to the Draconomicon, Dragons of Eberron, Monster Manual 5 (Great Game is in 5, not 4), and a few others. Of importance is Dragons of Eberron, which has a feat that grants you the Alter Self ability. This means you can pick any dragon you want as your base, and still have that ability. This also allows you to look at dragons by their abilities up to great wyrm without limiting your selection to the few dragons that naturally have this ability.

Indeed I have checked that out, along with the Half-Dragon form and Hidden Strength feats. Visually he looks to be a silver (or platinum I suppose) dragon with red around the edges of the scales. I said he was Silver/Red because it was cold and fire damage for breath weapons.


How much importance are you putting on your natural dragon abilities? Do they matter deeply to you? Do you not care? Do you want to be invincible, or just your average epic-level dragon? Depending on your answer, this will affect the build I offer.

Really my only concern is with the breath weapon being strong, the natural attacks are meh, natural spells aren't the greatest in the world, and Frightful Presence is pretty bad. I don't even want that high of a strength score, I prefer the casting stat (Int in this case), Con and a bit of Charisma.


...Okay, I think that's far enough. I'll wait to continue until after those questions are answered, out of fear of overloading you. :smalltongue:

Ja-ne! (Japanese for "see ya!")

I'm pretty good at being able to answer a lot of questions.

Thank you everyone. And arrivederci.

[Gavinfoxx]

Loredrake, Spellhoarding, Magic Blooded, Tome Dragon! ;) ;)

If you are playing a Dragon, go all out with the Casty.

[Getsugaru]

The first idealism.
OK. With that in mind, we don't have to go STP Erudite unless you really want to. :smallwink:

As I mentioned earlier the Archmage's Arcane Fire was an option, but after reviewing the Orbs I think I might prefer those. Was thinking of being a Conjuration specialist as that would also handle the short teleports. (PHII I believe)
I can't find the 3.5 one, but if you plan to specialize, might I suggest you take a look at the Pathfinder Specialization options (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools), specifically Divination (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/divination)'s Forewarned (Su), Prescience (Su)(Foresight (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/divination/foresight)), Foretell (Su)(Also Foresight); & Illusion (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/illusion)'s Bedeviling Aura (Su)(Phantasm (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/illusion/phantasm)), Binding Darkness (Sp)(Shadow (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/illusion/shadow)). Those abilities are, in my opinion, amazing.

As I mentioned earlier it is supposed to be fire encased in ice. While the origin is divine, I would presume the damage would be half fire and half cold. I only called it Holy Hail because that is the terminology I was given in class. I would presume it is either a variant of the Breath Weapon Admixture spell OR just a regular breath weapon with half damage cold and the other half fire. In theory I could use Innate Spell on Breath Weapon Admixture, but that would be giving up a level 17 spell slot.
The reason I asked what you meant was because of the Unholy Ravager of Tiamat prestige class's abilities; specifically its Breath Weapon Substitution and its Profane Blast. I know it wasn't exactly what you are looking for, but it's close, and a wonderful class.
But now I bet you're thinking "that class requires I be evil and give up my arcane casting, so why would I want to take that?" Here's the thing: if you can get the Evil subtype (which is actually pretty easy), you dan be any alignment you want and still qualify. And as for the casting, because you have spell-hoarding, you don't have an effective sorcerer casting level, you've got an effective wizard caster level, therefore, you wouldn't lose it (especially since it sounds like your DM is a nice guy). Plus the class also nets you some divine casting(which could be useful in a pinch), and better yet, improves the effect of your Frightful Presence, making it more worthwhile. Smite can sometimes be fun too. :smallwink:

Honestly it is a mix. The Summoned Swords and teleporting seem like something the character can do more than the blade. The Soul Reaver aspect I have decided to drop. So really the sword can do the ranged Plane Shift, a reanimating Tornado Blast (which I am positive is an epic level spell. The original draft has it so the sword knows the spell but the caster has to expend the slot)
Since you make it sound like sword combat is very important to you, might I suggest instead of Loredrake you take Wyrm of War? It gives you profession with all simple and martial weapons, all armor, all shields, and bonus feats that can be fighter or any combat-related feat tied to dragon abilities (Wingover, etc.). Plus, since you appear to be using Tome of Battle, it can also improve your initiator levels in exchange for sorcerer casting (don't have to, but can). Wyrm of War might be a better fit than Loredrake, in this case.
As for the teleporting, I know of two great routes. The first is Shadow Blink from Tome of Battle, which allows you to teleport as a swift action. The other method is the Incarnum Soulmeld Blinkshirt, which lets you teleport in the same way, but over much shorter distances.

Indeed I have checked that out, along with the Half-Dragon form and Hidden Strength feats. Visually he looks to be a silver (or platinum I suppose) dragon with red around the edges of the scales. I said he was Silver/Red because it was cold and fire damage for breath weapons.
The main reason I asked was because of this: some dragons have features other than the norm or the spell-likes (Silver Dragons have Cloud Walking, White Dragons are under a Spider Climb-like effect with ice, Force Dragons become made of Force, etc.). You've already confirmed that you're already a Great Wyrm (unless you choose something like an epic dragon), so I thought that it might be worth your while to look at dragons with abilities like those(some of them are great, some not, but they're all worth checking out). You've confirmed the sort of look you want, so we can (if you want) limit that list to Platinum-ey dragons like silver, white, steel, etc. Who knows, you may find a specific dragon type you really like!

Really my only concern is with the breath weapon being strong, the natural attacks are meh, natural spells aren't the greatest in the world, and Frightful Presence is pretty bad. I don't even want that high of a strength score, I prefer the casting stat (Int in this case), Con and a bit of Charisma.
Like I said above, there are some that have stuff you may want, and ways to improve the ones they all share. Personally, I like White Dragons because they have every movement type, Silver Dragons because they can walk on clouds, and clouds are easy to make (fog is just a cloud that's close to the ground, after all), Deep Dragons because they get both True Seeing and immunity to Charm effects, etc. Trust me, there are all sorts of dragons out there, you just have to look.

I'm pretty good at being able to answer a lot of questions.
Good to know. I was just worried because I'm known to overload my friends and family members with bombardments of questions and comments when it comes to topics I like. :smallbiggrin:

[Kuulvheysoon]

Yeah I love the Hork-Bajir too; I've even considered giving them DnD stats and using them in a game.

How would you stat out the average Hork-Bajir?

Hells no - Taxxons FTW.

[Yogibear41]

Yeah I love the Hork-Bajir too; I've even considered giving them DnD stats and using them in a game.

How would you stat out the average Hork-Bajir?

Amazing Str and Con, a slight bump to dex and a huge penalty to int, if you want to be true to the books they were about as smart as a young child 5 or 6ish if I remeber correctly, unless of course they happen to be the like 1/100000 that has the genetic anomoly where they are really smart.

