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View Full Version : DC44 Poison? SERIOUSLY? And other helps



Vaz
2013-03-22, 11:11 AM
This is a thread referring to my "Tunnel Crawler" campaign, so if any of my players are reading this, kindly please don't read on for spoilers. And Hi!

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Okay, so I've just been having a mooch through Dungeonscape, and I've located the "Megapede" Poison. Awesome, (DC44, Primary 2d6 Con+1d4 Dex, Secondary 2d6 Con+1d4 Dex).

I'm looking to use that, and one of my campaigns is based around a psychotic Vermin Master Druid, with a lot of immense Scorpions Centipedes as his pets targeting the party throughout his lair; essentially he's a Zookeeper/Entomanothropologist (Bug studier); and has started some form of "cleanse"; think an even more insane Unabomber (sorry if that affects anyone, it's not intended to; especially as the campaign is intended to wipe the earth with the battered remains of this guys face), crossed with an Anthrax envelope terrorist; he's killed a few inner city politicians with packages containing "Misters" (from DotU) to kill by remote; on others, using a homebrewed "Awaken Vermin" to do the same when it became a bit more obvious, and the "mysterious packages" no longer worked.

Naturally the city guards were able to establish (with the aid of the PC's) who the criminal was; and begun their investigation, but in a very "Se7en"-esque style, the PC's begun to discover ever more grisly murders that were reminiscent of the "crimes" perpetrated.

However, I'm looking for ways in which to get more poison threat to the party.

I'm struggling with a few things. I obviously have the advanced Vermin Companions of the Druid/Beastmaster with a few awakened Vermin as his immediate Bodyguards; a couple of Colossal Centipedes and Colossal Scorpions alongside his Megapede.

These have made a ton of traps which the party has to escape, alongside lesser Hivenest Necropolitans Sergeants.

So, that's the setting. Now for the questions.

- 1) How do I increase the threat of poisons? I know of Udrentide article in Dragon, but is there anything like that within the core game? Either for damage or DC, etc?
- 2) Vermin have so many different kinds listed; d20srd and Dungeonscape lists Colossal Scorpion as DC33, 1d10 Con, while http://www.realmshelps.net/stores/poison.shtml shows it as much higher, but costing much more. 1) how was this achieved, 2) if it's an error, how did they get that number?
- 3) Are there any other outstanding poisons I need to look out for, of any source? I have a huge stock of Handwavium if it's not normally available to a Druid.

Zubrowka74
2013-03-22, 11:14 AM
I just want to say that I like the idea behind this campaign.

Keltaris
2013-03-22, 11:26 AM
If you haven't read it already, there's this. (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=4854.0)

mattie_p
2013-03-22, 12:28 PM
It might not be DC 44. Up to you. Megapede poison is based off the monster in MM2, which listed the DC as 44. The 3.5 update booklet (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/DnD35_update_booklet.zip) changes the DC to 34. Obviously the Dungeonscape authors did not get the memo.

Medic!
2013-03-22, 05:03 PM
A few ways to increase poison DCs include:
Giving the source monster:
Increased HD/CON score
Ability Focus
The Virulent Poison feat tree
The Corrupted Creature template (or Saint template...but I doubt you're going there)
There's probably something simple I'm missing.


As far as favorite poisons, I've always been partial to Wyverns and Pseudodragons. Side note on the Pseudodragons: While some creatures are immune to magical sleep effects...they aren't necessarily immune to poison-based sleep effects :smallamused:

Spuddles
2013-03-22, 06:11 PM
Mockery bugs, monster manual 5. Super creepy. Cant link picture on my phone, bust google image search, second image:


http://www.google.com/search?q=d%26d+%22mockery+bug%22&hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=8ORMUbzgOOmpigLH84HoAQ&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=480&bih=219

Gazebo's Bane
2013-03-22, 07:50 PM
Another way to increase the threat from poison is Polymorph/disguise/change shape into the local tavern waitress and either hand them a toxic meal or add a little contact poison to their bedsheets.

Darrin
2013-03-22, 09:55 PM
It might not be DC 44. Up to you. Megapede poison is based off the monster in MM2, which listed the DC as 44. The 3.5 update booklet (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/DnD35_update_booklet.zip) changes the DC to 34. Obviously the Dungeonscape authors did not get the memo.

But, oddly enough, they did update the DCs for scorpion venom. Up until Dungeonscape, the highest poison DC in print was DC 54, colossal scorpion venom, as listed in the 3.0 Monster Manual. It's also listed in the Book of Vile Darkness, which was still a 3.0 book and using the MM DCs. It looks like this is where Realmshelp got its poison DCs, so that's why the numbers are higher.

Looking at the Megapede... yes, it should be DC 34 (10 + 1/2 HD + Con modifier).

Some other ideas to soften up Fort saves:

Atramen Oil (50 GP, Planar Handbook). Thrown as a splash weapon, on a direct hit the target takes a -4 penalty to Fort saves for 1 minute, or a -1 penalty if they get hit with a splash. It's also vegetable-based, so you can create it with psionic minor creation if need be.

Dire Weasels. Train a bunch of them as pets or guards. Yeah, sure, a seasoned party will mow them down with ease, but a few will be able to attach and do a little blood draining.

Minions with automatic debuffers. Paladin of Tyranny 3 has the Aura of Despair, -2 on saves. Hexblade can take the Dark Companion ACF for -2 on saves. A 1st-level kobold sorcerer with a wand of ray of sickness or stolen breath can harass the party with sickness (-2 to saves).

Drow of the Underdark has the Venemous Strike feat (trade 2d6 sneak attack damage to increase poison DC by 2), and a Mister that can deal contact, inhaled, and injury poisons as a touch attack. If you want to get rid of the touch attack and deliver poison to an area without an attack roll, use the Sprayer from the Arms & Equipment Guide.

GeriSch
2013-03-23, 06:00 AM
You don't necessarily need one huge monster with an up through the roof poison DC, many small poisonous opponents are scary enough - its not likely you will botch one save if you have to roll 3 or higher, but if you have to save 10 times, one of them will probably fail. Swarms of poisonous insects - if that won't do, send in more swarms.

gr,
Geri

hamishspence
2013-03-23, 07:58 AM
Maybe the trap poison is a concentrated version of the animal poison?

mattie_p
2013-03-23, 11:14 AM
Maybe the trap poison is a concentrated version of the animal poison?

That would make it unique, I believe, among all poisons.