Crit Ranges and stacking

[Sloshman997]

So I'm getting a new weapon soon with my current character and I am working around a crit build.

I was under the impression that Keen/Imp Critical would not stack with anything else, but around here I've seen people talk about it stacking with something like Disciple of Dispater for a 9-20 crit range or the Serrated type weapon from the 3.0 Mercenaries book.

So I would like to clarify, if I had a Keen greatsword that is Serrated would my crit range be 15-20?

Secondary Question: Are there any Double weapons with higher than 1d8 damage?

[Feralventas]

Keen and Improved Critical effects don't normally stack with each other, but Disciple of Dispater is one of the few options that explicitly states that it does in fact stack with those effects, so when you go with the non-magical serrated effect to add to the crit range, then apply both Keen and DoD's class ability, you can in fact gain a 9 to 20 crit range. However, in order to do this you will have to mix 3.5's Book of Vile Darkness, either 3.0 or a 3rd party Pathfinder book Ultimate Equipment for the serrated effect to get all of it.

So you're either mixing editions or mixing 3rd party systems in order to do so. In a game where 3.x and PF content is allowed, this is possible, but you'll want to run the whole thing by your DM first, including exactly why you feel your character should be auto-hitting 55% of the time.

[TuggyNE]

So I'm getting a new weapon soon with my current character and I am working around a crit build.

I was under the impression that Keen/Imp Critical would not stack with anything else, but around here I've seen people talk about it stacking with something like Disciple of Dispater for a 9-20 crit range or the Serrated type weapon from the 3.0 Mercenaries book.

So I would like to clarify, if I had a Keen greatsword that is Serrated would my crit range be 15-20?

3.0 crit range extensions are weird, because they tend to specifically mention that they stack with Keen, Improved Critical, etc (as you've seen), but that was redundant in 3.0, since every crit range boost stacked by default anyway. In 3.5, very few things stack crit range, and this is made explicit. So the logical course is to update a redundant reference to the default rule to the new default rule, which means that 3.0 sources are basically useless for critfishing.

Generally speaking, anyone who considers 3.0 sources to allow much bigger threat ranges is probably either a) a bit sloppy with the text or b) houseruling back in the old rules, with the reflection that really, larger threat ranges aren't all that big a deal. (Which is probably true, but it is a houserule.)

All that said, there are still a few ways to make critfishing interesting. (Ab)use of kaorti resin (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031014a) and Aptitude weapons are probably the most prominent.

Edit: Also, only natural 20s auto-hit; even if you have a 3-20 threat range, you won't auto-hit on a 3, or even a 19.

[Flickerdart]

One thing that actually does boost your crit range without using 3.0 content is psychic weapon master (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040827d) - with a rapier (18-20/x2) you can boost that to 15-20 with Improved Critical, then to 13-20 using its 7th level ability, then boost the crit multiplier to x3 using the increased multiplier ability (you can't use kaorti resin because it needs a crystal weapon).

[Callin]

using 2 third party books i got a daggers crit to 3-20x4 i think.

now the dagger part dont help ya none because the PrC was daggers only but the feats i used could help if you can swing it by the DM or use it to get the previous suggestion approved.

Bastion Press Torn Asunder (i love this book btw)
Greater Critical to triple your threat range (example 15-20 on a long sword)
Enhanced Critical to increase your multiplier by 1 (x2 to x3)

[Spuddles]

Kaorti Resin does not work Disciple of Dispater because that ability only works with iron weapons.