Probably make them medium but give them powerful build or something similar they were big but not that big probably goliath size if memory serves.

Also claw natural attacks and natural armor bonus, maybe a bite attack? its been so long since I read that book.

See Hork-Bajir chronicles for a reference.

[limejuicepowder]

Amazing Str and Con, a slight bump to dex and a huge penalty to int, if you want to be true to the books they were about as smart as a young child 5 or 6ish if I remeber correctly, unless of course they happen to be the like 1/100000 that has the genetic anomoly where they are really smart.

Probably make them medium but give them powerful build or something similar they were big but not that big probably goliath size if memory serves.

Also claw natural attacks and natural armor bonus, maybe a bite attack? its been so long since I read that book.

See Hork-Bajir chronicles for a reference.

The difficulty I've always had is scaling their power relative to animals, which are generally not that impressive in DnD. The Hork-Bajir need to be tough, but not beyond the power of tigers, bears, and gorillas. Based on that, I would put them at -

2 monsterous humanoid HD
medium size, powerful build
Str +4, Dex +2, Con +4, Int -6, Cha -2
base speed 40 feet, climb 20 ft
+8 to climb, +4 balance, +4 jump
2 blade attacks for 1d6

LA +0

Seers would be the same but +4 Int, no Cha penalty instead of -6 Int and -2 Cha

Oh and taxxons are disgusting....like really disgusting. I don't even like touching normal-sized centipedes.

[Ithquentbvare]

OK. With that in mind, we don't have to go STP Erudite unless you really want to. :smallwink:

I have been told to "avoid that cheese at all costs."



I can't find the 3.5 one, but if you plan to specialize, might I suggest you take a look at the Pathfinder Specialization options (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools), specifically Divination (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/divination)'s Forewarned (Su), Prescience (Su)(Foresight (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/divination/foresight)), Foretell (Su)(Also Foresight); & Illusion (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/illusion)'s Bedeviling Aura (Su)(Phantasm (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/illusion/phantasm)), Binding Darkness (Sp)(Shadow (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-schools/paizo---arcane-schools/classic-arcane-schools/illusion/shadow)). Those abilities are, in my opinion, amazing.

I am not much of an Illusion guy, conjuring seems to be my bag.
What I am talking about is called Immediate Magic on page 68 of PHII.


The reason I asked what you meant was because of the Unholy Ravager of Tiamat prestige class's abilities; specifically its Breath Weapon Substitution and its Profane Blast. I know it wasn't exactly what you are looking for, but it's close, and a wonderful class.
But now I bet you're thinking "that class requires I be evil and give up my arcane casting, so why would I want to take that?" Here's the thing: if you can get the Evil subtype (which is actually pretty easy), you dan be any alignment you want and still qualify. And as for the casting, because you have spell-hoarding, you don't have an effective sorcerer casting level, you've got an effective wizard caster level, therefore, you wouldn't lose it (especially since it sounds like your DM is a nice guy). Plus the class also nets you some divine casting(which could be useful in a pinch), and better yet, improves the effect of your Frightful Presence, making it more worthwhile. Smite can sometimes be fun too. :smallwink:

I also need to be able to cast Divine spells AND have the Destruction domain. I like the idea but I am unsure how viable it is.


Since you make it sound like sword combat is very important to you, might I suggest instead of Loredrake you take Wyrm of War? It gives you profession with all simple and martial weapons, all armor, all shields, and bonus feats that can be fighter or any combat-related feat tied to dragon abilities (Wingover, etc.). Plus, since you appear to be using Tome of Battle, it can also improve your initiator levels in exchange for sorcerer casting (don't have to, but can). Wyrm of War might be a better fit than Loredrake, in this case.

As for the teleporting, I know of two great routes. The first is Shadow Blink from Tome of Battle, which allows you to teleport as a swift action. The other method is the Incarnum Soulmeld Blinkshirt, which lets you teleport in the same way, but over much shorter distances.

Never intended on taking Loredrake, just Spellhoarding (which is from Dragon Mag). And I would love to use Shadow Blink, had that on my old build. Problem is that Warblade doesn't get Shadow Hand and taking Swordsage probably isn't the greatest idea. So my only real option is taking the Martial Study feat (I think it is named) which gives me a maneuver. Otherwise the Conjuration Wizard ability should work just as well.


The main reason I asked was because of this: some dragons have features other than the norm or the spell-likes (Silver Dragons have Cloud Walking, White Dragons are under a Spider Climb-like effect with ice, Force Dragons become made of Force, etc.). You've already confirmed that you're already a Great Wyrm (unless you choose something like an epic dragon), so I thought that it might be worth your while to look at dragons with abilities like those(some of them are great, some not, but they're all worth checking out). You've confirmed the sort of look you want, so we can (if you want) limit that list to Platinum-ey dragons like silver, white, steel, etc. Who knows, you may find a specific dragon type you really like!

Silver dragons, all the way. I love the look, I love the fluff, the breath weapon(s), even the spell like abilities. That is what I was figuring my base dragon around before.

You mentioned earlier you might have builds to suggest?


Amazing Str and Con, a slight bump to dex and a huge penalty to int, if you want to be true to the books they were about as smart as a young child 5 or 6ish if I remeber correctly, unless of course they happen to be the like 1/100000 that has the genetic anomoly where they are really smart.

Probably make them medium but give them powerful build or something similar they were big but not that big probably goliath size if memory serves.

Also claw natural attacks and natural armor bonus, maybe a bite attack? its been so long since I read that book.

See Hork-Bajir chronicles for a reference.

They didn't use their beaks for bite attacks. The Yeerks valued them for the blades and how easy they were to control. They were supposed to be a Type 5 species until the Andalites nearly wiped them out. Douchebags.

They were about seven feet tall.


The difficulty I've always had is scaling their power relative to animals, which are generally not that impressive in DnD. The Hork-Bajir need to be tough, but not beyond the power of tigers, bears, and gorillas. Based on that, I would put them at -

2 monsterous humanoid HD
medium size, powerful build
Str +4, Dex +2, Con +4, Int -6, Cha -2
base speed 40 feet, climb 20 ft
+8 to climb, +4 balance, +4 jump
2 blade attacks for 1d6

LA +0

Seers would be the same but +4 Int, no Cha penalty instead of -6 Int and -2 Cha

seems right. My mistake on the Large size. Also you think 20 ft. climb cuts it for a species who's home is IN the trees?


Oh and taxxons are disgusting....like really disgusting. I don't even like touching normal-sized centipedes.

YES.

[limejuicepowder]

seems right. My mistake on the Large size. Also you think 20 ft. climb cuts it for a species who's home is IN the trees?


Well...also remember their homes trees make the biggest redwoods look like christmas trees. This means the branches are practically flat, level floors. They can climb by digging in their blades, but they aren't squirrels.

