Level 3 Spells. Two Wizards, maximize outcome.

[killem2]

In my session, my DM is giving us xp as we get it, (we were doing it at the end of session), so our next session in april, I and a fellow wizard will be leveling up if we end up having even two challenging encounters.

I'm under 1200 to level up, and he bought of an la+1 adjustment and only needs 1 xp. Well, I will become level 2 Master Specialist, and due to feats I will be able to learn 4 new level 3 spells. The catch is, my friend can use all schools, I am a focused speciliast conjurer, banning evocation, necromancy, and enchantment.


So what would you suggest I pick up for Master Speciliast 2 and 3 to share with my wizard buddy when he levels to Generic Wizard (who also has Colliegate feat) 5 and 6? Then vice versa.

our DM lets us copy two spells, per rest period.

[Randomguy]

Haste, sleet storm, dispel magic, explosive runes, fly and either Greater Magic weapon (if you have noncasters in the party) or shrink item (if you have access to some heavy stuff to shrink so you can drop it later).

[Phaederkiel]

If I understand that right, you want to know which spells to take, when you lvl up, (2x2), two times?

my comments on the list above:

seriously, shrink Item is probably one of the best spells for non-combat situations and can be even applied for combat.

I'd skip on the explosive runes, if you want to deal damage: acid breath, elemental darts.

Dispel magic is often just needed to get through certain situations.

Haste depends on Party makeup. Is very solid with lots of fighters, less with lots of squishies.

Fly is a gamechanger, you need it.

Greater magic weapon is okayish. I`d rather make sure that you have baleful transposition.


so: fly, dispel magic, shrink item, haste / acid breath
are the four spells I'd take first.

[Malachei]

Unluck
Alter Fortune
Stinking Cloud
Slow
Dispel Magic

[ericgrau]

Ok so early 3rd level spells then: sleet storm, haste, mass snake's swiftness, slow.

He's going to get 4+4 spells of his own so that's 8+4 spells total which is already a lot for "early" spells. I might only get 3 of the above then make the other 1 a "late" spell like a buff. Like greater magic weapon, fly, greater mage armor (you do have 2 mages after all) or dispel magic. Or about 2 dozen others. I might not prepare it yet, but it will be good to have for later. When you level up again I'd make all 4 of them this kind of spell.

[RolandDeschain]

Haste, sleet storm, dispel magic, explosive runes, fly and either Greater Magic weapon (if you have noncasters in the party) or shrink item (if you have access to some heavy stuff to shrink so you can drop it later).

can anyone tell me why this spell is supposed to be so awesome?

[Karnith]

can anyone tell me why this spell is supposed to be so awesome?
Because it deals force damage and (according to some readings) you can stack multiple explosive runes on something and detonate all of them at once. This tactic doesn't waste normal spells per day (except an area dispel magic) because the runes are permanent until discharged, and it generally leaves smoking craters where enemies used to be if you have enough of the things, as each detonates individually.

[Jack_Simth]

can anyone tell me why this spell is supposed to be so awesome?
A particular abuse wherein you cast it many, many times, making a sheaf of papers which all have explosive runes on them, bundle them up with twine, toss them at an opponent's feet, and then cast a low caster level area dispel magic on them, to set most or all of them off at once for 6d6 damage (reflex half, SR applies, all individually) per rune.

[ericgrau]

Technically you're supposed to auto-pass any dispels against your own spells though, the spell specifically says "another creature", and the existence of the option to fail a dispel on purpose smells fishy. The whole thing is abusive anyway whether it works or not.

Without abuse it could be useful with a lot of planning. Normally DMs would use it, but PCs on the move can plant it behind them and on side passages to great effect. Anything that doesn't cost you a turn is a free bonus on top of your actual turn. It wouldn't be my first choice at level 5 with limited spells per day, but soon after that 3rd level spells become more expendable. So as a permanent spell with no costly material component it's a great deal.

[RolandDeschain]

Technically you're supposed to auto-pass any dispels against your own spells though, the spell specifically says "another creature", and the existence of the option to fail a dispel on purpose smells fishy. The whole thing is abusive anyway whether it works or not.

Without abuse it could be useful with a lot of planning. Normally DMs would use it, but PCs on the move can plant it behind them and on side passages to great effect. Anything that doesn't cost you a turn is a free bonus on top of your actual turn. It wouldn't be my first choice at level 5 with limited spells per day, but soon after that 3rd level spells become more expendable. So as a permanent spell with no costly material component it's a great deal.

Ahhh....I clearly overlooked that little nugget. I'm currently playing a Dwarf Runesmith and this spell is a nice fluffy fit. We do have a sorcerer in the party, so if I load up a scroll with Explosive Runes, throw it at my target and have the sorc fail a dispell attempt on it...KABLOOEY!! Do I have that right?

How many runes do you think we could detonate without having books thrown at us?

[Randomguy]

Technically you're supposed to auto-pass any dispels against your own spells though, the spell specifically says "another creature", and the existence of the option to fail a dispel on purpose smells fishy. The whole thing is abusive anyway whether it works or not.

Actually it says that you "may choose to" autodispell your own spells. You don't have to.

And while you don't have the option to fail a dispel, you do have the option to lower your caster level for any spell you have, down to the minimum (so 5), which makes success unlikely at low levels and impossible at high levels. There's also a feat that lets you take 10 on caster level checks, meaning you'd fail automatically against your own spells if you did.

You could always have an unseen servant read the paper, though.

[ericgrau]

How many runes do you think we could detonate without having books thrown at us?
1-4 I think :smalltongue:.

Arguably you might need multiple objects too, since the target of the spell is an object not the writing itself. Though it's simple enough to bag them together.

[JusticeZero]

Failing that, give someone with evasion one stamped onto something covered so they can have a cheap but dangerous PBAOE attack that can rip up those ghosts they cant hit. Rip the cover off the shield and hold it in the face of the enemy and Bluff them into looking at the interesting heraldry that says "Guess what spell I prepared today?" - no save to the reader - and the silly rogue/monk type has an awesome Reflex save, so. Really it's just a nifty and versatile spell that you can rig up during downtime.

[Flickerdart]

You don't even need to stack multiple runes. The best part about them is that you can generate free traps on off-days, not that you can ultranuke people.

[Jack_Simth]

Ahhh....I clearly overlooked that little nugget. I'm currently playing a Dwarf Runesmith and this spell is a nice fluffy fit. We do have a sorcerer in the party, so if I load up a scroll with Explosive Runes, throw it at my target and have the sorc fail a dispell attempt on it...KABLOOEY!! Do I have that right?
Assuming the sorcerer has Dispel Magic, yes. The Cleric can also get it, as can the Druid.

You've got a rather arcane heavy party, then?

How many runes do you think we could detonate without having books thrown at us?That's a question to ask your DM.
You could always have an unseen servant read the paper, though.
An Unseen Servant is Mindless, which makes that iffy at best. Prying Eyes (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/pryingEyes.htm), while not available at level 5, should be able to read them without much of a stretch, however.

[killem2]

Thanks, I should note, that my DM is probably drop the hammer down on any explosive runes shenanigans.