Making a Mad scientist (3.5, PF. mix)

[Drackstin]

So i have this idea for my next character to be a little crazy, i want him to take as many of the grafting feats as he can, and be a class that will pretty much kills and dissect things he finds and try to get his group to let him graft them(or anyone willing to).

i need some suggestions on race and class.

i was thinking a class with the capability to stun or cast magic, that way he can cupe anything he stuns, or effect them with all kinds of wired status effects.

he is going to be a little on the crazy side but not enough to kill his own party(just enough to attach anything he can find to them and see what happens).

ah, the sacrifices we make for science.

[Urpriest]

First of all, Fleshwarper (Lords of Madness) is the poster child for this sort of character. It's sort of hard to get into, though. Your earliest full-casting entry is probably something like Wizard 4/Master Specialist 1/Blood Magus 1/Wizard +1 (using the bonus feat to grab Graft Flesh)/Fleshwarper X. If you want to enter a bit more slowly, Glimmerskin Halfling Dread Necromancer 9 is a pretty cool entry IMO.

[The Viscount]

An alternative, if you want to go the inorganic route, is Renegade Mastermaker from Magic of Eberron. It's focused on making a non-warforged more like a warforged, complete with grafts.

[Drackstin]

First of all, Fleshwarper (Lords of Madness) is the poster child for this sort of character. It's sort of hard to get into, though. Your earliest full-casting entry is probably something like Wizard 4/Master Specialist 1/Blood Magus 1/Wizard +1 (using the bonus feat to grab Graft Flesh)/Fleshwarper X. If you want to enter a bit more slowly, Glimmerskin Halfling Dread Necromancer 9 is a pretty cool entry IMO.

this looks very interesting, is there a way to work around the requirements for graft flesh, so i can get them all?

lol be nice if i read the class first, so my question is, graft mastery adds a extra race to my grafting list, can i take graft flesh again to gain a additional race, also if i have 2 graft flesh feats can i pick an additional race for both with the graft mastery abilitie


An alternative, if you want to go the inorganic route, is Renegade Mastermaker from Magic of Eberron. It's focused on making a non-warforged more like a warforged, complete with grafts.

i am familer with the class but i don't want to do anything to myself(without proper testing) but more of a hey we just killed this demon, who wants its skin "evil laugh"

[Urpriest]

this looks very interesting, is there a way to work around the requirements for graft flesh, so i can get them all?

lol be nice if i read the class first, so my question is, graft mastery adds a extra race to my grafting list, can i take graft flesh again to gain a additional race, also if i have 2 graft flesh feats can i pick an additional race for both with the graft mastery abilitie


You can't take Graft Flesh multiple times. Fleshwarper is the only way to add additional grafting races, short of the new-style feats that don't combo well with other grafts.

[Drackstin]

ok, my next question is the choice of classes before it, why pick them, and i don't know if i can use home brew classes. (blood magus)

i think its a pathfinder campaign but my DM is letting me use anything from 3.5 i want, i know the hard part about getting into the class is having the knowledge(arcan) and heal skill, pathfinder has a witch class that has both so i wouldn't need to multieclass, also thinking of going tifling or human.

[killem2]

Age Of Worms, under the 1st module The Whispering Cairn, has a character called Filge, you could steal of ideas from that :). He is a necromancer who has many ranks in profession: mortician and injects himself with special syringes and has dead bodies floating in strange containers

[HunterOfJello]

Alchemist from Pathfinder, Wizard/Fleshwarper, and Artificer are your most common choices.


Lately, I've been playing an impromptu wizard/binder/anima mage as a mad scientist type character who loans out his soul for power in his craziness.

[Drackstin]

i was looking into wizard, but it doesn't have heal as a class skill, the pathfinder "witch" has both arcane knowledge and heal, so i wouldn't need to multiclass, but would other classes help the build more

if i take humen would i be able to take heal as a skill with its racial trait skilled?

after going threw all my books, i found their are 9 schools of normal grafting and 4 schools of eberron grafting, with fleshwraper i will get 5 with one feat, i can take the eberron ones seperatly, so i will be missing some, i would like to get all of them.

other things i was considering was adding in crafting feats, so i can complement the grafts i make with items.

on a side note, how can i make my familiar stronger, to the effect of an animal companion or close to it, that way when i get to add to it, it becomes more useful.

would anyone be able to plot out a build for me based on this?

[Talionis]

ok, my next question is the choice of classes before it, why pick them, and i don't know if i can use home brew classes. (blood magus)

Blood Magus is on pg 29 of Complete Arcane.

[Autopsibiofeeder]

If you don't want to take those two feats that the blood magus requires (which are not the best out there) and are willing to give up one caster level, you can consider human paragon (UA). They get heal as a class skill if they want as well as a bonus feat and a +2 to any score over three levels (and 2 caster level level ups).

[Juntao112]

Can't you get the heal skill from an apprentice feat?

[Urpriest]

Can't you get the heal skill from an apprentice feat?

Nope. Glimmerskin Halfling and Aerenal Focus (only available to Aerenal Elves) are basically the only options. Heal is surprisingly hard to get.


If you don't want to take those two feats that the blood magus requires (which are not the best out there) and are willing to give up one caster level, you can consider human paragon (UA). They get heal as a class skill if they want as well as a bonus feat and a +2 to any score over three levels (and 2 caster level level ups).