However, an argument could be made that they should get the brachiation feat as a bonus. They swing through the trees quite adeptly.

oooo and I forgot natural armor. Probably +2 or 3

[Getsugaru]

I am not much of an Illusion guy, conjuring seems to be my bag.
What I am talking about is called Immediate Magic on page 68 of PHII.
Main reason I mentioned illusion is because of Shadowcraft Mage, but you've made it clear that STP Erudite is too much cheese, so Shadowcraft Mage is clearly out of the question. As for the divination, I suggested it for 3 reasons:

If it's your specialization school, you only lose access to one othe school, instead of two.
The true benefits of specializing in Divination (if you can convince your DM to let you use the specializations from Pathfinder) come from the abilities it grants, esp. the ones I mentioned by name.
The extra spell-per-day isn't going to matter too much to you, and neither is the +2 to spellcraft for learning spells of the school, and, let's face it, being able to cast an extra Foresight, etc. will probably be more useful than an extra Orb of X at your level. :smallwink:


I also need to be able to cast Divine spells AND have the Destruction domain. I like the idea but I am unsure how viable it is.
I'm sorry, but I can't really believe that you've never looked at the cleric. One level in the class, and you get two domains, divine casting, and spontaneous healing/inflicting spells. And if you go Cloistered Cleric (from Unearthed Arcana), you get three domains (one of which is always knowledge, which , frankly, is wonderful, but can be traded for knowledge devotion, which is fantastic!), the same divine casting, and an ability that quite literally states that it is bardic knowledge under another name. So, yeah, that problem is very easily mitigated. :smallamused:

Never intended on taking Loredrake, just Spellhoarding (which is from Dragon Mag). And I would love to use Shadow Blink, had that on my old build. Problem is that Warblade doesn't get Shadow Hand and taking Swordsage probably isn't the greatest idea. So my only real option is taking the Martial Study feat (I think it is named) which gives me a maneuver. Otherwise the Conjuration Wizard ability should work just as well.
Swordsage is actually a pretty good class. But don't just take my word for it. Have a look at this (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=s578nu0497h169upv9ors7qhl0&topic=357).
Also, in your OP, you mentioned Loredrake, so that's why I commented on it.

Silver dragons, all the way. I love the look, I love the fluff, the breath weapon(s), even the spell like abilities. That is what I was figuring my base dragon around before.

You mentioned earlier you might have builds to suggest?
Yep. But rather than go through the list, I'm instead going to help out by taking your input and trying to make a build specifically for you! Working on it now, using what you've told us and your original build in the OP. When I have a workable beta, I'll post it.

Also, how do you feel about templates? :smallbiggrin:

[Ithquentbvare]

Main reason I mentioned illusion is because of Shadowcraft Mage, but you've made it clear that STP Erudite is too much cheese, so Shadowcraft Mage is clearly out of the question. As for the divination, I suggested it for 3 reasons:

If it's your specialization school, you only lose access to one othe school, instead of two.
The true benefits of specializing in Divination (if you can convince your DM to let you use the specializations from Pathfinder) come from the abilities it grants, esp. the ones I mentioned by name.
The extra spell-per-day isn't going to matter too much to you, and neither is the +2 to spellcraft for learning spells of the school, and, let's face it, being able to cast an extra Foresight, etc. will probably be more useful than an extra Orb of X at your level. :smallwink:


Just because it was a recommendation doesn't mean I will take it, that advice was from another poster on a board. I personally don't want to go back to psionics, I feel arcane is a bit more up my alley. I am quite interested in the Shadowcraft Mage myself, honestly.


I'm sorry, but I can't really believe that you've never looked at the cleric. One level in the class, and you get two domains, divine casting, and spontaneous healing/inflicting spells. And if you go Cloistered Cleric (from Unearthed Arcana), you get three domains (one of which is always knowledge, which , frankly, is wonderful, but can be traded for knowledge devotion, which is fantastic!), the same divine casting, and an ability that quite literally states that it is bardic knowledge under another name. So, yeah, that problem is very easily mitigated. :smallamused:

: Sigh. : This was my mistake for not clarifying myself, my apologies. Of course I have looked at the Cleric and it's variants. I meant that I was unsure if it would be viable because I had thought we were discussing going down the arcane route solely and I am trying to avoid going MAD.


Swordsage is actually a pretty good class. But don't just take my word for it. Have a look at this (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=s578nu0497h169upv9ors7qhl0&topic=357).

I know, once again just trying to avoid the MAD. But I think a dip for one or two levels might not be too detrimental. The boost to AC isn't bad and dragons have arbitrarily high scores as it is.


Also, in your OP, you mentioned Loredrake, so that's why I commented on it.

: Goes and corrects that. Meant Wyrm of War, had right decription, wrong name.


Yep. But rather than go through the list, I'm instead going to help out by taking your input and trying to make a build specifically for you! Working on it now, using what you've told us and your original build in the OP. When I have a workable beta, I'll post it.

Also, how do you feel about templates? :smallbiggrin:

That was a misunderstanding on my part about the builds. And I don't mind templates.




Well...also remember their homes trees make the biggest redwoods look like christmas trees. This means the branches are practically flat, level floors. They can climb by digging in their blades, but they aren't squirrels.

However, an argument could be made that they should get the brachiation feat as a bonus. They swing through the trees quite adeptly.

oooo and I forgot natural armor. Probably +2 or 3

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=14911550#post14911550

Figured that way we can discuss it more in depth, for anyone interested.

[Ithquentbvare]

Page 48 of PHII (Conjuration Immediate Magic) Spell like ability usable Int Mod/day as swift action, CL is 10+1/2CL+Int mod, can teleport 10 ft.

I was thinking this could be a good replacement for the teleportation as well, especially if I have to take the levels in Wizard because of Xorvintaal.

[Getsugaru]

After a long week filled with character building, school hardships, and a few other things, my beta is finally in the alpha stage. I'm going to post this now, then edit it in. Hope it's to your liking :smallsmile:

EDIT: It's taken me all day to post this much, and I'm still not done. :smallfrown: With how late it is where I live, I'm going to stop for now and pick it up tomorrow. Sorry...:smallfrown:

EDIT 2: After three days, I'm pretty much finished, apart from a few tiny finishing touches. In my "letting you know I've updated it again" post, I'll be posting the tasty flavor text/explanations. Therefore, I'm going to say this is ready for your checking out. Can't wait to hear what you think...


Ideals:
The unique Silver/Red Dragon I mentioned earlier with the Holy Hail breath.
Telekinesis at will.
Minor evocation properties, even like an Archmage's Arcane Fire ability (I know how bad Evocation is, but I have always seen him as a mix of blaster and controller)
Short teleportation.
Some mix of the swords I detailed above.

