[PF] Help me tweak my Alchemist for bomber concept

[TheIronGolem]

I just started playing in a PF game last night, with a 5th-level Alchemist. The build is a fairly conventional bomb-focused setup. I'm happy with how it has performed, but as I get more into the character I am finding that many of the other Alchemist class features (most notably Mutagen and poison use/immunity) don't really jive so well with the character concept. I see him as basically a sapper/grenadier type.

My DM is very accomodating, and has offered to let me come up with some alternate class features since none of the Pazio archetypes really fit the bill. Admittedly the Grenadier (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/grenadier) could make a good start, but still leaves me with a Mutagen I'm not going to use.

But I figure I'm not the first person to have this problem, so maybe some of you could suggest a third-party archetype or something? I definitely want to trade Mutagen for something of roughly equal value, and would like to do the same for poison use/immunity. Infusions and Brew Potion I could take or leave.

[StreamOfTheSky]

You could use the Cognatogen instead to boost Int and thus save DCs and damage with the bombs. I'd just go for the Mindchemist, which comes w/ cognatogen. Beastmorph would stack and get rid of the poison stuff mostly. Not sure you'd find it helpful for bombing, but getting wings, scent, etc... certainly wouldn't hurt.

You can get some decent use out of poison, though. Take the Poison Conversion discovery and you can get some really handy inhaled poisons (which I assume would be stored in a flask and thrown like a splash weapon). My favorite possibility is Drow Poison. Once you have poison immunity, you can stand and fight in the inhaled poison clouds, too.
It is expensive, though, and I personally don't like using poison.

How are you using the bombs? I suggest using Stink Bomb, Dispelling Bomb, and/or Confusion Bomb and focus on debuffing and battlefield control. Rather than using the bombs to kill things by damage. You don't get nearly enough for that.

If your DM is open to ANY 3rd party, there is an excellent mad bomber (I think that's the name) floating around that someone made, which has infinite bombs per day.

[TheIronGolem]

You could use the Cognatogen instead to boost Int and thus save DCs and damage with the bombs. I'd just go for the Mindchemist, which comes w/ cognatogen. Beastmorph would stack and get rid of the poison stuff mostly. Not sure you'd find it helpful for bombing, but getting wings, scent, etc... certainly wouldn't hurt.

Very sound suggestions, gameplay-wise. But I don't think Cognatogen will mesh with my concept much better than Mutagen. A little, but I just don't really see this guy swigging mind-altering chemicals in combat.


How are you using the bombs? I suggest using Stink Bomb, Dispelling Bomb, and/or Confusion Bomb and focus on debuffing and battlefield control. Rather than using the bombs to kill things by damage. You don't get nearly enough for that.

That is the plan, though I did take Explosive Bomb as well to get a side of damage with my BFC spam. And later I plan to take Delayed Bomb to further the sapper/demoman concept and add some tactical sneaky goodness. Possibly Demolition Charge as well, depending on how that ends up being worded.



If your DM is open to ANY 3rd party, there is an excellent mad bomber (I think that's the name) floating around that someone made, which has infinite bombs per day.

Ooh...nice. (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?310985-Mad-Bomber-Archetype) Grenadier, I'm afraid your services are no longer required.

That still leaves me with Mutagen. I suppose if nothing else I ask my DM to let me swap it for Cognatogen (it would. Still, I'd like to come up with something more thematically appropriate if I can.

You know, when I was first creating this character, I was thinking about using the Explosive Missile (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/explosive-missile) discovery along with Amateur Gunslinger, basically turning a pistol into a Fantasy Grenade Launcher. The reason I decided against it was that it Explosive Missile takes a standard action, which would preclude me from using it with Fast Bombs later on.

But suppose I could make Explosive Missile usable with a full attack, throw in Rapid Reload (using a light crossbow instead of a gun), and make that package my Mutagen replacement? That certainly scratches my conceptual itch, and it would synergize quite well with the Endless Bombs ability. Anyone care to weigh in on the potential balance quality of such a swap?

[Baroncognito]

Ooh...nice. (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?310985-Mad-Bomber-Archetype) Grenadier, I'm afraid your services are no longer required.

That still leaves me with Mutagen.

No it doesn't.

Maniacal Glee (Ex):...

This ability replaces mutagen.

[StreamOfTheSky]

Huh.... I guess that archetype is also good. I was specifically thinking of this one with the same name (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=11950) made by some other guy, though.

Seemed like exactly the thing you wanted, though still does not get rid of the mutagen.

[TheIronGolem]

No it doesn't.

Oops. That was the first one I found, must have linked it by mistake.

I meant this one (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=11950) (same one that StreamOfTheSky linked)

[cosmicAstrogazr]

Aforementioned DM here.

All of this is fantabulous, and by all means, carry on with optimisation to your (TheIronGolem, and all y'all's) content. ♥