If you're willing to lose a caster level any class with Heal will do, though Human Paragon isn't a horrible choice. The bonus feat, if timed right, at least allows you to qualify at 7 rather than at 9. The point of the Blood Magus build is basically to time everything right, but in your case it's probably unnecessary, see below:


i was looking into wizard, but it doesn't have heal as a class skill, the pathfinder "witch" has both arcane knowledge and heal, so i wouldn't need to multiclass, but would other classes help the build more

if i take humen would i be able to take heal as a skill with its racial trait skilled?

after going threw all my books, i found their are 9 schools of normal grafting and 4 schools of eberron grafting, with fleshwraper i will get 5 with one feat, i can take the eberron ones seperatly, so i will be missing some, i would like to get all of them.

other things i was considering was adding in crafting feats, so i can complement the grafts i make with items.

on a side note, how can i make my familiar stronger, to the effect of an animal companion or close to it, that way when i get to add to it, it becomes more useful.

would anyone be able to plot out a build for me based on this?


ok, my next question is the choice of classes before it, why pick them, and i don't know if i can use home brew classes. (blood magus)

i think its a pathfinder campaign but my DM is letting me use anything from 3.5 i want, i know the hard part about getting into the class is having the knowledge(arcan) and heal skill, pathfinder has a witch class that has both so i wouldn't need to multieclass, also thinking of going tifling or human.

As pointed out, Blood Magus is just about the furthest thing from homebrew, given that it's one of 3.5's oldest PrCs.

That said, Pathfinder does make qualification easier. Ask your DM how the graft reserve is going to work in that case, since normally it mitigates the XP cost but in PF itemcrafting has no XP cost.

Since you're going PF, Witch is actually a pretty great choice. You've got healing spells to use for the nice Sithilar grafts, and more wizardly spells for the rest, plus lots of sinister fluff. If you want to go for another casting class, as you mentioned there are plenty of ways to get an extra class skill in PF.

I think your count is a little off, as far as I'm aware there are 8 old-style and 5 new-style grafts (of which four are from Eberron, so maybe you're just dividing things up differently from how I am). You can grab all the new-style feats individually, but be aware that you can only apply one type of new-style graft to a given creature, so you can't mix, say, Construct and Elemental grafts on one guy. Since you can't get more than 5 old-style grafts (without homebrewing an Epic Fleshwarper or something), you'll have to forego some, I'd avoid Aboleth since most of theirs are useless out of water and think carefully about Maug since it's a short and specialized list.

Pathfinder also makes it easier to qualify because you get a feat at level 7. Because of that, something like Witch 7/Fleshwarper 10/whatever is a fine setup.

In terms of the familiar, most of the 3.5 ways to buff your familiar involve lots of class levels, either getting a high BAB (because your companion shares it) or a passel of Druid levels and Arcane Hierophant (Races of the Wild) (lets you merge your animal companion and familiar). Pathfinder may have archetypes or the like that make this easier, but I don't know of any.

[Spuddles]

There are two traits in Pathfinder that turn Heal into a class skill- Caretaker (faith) and Venicaan Medic (regional).

[Ravens_cry]

On the subject of Mad Science and Pathfinder, Vivisectionist Alchemist could fit if you want to go the Doctor Moreau route.

[Drackstin]

Nope. Glimmerskin Halfling and Aerenal Focus (only available to Aerenal Elves) are basically the only options. Heal is surprisingly hard to get.



If you're willing to lose a caster level any class with Heal will do, though Human Paragon isn't a horrible choice. The bonus feat, if timed right, at least allows you to qualify at 7 rather than at 9. The point of the Blood Magus build is basically to time everything right, but in your case it's probably unnecessary, see below:





As pointed out, Blood Magus is just about the furthest thing from homebrew, given that it's one of 3.5's oldest PrCs.

That said, Pathfinder does make qualification easier. Ask your DM how the graft reserve is going to work in that case, since normally it mitigates the XP cost but in PF itemcrafting has no XP cost.

Since you're going PF, Witch is actually a pretty great choice. You've got healing spells to use for the nice Sithilar grafts, and more wizardly spells for the rest, plus lots of sinister fluff. If you want to go for another casting class, as you mentioned there are plenty of ways to get an extra class skill in PF.

I think your count is a little off, as far as I'm aware there are 8 old-style and 5 new-style grafts (of which four are from Eberron, so maybe you're just dividing things up differently from how I am). You can grab all the new-style feats individually, but be aware that you can only apply one type of new-style graft to a given creature, so you can't mix, say, Construct and Elemental grafts on one guy. Since you can't get more than 5 old-style grafts (without homebrewing an Epic Fleshwarper or something), you'll have to forego some, I'd avoid Aboleth since most of theirs are useless out of water and think carefully about Maug since it's a short and specialized list.

Pathfinder also makes it easier to qualify because you get a feat at level 7. Because of that, something like Witch 7/Fleshwarper 10/whatever is a fine setup.

In terms of the familiar, most of the 3.5 ways to buff your familiar involve lots of class levels, either getting a high BAB (because your companion shares it) or a passel of Druid levels and Arcane Hierophant (Races of the Wild) (lets you merge your animal companion and familiar). Pathfinder may have archetypes or the like that make this easier, but I don't know of any.

Urpriest i always love all the information you bring to the table.

that being said, and now that i don't have to jank my way into fleshwraper in pathfinder, i was thinking of this build

Witch 2/ Artificer 5/ fleshwraper epic to get all the grafts

although with this build i do lose some spell casting levels for witch until fleshwraper kicks in again. it would give me a lot of versatility. and would make me almost a master crafter.

how would this work out, and what feats should i take. (ill see if i can get my DM to add the grafting and crafting pools together and make them count as discounted gp cost) also keep in mind i want to get all the grafting feats also.

i will be jumping out of artificer before i get the heavy stuff, so i might need to take the craft wand as a feat, with my bonus crafting feat, i was thinking the 25% time reduction, or craft construct.

would improved familiar be worth it? and is there a greater familiar feat?