NOTE: If you can, I suggest trying to convince your DM to use the dragons and wizard from Pathfinder. If he says no, then I will re-post this using only 3.5. :smallsmile:
NOTE: For the purpose of feats, etc., I've assumed a minimum attribute score of 13 in all 6 attributes at 1st level, and that your attribute score is at minimum the values of the Great Wyrm on the SRD. Currently don't remember how Dragons increase their Attributes, but, if I remember correctly, by Great Wyrm, most of your Attributes should be near 30.

Ithquentbvare (human name: Ryokou Kavallion): Silver Dragon {Silver Dragon (MM); Spell-Hoarding, Ravening (DRR313); Red Dragon Major Bloodline (UA); Wyrm of War (DE); Xorvintaal (MM5)}
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll209/Violet-Dream_2008/Dragons/silver_dragon_by_Ckathexis.jpg
Hope the image is to your liking. If not, here's another one...
http://i337.photobucket.com/albums/n365/b_nebb/SilverDragon.png
Image by Nevitan (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11141905&postcount=85).
{table=head]Level|HD (Age Category)|Class Level|Base Attack Bonus (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm#attackBonus)|Fort Save (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm#fortitude)|Ref Save (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm#reflex)|Will Save (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm#will)

1st|1(N/A)|Dragon-blood Cloistered Cleric 9 (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=4804.0)(RotD)(UA)|
+6|
+6|
+3|
+6

2nd|2(N/A)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 1|
+7|
+8|
+5|
+8

3rd|3(N/A)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 2 (Bloodline 1)|
+8|
+9|
+6|
+9

4th|4(N/A)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 3|
+9|
+9|
+6|
+9

5th|5(N/A)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 4|
+10|
+10|
+7|
+10

6th|6(N/A)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 5 (Bloodline 2)|
+11|
+10|
+7|
+10

7th|7(Wyrmling)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 6|
+12|
+11|
+8|
+11

8th|8(Wyrmling)|"Pathfinder" Wizard Illusionist 7|
+13|
+11|
+8|
+11

9th|9(Wyrmling)|Shadowcraft Mage 1 (RoS)|
+14|
+12|
+9|
+12

10th|10(Very Young)|Shadowcraft Mage 2|
+15|
+12|
+9|
+12

11th|11(Very Young)|Shadowcraft Mage 3|
+16|
+13|
+10|
+13

12th|12(Very Young)|Shadowcraft Mage 4 (Bloodline 3)|
+17|
+13|
+10|
+13

13th|13(Young)|Shadowcraft Mage 5|
+18|
+14|
+11|
+14

14th|14(Young)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 1 (Dr)|
+19|
+14|
+11|
+14

15th|15(Young)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 2|
+20|
+15|
+12|
+15

16th|16(Juvenile)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 3|
+21|
+15|
+12|
+15

17th|17(Juvenile)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 4|
+22|
+16|
+13|
+16

18th|18(Juvenile)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 5|
+23|
+16|
+13|
+16

19th|19(Young Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 6|
+24|
+17|
+14|
+17

20th|20(Young Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 7|
+25|
+17|
+14|
+17

21st|21(Young Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 8|
+26|
+18|
+15|
+18

22nd|22(Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 9|
+27|
+18|
+15|
+18

23rd|23(Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 10|
+28|
+19|
+16|
+16

24th|24(Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 11|
+29|
+19|
+16|
+19

25th|25(Mature Adult)|Unholy Ravager of Tiamat 12|
+30|
+20|
+17|
+20

26th|26(Mature Adult)|Dragon Ascendant 1 (Dr)|
+31|
+20|
+17|
+20

27th|27(Mature Adult)|Dragon Ascendant 2|
+32|
+21|
+18|
+21

28th|28(Old)|Dragon Ascendant 3|
+33|
+21|
+18|
+21

29th|29(Old)|Dragon Ascendant 4|
+34|
+22|
+19|
+22

30th|30(Old)|Dragon Ascendant 5|
+35|
+22|
+19|
+22

31st|31(Very Old)|Dragon Ascendant 6|
+36|
+23|
+20|
+23

32nd|32(Very Old)|Dragon Ascendant 7|
+37|
+23|
+20|
+23

33rd|33(Very Old)|Dragon Ascendant 8|
+38|
+24|
+21|
+24

34th|34(Ancient)|Dragon Ascendant 9|
+39|
+24|
+21|
+24

35th|35(Ancient)|Dragon Ascendant 10|
+40|
+25|
+22|
+25

36th|36(Ancient)|Dragon Ascendant 11|
+41|
+25|
+22|
+25

37th|37(Wyrm)|Dragon Ascendant 12|
+42|
+26|
+23|
+26

38th|38(Wyrm)|Swordsage 1 (ToB)|
+43|
+26|
+23|
+26

39th|39(Wyrm)|Jade Phoenix Mage 1 (ToB)|
+44|
+27|
+24|
+27

40th|40(Great Wyrm)|Jade Phoenix Mage 2|
+45|
+27|
+24|
+27

41st|41(Great Wyrm)|Jade Phoenix Mage 3|
+46|
+28|
+25|
+28

42nd|42(Great Wyrm)|Jade Phoenix Mage 4|
+47|
+28|
+25|
+28

43rd|43(Great Wyrm+1)|Jade Phoenix Mage 5|
+48|
+29|
+26|
+29

44th|44(Great Wyrm+1)|Master of the Nine 1 (ToB)|
+49|
+29|
+26|
+29

45th|45(Great Wyrm+1)|Master of the Nine 2|
+50|
+30|
+27|
+30

46th|46(Great Wyrm+2)|Sand Shaper 1 (Sa)|
+51|
+30|
+27|
+30

47th|47(Great Wyrm+2)|Sand Shaper 2|
+52|
+31|
+28|
+31

48th|48(Great Wyrm+2)|Sand Shaper 3|
+53|
+31|
+28|
+31

49th|49(Great Wyrm+3)|Sand Shaper 4|
+54|
+32|
+29|
+32

50th|50(Great Wyrm+3)|Sand Shaper 5|
+55|
+32|
+29|
+32[/table]{table=head]Level|Racial Features|Class Features|Feats|Skills Ranks Needed by this Level***|A0|A1|A2|A3|A4|A5|A6|A7|A8|A9|D0|D1|D2|D3 |D4|D5|D6|D7|D8|D9|Notes

1st|N/A|Rebuke Undead, Lore (Ex), Domains (Destruction), Divine Spellcasting, Energy Sustenance|Knowledge Devotion (trade for Knowledge Domain), Trickery Devotion (trade for Trickery Domain), Divine Metamagic, Hover (Flaw), Embed Spell Focus (Flaw)|/|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|Flaws (Quick, Illiterate)

2nd|N/A|Summon Familiar (Hummingbird suggested for its +4 to initiative and ability to speak like a raven), Arcane Spellcasting**|Scribe Scroll (Wizard), Alertness (Bloodline)|/|3|1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

3rd|N/A|-|Adroit Flyby Attack|/|4|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

4th|N/A|-|Entangling Exhalation (Wyrm of War)|/|4|2|1|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

5th|N/A|-|-|/|4|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

6th|N/A|-|Power Attack, Spell Focus (Illusion) (Wizard)|/|4|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

7th|Alternate Form 3/Day, Acid & Cold Immunity, Weakness to Fire|-|Eschew Materials (Spellhoarding), Lightning Reflexes (Spellhoarding)*|/|4|3|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

8th|-|-|Recover Breath (Wyrm of War)|Bluff 4, Hide 4|4|4|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

9th|-|Cloak of Shadow|Tempest Breath|/|4|4|3|3|2|-|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

10th|Cloudwalking, Detect Evil§|Silent Illusion|-|/|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

11th|-|Shadow Illusion|-|/|4|4|4|3|3|2|-|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

12th|-|Extended Illusion|Draconic Knowledge, Maximize Breath (Wyrm of War)||4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

13th|Graceful Flight|Powerful Shadow Magic|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|By this point, the alignment subtype ritual from Savage Species must be undertaken to gain the Evil subtype; otherwise, you will have to be of an evil alignment.

14th|-|Divine Conversion (has no effect), Smite|Great Fortitude (Bloodline)*|/|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|0+1|-|-|-|-|

15th|-|Breath Weapon Substitution|Iron Will|/|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|-|6|4+1|4+1|3+1|3+1|1+1|-|-|-|-|

16th|Fog Vision, Feather Fall§|Aura of Despair|Improved Speed (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|6|5+1|4+1|4+1|3+1|1+1|1+1|-|-|-|

17th|-|Smite 2/Day|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|6|5+1|4+1|4+1|3+1|2+1|2+1|-|-|-|

18th|-|-|Heighten Spell|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|-|6|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|2+1|2+1|1+1|-|-|

19th|DR 5/Magic, Spell Resistance|-|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|6|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|2+1|3+1|2+1 |-|-|

20th|-|Profane Blast|Shape Breath (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|3+1|3+1|2+1 |1+1|-|

21st|-|Smite 3/Day|Fast Healing|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|2|1|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|3+1|3+1|3+1 |2+1|-|

22nd|Frightful Presence, Fog Cloud§|-|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|3|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|3+1|4+1|3+1 |3+1|2+1|

23rd|-|-|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|3|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |3+1|3+1|

24th|-|-|Mindsight(LoM), Multiattack (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|3|3|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

25th|DR 10/Magic|Mas Profane Blast, Smite 4/Day|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

26th|-|Awesome Aura (Fear)|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

27th|-|Hit Point Increase|Earth Sense|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

28th|Cold Aura, Control Winds§|Transmutation Immunity|Improved Multiattack (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

29th|-|Hit Point Increase, Increased Damage Reduction|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

30th|-|Awesome Aura (Resolve)|Earth Spell|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

31st|DR 15/Magic|Hit Point Increase, Lifewarding|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

32nd|-|Deflection Bonus|Rapidstrike (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

33rd|-|Hit Point Increase, Increased Damage Reduction|Invisible Spell|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

34th|Reflective Scales, Control Weather§|Iron Mind|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

35th|-|Awesome Aura (Daze), Hit Point Increase|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

36th|-|Resistance to Fire, Spell Resistance|Arcane Thesis (Silent Image), Power Climb (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

37th|DR 20/Magic|Hit Point Increase, Immortality|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

38th|-|Quick to Act +1, Discipline Focus (Weapon Focus), Maneuvers|-||4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+ 1|4+1|4+1|

39th|-|Arcane Wrath, Rite of Waking|Adaptive Style|Concentration 9, Knowledge (Arcana, Religion, & History) 2 each|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|4+1|

40th|True Courage, Reverse Gravity§|Mystic Phoenix Stance|Power Dive (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

41st|-|-|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

42nd|-|Empowering Strike|Persistent Spell|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

43rd|-|-|-|Any four Discipline Skills 10 (I suggest Tumble, Concentration, Hide, & Balance)|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|4+1|4+1|

44th|-|-|Rapid Breath (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

45th|-|Dual Stance|Extend Spell|Knowledge (Nature) 4, Survival 4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+ 1|4+1|4+1|

46th|-|Desert Insight, Dust Magic, Sand Shape|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

47th|-|Sandform|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

48th|-|Sand stride|Vital Recovery, Improved Rapidstrike (Wyrm of War)|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

49th|-|Improved Sand Shape|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|

50th|-|Improved Dust Magic 3/day|-|/|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|4|6|5+1|5+1|5+1|5+1|4+1|4+1|4+1 |4+1|4+1|[/table]Final Results at 50:{table=head]Name|Ithquentbvare (human name: Ryokou Kavallion):
Size/Type:|TN Colossal+ Dragon (Cold, Evil)
Hit Dice:|1100 (600+{10[CON]x50})
Initiative:|5=1+4(Hummingbird Familiar)
Speed:|60 ft. (10 squares), Fly 270 ft. (Poor)
Armor Class:|82=10+53(Natural)+10(Deflection)+1 (DEX)-8(Size)+10(Armor)+6(Swordsage), Touch 19, Flat-Footed 81
Attack Bonus:|88=55(BAB)+15(Epic)+18(STR)
Natural Attacks:|Claws 4d8, Bite 6d6, Wings 4d6, Tail Slap 4d8, Crush 6d6, Tail Sweep 4d6
Space/Reach:|30 ft./60 ft. (Tail Slap, Tail Sweep Radius), 40 ft. (Bite, Wings), 30 ft. (Claws)
Special Attacks:|Breath Weapon: 80 ft. Cone or 160 ft. Line of Cold (30d8 Cold [+4 w/Deep Breath], Reflex DC=35+10 for half), Breath Weapon: 30 ft. Cone or 60 ft. Line of Fire (6d8 Fire [+4 w/Deep Breath], Reflex DC=35+10 for half), Spell-Like Abilities, Profane Blast (Touch: 880 ft., 30d12 Divine or 6d12 Divine [+4 w/Deep Breath]), Mass Profane Blast (80 ft. or 30 ft. Cone, or 160 ft. or 60 ft. Line, 30d12 or 6d12 Divine, respectively [+4 w/Deep Breath], Reflex DC=35+10 for half), Draconic Roar (30 ft. circle 15d8 Sonic+Deafen, Fort DC=35+CON for half & no Deafen), Smite 4/Day, Maneuvers, Spells, etc.
Special Qualities:|Imunity (Acid, Cold, Fire, Transmutation, Energy Drain, Ability Drain, Ability Damage, Mind-Affecting Effects, Sleep, Paralysis, Divinations pertaining to Xorvintaal), Awesome Aura (Fear, Resolve, Daze), Aura of Despair, Alternate Form, Senses (Dragon Senses [Darkvision 120 ft., Blindsense 60 ft., Superior Low-Light Vision], Telepathy 10-miles w/Exarchs, Telapathy 100-miles w/Willing Xorvintaal Dragons, Mindsight {Blindsight equal to Telepathy range [100 miles:smallamused:]}), Create Exarchs, Xorvintaal Abilities (5 of your choice, but the following are my suggestion: Deep Breath, Draconic Roar, Dragon Eyes, Twist of Fate, Rejuvination), Divine Spellcasting (CL=23, 24 w/Illusion Spells), Arcane Casting (CL 24, 25 w/Illusion Spells), Maneuvers$ (IL 32=8[Initiator Classes]+21[Non-Initiator Classes/RHD]+3[Bloodline]; Maneuvers Known=31, Maneuvers Readied=15, Stances Known=8)
Saves:|Fortitude 59=32(Class/RHD)+10+2+15(Epic), Reflex 47=29(Class/RHD)+1+2+15(Epic), Will 55=32(Class/RHD)+6+2+15(Epic)
Abilities:|STR: 47 (43+Ravening's+4), DEX: 13, CON: 31, INT: 32 (30+Spellhoarding's+2), WIS: 23 (31-Ravening's-4-Spellhoarding's-4), CHA: 30
Skills:|This is up to you, but I suggest maxed out Knowledge skills (you get all of them), Bluff, Diplomacy, Spot, Listen, Tumble, Concentration, Hide, Move Silently, and Fly. Again, however, it's your call.
Feats:|Knowledge Devotion (trade for Knowledge Domain), Trickery Devotion (trade for Trickery Domain), Divine Metamagic, Hover (Flaw), Embed Spell Focus (Flaw), Scribe Scroll (Wizard), Alertness (Bloodline), Adroit Flyby Attack, Entangling Exhalation (Wyrm of War), Power Attack, Spell Focus (Illusion) (Wizard), Eschew Materials (Spellhoarding), Lightning Reflexes (Spellhoarding)*, Recover Breath (Wyrm of War), Tempest Breath, Draconic Knowledge, Maximize Breath (Wyrm of War), Great Fortitude (Bloodline)*, Iron Will, Improved Speed (Wyrm of War), Heighten Spell, Shape Breath (Wyrm of War), Fast Healing, Mindsight, Multiattack (Wyrm of War), Earth Sense, Improved Multiattack (Wyrm of War), Earth Spell, Rapidstrike (Wyrm of War), Invisible Spell, Arcane Thesis (Silent Image), Power Climb (Wyrm of War), Adaptive Style, Power Dive (Wyrm of War), Persistent Spell, Rapid Breath (Wyrm of War), Extend Spell, Vital Recovery, Improved Rapidstrike (Wyrm of War)
Spells Per Day:|Cleric: 0: 6, 1: 5+1, 2: 5+1, 3: 5+1, 4: 5+1, 5: 4+1, 6: 4+1, 7: 4+1, 8: 4+1, 9: 4+1; Arcane: 0: 4, 1: 4, 2: 4, 3: 4, 4: 4, 5: 4, 6: 4, 7: 4, 8: 4, 9: 4
Spell-Like Abilities:|At Will: Detect Evil, Feather Fall, Fog Cloud, Control Winds, Control Weather, Reverse Gravity, Charm Monster [Exarchs only], Breath Weapon Substitution (as part of Breath Weapon attack); 3/Day: Scrying [Exarchs only]
Class Features:|In the table above.
Suggested Possessions:|+5 Twilight Mithral Breastplate of Nimbleness (+5 enhancement, +5 Breastplate (ACP=0, Arcane Spell Failure 5%, DEX +7, Counts as Light Armor), and your swords, which I'm still doing research for...[/table]*the feat normally granted by this is replaced with a different one, due to the character already having the feat.
**Can also cast cleric spells and those from the Air, Good, Law, and Sun domains as arcane spells.
***6+INT for all levels, with 24+(INTx4)-2 at 1st, due to illiterate flaw buy off.
§ Spell-Like Ability is usable at will.
$Note: This information is partly off because WotC never officially printed any info on Epic-Level Tome of Battle. You and your DM will need to work out the details later...
Books Used Code (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/List_of_Book_Abbreviations_(3.5e_Other))

[Getsugaru]

...and with that edit/post about 2/3rd's done, I sign off for the night...:smallfrown:

[Ithquentbvare]

So far I am extremely impressed. I don't want to post questions or corrections until I see the finished thing, as the whole might answer questions for me.

[Getsugaru]

So far I am extremely impressed. I don't want to post questions or corrections until I see the finished thing, as the whole might answer questions for me.

Updated again, and here's the tasty flavor text/explanation. Feel free to edit it at your leisure. :smallwink:
Prologue: The Secret Born of Fire so Cold...
"Knowledge is Power." These words were drilled into Ithquentbvare's head at a young age, and was the basis for his growth over the past 4 millennium.

Born over 4000 years ago, Ithquentbvare was born to a pair of silver dragons in the frigid north. One of a clutch of 5, Ithquentbvare was the odd-ball of the group. This was due to his unusual coloring; his silver scales were tinted with red. This was because, unknown to him, his father wasn't the father of his brothers and sisters. While their father was an honorable silver dragon, Ithquentbvare's father was a ravenous red dragon and a cleric of the mighty Tiamat. This fact had been hidden from Ithquentbvare, his father, and his brothers and sisters, for their mother never wished for the dark act she had performed long ago to ever be revealed...

Half a century passed, and Ithquentbvare finally reached adulthood. His brothers and sisters had already passed this age and left their childhood home. Before he left their home for what was to be the final time, his mother pulled him aside into her private sanctum, where Ithquentbvare and his brothers and sisters had always been forbidden to enter. Entering the sanctum, Ithquentbvare was surprised to see what was inside; cave walls were covered with books, a vein of molten lava crossed a section of the floor, passing through the room and down a tunnel, and a draconic sihlouette was hidden down below. At first, Ithquentbvare thought it to be the shadow of his father, the silver dragon who'd taken both himself and his brothers and sisters hunting in the south 7 years prior.

But it was not the case. Or rather, it was exactly the case. Emerging from the tunnel came a stout, crimson dragon, his scales glowing crimson in the light of the molten rock. Shocked by the emergence of this titanic being, Ithquentbvare instinctively dropped into a fighting stance. But before the first strike was made, his mother's beautiful claw stopped him. Confused, Ithquentbvare inquired about what was going on.

"Ithquentbvare, my son, have you ever wondered why you were so different from your siblings?*" The young dragon nodded. "There is a reason for this."
(*translated from Draconic)
The red dragon stepped forward. Staring deep into Ithquentbvare's eyes, the dragon smirked. "You have the spark," he said. "I'd expect nothing less from the flesh of my flesh." Ithquentbvare's eyes widened, changing from an enraged glare to shocking disbelief.

"It's the truth, Ithquentbvare," his mother said. "I met your father in combat. His power was incredible, as was his unwillingness to give up."

"Your mother gives herself too little credit," his father interjected. "Her strategy was flawless, as was her execution in battle."

"The two of us encountered each other after the battle, but rather than continue the fight, we began to speak."

"We discovered how much we had in common, your mother an I. Including our love of knowledge."

"We began to swap stories, knowledge, information. Eventually, we grew close."

"One thing lead to another, and then you came along. I've wished to meet you for 50 years, and I'm proud of what you are."

Ithquentbvare took a minute to process this. "What happens now?"
Levels 1-25: The Path of Knowledge
Following in the footsteps of his parents, Ithquentbvare took the path of knowledge. Like his father, Ithquentbvare took an interest in the knowledge that only the gods could provide. Cloistered away, Ithquentbvare became a cleric of the draconic goddess, Tiamat, learning divine secrets in exchange for supporting her desire to (violently) place dragons on top. While doing so, however, Ithquentbvare continued to amass knowledge of the arcane. Mastering illusions was a skill that would help him later in life, as now he understood what made an illusion, and, more importantly, how to end them.

The second century of Ithquentbvare's life brought forth an unusual revelation: A hunger for knowledge was just that: a hunger. This revelation also lead to an unfortunate curse. Ithquentbvare's hunger for knowledge had lead to gorging upon food in a ravenous form. Unable to stop, Ithquentbvare let out a cry for help through magic. Responding to his call, Ithquentbvare's father, now an Unholy Ravager of Tiamat, arrived in time to stop his son from destroying a town filled with Tiamat's servants. Throwing an ioun stone at his son's head, his father stopped Ithquentbvare's rampage. In thanks, and seeing his father having amassed cataclysmic power, Ithquentbvare asked his father to teach him the ways of the unholy ravager.
Level 26-50: Transcending the Transmundane
Two-hundred years passed, and Ithquentbvare had grown into a master of divine knowledge. However, he saw his parents were nearing death, and realized that, to continue to learn, Ithquentbvare must surpass the limitations of mortality. Over the next 100 years, Ithquentbvare traveled the world, searching for a way to survive past the twilight. Finally, at the age of 562, he found a solution: ascension.
Consuming his entire hoard, Ithquentbvare began the process of ascension. Over the next few hundred years, Ithquentbvare became an immortal Dragon Ascendant (His father would take a different path). No longer bound by time, Ithquentbvare decided to master the only form that could now kill him: combat. Learning the ways of the martial maneuvers, Ithquentbvare became a Swordsage. But this was not enough.

Training under master after master, Ithquentbvare learned the art of the Jade Phoenix Mage, then the Master of the nine. But for some reason, it was not enough either. Something was calling to him. No longer caring about the earthly wealth of gold, Ithquentbvare was drawn to the wealth of knowledge, once again in the form of arcane might. Still desiring recognition by his fellow dragons, however, he decided to joined the sacred game of Xorvintaal, having the distinct advantage of his hoard being etched into his very scales. Turning to the wastes, Ithquentbvare traveled through the ancient deserts in search of the lost knowledge of the waste's ancient rulers: the Sand Shapers. Over many more years (and several encounters with his siblings, most of whom were now at the twilight of their lives), Ithquentbvare discovered the ways of the lords of the wastes. Now a powerful Sand Shaper, Ithquentbvare continues the excavating of their ancient ruins, still yearning for the next piece of the ciphers of his life...

Explanation: This build was designed around your desires, combined with the ingredients you provided and some draconic spices. The Advantages of the build are as follows:

It meets 96.5% of what you requested, only missing the flavor of the weapons themselves.
You are immortal, and have multiple ways of coming back if you ever find an opponent stronger than yourself.
This build is symbolic of this thread: You came in search of knowledge for building your character, who's lived for a plethora of campaigns.
This build allowed me to finally put into use some of the dragon builds that have been floating around in my head for years, which really felt good.

The Disadvantages:

...nope; can't think of anything. Not unless the long week of research counts...


Well, what do you think?

[Ithquentbvare]

Shellshock was my first reaction. The combination is absolutely brilliant.

I have a few questions, so I could understand the build and ruling clarifications:

1. How do I get Mindsight?
2. I thought once you hit Epic Level you had to use the Epic Level BAB and Save progression INSTEAD of those listed.
3. I thought the rule in Tome of Battle about half your level counting for Initiator levels only counts for Maneuvers you are eligible to pick, not how many.
4. When gestalting with a racial species, do character still gain the +1 to ability scores ever four levels like normal characters do?

Aside from that I only take issue with the Sandshaper levels, it just isn't my style. I presume taking more Wizard would not impact anything significantly? Plus it would allow me to prep for Innate Spell so I could gain the Telekinesis I want and Breath Weapon Admixture at will, which solves some of the other thinks I wanted. Unless I am mistaken?

I need to look through Pathfinder to see what their progression for Silvers are, because I am unsure how correct that looks. The 3.5 has a Strength bonus of at least +32 for Wyrmling to Great Wyrm (not counting the Advanced Dragon ability score increases). And naturally I plan on buying the Tomes and such when I get the appropriate money.

The sword is either an Epic Artifact or an Epic Legacy Weapon. I would prefer artifact as it allows for more "at will" abilities and tweaking like the "Wind Sword" being a variant of the Nightblade.

If you are still looking at information for it, then the Soulknife class has several abilities from it, but isn't a viable class in full. I wish there was some way a weapon could have class levels, that would let me approximate pretty much everything.

Overall though that is absolutely brilliant and I am beyond pleased. Thank you so much for all of your help, you really went above and beyond what you needed to do and what I expected as help from the board. Thank you, truly.

[Getsugaru]

Shellshock was my first reaction. The combination is absolutely brilliant.

I have a few questions, so I could understand the build and ruling clarifications:
I'll do my best to answer them.

1. How do I get Mindsight?
Mindsight is a feat from Lords of Madness: The Book of Abberations; page 126. All it requires is that you have telepathy, which you do from being a player of Xorvintaal (at a 100-mile radius:smallamused:).

2. I thought once you hit Epic Level you had to use the Epic Level BAB and Save progression INSTEAD of those listed.
Yeah, this is tricky because of your Racial Hit Dice. You see, Racial Hit Dice get around the rule in a weird way. I'd go into more detail, but it's almost midnight here, so I'll pick it up later. Still, if you take a look at the true dragons in the SRD, you'll see that their BAB is equal to their HD, or only one below it. Again, more on that tomorrow.

3. I thought the rule in Tome of Battle about half your level counting for Initiator levels only counts for Maneuvers you are eligible to pick, not how many.
Sorry, I'm not very good with ToB myself, so I'll take another look at it to double check.

4. When gestalting with a racial species, do character still gain the +1 to ability scores ever four levels like normal characters do?
I have absolutely no idea. Might want to ask Urpriest or Psyren about that...

Aside from that I only take issue with the Sandshaper levels, it just isn't my style. I presume taking more Wizard would not impact anything significantly? Plus it would allow me to prep for Innate Spell so I could gain the Telekinesis I want and Breath Weapon Admixture at will, which solves some of the other thinks I wanted. Unless I am mistaken?
Main reason I added Sand Shaper was because it's a class I'm a fan of, I thought it fit thematically with the whole "knowledge is power" theme of the build, and I couldn't remember any other arcane casting prestige classes at the time. Tomorrow I'll take a look around and see if I can find anything that fits better...
On the topic of Breath Weapon Admixture, I'm not so sure it's necessary, since you've already got Breath Weapon Substitution at will. That and since you have two seperate breath weapons, you might be able to convince your DM to homebrew a feat that lets you use both in the same action over the same area, or something...

I need to look through Pathfinder to see what their progression for Silvers are, because I am unsure how correct that looks. The 3.5 has a Strength bonus of at least +32 for Wyrmling to Great Wyrm (not counting the Advanced Dragon ability score increases). And naturally I plan on buying the Tomes and such when I get the appropriate money.
Like I noted in the edits, I don't exactly remember how the attribute advancement works with dragons and need to reread it. Give me some time, and I'll get back to you. As I said, I basically set the average at 1st of 13 in all, then just used the stats for the Great Wyrm from the SRD. I'll keep at it...

The sword is either an Epic Artifact or an Epic Legacy Weapon. I would prefer artifact as it allows for more "at will" abilities and tweaking like the "Wind Sword" being a variant of the Nightblade.

If you are still looking at information for it, then the Soulknife class has several abilities from it, but isn't a viable class in full. I wish there was some way a weapon could have class levels, that would let me approximate pretty much everything.
I considered the Soulknife/Soulbow progression, but I wasn't sure it fit thematically. But now that you've mentioned it, I'll take another look...

Overall though that is absolutely brilliant and I am beyond pleased. Thank you so much for all of your help, you really went above and beyond what you needed to do and what I expected as help from the board. Thank you, truly.
Glad I could help. :smallsmile:
Also, either of those pictures to your liking?

[Ithquentbvare]

On the topic of Breath Weapon Admixture, I'm not so sure it's necessary, since you've already got Breath Weapon Substitution at will. That and since you have two seperate breath weapons, you might be able to convince your DM to homebrew a feat that lets you use both in the same action over the same area, or something...

Very true. The profane blast could always have the flavor text rewritten to have it look like the Holy Hail


Like I noted in the edits, I don't exactly remember how the attribute advancement works with dragons and need to reread it. Give me some time, and I'll get back to you. As I said, I basically set the average at 1st of 13 in all, then just used the stats for the Great Wyrm from the SRD. I'll keep at it...

Pathfinder or 3.5 SRD? I know the progression for 3.5


I considered the Soulknife/Soulbow progression, but I wasn't sure it fit thematically. But now that you've mentioned it, I'll take another look...

It satisfies the summoned swords and with the same flavor it could be also the wind sword. So really the only thing as the Meido, Dragon Twister and the short teleports through the summoned sword.


Also, either of those pictures to your liking?

Yeah actually, the first one was awesome.

(Sorry for the list of questions again, I forgot these earlier.)
How do I get Superior Low-Light Vision?
Where is Power Dive from?
How did you calculate the CL's for Arcane and Divine? I have:

7 Arcane from Illusionist
4 Arcane from Jade Phoenix
4 Arcane from Sandshaper
15 total with a possible 5 more from the Shadowcraft Mage.

1 Divine from Cleric (unless the Bloodline Cloistered Cleric grants 6)
11 Divine from Unholy Ravager
15 total with a possible 5 more from the Shadowcraft Mage.
21 total with a possible 5 more from the Shadowcraft Mage if the Cloistered grants a 6 CL)

[Getsugaru]

Pathfinder or 3.5 SRD? I know the progression for 3.5
3.5. I was just grabbing for stats. The one's I provided were a bit off, however. Forgot to add in the Bloodline bonuses. Anyways, those stats may not actually be your stats; I just needed a base to show an example at level 50 (also discovered that I forgot to put in the traits from the psychoses and the advanced dragon attribute bonuses...Oops).

It satisfies the summoned swords and with the same flavor it could be also the wind sword. So really the only thing as the Meido, Dragon Twister and the short teleports through the summoned sword.
If it's to your liking, then I'll find a way and add it in.

Yeah actually, the first one was awesome.
Glad you liked it. :smallsmile:

(Sorry for the list of questions again, I forgot these earlier.)
No problem. I like questions. :smallbiggrin:

How do I get Superior Low-Light Vision?
Dragon Senses. Regular Low-light Vision lets you see twice as far compared to a human in low light conditions. Dragons see four times as well in said conditions. Therefore, Superior Low-Light Vision.

Where is Power Dive from?
Draconomicon. Power Dive lets you basically make an overrun attak that your opponent can't avoid for 4d6 damage at colossal size. Great for knocking an opponent into flat-footed state. :smallwink:

How did you calculate the CL's for Arcane and Divine? I have:

7 Arcane from Illusionist
4 Arcane from Jade Phoenix
4 Arcane from Sandshaper
15 total with a possible 5 more from the Shadowcraft Mage.

1 Divine from Cleric (unless the Bloodline Cloistered Cleric grants 6)
11 Divine from Unholy Ravager
15 total with a possible 5 more from the Shadowcraft Mage.
21 total with a possible 5 more from the Shadowcraft Mage if the Cloistered grants a 6 CL)
Your numbers are a bit off. Allow me to clarify:
Arcane:
7 levels of Illusionist gives you CL 7;
5 levels of Shadowcraft Mage gives you CL 5;
5 levels of Jade Phoenix Mage gives you CL 4;
5 levels of Sand Shaper gives you CL4;
3 Bloodline "levels" gives you an additional +3 on all your classes effective level for numerical's;
Therefore, Arcane Caster Level=7+5+4+4+3=23(+1 if casting an illusion spell).

Divine:
1 "level" of Cloistered Dragonblood Cleric "9" gives you CL 9 (advantage of utilizing poor writing);
12 levels of Unholy Ravager of Tiamat gives you CL 1;
3 Bloodline "levels" gives you an additional +3 on all your classes effective level for numerical's;
Therefore, Divine Caster Level=9+11+3=23(+1 if casting an illusion spell).

Any other questions? :smallsmile:

[Ithquentbvare]

I'm on my iPad so responding to each thing isn't a go.

When it comes to the soul knife it isn't a big deal, you already did more than needed. I think I can manage the sword.

Urpriest said they do NOT get the ability score increases every four levels.